Comebacks And Chokes
November 15th, 2019
Defense hasn’t helped Jameis.
When America’s Quarterback, Pro Bowler Jameis Winston, led the Bucs on a late touchdown drive to beat the lowly Cardinals, that was one reason the Bucs drafted him No. 1 overall.
The reason? To lead the Bucs on a scoring drive in crunchtime to bail the team out from a loss.
But if anything needs bailing out, it’s the Bucs defense in recent years. As Greg Auman of The Athletic points out, six times in his career, Jameis has rallied the Bucs from behind in the fourth quarter. Per Auman, that’s middle of the pack. Jameis is tied with Blake Bortles and is one comeback win from Russell Wilson and Matty Ice.
That’s not bad for Jameis, one behind clutch quarterbacks like Wilson and Matty Ice. Those guys have played on teams with much better defenses. And that’s the issue.
The Bucs defense, just as a reminder, has been garbage for the past three years. Or sure, the Bucs this year have an elite rush defense and in recent weeks have become a good pass-rushing team. But oh, that secondary! đ¤Śââď¸
To give you an idea of what a slap-in-the-face the Bucs defense has been in recent years, consider the defense has choked away 12 games in the fourth quarterback since Jameis became starter.
That’s double the number of games Jameis has won in the fourth quarter!
This is just further evidence that until this secondary is fixed — which likely won’t happen until March at the earliest — there isn’t a quarterback in the NFL that could win consistently with this defense.
But yeah, let’s get a new quarterback. Because Andy Dalton.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:06 am
Does the Bucs defense also throw interceptions and fumble the football on a league-leading consistent basis since 2015?
November 15th, 2019 at 9:06 am
If he’d only stop scoring for the bad guys he wouldn’t need all those heroics.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:06 am
nice pick but your could have showed a picture of Captain Blowout Cancer93 and his inconsistent sidekick LVD to make your point a little closer to home. nobody has choked or blown more leads than that duo of mentally weak captains.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:08 am
Fixed it for you: Or, can Jameis play corner?
When the Bucs defense was halfway decent, the Bucs lost a tiebreaker for a wild card. With the same quarterback. Yeah, strange, isn’t it?
November 15th, 2019 at 9:09 am
Jameis Winston turnovers account for 21% of total points allowed. That’s right the opposition scored 21% of Bucs total points allowed immediately after Winston turnovers. That’s 58 points and counting.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:09 am
MidwestBucsFan Say
no but it does show that winston has handed cancer93 and lvd leads in the fourth quater multiple times and they went face down arse up like a cheap carckwhores…
jamies is a victim
jaamis is the only quarterback in nfl who has to face 2 defenses each week the opponents and his own….
November 15th, 2019 at 9:15 am
@tmaxcon
You could say the same thing about Bucs D
They have to play against 2 QB’s… opposing teams and Winston T.O. Machine
November 15th, 2019 at 9:19 am
When the Bucs defense was halfway decent, the Bucs lost a tiebreaker for a wild card. With the same quarterback. Yeah, strange, isnât it?
When Jameis doesnât turn it over with a decent defense-Bucs usually win
When Jameis turns it over- Bucs will lose, with or without a good D.
Yes, Bucs need better play from secondary or better players, but turnovers must be Reduced!
November 15th, 2019 at 9:20 am
TMax going snowflake? Heaven forbid!
November 15th, 2019 at 9:20 am
Screaming for a new QB? I agree with Joe. Your not gonna a get a top tier QB with an average team without breaking the bank. Then you have to ask yourself about drafting a QB well if you want to take 5 years to rebuild then that’s the avenue you take but it will involve a lot of losing and growing pains. However if you build a good team first then bring in a Rookie or Sign one then at least you can develop that QB and give him the best chance for success.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:23 am
Great. I’m trying to think how many games in January you are rewarded for the ring of honor worthy “lost a tiebreaker” wild card spot.
[pecks calculator]
[carries the 4]
[waves finger in air]
Oh, right.
None.
(Just ask 2010 Josh Freeman)
November 15th, 2019 at 9:24 am
@MidwestBucsFan
BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 9:25 am
Iâm not a stat geek, but do believe there are some interesting nuggets out there. It seems we have two camps related to JW.
Traditional stats vs New Age Stats.
Traditional stat followers say âlook at all those yards and touchdowns (Some also ignore the Ints and blame the defense).
New Age Stats are wonky, but tell an interesting story.
When you look at DVOA, DYAR and QBR, Winston was below the league average nine weeks into the season. You can look up the acronyms, but the these stats account for situational football. Not all yards are created equal. Neither are Intâs.
Then thereâs Joe, he hates stats, unless they match his narrative
We need to get JW cheap if we do sign him to another contract
JW = Fools Gold.
In BA I Trust!
November 15th, 2019 at 9:25 am
Winston needs a change of scenery. Jalen Hurts will instantly make this team better
November 15th, 2019 at 9:25 am
JW is a tough sob. Garrett wouldn’t have dared to pick a fight with him
November 15th, 2019 at 9:28 am
Lamarcus Says:
November 15th, 2019 at 9:25 am
JW is a tough sob. Garrett wouldnât have dared to pick a fight with him
my guess jameis holds his own but his offensive line would scatter like like little beotches… they are not fans of contact proven by the nonstop assault on americas quaterback week in and week out.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:29 am
The defense gets exposed because of the most turnovers in the league since 2015
14 INTs this year, 10 fumbles with 4 lost and this is what you have: 3-6 record.
The Buccaneers are the âloud fartâ if the NFL. A whole lotta noise (ppg), but nothing to show for it (wins).
