Clobbering The Quarterback Class

April 10th, 2014
johnny football 0216

A Super Bowl-winning quarterback offers little love for Johnny Football and his QB classmates

After last year’s pre-draft happy talk about Mike Glennon and Geno Smith, now it’s time for the 2014 edition of Phil Simms’ annual look at quarterbacks in the NFL Draft, via CBSSports.com.

Simms, the former Giants quarterback, is not feeling the love from this year’s giant crop of QBs. And that makes Joe happy on a sunny day with (plummeting?) Johnny Football in town for an intense visit at One Buc Palace.

The negativity keeps pouring in from various angles. And that can only help make a superstar prospect like Johnny Football or Teddy Bridgewater fall to the QB-needy Bucs at the No. 7 overall pick. Yes, the Bucs need a quarterback with a lot more upside than Glennon and Josh McCown possess.

Simms says Blake Bortles doesn’t throw easily and Johnny Football is a circus. Here’s more on two other hopefuls.

3. Teddy Bridgewater: Simms was quick to say Bridgewater’s spotty pro day performance was a “red flag.” The Louisville QB should have looked a lot better than he did and some of his bad throw tendencies that show up in games were present at the pro day.

We focused on the glove Bridgewater wore during the season and what it meant. Simms said, “The glove is important to him because it hides a deficiency in his motion. Bridgewater is not a classic thrower, he dips under his ball and the elbow drops, the glove saves his throws.” Simms also felt Bridgewater’s arm faded late in the season, which is a concern.

4. Derek Carr: Simms was surprised I asked about Carr in the same context of the other three because he hadn’t heard anyone talk about the Fresno State QB along with the others.

Simms said some would hold his brother (onetime No. 1 overall pick David Carr) against him, but wasn’t sold on Derek Carr as a first-round talent anyway. Simms did say Carr can spin the ball and has some God-given talent, but there are just too many screens and lob balls to get excited. As for Carr’s mechanics, Simms thought he was a bit tight and too much like he’s been lifting a lot of weights.

Joe doesn’t discount Simms’ analysis (you can click-through above to read) but Joe is simply not scared off by the criticism. It was clear months ago that all the QBs in this class have question marks that take them out of can’t-miss status. There are no Andrew Lucks here. But that doesn’t mean a quarterback won’t make sense for the Bucs at No. 7.

Jason Licht has said he’s all about “value.” Well, considering the peanuts that first-round quarterbacks earn for the their first five years under the rookie salary cap, a QB certainly could be good value at that position. If Glennon or McCown thrive, they’ll bee looking for gargantuan contracts soon long before a 2014 first-round pick.

But that kind of talk is for bean counters. A successful quarterback is worth a ton. Joe simply thinks the Bucs’ best shot for one lies in the draft.

114 Responses to “Clobbering The Quarterback Class”

  1. ander Says:

    i hear phil simms alot in the radio down here in south florida however i am not impressed with the way he analyzes and explains the reasons why he doesnt like a player.

    @joe i rather ask you i know espn is bspn but what you think about merril hoge basically saying manziel shouldnt get drafted?? since i know you are a big fan of jonny football

  2. bucrightoff Says:

    Actually the fact there are no sure things or Andrew Luck’s makes it much less likely a rookie GM will tie himself to a QB who may flame out. Obviously the GM who picks a QB bust in his first draft is the GM who gets fired promptly.

    And your comment on Glennon makes no sense. He’s locked into his rookie deal for 3 more years. That’s what makes Russell Wilson the best value in the NFL by far. Joe Flacco makes $20 million…Russell Wilson makes $700,000.

  3. Sweets Willie Says:

    While getting dressed for his private workout for the Bucs, Manziel’s socks and cleets were stolen. He is throwing barefoot. One mystery man is taking numerous photos of Johnny’s feet.

  4. robert6 Says:

    another manziel piece….REALLY? very tired. your losing people on here because of this.

    from a business standpoint you might want to rethink it. there’s are other places for buc news

  5. BFFL Says:

    Johnny is the only QB that has more upside than Glennon and I am part of the MGM. I’m also part of the JMM so I’m really conflicted.

    Being a “circus” is not a real critique. It sounds like Phil Simms has some personal issues. The real circus was his son Chris. Didn’t he get caught smoking some Marry Jane. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but you should at least have enough brains not to do it in a car. Also, what’s up with that sissy tattoo on his ankle?

  6. Joe Says:

    there’s are other places for buc news

    Sure, But no one does it like Joe. :)

  7. Bucsfanman Says:

    Didn’t feel like a Manziel piece to me. In fact, other than the photo, I’d say the Johnny love was muted.
    Well said BFFL. I have not heard a legit critique on Manziel other than being a “circus” and being “too small”.

  8. deminion Says:

    love the site were are fortunate joe doesnt charge…

  9. Buc1987 Says:

    deminion says

    “love the site were are fortunate joe doesnt charge…

    shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

    robert6 (MGM) the draft is almost here buddy, it will be over soon. I’m still counting down the days so Joe will stop it.

  10. Couch Fan Says:

    @Buc1987

    I’m debating on whether Joe is really going to stop or not. But either way people need to quit bitchin. Sheesh. Dont read the article if your so “tired” of hearing about Manziel. Quite simple really.

