Botched Virtual Reality Call?
June 10th, 2019
New change provokes questions
Back in 2015, the Buccaneers were pumped for the new virtual technology they had secured to help groom rookie Jameis Winston, America’s Quarterback — the Sidekiq football-simulator software developed by EON Sports VR.
Joe used to ask former Bucs quarterback coach Mike Bajakian how it was progressing as a teaching tool.
In 2016, Bajakian said it was virtually invisible.
In early 2017, general manager Jason Licht told a national radio audience that Jameis really liked using it.
One year ago, Bajakian told Joe the technology was virtually useless for a veteran QB.
“You know, it’s fading a little bit,” Bajakian said of the technology use. “I think that that technology is best for players that are new, frankly, that are rookies or developing. At some point, you’ve gotten so many accumulated live reps, whether it be practice or the games, that virtual reps do you little good. So there’s a place for it, I’m sure. But we haven’t utilized it as much as maybe we have in the past.”
Enter Bucco Bruce Arians, and he swears by the value of virtual reality technology, so he explained on Arizona sports radio. Carson Palmer, at age 36, got into it under Arians in Arizona, and Arians said he changed his career.
Last week, Arians told the Tampa Bay Times that the same STRIVR technology Palmer used religiously has been rolled out in Tampa for Jameis.
The Cardinals added STRIVER in 2015, the same year the Bucs added the competitor Sidekiq. So Joe has to wonder whether the Bucs simply bought the wrong software four years ago, or whether their former coaching staff didn’t understand its value. Or both?
The 2015 Bucs season featured a still-unthinkable home blowout loss, an historic defeat the following month (Capitol Collapse), and a four-game losing streak to close the season. And the real stunner was those Bucs might have been the first team in NFL freakin’ history to have a top-10 offense (No. 5) and defense (No. 10) and still lose 10 games.
So Joe think it’s reasonable to think the guys running the team picked the wrong software.
Good luck with your new toy, Jameis.
June 10th, 2019 at 5:12 pm
Proof that coach bj was out of his league. Not only did JW have to overcome opposing defenses he had to overcome his own coaching staff.
June 10th, 2019 at 5:12 pm
I’m for anything that will actually help. Just have to watch the gimmicky
June 10th, 2019 at 5:13 pm
I remember that top 10 defense. They were the worst on third down, they gave up a league record of 72% completion and gave up the most points. We were pretty good against the run but teams figured out quick we could not stop the pass and they made little attempt to run. That was the tennessee ready year.
June 10th, 2019 at 5:13 pm
I bet Jameis is real good at the virtual reality game.
June 10th, 2019 at 5:14 pm
He’s gonna turn in his scores to the next team that might sign him.
June 10th, 2019 at 5:18 pm
db55
and folks got their panties in a bunch when JW said he can relate better to BL….BL has experience as a player in the league and having played the position at the highest level…..
MB was over his head along with dirk and smitty….
GO BUCS!!!!!
June 10th, 2019 at 5:21 pm
What’s next? Shoes? Laces? Helmet?
June 10th, 2019 at 5:21 pm
813
Monken was the only one worth anything
June 10th, 2019 at 5:32 pm
I lied. The bucs gave up 70% completion which was 32nd, 26th in scoring defense, 29th in 3rd down conversion, 31st red zone td percentage. The tennessee ready days.
June 10th, 2019 at 5:36 pm
NE/Brady has been using Strivr since 2017. There is your answer on the question of the Bucs picking the wrong software.
June 10th, 2019 at 5:39 pm
Yard don’t win games:
They were 26th in scoring defense.
Even going by yards, they were 27th in yards given up per drive, and 31st in points given up per drive.
Horrible.
It’s insanely flukey they were top 10 in yards on defense that year.
And it’s extremely Dirk Koetterish that they were top 5 in offensive yards but only 20th in scoring.
Top 5 in yards per drive
but only 16th in points per drive
Dude does not have that killer scoring instinct as a play caller. He knows how to move thet eam but something happens when the field shortens.
GO BUCS!
June 10th, 2019 at 5:46 pm
Dirk and his staff dropped the ball on a lot of things.
June 10th, 2019 at 5:47 pm
Why does every one of my post go into moderation?
June 10th, 2019 at 5:48 pm
What is Mr Magoo’s uncorrected vision? What is his DQ?… decision quotient
June 10th, 2019 at 5:57 pm
So let me get this straight. My post asking why does all my post go to moderation is cleared before the first two posts I submitted on this thread? Wow joe. Unbelievable. I guess you did not like me talking about the tennesee ready defense you called top 10. Lesson learned.