The defense is bad, but the turnover issue is a bigger culprit to our losing. And itâs easier to change one player out (QB) then it is to draft 8 or 9âDBs whom all canât play. Just draft a QB, pay him peanuts and buy some talent around them with the cap space. No shot in hell Jameis is worth the money. We lose and he turns it over more they Bortles or Eli: both of whom have been banished or relegated to the bench. Wake up and smell the turnovers.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:33 am
Wake up and smell the turnovers.
The culture of losing can never be restored with a lack of accountability
For poor performances, loafing, and TURNING THE FOOTBALL OVER MORE THAN ANYONE.
Sorry for all caps, but I am just not sure that the Winston Apologists understand we lose a lot of games and the turnover battle is a major contributor.
Joe- âBut, Andy Daltonâ should read âBut, all those turnovers committedâ. Fixed it for you. đ
November 15th, 2019 at 9:35 am
It’s like the snake thing eating its own tail. Only W fingers. Both sides of the ball mess it up for the other one.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:36 am
@SteveK – Exactly! The defense on this team is terrible — but those staggering turnover numbers by the guy under center we’re paying $21M (in a CONTRACT YEAR) contributes just as much to the team failure.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:36 am
You’re cherry-picking again Joe, as always. Yes the Bucs came back against Arizona. And PRIOR to that drive, the Bucs defense stopped the Cardinals deep in Bucs territory, and then stopped them AGAIN after that go-ahead drive. That same horrid defense forced 2 Cards’ turnovers, which helped the offense. Nothing about that, nor anything about the THREE turnovers by our Bucs’ offense, TOs that the horrid Bucs’ defense had to clean up the mess from.
This Secondary is a work in progress & everyone but you seems to know it. It barely qualifies as a college Secondary given the ages of these young defenders. Imagine how different it might have performed if it had a quality veteran CB out there. Heck with Jameis averaging over $1 mil per turnover we might’ve even paid for that veteran CB by charging Jameis say $500K every time he throws an INT. Oops forgot, ACCOUNTABILITY on the Bucs, or in the NFL, doesn’t work that way. My bad.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:37 am
SteveK
the defense get’s exposed because they can’t play football… last year it was coaching this year it’s exposed…. jameis turnovers have cost the bucs a few games NO doubt about that but blown leads by cancer93 and mentally weak lvd have been in double digits since schiano left.
defense sucks the entire organization sucks…. it has sucked pretty much every year with the exception of gurnden and sapps glory year.
jameis is a victim
give him a decent oline and a defense that can keep teams under 40 and he wins a championship. Then we can finally forget about those underachieving one year wonder washed up has beens once and for all.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:37 am
Meaningless stats. Sure, the D needs more work. This is not a reasonable defense of Jameis. He keeps both teams in every game. Like Dilfer, Jeff George, and a lot of other guys that can play QB but would never be elite NFL QBs.
Looked at another way, how many times has the New England defense had to save a win because Brady made an terrible decision or wildly inaccurate throw in a critical part of a game? Not very many.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:38 am
Defense Rules Says:
November 15th, 2019 at 9:36 am
Youâre cherry-picking again Joe, as always.
pot meet kettle… wow dude that is some balls calling joe out for what you do every single day… nice job sir
November 15th, 2019 at 9:40 am
SteveK is on the money. The best I could do stomach a super team friendly contract extension for JW. Can you imagine losing ME or CG due to a JW cap busting salary. Screw that!
A rookie would do well with those two guys. The record books say it would impossible to throw more interceptions.
JW = Fools Gold
In BA I Trust!
November 15th, 2019 at 9:45 am
Sport
In BA I Trust!
trusting in a washed up embarrassing old man renders you with no credibility…. BA has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt he is a sideline clown not a head football coach….
November 15th, 2019 at 9:47 am
Jameis Winston has turned the ball over more times in his career than Blake Bortles.
Let that sink in.
Itâs time to move on.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:54 am
Iâve watch football some 30 yrs. heck I remember Bucs staring rob johnson. Iâm not in favor of drafting a young QB.again and again. These qb need time. Good defense.good oline. It all starts there. Tom Brady first five years were shaky avg 25td 17int. But that patriots team was Drew Bledsoe and defense. Brad Johnson super bowl year 26td 21int but it was the defense team.
Jameis has had nothing after drafted #1. No defense. No oline. No coach. Give the guy acouple 1-2 yrs more. Why draft a qb. Donât you all like griffin? Iâll be ok of drafting a qb maybe 3-4 rounds. But Bucs should build the trenches.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:56 am
Put Jamies with the cowboys right now. And dak with Bucs.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:56 am
Fix the OL Fix the pass defense. Keep Jameis. A rookie QB is no solution, just another problem. Bret Favre was a turnover machine too, and he had far superior OLs to work behind. He also had a decent ground attack.
November 15th, 2019 at 9:59 am
Put Jameis with the patriots now and Brady with Bucs. Exactly. Good teams build a complete team. Bucs are not there yet. And we want to start again with a qb.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:04 am
Horrid defense for three years, so we bring in “The Quarterback Whisperer” as head coach? Doesn’t compute…
November 15th, 2019 at 10:11 am
Why pay $25-30 million per year of the salary cap towards a turnover machine?
Itâs such a loser mentality to stick with the losing: back to back 5-11 seasons and sitting at 3-6 this year. We can do better. The defense would be better if they didnât have an offense that turns it over more than anyone.
Can we all agree that the defense blows as much as our turnover numbers?