  11. Buc1987 Says:

    Bucsfanman Says: “Well said BFFL. I have not heard a legit critique on Manziel other than being a “circus” and being “too small”.”

    I guess you didn’t click the link to read Simms full critique on Manziel. So hear ya go. Might be some stuff Joe left off the article on purpose.

    2. Johnny Manziel: When I mentioned Manziel, the first thing Simms said was: “Get ready, because the circus is coming to town,” and that the team drafting Manziel has to be all in with who Johnny Football is as a quarterback.Simms is “bothered by his size and that speed is such a big part of his game,” pointing out that all QBs slow down as their pro careers advance, but NFL defenses never slow down.

    Simms’ main question about Manziel: “How will he be when he loses speed?”

    As for Manziel’s throwing, Simms said, “He throws fairly well, but not by NFL standards,” adding a concern that Manziel’s arm was less crisp later in the season. When I noted how good his arm looked in the bowl game, Simms was quick to point out getting a month off to rest for a bowl game is no measuring stick because NFL quarterbacks never get a month off.

    I asked Simms about Manziel’s relatively small body of work in college — only 26 regular-season games — as a foundation for NFL readiness. Simms said Manziel should come out now because he may not get any better at Texas A&M, where he’s already taken a lot of hits.

    LOOK! Look at that picture above does that guy look like a guy that can sustain that many hits in the NFL. He’s going to get KILLED!

  12. Ernest T. Bass Says:

    I love the Johnny Football stories!! They make my day, the comments have me laughing so hard!! I’m going to miss them after the draft, unless somehow Johnny does end up with the Bucs. Then the whirlwind would continue…

  13. unbelievable Says:

    Does Simms ever like any quarterbacks besides Brady and manning ? I hate listening to him announce games. I respect his skills, but his voice just bothers me.

  14. doubting thomas Says:

    “If Glennon or McCown thrive, they’ll be looking for gargantuan contracts soon long before a 2014 first-round pick.” Would that be such a bad thing? Only 1yr difference between Glennon vs. a rookie on that potential big contract. Only difference being if we don’t reach for Johnny at 7 then maybe we’ve filled another big hole on the team with someone 5 yrs. out from a big contract.

  15. phattitudes Says:

    “Value” does not lie in a non franchise Quarterbacks who falls to number 7. Value lies in grabbing the cream from a “loaded” crop of Wide Receivers. The number 7 pick has value and to waste it on a grabbing the perceived best from a weak class of Quarterbacks is not prudent. Using a 3rd round or latter pick will still yield an iffy Quarterback candidate but not waste the valued higher picks in doing it.

  16. tmaxcon Says:

    Johnny @ 7

    It’s time for Tampa to have a rock star qb with a strong will to win. Winners win losers make excuses. The bucs had the worst offense and worst qb in the league last year those are facts. It’s time to win now. Stop wasting time with mediocre qbs better suited for holding clipboards or fetching coffee

  17. Nick H Says:

    Hopefully we’re not picking 7th overall for a long time, but our best shot to get a top tier college QB is probably now. Although being 4-12 it’s hard to say that we absolutely CANNOT draft outside of the QBs since we could use some young talent almost everywhere on the field.

    Bang for buck is relative now with the wage scales, I just can’t help but feel like there’s more bust potential in QBs due to the nature of media scrutiny at that position. Not to mention draft history.

    Whoever our guy is, I’ll be pleased as long as it’s one of the top 10 talents. Johnny Football or not, but preferably not lol.

  18. Nick H Says:

    Who’s to stay Jonathan Manziel isn’t better suited for holding clipboards in the NFL? He’s never played a snap, none of these guys have.

    I don’t understand the “superstar” status, must be media hype infecting the brains.

  19. tmaxcon Says:

    I find it funny that the Glennon supporters love to point out Johnny size. People in glass houses should not throw rocks. Glennon is not by any stretch an athletic qb nor does he have an athletic body type. Tall and skinny is more fragile than average height any skinny.

  20. JGM 2.0 Says:

    “robert6 Says:

    April 10th, 2014 at 11:15 am
    another manziel piece….REALLY? very tired. your losing people on here because of this.

    from a business standpoint you might want to rethink it. there’s are other places for buc news”

    That is true, but this is the best place to get Bucs news.

  21. Buc Fan #237 Says:

    I get my laughs from JBF…

    but I get my football news from here

    http://www.lockerpulse.com/NFL/Buccaneers/

  22. bucrightoff Says:

    tmaxcon Says:
    April 10th, 2014 at 12:09 pm
    Johnny @ 7

    It’s time for Tampa to have a rock star qb with a strong will to win. Winners win losers make excuses. The bucs had the worst offense and worst qb in the league last year those are facts. It’s time to win now. Stop wasting time with mediocre qbs better suited for holding clipboards or fetching coffee
    ________________________________________________________

    Worst QB in the league eh? The hyperbole people go to sometimes just to slam Glennon makes them deranged. I mean worst QB in the league? Good lord….

  23. Buc1987 Says:

    tmaxcon ….I see no MGM referring to Manziel’s size on this thread. If you’re talking about me, I’m not part of the mob.