June 10th, 2019 at 6:04 pm
smh. Joe approved the comments in chronological order in the moderation queue. No conspiracy.
June 10th, 2019 at 6:04 pm
I used to turn the caddie help off during putting in PGA Tiger Woods golf back in the day……
June 10th, 2019 at 6:45 pm
Was Sidekiq cheaper? If so, that’s probably why the Glazer Babies bought it over STRIVER.
It makes sense since you know how much the BP Gulf Oil spill ruined their finances and cost them all the fan support. Just ask their lawyers.
June 10th, 2019 at 6:49 pm
A lot of noise was made in the last off-season (and the playoffs right before it) about Case Keenum’s heavy use of VR and how he and everybody else said it had a huge impact on his big improvement. So there’s Keenum and Palmer as exhibits A and B for VR doing something to help. But… obviously coaching, scheme/playcalling, and surrounding support on the offensive unit still have a LOT to do with a quarterback’s success — because exhibit C is Keenum last year in Denver…..
June 10th, 2019 at 7:31 pm
Gee, why do I have this ominous feeling in 6 months the Winston groupies are going to be blaming THIS coaching staff?
– Looking over his shoulder with Fitz made him uncomfortable.
– Trying too hard.
– The run game sucks.
– Couldn’t “relate” to his previous OC and HC.
– The O line sucks.
– DJAX Pearl Harbored him.
– The software sucks (Editorial: What App does Brady use?)
– What am I missing?
The shameful excuses run loud, and run DEEP. And ignoring Winston’s inability to follow rules and make good decisions is conspicuously missing for the Winston lovers.
June 10th, 2019 at 7:37 pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlVaI-E0ujk
vs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwnjjUDOets
Its like comparing MS Paint to Photoshop. Just goes to show how out of touch the previous coaching staff was.
June 10th, 2019 at 7:38 pm
Dude
Who would you prefer to have as our franchise QB?
June 10th, 2019 at 8:10 pm
@ db55
Thats easy. He would prefer david duke
June 10th, 2019 at 9:02 pm
There are many more I’d prefer. First, no one on the roster this year or last five years. None of the one I’d like are reachable. Pat Mahomes, Deshaun Watson, Baker Mayfield. Yup, none of those are attainable NOW but ALL of them could have been had we ended the Winston experiment end of ’17. I didn’t like the Bucs prospects of drafting Mariota either. Going forward, we need to draft our own new guy…yet again. Winston has bamboozled the Glazers long enough, and JL keeps him because when he gives up on him, it’s an indictment of his own body of work here…as if that’s not already etched on the cliff folks are jumping off.
June 10th, 2019 at 9:13 pm
@Lord C … “Yard don’t win games: They were 26th in scoring defense.”
Have tried to make that argument MANY times LC, but it’s the classic ‘peeing in the wind” (or as Joe would say “Urinating in the wind”. But hey, my wife gave me a placard several years ago that she says describes me pretty well … “I live in my own little world, but it’s OK, they know me here”. Maybe we should invest in one of those for Joe.
June 10th, 2019 at 9:20 pm
VR can absolutely be useful for this – but it does require some really good software. Also the tech difference in VR between now and 2015 is huge. I’ve been into VR since the 90s and had the Oculus Rift since DK1 up through the new Quest, and leaps that have taken place in only a few years is pretty remarkable – and the stuff coming here very soon is even more remarkable. But using it for this, again, it needs some amazing software and I just can’t believe there is a big enough of a market to really sink money into the software development side of things – not to mention the hardware tracking needed for like arm trajectory and stuff (assuming it’s being used for more than just reading defenses.
June 10th, 2019 at 9:29 pm
The nut huggers who gripe about Winston
They needed a chance at a franchise QB and they went with the number 1 talent. Go figure
June 10th, 2019 at 9:31 pm
They should have taken. Blah blah blah they waited a year to late. They pulled the trigger a year to early and could have this guy. Who cares
Get over it
June 10th, 2019 at 9:36 pm
Please next just hand in your resamay to the Bucs and you see what happens.
Not qualified
June 10th, 2019 at 9:39 pm
Hey I’ve got a Sega Genesis with Madden ready to help at one buc!
June 10th, 2019 at 9:43 pm
I think its trash
June 10th, 2019 at 10:59 pm
Mahommes, Watson, Mayfield.. What do they have in common??? All were off the board when the Bucs drafted..