November 15th, 2019 at 10:11 am
Debate all you like, but Jameis will be back next year. The alternatives are lamer or waaay older and past it. Maybe the Bucs do draft t the QB of the future, but would you trust that he won’t get destroyed behind the current line? I sure wouldn’t invest millions in somebody that won’t survive. We better hope like heck that Jameis can clean up the turnovers or we’re in for moer of the same. If our D was even half decent we’d be in the hunt. They aren’t, and we’re not. It ain’t all on Jameis.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:25 am
jamies is the modern sapp
he has a heart of a lion hated by some loved by none…….
ironically they have the same issues… Sapp played for an ignorant one dimensional fool in dungy the clown and begged for 17 pts a game. Jameis has played for coaches who can’t keep teams under 40… jameis has better supporting cast on offense than the overrated back ups sapp carried to the promise land but essentially they are in the same boat. sapp was a victim and wasted by one dimensional dungy the clown and the glazers have wasted jameis with 3 garbage coaching staffs and quite possibly the worst gm since that fraud mckay could not field a high school level offense.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:30 am
I believe weâd be in the hunt too if we turned the ball over less. I agree the defense isnât helping out a lot early, but they bailed out James and RoJo last weekend off their turnovers.
I just donât see how we can pay Jameis and expect
Different results: less turnovers, more team wins? Am I missing something here? I get that heâs a good QB, but heâs also
Inconsistent and has too many giveaways.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:38 am
Maybe The corners can play Quarterback! Can’t do any worse than Winston .
Fixed it for you Joe! Almost 1 for 1 TD /Ints. It must be hard because no other Quarterback has done worse than your boy Winston.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:44 am
Does anyone else ever dream about Jameis playing with our SuperBowl era defense? I do â¤ď¸
November 15th, 2019 at 10:44 am
Lowest attendance in Ray Jay’s history last week ! Sign Winston and it will only be Joe and T-max in the stands.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:51 am
Tampa Town, Lay off the magic mushrooms.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:51 am
T Town,
If he had, Sapp would’ve beat his A$$ on multiple occasions for all the turnovers.
In the first half of the AZ game. the defense made multiple stops, and JW and the offense could not capitalize. That game should have been a blowout by halftime.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:53 am
Dam joe panty’s in a wad ? y/c/is/a/m?
November 15th, 2019 at 10:53 am
Jameis Winston + AVERAGE scoring defense = winning record.
Thatâs been proven through his sample size so far; and thatâs with subpar run game / special teams.
Even with ZERO offensive turnovers or points for the other team factored out; our defense is bottom 1/3 in scoring.
It isnât complicated. You canât win in this league with horrible D especially pass
D. We have forgot what aN even average NFL defense looks like
November 15th, 2019 at 10:53 am
Jaboo haters
keep wasting your time and complain all you want..he WILL be back next year and hopefully for years to come. nothing you post on this site will change ANYTHING.
and as always…GO BUCS!
November 15th, 2019 at 10:55 am
Dekemper! Yes the defense hasnât helped Jameis BUT PLEASE donât act like Jameis doesnât cause turnovers and puts the defense in short fields at least once a game.
November 15th, 2019 at 10:58 am
One of the most, if not the most, productive buccaneer offenses in history.
-And, this is the first year in a new offense.
A dreadful cant stop anyone defense.
Letâs change the offense??
November 15th, 2019 at 10:58 am
midwest
BINGO!!!!!
we wouldnt have to come back if JW stopped giving the opposing team extra possession…
GO BUCS!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:06 am
Waste of an article all the haters see is interceptions which especially in the 4th when you are always down you have to take risks. Nervermind what the article was about by all means mention interceptions like he hasn’t still had comebacks. With the exception of 2 games he has played well enough to have a better record but the idiots will keep bringing up Winston because all you need to win is a quarterback, who needs a good defense…..jokers don’t actually watch games they look at the stat sheet.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:16 am
Thanks Joe! Spot on! I love your point to the fact Jameis has one of best seasons when our defense was actually respected. Go Bucs you know what needs to be done!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:17 am
pewter
nawl….
no one is hating…just stating facts….
we’re talking about the 1st quarter INTs and pick6’s that put us in a hole minutes into the game….
the article should be called make up and not comebacks because he’s usually the reason why we have to comeback in the first place….
the excuses with this guy never stop…lol…
GO BUCS!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:17 am
Oh man Joe, you just summoned the dumbest fans of the dumbest fan base with this one ha.
Enjoy the ignorance!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:24 am
@bucnutter yup you can see the same clowns posting the anti jameis stuff. 813 still mad his boyfriend got kicked off the team and the rest are just trolls with new accounts like h8. And to those who had the guts to say jalen hurts would make this team better, youre a joke. Hurts couldnt win in Alabama with a team superior to who they played every week. Those thinking a rookie is going to come in a fix us havent watched much football in their lives. Just stupid stuff from the posters om this site.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:25 am
YEP! JAMEIS WILL BE AROUND FOR A LONG, LONG, LONG, LONG…..
LONG, LONG, TIME!
Going to be a ton of hate filled posts over the next decade.
Just not when he wins the super bowl!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:27 am
If evaluating excessive interceptions from a quarterback labels one a hater, then ‘yes’ —
I guess i’m a full-on #HATER? ÂŻ\_(ă)_/ÂŻ
November 15th, 2019 at 11:27 am
Jmarkbuc:
You forget Sapp played with Trent Dilfer. There were multiple times I thought Sapp would put his hands around his throat. I know I wanted to.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:27 am
@midwest nope but theyve been consistently ranked in the bottom 5 of every statistical category since jameis has been here. But hey lets ignore those pesky facts since they dont fit your narrative.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:31 am
JOE SAYS “My favorite golfer has consistently made 5 birdies per round. But pay no attention to his 3 triple-bogeys per round too, let’s only talk about his amazing birdie numbers.”