  24. tmaxcon Says:

    32 ranked offense out 32 teams equal worst offense. Fact… Glennon got worse the more tape on him. Fact. I’m tired of losing and wasting time on mediocre qbs. FACT… Other than the mob no other group sees Glennon as a savior because he is not. The National media doesn’t even consider him a threat to a career backup. Win now

  25. brandonbucfan Says:

    Let’s see..unless I forget the same family that owned the BUCS under first year Rockstar and RAH and let them move up to pick JF5 still own the team. Do you REALLY think they will allow ANY chance of another 1st round QB mistake unless there is a “can’t miss” there (and unfortunately there ISN’T”) Trad down build the team as I mentioned earlier this morning.

  26. Buc Fan #237 Says:

    Manziel is tiny.

    His arm strength is on record as weaker and slower than Glennons from the combine… if he were man enough to throw at the Combine.

  27. mpmalloy Says:

    Dear Joe,
    You are so courageous to come out with your true
    feelings about Johnny Football. If it’s really how
    you feel then an alternative lifestyle is nothing to be ashamed of.
    You are a beacon to other men who are trapped and afraid to
    let their true feeling show.

    Godspeed my flowery friend.

  28. deminion Says:

    im rdy for the draft man im loving the new regime even if the moves are questionable man as long as we win… glad schiano is gone glad lovie weeded out guys u have to ask yourself are we a better team on paper then last yr i say yes we actually have depth now and the dline looks better oline looks better already do u remember how much of a disaster that it was sure we need a qb so does most of the league but we are going in the right direction

  29. mpmalloy Says:

    On a more somber note:
    Good Gravy! If Phil Simms thinks this class
    of QB’s is over-hyped then that’s it.
    That’s the definitive opinion.
    Add his name to the list of smart football minds
    who would not necessarily target ANY of the QBs
    in the 2014 draft.

    Especially not bringing a guy with Manziels personal
    vices to Tampa. The Austin college chicks are a far
    far cry from the professionals that proliferate in Tampa.
    If Manziel gets mixed up with them (and he will if he comes here)
    it can only hurt the team. The media will be waiting with
    baited breath for the first DUI or domestic violence charge.
    Hell, they may even set up naive little Johnny just to boost
    their ratings.

    Again. Sane minds agree. Draft BPA which is NOT Jonny FB.

  30. deminion Says:

    BPA BPA BPA

  31. bucrightoff Says:

    tmaxcon Says:
    April 10th, 2014 at 12:30 pm
    32 ranked offense out 32 teams equal worst offense. Fact… Glennon got worse the more tape on him. Fact. I’m tired of losing and wasting time on mediocre qbs. FACT… Other than the mob no other group sees Glennon as a savior because he is not. The National media doesn’t even consider him a threat to a career backup. Win now
    __________________________________________________________

    Fact: Saying the word fact does not make what you’re saying a fact. You utterly despise Glennon to such an extreme level that my only possible guess is he slept with your girlfriend. I’m not sure anyone has claimed Glennon is a savior. That said you act like he’s the wors QB to ever play the game. From the sounds of your rants, you’d rather have Tebow as QB.

    It’s funny because beyond this site, most people like Glennon. Go see some positive Glennon post on PFT and you’ll always see more, and in some cases substantially more, thumbs up than down. Many franchises wish they had a QB would performed as well, circumstantially, as Glennon did. The Bucs will be mocked by the national media if they straight up dump Glennon, and they should be too.

  32. Patrick Says:

    We had the 32ND ranked offense with FREEMAN. Glennon gave us the 27th ranked offense!!! Get your facts straight!!!

  33. tmaxcon Says:

    Excuses excuses excuses… Glennon is a good backup not a starting qb. Twisting and turning stats and words will not change that. Glennon maybe a decent guy personaly. I have no idea nor do I care. I care about winning this isn’t tee ball and everyone does not get a trophy. Bucs need a winner with IT… Call it charisma or whatever you like but neither Glennon nor career backup McCown have that quality. Wins are all that matter. Bucs need winners not nice guys that people nonstop make excuses for. I’ll miss some of the mob when Glennon is traded draft day or prior to draft.

  34. Buc1987 Says:

    bucrightoff says :

    “It’s funny because beyond this site, most people like Glennon.”

    You’re right they do. There are positive stuff about Glennon all over the net.

  35. Buc1987 Says:

    tmaxcon….you guys can call it excuses all you want but they are still facts. Such as only having one decent WR, no RB threa,t a weak ass offensive line that is not even here more.

    Again I’m not part of the mob. I just want the best QB in there to help the TEAM win.

  36. tmaxcon Says:

    Winners make subpar players better which removes the need for excuses. I want to win now and the bucs need a qb, wr and Oline help desperately to accomplish wins. In so called deep draft. I must trust that l&l will pick accordingly and not stand for mediocre qb play.

  37. bucrightoff Says:

    Don’t worry tmaxcon, when camp rolls around and its McCown, Glennon and Kafka…well you’ll probably already be in the asylum at that point. If not then you will lose your mind.

    I’ve posted it before, I will again. Marino…Russell Wilson….RGIII…Glennon…the only rookie QBs ever to have 10 more TDs than Ints. Without even getting into circumstance, that’s worthy of being straight dumped? Ok then….

  38. WalkdaPlank Says:

    Glennon sure made Tim Wright look better. And Tiquan Underwood. Just sayin’.

  39. Buc1987 Says:

    tmaxcon …so Matt Ryan is a loser?

