NFC Quarterback Reality And A Defensive Focus

January 29th, 2014

Shaun O’Hara, the former Pro Bowl center now of NFL Network, weighs in on the Bucs.

The Bucs’ conference is loaded with quarterbacks, 14 of 16 NFC teams have established starters with guaranteed jobs.

Twelve have legitimate accomplishments under their belts.

Tony Romo (63-45 record as starter, 3 Pro Bowls)
RGIII (Division Champ)
Eli Manning (Two Super Bowls)
Nick Foles (Division Champ, Pro Bowl)
Aaron Rodgers (Super Bowl)
Jay Cutler (56-48 as a starter, Division Champ)
Drew Brees (Super Bowl)
Cam Newton (Division champ)
Matt Ryan (60-34 as a starter, division titles)
Colin Kaepernick (Super Bowl, Pro Bowl)
Russell Wilson (Super Bowl, Pro Bowl)
Carson Palmer (Division titles, Pro Bowls)

That leaves former No. 1 overall picks Matthew Stafford and Sam Bradford, guys with massive talent that have yet to reach their potential, though Stafford did have one phenomenal season in 2011 and one the NFL’s comeback player of the year award.

And then there’s the mess in Minnesota — and Mike Glennon.

This is what gnaws at Joe’s core. The Bucs need to improve at quarterback. They need big time competition for Glennon — at least. It’s a quarterback league, and the Bucs are lacking.

Joe talked a lot about offense yesterday with former Giants Pro Bowl center Shaun O’Hara of NFL Network.

O’Hara had the mindset that the Bucs should be dialed into establishing their defensive identity and not worrying about firepower to match what’s in their division. Rather, O’Hara said, the Bucs should be looking to match up defensively with those teams and not force finding a franchise quarterback.

In O’Hara’s eyes, there will be one key criteria for Lovie Smith’s 2014 Bucs QB.

“You have to have a quarterback that can take care of the football. Because if you turn the ball over against those NFC South teams and you’re down early, it’s too tough to come back from consistently,” O’Hara said.

Often seen as an analyst on the Xs-and-Os-heavy show Playbook, O’Hara said he could see a clear difference between Glennon and Josh Freeman.

“It was obvious to me as the year went on, and as Mike Glennon got more comfortable, that Josh Freeman struggled a lot with some of the protections and reads because Glennon was doing a much better job getting them protected and picking up the blitzes.”

O’Hara went on to say defenses caught up to the Bucs after their midseason run of wins. O’Hara credited the Bucs’ late-season struggles on the offensive line to injuries and Glennon and the offense’s inability to counter the multitude of blitzes and looks thrown at Glennon.

113 Responses to “NFC Quarterback Reality And A Defensive Focus”

  1. Solinor Says:

    Once again,

    “The only people who believe Glennon is good are those who evaluate talent for a living”

    Best line I ever heard on here

  2. Touchdown Gus Says:

    We aren’t going to find a quarterback with the resume you mentioned above. Best thing to do is bring in a vet to compete with Glennon. This isn’t the last draft to have good quarterbacks in it

  3. BucsFan007 Says:

    My goodness, Glennon’s only a rookie. Wonder how many on the above list din’t have any better credentials than Glennon after their rookie campaign either ?

  4. Glennon Mob Says:

    Accept it, Glennon will be our starter next year.

  5. d-money Says:

    You should chnge the name of this site to,

    JoethinkstheBucsneedanewQBandthatsallhesgoingtowriteaboutuntilthedraft.com

  6. BucsfaninChina Says:

    Hellllllllllll no! Glennon will not have a single role of taking care of the damn ball. Lovie has no loyalty to Glennon and you damn well better believe Tedford will have at least one quarterback waiting in the wings to take charge of the offense if Glennon can’t manufacture points. I do agree that Lovie will address the defense in playing up to its potential before scouring the earth for Glennon’s replacement.