November 15th, 2019 at 11:31 am
Joe: You always harp on the Defense and rightly so. However can’t you ever mention how JW puts the Defense in Horrible spots? Most turnovers by a LARGE margin since 2015 means the Defense has to work WAY harder than necessary.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:32 am
Nice analogy BucsBandit
November 15th, 2019 at 11:33 am
Buccernutter,
I can guarantee you Jameis Winston won’t be a Tampa Bay Buccaneer for a very long time. If they sign this turd to a long-term extension watch what happens to the fan base. 90% of long-time Bucs fans will abandon the team until he’s eventually gone. Fewer people than now will still go to the games. It will be a nightmare for the Glazers.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:35 am
Lord C … “It isnât complicated. You canât win in this league with horrible D especially pass D. We have forgot what aN even average NFL defense looks like.”
So true LC. What’s also true though is when you have a bunch of rookies & 2nd year players manning your Secondary, you probably should expect exactly what we’ve been seeing to this point. When your starting Center makes MORE money than your ENTIRE 9-man Secondary, MAYBE, just maybe, you need to rethink your priorities about team-building.
Still, we are where we are. It’s what happens in this 2nd half of the season that interests me. Fully expect that we’ll be starting THREE rookies & TWO 2nd-year defenders in our Secondary against Drew Brees & the Saints on Sunday. But I also expect that group of youngsters will play BETTER than the Secondary we fielded against the Saints earlier this year. VHIII got roasted in that game, giving up exactly 100 yards & 1 TD. Rookie Mike Edwards also got roasted for 72 yards, giving up 2 TDs. SMB, Minter & Whitehead got torched for 1 TD each.
Well, Edwards & SMB have both improved since then & VHIII is gone, replaced by Dean. White is now in at ILB in place of Minter, and Whitehead is playing solid football IMO. Hopefully Carlton Davis makes it back (and doesn’t commit more penalties). This Secondary SHOULD do better than what we saw in the earlier game. I think the Bucs will win, like around 31-27.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:36 am
Everyone needs to stop and realize that the blame is a chicken and egg situation. Does Jameis throw INTs because the secondary thinks the other team has chicken pox or does the secondary suck because they’re afraid of Jameis throwing an interception like its pizza at a kid’s chuck e cheese party.
I have my opinion based on my eye and statistics that I find just as the same as the other crowd.
Let’s stop having that argument and discuss the most likely solution to get Mike Evans, Lavonte David and our favorite veterans into the playoffs as soon as possible.
In my opinion, drafting a rookie quarterback is boom or bust for next 5 years. That’s not an acceptable timetable or risk for Evans or David. For me, depending on a rookie quarterback is out. Draft one in later round is fine… but not my 1st pick.
Next is a veteran quarterback. Who’s the likely veteran quarterbacks on the market to give us the best opportunity?
At the end of the day, whether we like it or not, Jameis gives us the best odds to get us into the playoffs as soon as possible. Bring in veteran competition, draft a 3rd or later round draft pick to mitigate risk but its in our best interest to resign Jameis for 1 or 2 years.
—
Now let’s address the primary question again. What gives us the best opportuntiy to get Mike Evans and lavonte David in the playoffs?
1. Hit on a primary need of our #1 draft pick.
2. Sign veteran cornerback help.
3. Resign Shaq Barrett
4. Upgrade Offensive Line
5. Try to keep JPP
If we did those 5 things, would we have legitimate shot of getting in the playoffs next year with Jameis Winston? I’d suggest we would. It’d be a much more likely scenario than trying to hit the lottery on a rookie quarterback in the 1st round or whatever veteran we find in the league.
This is what I want. I want LVD & Mike Evans to get into the playoffs as much as possible as soon as possible.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:38 am
SB Says:
November 15th, 2019 at 11:31 am
Joe: You always harp on the Defense and rightly so. However canât you ever mention how JW puts the Defense in Horrible spots? Most turnovers by a LARGE margin since 2015 means the Defense has to work WAY harder than necessary.
BINGO!!!!!!!
folks like joe and @nutter get mad when our defense cant stop JWs pick6…..lol….
GO BUCS!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:42 am
tmaxcon … “pot meet kettle⌠wow dude that is some balls calling joe out for what you do every single day⌠nice job sir.”
It’s more likely to be called ‘counter-arguments’, but hey, thanks for playing. Heaven forbid that you should bring anything but bitching to any discussion.
Oh and for the record, Tony Dungy was no ‘clown’ but you certainly fulfill the definition of that word. Kudos, you obviously work hard at it.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:43 am
and @nutter wonders why we all laugh at him…..lol….
comments like that just shows how little this clown knows about football….lol…
i bet your a great checkers player tho….lol…
GO BUCS!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:45 am
Bandit
I can guarantee you you’re wrong. If he gets resigned, your logic is out the window because they will have already committed.
You just hope he doesn’t last, but people will show up if we’re winning regardless of Jameis.
Of course saying he will be here a long long time is an opinion, but it’s an educated one unlike those who want him gone cuz he’s a turd.
November 15th, 2019 at 11:49 am
OMG 813 you just completely showed how much I am in your head.