  40. Buc1987 Says:

    bucrightoff..ha ha so there’s 2 of us that think it will be McCown, Glennon and Kafka in training camp.

  41. Buc1987 Says:

    I guess we should make up a new mob then. The MGKM?

  42. BamBamBuc Says:

    Gotta love these “size” issues.

    Combine results for QB measurements:
    Bortles: 6’5″ 232
    Bridgewater 6’2″ 214
    Manziel 6’1″ 207

    Griffin III 6’2″ 223
    Luck 6’4 234
    Wilson 5’11″ 204
    Rodgers 6’2″ 223
    Ryan 6’5″ 228
    Stafford 6’2″ 225
    Dalton 6’2″ 215
    Glennon 6’7″ 225

    Looks like 6’2″ to 6’4″ is about average, but not always the best (see Russell Wilson). Seems about 220 to 225 is fairly normal, so a little above or below isn’t significant and weight can be put on in the training room if needed. Just because a QB is 245 doesn’t mean he’ll be good, Newton seems pretty good, but Freeman wasn’t. Seeing guys 6’5″ to 6’7″ still weighing in around 225 definitely means they had a narrower frame entering the NFL than a guy 6’2″ 225 and probably about the same as a guy 6’2″ weighing 215.

    When it comes to taking hits, I have to assume a moving target (that knows how to get down) is much harder to hit squarely than a statue. In this case, comparing Bridgewater to Glennon, both with slight frames, approximately equal build, it should be safe to assume Bridgewater will take less punishment than Glennon simply because he can more easily get out of the way of the direct hit.

    The thing I have to think about in this draft (with supposedly no QB that is “guaranteed” franchise like Luck) is what makes the good QBs good. First thing that comes to mind is football smarts. Every future HOF playing now, plus Ryan, Rodgers, etc are extremely smart QBs. Glennon is smart, Bridgewater is extremely football smart. More recently, with guys like Rodgers and Luck and Newton and Wilson it’s functional mobility. Not always scrambling ability, but mobility. Bridgewater has that in spades.

    Sure, there are some deficiencies you can pick apart with most any player, but we have a chance to get a franchise QB this year. Is it guaranteed? No, of course not. It never is. We can get a #2 WR at almost any point in this draft. We can add OL deep in the draft. Getting an “almost can’t miss” franchise QB is best served in Rnd 1. Draft the WR and we may only get the chance to get the “surefire” franchise QB by mortgaging the future to the hilt moving up from the middle of the draft to the top and having to outbid every other team in the league to get him. Every team covets the surefire player. That’s why you take the “almost a sure thing” guy when you have the chance without giving up anything.

  43. Buc1987 Says:

    Manziel 6’1? BamBam don’t buy the lie.

  44. Orca Says:

    I would argue none of the big-3 (or 4) QBs are a “good value” in the top 10 due to the significant risk in their selection. I’ve said it before – it’s MUCH better value to take your chances with a 2nd or 3rd round QB this year.

  45. Patrick Says:

    @tmaxcon……..they’re facts, not excuses. Stop spewing bull s#*@ cause that’s what you’re doing. You’re obviously living under a rock if you don’t see the promise Glennon showed last season. What did you expect him to do? Play like Manning?

  46. rdbucfan Says:

    tmaxcon

    The worst QB in the league last year is no longer employed in the NFL and was a contributor to the 32nd ranked offense. The NY Giants offense led by Superbowl MVP Eli Manning was ranked 28th last year. Shouldn’t the Giants draft a QB in the 1st round. Maybe they should move up to take Johnny Backfoot the 2014 NFL int/pick 6 king. Did you realize that the teams running the same offense as the bucs last year also struggled? Maybe they should all draft a QB since their veterans barely outplayed a rookie 3rd round pick.

    You should not be depending on the national media to tell you the skill of a player. You should rely on those that evaluate talent for a living for that info. Joe has talked to some of them and a majority think Glennon is a good QB. As Joe would say it’s in the archives.

    Joe doesn’t think Glennon is any good because his good buddy the little puppy told him so.

  47. Buc1987 Says:

    I know another thing (excuse) I was bitching about Sully’s playcalling way before Glennon was named the starter. So there ya go, there’s another excuse too.

    Again I’m not all that impressed with Glennon as well. Not part of the mob, but considering all the circumstances (excuses) that he was dealing with I think he did okay and I would have liked to have seen him play along with a decent squad. Considering L&L are tearing apart the squad that Glennon had to work with.

  48. rdbucfan Says:

    Buc1987,

    Count me in the MGKM also.

  49. stevek Says:

    Bam Bam,

    Teddy was 188 pounds last season. He is a small guy, with smallish hands.

    Not a fan in the 1st.

    Give me on of:

    Clowney, Mack, Watkins, Mathews, Robinson, Lewan, Donald, Trad Back.

  50. rdbucfan Says:

    Buc1987

    Isn’t it kind of funny that Glennon is one of the remaining players from the 4-12, 32nd ranked offense and it was the offensive line that was blown up. L&L also brought i a veteran to teach Glennon as per Licht himself. I can’t wait for the draft, there is going to be some butt hurt people that weekend. I don’t care who we graft, L&L will get my support until they no longer deserve my support.