    But the Bucs were the worst offense last year. The worst! You better believe the Glazers are going to be forking out money to put a quality offense out on the field, and thus putting butts in seats to watch the game. Furthermore, while I am endorsing Glennon to start the season with a healthy team and blank slate, he must do more than protect the ball and prove he is the long-term solution for this team. 4 games max. If he hasn’t given us the wow factor needed to be a QB in the NFL, tough luck bud.

  7. Phillip Says:

    People really need to get it together man.. I disagreed with Joe all the time after the Freeman debacle(still do) but hes so spot on when it comes to QB play in the NFL now..

    This game has changed sooooo much that even with a dominating D you still need a QB that can win you the game… Seahawks aren’t playing for the SUPER BOWL if Russel doesn’t make a crazy 40 yard TD strike to Kearse on a 4th and 15 or whatever the hell it was against the 49ers.. So please don’t use that we can get by with a dominant D.. Such a weak argument..

    Ya we need help at QB but we also have needs at OL DL TE WR CB S and possibly a LB.. But what’s the MOST important position in the NFL? QB and its not even close.. Plus there is free agency for the other positions that don’t cost as much as a QB (Top Backup QB’s were making 4.5 Million last year!) I’m all for doing whatever it takes to get a QB high in the 1st because this might be the last time for awhile where we are drafting in the top 10( GOD I HOPE SO) Lovie is too good of a coach where we won’t be atleast a 7-9 team next year and giving Glennon one more year then drafting one next just means we will have more teams in the way of getting whomever we would be targeting..

    If Glennon were to beat out whatever rookie QB we draft in camp(which he won’t because he might be the ONLY QB in the NFL to throw away a pass on 4th down when needing a score to win the game ) then all that means is we can trade him or the rookie QB for draft picks(More likely Glennon because he’ll have proven he can do it)

    Oh and please can everyone stop with the STATS and the QB Rating comparing Glennon to Brees Brady Manning.. Totally different NFL now then it was when they were rookies.. This is a passing first league now for about 85% of the teams and you can barely sneeze on a player without getting a flag now…. QB rating doesn’t take how many sacks misreads.. QBR is a better rating because it takes the sacks and turnovers and when they happen into account which he had a 45.6(scale 1-100) which he finished 27th out of 39 out of qualified QB’s

  8. ROBERT6 Says:

    WOW, ha to read it 2 times. where’s the dig for MG?

    finally some common sense up in here!

  9. ROBERT6 Says:

    they were the worst offense for a LOT of reasons…

    Offensive scheme
    play calling
    injuries
    O line
    no adjustments
    seemed like zero came plan….

    Glennon was WAAAY down on the list of reasons!

  10. Keirster Says:

    d-money Says:
    January 29th, 2014 at 3:18 pm

    You should chnge the name of this site to,

    JoethinkstheBucsneedanewQBandthatsallhesgoingtowriteaboutuntilthedraft.com

    I almost soiled myself I laughed so hard…that was a good one. I hope Glennon gets some competition and still proves he is the guy. Fans are so impatient but I am willing to give the kid a little leeway. I agree with Ohara, get the D tuned up and we will have a chance in every game.

    Go Bucs!!!

  11. Chris@Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa Says:

    I will be very surprised if Glennon is not our QB, on opening day, unless a top QB falls to us in this draft.
    That seems quite unlikely.
    I want to see what Glennon can do if we give him a better scheme, and some real weapons, besides a slow as molasses, always double covered Vince Jackson.