I literally told you yesterday there are more than a few people that laugh at your comments, then you proceed to wait a day after getting embarrassed in the last thread and repeat to me the exact same thing I said to you! HAHAHAHA
Not to mention you finished yesterday’s comment with some dumb s*** about smart people not debating with fools cuz other’s don’t know the difference, then you proceed to antagonize a smart guy a day later who said NOTHING to you! HA
You’re an insecure guy that spends all of his time on this page and fails to see how many people make fun of you ON A DAILY BASIS and repeats insults like you made them up…
You’re an idiot dude and once jameis is resigned, I’ll be here to laugh at you like I do when I occasionally visit this site and see how much time you spent and effort to deflect from how lonely and dumb you are. HA!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:53 am
By all means 813, if you want to show face, or if anyone for that matter, instead of hiding faceless behind a computer screen and a google account that you utilize when debating because you lack football iq, let me know we can exchange info.
I’ll go live on a podcast and embarrass you like most these other people do on a daily basis. Or I can meet at a game and embarrass you to your face.
But I’m sure you’ll just insult me with my insults like their your own and never really say anything with any true merit about this football team.
I’m in your head!
November 15th, 2019 at 11:56 am
if this team is ever going to be relevant and become contenders, many of these players need to be sent packing…
These people arguing about Jameis and the defense when both are no more than mediocre.. JW is no better than Andy Dalton, Blake Bortles, Josh Freeman, Marcus Mariota, or any other qb that just can’t hack it as a starter..
The defense is no help but when you throw ints in the 1st drive several times and you play no better in yar 5 than rookie year, you just don’t have the ‘IT’ that is needed to lead a winning NFL team…
Maybe Arians gets Luck to come out of retirement to help next year… who knows.. BUT 1 thing is proven 60+ games, Jameis as starter is more losing and NO playoffs… history all but guarantees it!
November 15th, 2019 at 12:26 pm
Tye You do realize bruce disagrees and wants to extend him right? I’m just confused as to how you really believe that. There’s a lot you’re ignoring in relation to his career vs theirs. I can see dalton cuz he was great at one time but inconsistent but there’s more to this story.
The defense is not mediocre. We have one of the worst d back units I have ever seen. Do you think brady, wilson, rodgers can win with that?
History doesn’t guarantee anything because jameis has had an inconsistent career with a low floor and a high ceiling in three years with one coach! Dirk Koetter! Like Bruce said it’s a new year and he doesn’t care about that past. He’s had 2 terrible games adjusting to the scheme with his receivers and 7 average to great games. The story is not over like I said.
November 15th, 2019 at 12:28 pm
What happens if JW finishes the season strong? Do you guys change the narrative or still stick with he’s a bust and a waste of time?
Your answer speaks volumes about who you are as a fan.
November 15th, 2019 at 12:28 pm
jaymiss winsnot isnt worth 25-30 million ….. period …..
November 15th, 2019 at 12:29 pm
nutter
lol…we laugh at you every day!!!!!…lol…
no one takes you seriously….
yeah you’re in my head alright….
when i need a good laugh i read one of your post….lol…
you top a previous dumb post with another dumb post everytime….
you’re sensitive as hell….what are? 12?..13?….lol….
podcast, at the game, at the pressbox, at hatricks, at winghouse….it dont matter….i’ll have you crying in humiliation….
grow a pair before you jump off the porch with the big boys….
GO BUCS!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 12:36 pm
nutter
JW has finished the season “strong” back to back years…lol…
and we finished 5-11 as a team….
your ignorance is on full display!!!!!….lol….AGAIN!!!!
keep em coming….this is better than comicview on BET!!!!!
GO BUCS!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 12:37 pm
I have posted on here 4 times in 2 months HA! You literally are repeating what I said to you now and the only person that sided with you is Jean who was also embarrassed.
It took you 20 minutes for this response? HA!
Give me your info man. JBF world I want to go live with this dude and show you how much of an embarrassment he is to this fan base, that is if he mans up.
Ya dude I’m 12. You got me! You must get the rest of your humor from ALL THAT.
Dude is talking about sensitivity but literally has been thinking about me all night to the point he went out of his way to repeat my insult back to me 24 hours later! Ha you’re transparent dude. Until you try to link up with me we all see through your bull***. You’re a lonely, dumb, and weird apparently, guy.
I put myself up there. It’s up for you to man up. Until then you’re a sensitive guy with nobody who spends all his time on this website.
I feel bad for you in a weird way.
November 15th, 2019 at 12:38 pm
tye says:
JW is no better than Andy Dalton, Blake Bortles, Josh Freeman, Marcus Mariota, or any other qb that just canât hack it as a starter..
The defense is no help but when you throw ints in the 1st drive several times and you play no better in yar 5 than rookie year, you just donât have the âITâ that is needed to lead a winning NFL teamâŚ
*********************************************************
BINGO!!!!!
couldnt have said it better….
GO BUCS!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 12:48 pm
no one thinks about you young man….or girl….lol….
plenty of folks have lost faith in JW and dont think he’s the QB of the future….
just read above….lol…
but obviously you have trouble with that….
lets go live…..face to face….winghouse, pressbox, abe’s, hatricks….i’ll be at the game sunday…we can meet right at winghouse or al lopez park….
i’ll put you over my knee and give you a good spankin….
GO BUCS!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 12:48 pm
Defense Rules Says:
November 15th, 2019 at 11:42 am
Oh and for the record, Tony Dungy was no âclownâ
so if you don’t like clown do you prefer
Post Season Choke Artist
Career Post Season Loser
Waster of Hall of Fame Talent
Ignorant One dimensional Bum
Religious Hypocrite
Stubborn Fool
List goes on you pick one for me….