  51. Buc1987 Says:

    rdbucfan …yah man I think that’s what they are going to do. Some may say Glennon might get traded pre-draft or during, but I’m not one of them. I think L&L have of course seen the tape on Glennon and are smart enough to know the mess he was thrown into. We’ll see though, but that’s where I’m leaning right now. It’s still hard to get a gauge L&L though. After the draft and a full season maybe they will be a little more easier to make predict.

  52. lightningbuc Says:

    It is blatantly obvious that Phil Simms is just another in a long line of jealous non-pullers who is envious of John’s pulling ability.

  53. WalkdaPlank Says:

    @lightning – If I were Johnny I would be more jealous of that Super Bowl Ring. With that thing you don’t need Mancrush’s “ability to pull” to get someone. lol

  54. Bill Byrne Says:

    The BUCS continue to need football players, to get back to the playoffs, NOT wanna-be Fran Tarkentons.

  55. Bucfan#37 Says:

    I agree with the poster who said Simm’s voice irritates. I don’t like him from a game in the past, it may have been his first start for the Giants back some years ago when he beat the undefeated Bucs who were 4-0 or 5-0 up in New York. That and then his son was a washout for the Bucs.

  56. JBFstalkingjohnnyfootBALLS Says:

    Please don’t be surprise if Johnny falls in the draft. It has happen in drafts past. He scare some teams. Truth be told, known of the QB’s are worthy of top 10 pick. Bucs is in need of a player will play right away. Clowney, Watkins, and one of the OT’s.

  57. mark2001 Says:

    Johnny’s not a Munchkin, but would be lucky to top out at 6′ tall. Probably about 5’11 and 190….and why do you think he wore the pads? Maybe to look bigger? Rodgers about right…Favre about 6’2, 220. Not saying he can’t play, but we will see how he holds up for someone, starting about six months from now.

  58. Buc1987 Says:

    JBFstalkingjohnnyfootBALLS ….if he slips past the 15th or even the 20th Joe and Eric are going to go freaking crazy. Should be a fun day in here though either way. What if he’s there and they do take him at 7? Joe will probably jump so high in the air they will need the fire department to pull his head out of his ceiling

  59. JBFstalkingjohnnyfootBALLS Says:

    @lightningbuc Says:
    April 10th, 2014 at 2:58 pm

    It is blatantly obvious that Phil Simms is just another in a long line of jealous non-pullers who is envious of John’s pulling ability.

    What are you, a teenager? Anyone talk bad of lil Johnny is jealous? Wow! Go kiss your Johnny Football posters, and wait for mommy to finish supper. Geez!
    Like a teenage girl upset about someone speaking badly of Justin Bieber.

  60. Buc1987 Says:

    @Harry wherever you are. Now I’m being hypocritical. Joe’s got me posting on Manziel articles all the time now. I guess that’s what happens when you have no life like me.

    Manziel maybe 6 ft with cleats and helmet on.

  61. Posey99 Says:

    Franchise QB or not in this Draft, who knows? I know this: I’ve never seen a better draft of Quarterbacks. We will take one. Get over it.

  62. lightningbuc Says:

    JBFstalking,

    I take it you are new on here since you didn’t get my comment. Joe is the one who has been telling those of us who don’t want to draft Johnny that it must be because we couldn’t get laid in college and are jealous of Manziel because he can “pull”.

  63. rdbucfan Says:

    JBFstalkingjohnnyfootBALLS Says: 
    April 10th, 2014 at 4:29 pm

    @lightningbuc Says:
    April 10th, 2014 at 2:58 pm

    It is blatantly obvious that Phil Simms is just another in a long line of jealous non-pullers who is envious of John’s pulling ability.

    What are you, a teenager? Anyone talk bad of lil Johnny is jealous? Wow! Go kiss your Johnny Football posters, and wait for mommy to finish supper. Geez!
    Like a teenage girl upset about someone speaking badly of Justin Bieber.

    JBFstalkingjohnnyBALLS,

    lightningbuc was just using Joe’s own words against him. Joe said a few weeks ago the reason people dislike Johnny is their jealousy towards his ability to pull in college. Which stems from their inability to pull in college.

  64. Phillip Says:

    He was 5’11 3/4″

    http://www.nfl.com/combine/participants

    Click on position and player its really that simple

    Height doesn’t mean everything… As long as he can see the throwing lanes and deliver the ball, that is all that matters… Watch Brees and Wilson in the pocket along with any other shorter QB

  65. robert6 Says:

    Sorry, I did not read the article. assumed it was another johnny love fest. others probably did the same

  66. JBFstalkingjohnnyfootBALLS Says:

    @Buc1987,

    The circus is a concern to some, not all NFL front office. Then you have the height. He doesn’t always take what the defense gives him. And NFL defenses don’t give you what you want. He bring things to the table that other QB’s don’t have. But is he or any of the QB’s worth top 10 consideration. And do the top teams feel that way.

  67. JBFstalkingjohnnyfootBALLS Says:

    @lightningbuc ,

    I would like to apologize to you.

  68. Buc1987 Says:

    “Like a teenage girl upset about someone speaking badly of Justin Bieber.”

    Joe loves Johnny more than any teenage girl loves Bieber.

  69. Buc Fan #237 Says:

    Why come no Manziel critique?