  12. Jeagan1999 Says:

    I said this earlier, and I think it bears repeating here since Joe brought up other QB’s in the Conference:

    I think Joe and the Glennon detractors need to have a little perspective. Here are some of the top QB’s in the game and how they performed in their first full season as a starter:

    QB TD’s INT’s Comp. % Avg. Yds

    A. Luck 23 18 54% 7.0
    D. Brees 17 16 60% 6.2
    P. Rivers 22 9 61% 7.4
    P. Manning 26 28 56% 6.5
    M. Ryan 16 11 61% 7.9
    E. Manning 24 17 53% 6.8
    B. Roethlisberger 18 23 59% 7.5
    J. Flacco 14 12 60% 6.9
    J. Cutler 20 14 63% 7.5
    T. Romo 19 24 64% 8.1

    Now let’s see how Glennon did in comparison in his first 13 games:

    Mike Glennon 19 9 59.4% 6.3

    On the good side….Glennon had the 2nd best TD/INT % (behind Rivers), tied for 1st for fewest INT’s (with Rivers), 6th most TD passes (tied w/ Romo). On the needs improvement side….He had the 5th lowest COMP% (tied w/Roethlisberger) and the 2nd lowest YDS Avg. (Brees had the worst).

    It’s pretty clear to see that Glennon compares favorably to the other QB’s on this list! Now I am not suggesting that MG will magically turn into Brees, Manning, Ryan or Rivers…but you have to wonder, if their teams had given up on these other guys after just one season (and in Glennon’s case just 13 games), wouldn’t they be kicking themselves now for their mistakes?

    None of the great QB’s on this list were a finished product in year#1. Why do so many people think Glennon cannot show the kind of improvement these other guys did?

  13. Glennon Mob Says:

    Any QB would look bad with no OL or WRs.

  14. Mumbles Says:

    Finally, a Rutgers guy that makes sense!

  15. flmike...hates Johnny Football Says:

    Tony Romo (63-45 record as starter, 3 Pro Bowls) Didn’t take snap rookie year
    RGIII (Division Champ) also got ass handed to him
    Eli Manning (Two Super Bowls) 9 games, 48% c/r 6 TD 9 INT 55.4 QR
    Nick Foles (Division Champ, Pro Bowl)7 games, 60% c/r 6 TD 5 INT 79.1 QR
    Aaron Rodgers (Super Bowl)3 games, 56.3% c/r 0 TD 1 INT 39.8 QR
    Jay Cutler (56-48 as a starter, Division Champ)5 games, 59.1% c/r 9 TD 5 INT 88.5 QR
    Drew Brees (Super Bowl)1 games, 55.6% c/r 1 TD 0 INT 94.8 QR
    Cam Newton (Division champ)16 games, 60% c/r 21 TD 17 INT 84.5 QR
    Matt Ryan (60-34 as a starter, division titles)16 games, 61.1% c/r 16 TD 11 INT 87.7 QR
    Colin Kaepernick (Super Bowl, Pro Bowl)3 games, 60% c/r 0 TD 0 INT 81.2 QR
    Russell Wilson (Super Bowl, Pro Bowl)16 games, 64.1% c/r 26 TD 10 INT 100 QR
    Carson Palmer (Division titles, Pro Bowls)Didn’t take snap rookie year
    Mike Glennon – 13 games, 59.4% c/r 19 TD 9INT 83.9 QR

    Comparing rookie seasons, I really don’t see a problem other than really bad play calling and coaching.

  16. flmike...hates Johnny Football Says:

    @Jeagan1999
    I was dong the same thing at the same time

  17. Lou. Says:

    First, it’s good to get some national perspective. In 2013, the independent analysts looked at the Bucs as a mediocre team with about a 6-win forecast. They always were suspect on JFree, and several said on that draft day that the Bucs were taking a five year gamble. Seems their consensus was closer to the truth than our hometown bandstand.

  18. Phillip Says:

    @Jeagan1999

    No it actually doesn’t.. TOTALLY different NFL from most on the list.. Long gone are the days when hitting the 4000 yds and 25-30 TD’s were Franchise caliber stats.. Its now almost the norm and you better be getting over 30 TD’s(Rushing/Passing).. So please quit trying to prove a point with something that doesn’t apply here…

    He had a sub 47 total QBR last year and ranked 27th in the league from qualified QB’s

    Everyone that’s apart of the MGM needs to realize if we draft a QB in the 1st round it doesn’t mean your Giraffe neck boy wonder can’t beat him out for the starting job and then we can trade either him or the rookie QB

  19. RustyRhino Says:

    Hold on I thought stats can be turned however you want them to look like. Right?
    “And then there’s the mess in Minnesota — and Mike Glennon.”
    What else should we need to know….