2 playoff wins in 6 years is laughable not legendary
November 15th, 2019 at 12:51 pm
Joe … Pro-Football-Reference publishes a section they call ‘Advanced Defense’ which I’d never really paid attention to before. Don’t know how accurate their info is, but the detail is intriguing. For instance, according to their stats, various defenders have been picked on during these initial 9 games. VHIII was picked on A BUNCH, and gave up the most yardage by far (578 yards in 9 games … 64 YPG average). He also surrendered 4 TDs according to them, BUT … that’s not the most on the team.
Mike Edwards got skewered in the Giants game for 158 yards & 2 TDs. He did OK against the Rams (gave up 1 TD), but got skewered again in the Saints game for 72 yards (gave up 2 TDs). He’s the team leader, giving up 5 TDs.
MJ Stewart got skewered in the Rams game for 114 yards (and allowed 1 TD), and really disappeared after that until resurfacing in the Cards game. Jamel Dean got butchered in the Seahawks game, allowing 155 yards & 3 TDs, but had 4 PDs in that game & played very well I thought in the Cards game (another 4 PDs). SMB has pretty much held his own, but has also given up 3 TDs.
The most steady performers in our Secondary have been Carlton Davis & Jason Whitehead (he got picked on in the Cards game for 83 yards & surrendered 1 TD, but has done well otherwise). Davis has surrendered 3 TDs but has been a steady performer in terms of passes negated.
What I see is just that they’re all young, all making mistakes, and all learning on-the-job. Not ideal, but it is what it is.
November 15th, 2019 at 12:54 pm
As usual, the people who think everything is Jameis’ fault, and the people who think nothing is his fault, are both misguided idiots.
Which camp do you fall into?
November 15th, 2019 at 1:00 pm
d r
another thing… Dungy the clowns embarrassing offenses made lovie and mike smith defensive units look credible…
there is more to football than defense… dungy the clown was a one dimensional bum who wasted more talent than any other head coach in nfl history. the hall of fame is now a disgrace with his sorry arse enshrined.
you can’t rewrite history and selectively remember the past… dungy the clowns teams never were contenders and never had a chance in the post season. they were bad teams with a highly ranked defense nothing more.
dungy the clown knew nothing about offense, special teams, game day management…. should have spent a little more time learning how to be a complete coach than lecturing everyone on how to raise kids
November 15th, 2019 at 1:08 pm
Extend Jameis
November 15th, 2019 at 1:22 pm
DR
so they all got burnt not just VHG….lol…something ive said for a while….lol…
so the conclusion you came up with is that, they’ll continue to get burnt….ok cool…something i also mention which wont change until we get consistent pressure on the QB….
so with VHG gone, who replaces him as the scapegoat?….CD?…whitehead?….they’re the new leaders of the secondary whether they’re ready for it or not…..the break downs in coverage will be their responsibility……
JWs TOs + young secondary= another 5-11 season….
GO BUCS!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 1:24 pm
Probably the defense would statistically be a bit better if the Bucs didnt average 2-4 turnovers per game?
November 15th, 2019 at 1:51 pm
still gargling on those Vh3 balls huh? lol
Get over it already. If you read the stats the DR posted, you’d see that while they’ve all struggled, the other guys have made plays in more than 2 games all season…
November 15th, 2019 at 1:51 pm
And they also all give up a much lower completion % than Vernon did…
November 15th, 2019 at 2:01 pm
813 so you’re gonna deflect still?
Send me your email. Better yet mine is eac1029 at hotmail . com
You just said you all laugh at me and then said nobody thinks of me. HAHAHA Damn dude you are definitely the dumbest person on JBF. Mostly because you don’t know when you’re wrong.
I understand people don’t think he’s the future. I respect that. I’m going off of facts and the likelihood he gets extended. There is something for everyone, haters and supporters but nothing is concrete. His ceiling is high and his floor is low I’m simply implying he is going to get extended and having faith he does win the superbowl is what every fan should do regardless of their opinion of him. Somehow you can’t comprehend very well. Not sure why. I mean you do this all the time and still suck at it.
You’ve called me a girl, 13, and suggested you wanted to meet me to spank me. At least make someone laugh man.
We all know you’re a lonely, older guy that spends all his time on the internet. This is your home, your domain and you get embarrassed here daily. So what do you really have? Nothing.
Reach out to me dude and we’ll discuss. Until then we all know who you are, it’s evident with the content you spend the majority of your life posting on this here site. A lonely, strange, older man (or woman) that blogs for fun and still gets embarrassed by 12 year old girls.
November 15th, 2019 at 2:24 pm
settle down ladies… it a sports blog anyone who gets their panties in a wad over blog posts should seek help
November 15th, 2019 at 2:26 pm
Weâve had three Buccaneer QBs win SBs with other teams. Jameis is far superior to two of them. If Jameis goes to a team with a decent OL and a mediocre defense, he will win a SB before the Bucs do. He may not ever be an elite QB, but he is still the best this franchise has ever had. No QB is going to win with this team until the OL and DBs get upgraded.
November 15th, 2019 at 2:29 pm
1sparkybuc
Exactly! Not sure why this fan base is too dense to LEARN that. Let alone know that.
November 15th, 2019 at 2:32 pm
Would any of you Fans sign a league leader for five seasons in turnovers? Would you expect anything different to change if he went to your team? What do we think will happen if we do sign the league leader in turnovers to another contract? He would instantly not throw the ball into the hands of the opponent? Why ? What has changed?
And all this talk of bringing in a rookie and Jameis Winston helping him learn the NFL. Exactly how well do y’all think that will work out? We already heard it from BA that Jameis can’t have anyone backing him up who he would have to watch over his shoulder for. Why do we all think that is? How many times have we heard that in reference to the RB LB WR Oline Dline, they can’t have anyone pushing them causing them to “wait for it” worry about their jobs. I am tired of all the fluff and stuff. Winston is not Farve for one simple reason. Farve won games, by himself if need be. How many times has Winston done that? Remember Farve played against Sapp, and Rice and Brooks and Barber and Lynch. How well would Winston have done playing against those teams? And be as truthful as you can be.