    “2. Johnny Manziel: When I mentioned Manziel, the first thing Simms said was: “Get ready, because the circus is coming to town,” and that the team drafting Manziel has to be all in with who Johnny Football is as a quarterback.Simms is “bothered by his size and that speed is such a big part of his game,” pointing out that all QBs slow down as their pro careers advance, but NFL defenses never slow down.

    Simms’ main question about Manziel: “How will he be when he loses speed?”

    As for Manziel’s throwing, Simms said, “He throws fairly well, but not by NFL standards,” adding a concern that Manziel’s arm was less crisp later in the season. When I noted how good his arm looked in the bowl game, Simms was quick to point out getting a month off to rest for a bowl game is no measuring stick because NFL quarterbacks never get a month off.

    I asked Simms about Manziel’s relatively small body of work in college — only 26 regular-season games — as a foundation for NFL readiness. Simms said Manziel should come out now because he may not get any better at Texas A&M, where he’s already taken a lot of hits.”

    -Pat Kirwin

  70. buccanAy Says:

    Thanks for the link 237…it’s gettin’ harder to find real Buc news and analysis. I like Bucnation, those guys are serious about Buc football. This site has become a cartoon, and Pewter Report’s “editor”, is on some sort of religious crusade, where one’s religious affiliation has taken precedence over BUC FOOTBALL.

  71. Buc Fan #237 Says:

    Also… lookl at the cbssports link Joe privided.

    Manzielis even smaller than Bridgewater. The guy is tiny.

    You know who he reminds me of? Jeff Garcia.

  72. Newschoolbucsfan Says:

    This article is a non issue.I reall dont believe that John “my show”football is going to be taken by the bucs.Anyone who has ever watched a Lovie smith team knows they have a bruising running game.The O line i laughable.I think oline first,reciever second,middle lb third.
    I see johnny football as a lienhart clone.

  73. Buc1987 Says:

    Buc Fan #237…also I already posted that at the top of the thread.

  74. Buc1987 Says:

    Reminds me of Flutie.

  75. BamBamBuc Says:

    That’s all I was getting at, Phillip. Height, weight… it really isn’t an indicator of a good or bad QB. It’s just a way for some people to say “don’t take that guy in the first” like many did with Russell Wilson and the Saints Drew. Just like the Patriots Tom had too fragile a frame as well (6’5″, 211, with a 5.28 40)… yeah, standing on his toes with his chest puffed out holding a 20 lb weight maybe. But hey, he didn’t turn out so bad.

    Yeah, I like Bridgewater in the first and would take him in a heartbeat (although I’m not as high on Manziel, I think he has some intangibles that may or may not translate to the NFL). What I was really getting at is how people LOVE Glennon because he’s 6’7″, yet he only weighs like 10 lbs more than guys 5 inches shorter. To me that is a sure sign he’s scrawnier in build than any of the top 3. Yet people like him because he’s tall? He still had balls batted down at the line of scrimmage, so what does it matter how tall he is? Does he have the frame to add some muscle? Yeah, and so does Bridgewater. Even if he played closer to 190 last year, if they work with him to add muscle rather than just add weight to look like better measurables at the combine, Bridgewater can be just as strong as any of the other QBs. Besides, again, it’s intelligence Bridgewater has. Football intelligence, not just IQ or book smarts. That’s how the Saints QB has survived all these years. Heck, Jeff Garcia was small as well (6-1, 195) yet he survived in the NFL for 12 years and 5 in the CFL before that. A 17 year pro career including 4 Pro Bowls and induction into the CFL HOF.

    If the guy can play, then he can play. Want to get caught up in measurables and maybe miss out on a Wilson, Garcia or Saints QB? Let’s look at one bad Pro Day and throw his whole body of work out the window saying he’s not a guarantee. When a player is good (Bridgewater and Manziel) and a winner, you don’t skip because you’re afraid. I trust NFL scouts and front offices are not afraid and some team will be very happy, while others will lament their timidity.

  76. BamBamBuc Says:

    Doug Flutie – nearly 20 years as a professional QB between the USFL, CFL and NFL. Man, he was horrible…

  77. Buc Fan #237 Says:

    Jeff Garcia was a tough little guy. I liked him with Tampa… but he was only a 9-7 one and done type QB in the NFL… mainly because he couldn’t throw the deep ball unless he had a run and jump crow hop. He couldn’t just arm anything. He couldn’t throw over the line… tiny little NFL QB.

  78. Buc1987 Says:

    Bam…that does not mean he is Flutie.

  79. WalkdaPlank Says:

    Flutie? Nah, Mancrush reminds me of Troy Smith. Heisman winner, short, ran. He didn’t last very long.

  80. Buc1987 Says:

    Maybe Manziel will become a good CFL QB someday too.

  81. stillwantingSB Says:

    Lost in the “fine print” as they say, has anyone besides me noticed that after raving about Josh McCown coming to town to take Glennon’s job away so they could trade him or cut him loose, that he now has turned on him also. Joe, may I ask a question? What are you, steve and justin going to do after the season starts and Glennon is put in at some point? Are you going to repeat last years grand work of talking down the man (every thing to his looks, 3rd round pick crap(as if no other good/great QB’s picked same round or later) and “worst QB in South” (what awards did he get?). Next time you ask him a question, if you ever have, ask him, how does his constant bashing by the print writers and radio hosts effect how he want’s to play and live in Tampa and what effect does he think it had on the team last year after he was identified as Schiano’s boy and responsible for Freeman downfall?