June 11th, 2019 at 12:20 am
Ok. Winston as a rookie was the second rookie in nfl history to throw 5 tds in one game. Oh and he had 0 ints and won. Watson was the third rookie qb to throw 5 tds in a game. He also threw 4 ints in that game and lost but fans like the magadude still praised watson. The irony is just appalling. This is the dumbest fan base
June 11th, 2019 at 12:48 am
My bad. 4 was his number on his jersey but he did have games where he threw 2 ints and fumbled but watson TEAM won. There are many articles in 2018 talking about watson’s turnover issues especially in the redzone/endzone. But according to vuc fans, its okay if watson does it but winston is a bum
June 11th, 2019 at 12:57 am
Watson had 9 ints and 9 fumbles last year. Winston 14 ints and 7 fumbles. The difference is defense and kicking. We need defense buc fans
June 11th, 2019 at 1:39 am
Rod,
You are spot on. There’s such a small market to capture that it’s not cost effective to develop the software. I know first hand and the best option I was given was to create a hybrid system using madden as a platform to construct around. The licensing , if it was available, would be enormous and push any break even calculations far beyond any but the most fantastical revenue projections. The price to start from scratch, even if the coding was written in China, was so expensive as it was a non starter.
I don’t know if you’ve experienced the occulus with a racing sim from Assetto.
Unbelievable. And the gains in both the vr, and software from as little as this year from last is amazing. Comparing today vs 5yrs ago is akin to comparing a model t to a current year Mustang gt. Check it out i.
June 11th, 2019 at 1:46 am
Rod,
Believe it or not the arm trajectory and all the other calculations required to construct an accurate sim is actually one of the easiest to do. In fact, it’s as simple as plug and play and there’s multiple methods that all are capable of accurately replicating a throw.
June 11th, 2019 at 3:28 am
Webster,
Watson threw 4ints in a game vs 5TD.
Winston threw 5 and no picks in a game.
And the thing you take away from this is …..
People continue to praise watson because they’re dumb.
….
There’s no need to point to the smart one game comparison or missing the one and only variable …..but it’s worth questioning the accusations that you make regarding other fans opinions. Perhaps the people who don’t agree with you may be looking at other data than you.
I’m suggesting that fans may look at numbers like 26-9, 19-8 , 103.
another set that includes, 19-14, 19-11, 91.1.and conclude that the first set is superior to the second set. Any other conclusion is mathematically incorrect.
So there’s really just one correct answer . Set one.
What numbers are those ?
Answer , season totals for ( previous 2 seasons )TD’S -INT’s, passer ratings.
The first set is Watson and the second Winston.
The superior numbers don’t change when we add names to them. Therefore,
Watson is superior to winston.
Question,
What is dumb and what’s dumbest? Your one game comparison or the fact that you see yourself as much more intelligent than anyone else?
June 11th, 2019 at 4:16 am
Well which is better Jameis “Virtual Stats” Winston or Jameis “Meaningless Stats” Winston?
Can’t find virtual wins and losses in the record book but I do find actual wins and losses in the QB stats page.
A simulator can help prepare you for battle but it can’t win the battle for you.
The “Best” QB in Buccaneers History is not even on track to make the Ring of Honor at Ray Jay.
Not even the virtual ring either…
June 11th, 2019 at 5:14 am
Pete, help me out, I can’t tell exactly where you stand on Winston, day after day, thread after thread.
June 11th, 2019 at 6:17 am
Ah, there’s our man webster again throwing down the race card…no wonder he is in moderation.
June 11th, 2019 at 7:05 am
Why don’t the whole team use virtual reality, it would help on injuries. Maybe the O-line could learn how to block better. Maybe Jason Licht could learn how to manage better.
June 11th, 2019 at 8:47 am
Lord Cornelius,
If yards do not win games, then why point out the yards other teams got on our defense?
Hmn?
June 11th, 2019 at 1:42 pm
D1 – Interesting stuff, thanks for sharing. I should have said on the arm side of things is the external tracking accuracy and then figuring out release point and where it’s going, etc, AND have it integrated into whatever it is you’re seeing on screen – assuming the software is that complex and isn’t just a light gun like experience where you throw to the open guy and it only knows if the direction/angle is correct.
June 12th, 2019 at 11:38 am
Ah, gotta love posting offensive and defensive rankings based on yards, as if that means ANYTHING!
What were their ranks in SCORING offense?
How about in SCORING defense?
Ah, that’s right, NOT top-10 in either. Why don’t you post stats that actually matter?