Show me, dont tell me ” I just need to get better” after yet another multi Turnover game.
Go Bucs!!!
Tmaxcon for GM 2020
November 15th, 2019 at 2:33 pm
813bucboi … Sorry, but you generalized off of what I wrote to make YOUR point. If you run through those stats game-by-game you can see progress from certain players. I think a lot of what I was seeing is that IF a certain player gets ‘picked on’ in a particular game, they can get skewered. Duh. For instance, Dean got targeted 14 times in the Seahawks game by one of the best QBs in the NFL. He got tagged for 10 completions, 155 yards & 3 TDs (boo) but had 4 PDs also. VHIII got targeted 13 times in the first Panthers game. He got tagged for 11 completions, 140 yards but 0 TDs. But the leader of the pack was MJ Stewart … he got targeted 16 times in the Rams game, and was tagged for 9 completions, 114 yards & 1 TD. That’s a LOT of targeting.
Far and away though VHIII got targeted the most. Although he officially only gave up 4 TDs, completions that he allowed set up opposing teams for subsequent TDs. With VHIII now gone, and MJ Stewart pretty much riding the bench, I think this Secondary will grow a lot faster. And we’ve certainly got much more speed back there.
November 15th, 2019 at 2:36 pm
Moderation again!
November 15th, 2019 at 2:38 pm
tmax … You’re one of the best JBFers at rewriting history. If Tony Dungy were to read your rantings (seriously doubt that he does however), he’d probably say “Send in the clowns; and tmax, you can lead the parade”. Let it go dude.
November 15th, 2019 at 2:46 pm
Jameis Winston vs the Bucs defense. Tale of the tape.
49’ers: Edge Bucs defense
Panthers: Edge even
Giants: Edge Winston
Rams: Edge Winston
Saints: Edge even
Panthers: Edge Bucs defense
Titans: Edge even
Seahawks: Edge Winston
Cards: Edge even
The only two games where you could give the Bucs defense an edge are the games where Winston had a total of 9 turnovers. Where as the games where the Bucs defense forced some turnovers they still gave up 30+ points. See Rams.
The Bucs defense has been the major reason for this franchise being bad for over a decade. Once they start giving up less than 24 points a game every game then the attention will be solely placed on Winston’s turnovers.
Even games where there are zero or one offensive turnovers they still give up 30+ points sans the first Panthers game. See Giants, Rams, Saints and Seahawks.
November 15th, 2019 at 3:10 pm
lol…
oh look….
@nutter’s little big brother came to help him up….lol…
how cute….
GO BUCS!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 3:11 pm
Defense Rules
Great point! There’s also a reason we drafted more cornerbacks this season and it’s becoming very clear why.
Looking like this staff can actually develop players as evidenced by Vea, Rojo, Davis, Cappa, etc.
November 15th, 2019 at 3:18 pm
813
Dude what are you talking about?
You’re like an episode of the golden girls. Unfunny insults and female sensitivity. Nothing you’ve said is funny and I still have only seen one person get your back.
Oh and another guy that tried to lie his way out of spelling syndrome SENDRUM.
That’s your people. Waiting on your email so I can embarrass you some more. đ
November 15th, 2019 at 3:19 pm
ATTENTION EVERYONE!
Does anyone really like this 813 guy? Or respect him?
November 15th, 2019 at 3:21 pm
DR
wouldnt you say VHG was targeted the most because he was covering the #1 WR…..
but it is what it is….VHG didnt live up to his 1st round bill in tampa….
we’ll see if the secondary grows a lot faster….not sure if we got more speed….we definitely got more length on the outside tho….
GO BUCS!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 3:22 pm
Nutter,
Liking one another is moot, but we should all respect one another for being fans of this âlaughingstockâ. Itâs sad that our team blows ass hard every year and the fans are stuck talking draft before Halloween. It is making us turn on one another.
I just agree to disagree with some and I try to understand everyoneâs points.
November 15th, 2019 at 3:30 pm
“Jameis Winston vs the Bucs defense. Tale of the tape.
49âers: Edge Bucs defense
Panthers: Edge even
Giants: Edge Winston
Rams: Edge Winston
Saints: Edge even
Panthers: Edge Bucs defense
Titans: Edge even
Seahawks: Edge Winston
Cards: Edge even
Wait a second here…
Saints – Defense gave up 31 points to a backup QB and 24 points by the beginning of the 3rd quarter after allowing TD drives to end the half and begin the 2nd half. None were off Bucs turnovers.
Offense goes on to score a TD to answer and make it a 1 score game in the 3rd then the defense gives up 7:30 minute drive for a TD to pretty much ice the game…. No winston turnovers in this one but yeah it’s even / his fault because he didn’t score over 31 points?
Cards game not sure how it’s even at all. THe defense gave up 24 points unrelated to turnovers on long scoring drives despite having a massive edge in TOP. THe offense scores 31 but because of turnovers we’re calling it even ? Nah.
The rest are reasonable. 2 for the D having an edge, 2 for even, and 4 for Winston>D IMO
November 15th, 2019 at 3:32 pm
SteveK
Respect that man. However all of us aren’t turning on each other, just a select few including 813 who initiate drama. Most talk about football and that dude comes along and talks about spanking 13 year old girls he met online.