    Anyone remember Terry Bradshaw? He started out the same way Wasn’t it 4 Super Bowls?

  82. JBFstalkingjohnnyfootBALLS Says:

    Doug Flutie was a good NFL QB that was discriminated against because of his 5’10 height. If Doug had been 6’1 or taller, he would have been giving more of an opportunity. The difference between Doug and Johnny, is that Johnny plays out of control sometimes. (Running around throwing up off one leg)

  83. Buc1987 Says:

    (Running around throwing up off one leg)

    Holy crap that has to be fixed.

  84. Newschoolbucsfan Says:

    I have heard alot of people who I know who seem to know football think that manziel reminds them most of Quincy Carter,and how he flopped with the cowboys.

  85. rdbucfan Says:

    Buc1987

    Not just one leg, it’s usually off his back foot fading backwards. That’s why I call him Johnny Backfoot and say he’ll lead the NFL in pick 6′s.

  86. BamBamBuc Says:

    Look, I don’t care if our QB is Dikembe Mutombo or a circus midget, so long as they know how to play & win despite height or weight limitations. We can joke about CFL QBs that had success in the NFL (Warren Moon also went that route, not due to measurables), but success is success. I’d rather get the guy as a rookie than a fifth year player.

  87. Buc1987 Says:

    rdbucfan…maybe he’s like what Jaworski said about him. A project.

  88. Joe Says:

    stillwantingSB:

    Let’s not get carried away with comparing Glennon to Terry Bradshaw just yet. If Glennon beats out McCown, not sure how that’s a bad thing. Not sure that will happen. Joe specifically and directly asked Glennon if he lights things up in training camp and preseason and clearly has a better summer than McCown, if he can win the starting job, Glennon, in so many words, told Joe to ask Lovie.

  89. tmaxcon Says:

    Patrick – stop the keyboard tough guy routine… No one is spreading BS…Just because you disagree with my opinion on Glennon does not make it BS. I am tired of mediocrity and Glennon is the definition of mediocrity. You have every right to disagree and prove me wrong that being said calling someone a BS’er because he disagrees with you is laughable. Get a life tough guy!

    Answer me one question. Did Glennon get better down the stretch or worse????

    Wins are what matter nothing else.

    I am loyal to my Team. Players come and go! some players are better than others some more easier to pull for personally than others. I’ll say it again, if Glennon is destined for stardom and multiple Superbowl championships then teams will be lining up to give draft picks to the bucs. The Bucs need draft picks not mediocrore qb’s with little upside and no athletic ability. He has a nice arm but please don’t embarrass yourself further by calling Glennon Athletic. That’s like calling bigbird George Clooney. I am not going to hide the fact I don’t think Glennon is the answer. Not sure Johnny Football or any QB in this draft is the answer but I’d rather see someone new give it a shot then a QB we have already witnessed wilting down the stretch.

  90. Couch Fan Says:

    Right no rookie that was any good ever wilted down the stretch. Nope none at all. Guess that means he’s a loser. Lol, ignorance is bliss.

  91. tmaxcon Says:

    ignorance is bliss and assuming Glennon is the next coming of Joe Montana is just as ignorant. Especially considering he can’t pull like Montana did. Its just as valid as a point than suggesting the Bucs should not upgrade the QB position. The question is do you want to win a Superbowl or be mediocre year after year. After the last 7 to 10 years I guess mediocre would be an upgrade. Maybe that is why some of the fans on here are so quick to defend players on a 4 and 12 team. The standards need to be raised.

  92. Couch Fan Says:

    Who said he was the next coming of Joe Montana? Oh yea the same guy who says he’s the worst QB in the league to try to prove his point. Nonsense is nonsense no matter how you try to twist it.

  93. tmaxcon Says:

    the bucs don’t have time for Glennon to develop. We will all see Lovie’s opinion on the subject when your boy is traded draft day or prior to draft. maybe it will sink in then he is not the answer. Lovie has to win now not gamble. he did nothing to suggest he would lead the bucs to the Superbowl. I’ll admit if I am wrong but I’d bet a paycheck Glennon is gone draft day or sooner.

  94. lurker Says:

    i think glennon is a scrub, too, but I would take that bet. I hope the bucs take a qb day 1 but do not think glennon will get traded. I also wouldn’t discount the bucs keeping 3 qb’s on the roster, no matter what was said. however, I’ve seen the wonder twins front office cut their noses to spite their face already.

  95. WalkdaPlank Says:

    Didn’t Licht himself say McCown was there to mentor Glennon? I see no problem with a year or two with McCown while Glennon learns the system. I don’t know what the chances are of that happening, but after only 13 games I don’t think it’s safe to say Glennon is or isn’t the answer.

  96. lurker Says:

    sure it is…

    we need more out of the position than either can/will provide.

  97. Buc1987 Says:

    WalkdaPlank welcome to the McCown, Glennon, Kafka Mob. The MGKM!

  98. Maze Says:

    Johnny Wonderlic Manziel. Rumor has it Lovie, loves him some Johnny Football. What a draft day dream that would turn out to be. I want some damn offence for F sakes!