There’s a few breeds of us. Those like you and I (logical fans), casual fans (who don’t engage on this site), and those like 813 who hate their lives so much they have to spend it all on here making fun of the team and others (and fail). That’s whats wrong with this fan base. People like that kid who don’t know much but are passionate with their hate.
It’s in my opinion that’s the biggest problem with our team. The aforementioned 813 fans influence the front office.
But yes, agree to disagree and try to understand everyone’s points. Try.
November 15th, 2019 at 3:34 pm
LordCorn
More logical, football related, content. This is what makes this site great.
Agreed.
November 15th, 2019 at 3:37 pm
The thing that’s also crazy – these games where the defesne had the edge – the defense wasn’t even that amazing
49ers – gave up 17 points unrelated to turnorvers including a missed FG (so coulda/shoulda been 20)
Panthers – gave up 20 to the Panthers unrelated to turnovers, with 2 missed FGs
It’s not bad but it’s not dominant or the equivalent of hanging 55 on the Rams or 34 in Seattle
November 15th, 2019 at 3:39 pm
Buccernutter Says:
November 15th, 2019 at 3:19 pm
ATTENTION EVERYONE!
Does anyone really like this 813 guy? Or respect him?
*********************************************************
your mother says YYYEEEESSSSS!!!!!!!!!
GO BUCS!!!!!
November 15th, 2019 at 3:47 pm
813
Do you chuckle to yourself when you make jokes? For some reason I imagine you look like Newman from Jurassic Park.
November 15th, 2019 at 3:57 pm
Lord C … Can’t disagree with your logic. Bottom line is that defense (especially pass defense) has hurt us AND turnovers have hurt us. Bottom line is that we’re 3-6, BUT … we’re on a 1-game win streak to start this 2nd half.
One factor that few seem to acknowledge is the impact of coaching on wins-losses. I’ll maintain forever that we lost the Giants & the Titans games because of coaching. We wasted far too many opportuniteis in those 2 games. Yes the defense surrendered a total of 59 points in those 2 games, BUT the Bucs squandered a number of opportunities to score a lot more than we did. THAT wasn’t on Jameis & the offense IMO; THAT was on coaching. Even the Seahawks game was winnable, considering that we were ahead 21-7 early in the 2nd quarter. Bucs need to learn how to step on their throats & put teams away.
November 15th, 2019 at 4:59 pm
This discussion about the wonderful offense vs. the terrible defense blowing leads is always very humorous to me.
As the excellent poster, Defense Rules, often points out, the Bucs spend more than 98 million dollars of their total cap for 23 players on the offense, the HIGHEST in the league.
The total for 24 players on the defense is 59 million dollars, which is 39 million dollars less than spent on the offense! (For the math-challenged)
Winston accounts for the largest percentage of dollars spent on the offense.
The next three highest paid are Mike Evans, Donovan Smith and Ali Marpet, who account for ~ 36 million of the total.
Now, suppose we took those three players off the offense, and used their money to sign the two or three top-dollar defensive players. Same money spent, but different focus on building the team.
Exit Question: How would Winston and the offense fare with those three players off the offense, and would our “terrible, no-good” defense fare any better than now?
tickrdr
November 15th, 2019 at 7:50 pm
Defense Rule
how am i rewriting history sir…. 2 playoff wins in 6 years is truly laughable. they never contended only pretended how am i wrong… dungy was 500 coach who sucked in the post season period…
November 16th, 2019 at 9:34 am
SteveK
Can you explain how Jimmy G has virtual a 1:1 ratio in TD to TO and is still 8-1?
November 16th, 2019 at 9:38 am
Tick
You assume that Licht will sign valuable FAs. Recently I posted a list of Licht’s FA signings for the past 5 years most of which are out of the league. You’d expect a Marcus Peters type signing for the Ravens, cheap acquisition and high output but chances are you’ll get a Michael Johnson or Vinny Curry type signing.
November 16th, 2019 at 12:45 pm
Db55,
JG: 14TD 8 INT: 67.6% completion rate,
Sacked 17 times with 4 fumbles
JW: 17 TD 14 INT (3x pick 6), and a 59.8% completion rate. Sacked 34 times with 10 fumbles.
Jameis doesnât take care of the ball as well as Jimmy. And Lynch believes in trenches where Licht is stuck on DBs, kickers, and trying to fix his 2016 sh!tshow draft.
November 16th, 2019 at 1:17 pm
@DB55:
You often make fun of the educational system in Florida, but your reading comprehension missed my point entirely.
I agree with you that Jason Licht has not signed very many quality free agents and the reasons are likely myriad.
My point is that if you took the 39 million MORE being spent on players on OFFENSE, and spent it on players on DEFENSE, (even recognizing that Licht would likely not sign the best of those free agents), then the offense would be much worse off, and that the defense would almost necessarily be better.
With the “weapons for Winston” campaign, the offense is SUPPOSED to be much better than the defense, since that is where the majority of the resources (cap dollars) are being spent!
tickrdr
November 16th, 2019 at 1:27 pm
So translation, JG has a running game, def and an oline?
Btw you forgot the lost fumbles. 14 TDs to 10 TOs and an 8-1 record.
November 16th, 2019 at 1:52 pm
Db 55,
Jameis has 4 lost fumbles out of 10 and 14 picks and 37 sacks. So Jameis has 17 TD, 18TO
What is the difference in the time it takes for JG vs JW to throw?
The Bucs have a run game. And Iâd argue that JH only has George Kittle, where as the Bucs have ME13 and Godwin. More playmakers on O for the Bucs.
The difference is that Lynch knows how to draft: trenches and Licht does not. And Jameis is not as good as Jimmy G. Itâs close though.