  99. Buc1987 Says:

    “I’ll admit if I am wrong but I’d bet a paycheck Glennon is gone draft day or sooner.”

    ^^^rolling my eyes.

  100. Buc1987 Says:

    Maze ….you’re going to get Lovieball. You’re not going to get offence (offense) for F sakes!

  101. Maze Says:

    Josh Freeman fans must move on.

  102. Maze Says:

    How exactly does hiring Tedford lead you to believe Lovie still wants to run a conservative O. Taking a year off to watch football and reassess the game has opened his eyes from everything I’ve been hearing. Believe brother in better days ahead

  103. Buc Fan #237 Says:

    Josh Freeman fans want Glennon to fail… yet don’t want Johnny Football drafted… they are weird. I think they want Lovie to trade up for Bridgewater.

    Hey Freeman lovers… J Fro is a free agent… wanna sign him to a league min deal and cut Mike Glennon?

  104. WalkdaPlank Says:

    BSPN just showed a mock of the Bucs passing on Mancrush in favor of Mike Evans @7 while Mancrush goes next to the Vikes. I honestly would have no problem with that. No trading up, the Bucs get a stud receiver, and JBF blows up on L&L. T’would be a good show. Lol.

  105. Joe Says:

    JBF blows up on L&L

    Nope. Would be a mistake, but not going to trash L&L.

  106. Joe Says:

    How exactly does hiring Tedford lead you to believe Lovie still wants to run a conservative O. Taking a year off to watch football and reassess the game has opened his eyes from everything I’ve been hearing. Believe brother in better days ahead

    Shoot, even the players don’t know what Tedford’s offense is going to be like. As Vincent Jackson said when Joe talked to him they were on their second day learning it.

  107. Buc1987 Says:

    Maze ….you guys are hilarious. Keep buying th hype.

  108. Buc1987 Says:

    Who here still wants Josh Freeman?

  109. WalkdaPlank Says:

    Not trashing necessarily just an article or two on how bad L&L supposedly messed up. Like saying Dom got played when he traded back for Barron and the Cowboys got Mo Claiborne. Of course, that was before they traded up for Doug Martin. And to think he would’ve gone tothose pesky Giants. One of the few selection and trades Dom got right.

  110. lurker Says:

    don’t need to waste #7 on evans. Watkins only receiver worth it that high. you guys are silly saying the qb’s are worth the pick that high but a plodding receiver to go with our plodding qb’s is?

    Watkins or manziel, please.

  111. Maze Says:

    I guess all I’m saying is Lovie was fired after a 10 win season, so he had to know he needed to adapt to the ever changing NFL. Hiring 1st time NFL offensive coaches to run the two key positions on that side of the ball seems like a bit of a clue that Lovie might be ready to make some necessary adjustments to his coaching stagagy. Damn you NFL for pushing the draft back.

  112. tmaxcon Says:

    Winning is everything. The only ones who remember when you come in 2nd is your wife and your dog. Johnny at 7

    Johnny has a legit shot at rookie of the year not some bs made up qb rookie of the year crap. I’m confused when did every position have a rookie of year. I guess it must say you sucked less than other qbs drafted this year.

    Johnny at 7

  113. stillwantingSB Says:

    Joe

    No-one ever compared Glennon to Bradshaw. I was just saying that when he was first starting, press and other said he was dumb and ignorant(I believe he might have had high grades like Glennon + not a comparison of Glennon to Bradshaw; just a strange coincidence). Remember the Terry Towels?

    As to your question you referenced, that was not the one I challenged you to ask, it was just a poor attempt to deflect the obvious, you did not desire nor would ever ask, so you ignored and answered your own question so others would take the bate and swallow hook line and sinker.

    i will ask again, what will you do when Glennon is put into the game at some point , will you support the team and their QB or will you continue trashing the man anyway you can and every chance you get (it’s in the archives)? Can’t wait how long it takes later today when you join your fellow anti Glennon radio buddy to see how long it is till you start in one the same old crap (4th worst in south, just a backup, lead the worst offense, the list goes on(check the tapes).

    First, Joe doesn’t trash Glennon. Let’s not make stuff up. Glennon did a decent job last season considering his draft status and getting tossed in the fray in Week 4. Joe just doesn’t think Glennon is a starter material. Why is that “trashing?” The current regime just picked journeyman Josh McCown over Glennon. Second, of course Joe will root for Glennon. Joe’s a Bucs fan. When the whistle blows, Joe has no other allegiance than to victory. –Joe

    You are better than this. We are not a member of a mob, not mobsters as steve is want to say. We just want fair treatment from men who are supposed to be non bias, as any good reporter should be if the carry press passes.

    On this point, of course Joe is biased! What have you been missing? Joe’s opinions are out here daily and Joe doesn’t shy away from them or pretend to be objective at all times. This is not a new concept to journalism. The newspapers have been filled with editorials and columns for centuries. –Joe

    Thank you for letting me have a little small voice to express my feelings. Never will not say anything about some one behind their back that I will not say to their face. If I ever get the chance to buy you a beer it would be a pleasure.

    Thanks

  114. BoJim Says:

    tmaxcon. You aren’t gonna change our minds and we will never change yours. You don’t like Glennonn and we do. What a conundrum. I think L&L have a plan to which we are not privy to.

 
 

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