  20. bigpoppabuc Says:

    EIGHT multiple TD games… NFL rookie record. TD in first eight starts… NFL rookie record. 19 TD passes… Bucs rookie record.
    Mike Glennon sent the great Russel Wilson running away to Wisconsin to avoid riding the pine.
    go look at the tape… Glennon can make EVERY throw. He can throw on the run. He’s got a very quick release. Very accurate when kept clean. He’s every bit as capable as a QB like Joe Flacco or Matt Ryan.
    Joe has said he doesn’t believe in Glennon but he can’t say why. Only that he doesn’t see “it”. I do… And I think Glennon is going to blossom into a top ten QB in this league if given good protection and dependable targets.

  21. Orca Says:

    Glennon has a chance to be very good. That can’t be said for the offensive line. The pass rush needs help. There’s no speed at receiver. There’s no need to reach for a QB, but if a good value appears at our draft position (after round one), take him.

  22. Lou. Says:

    Further, the national types seem to think Glennon had a nice year. Not great not earth-shattering, but best of the rookie crop with potential to improve. While I would take Bridgewater or JFootball at #7, is there anyone else who would be a huge upgrade at that spot?

  23. RustyRhino Says:

    If we do draft a QB in round 1 where is it written that that QB will be successful in his first season or even his first 2 seasons?
    I am all for having competition across the entire team but if we happen to miss on our first round pick in this draft. Will that not put us right back where we sit today? Hopping and praying we can find the next great QB?
    I recall a ill used average QB we let go of who won a super bowl…. We are high in our expectations but low on our planning to meet those expectations.
    Go BUCS!

  24. Lou. Says:

    Finally, I really doubt that franchise qbs are most available before the #8 pick. First round selections start for many teams because of the team’s investment. But Dalton is better than Ponder, Kaepernick is better than Smith, and New Orleans and Seattle are satisfied with their later round picks. Detroit and St. Louis have to have doubts about their choices.

    I get tired of the presumption that anyone who sees worth in Glennon is a mobster. What’s not to doubt? But is it better to get a potential All Pro at DE or OL or WR or ML? (I am not sold on ours). Or should we trade this draft away for a slight upgrade — or no upgrade at all?

    Finally, I heard Tarkington exain his criticisms of Josh — he views the qbs’ main responsibility as leadership and preparation for success. He thought Josh had the arm to throw into tight windows but didn’t have the savvy to pick out the easier target or open receiver. In fact the Morris regime didn’t want to burden Josh with competition. Glennon might not win a qb derby, but I bet he would fight his heart out.

  25. BigMacAttack Says:

    I like these top QB’s in the draft but don’t think any of them are the next Peyton Manning. I think Johnny Football however, has the potential to be a franchise QB, but that is a big risk to take, because he is young and dumb and full c__. He is a wild child. If I were the Bucs I would pick a top OT or trade down and get more solid players to fill out the roster, LB, DE, TE(badly needed), CB, OG etc etc etc. Hopefully they will do the same in free agency and get good quality at fair prices. Then I would wait for the next Peyton Manning, move up in the Draft and get him, regardless of the price.

  26. spanishbuc Says:

    I can’t stand how the biggest issue with this team is not addressed by Joe. THE OFFENSIVE LINE!!!!
    3.8 yards per rush, 27th in league. (Don’t blame injuries to RB’s,
    Doug Martin – 3.6 yards/rush).
    47 sacks allowed, 26th in league. (Yes, some of those you can blame on a rookie QB)
    Anyone who knows football knows it starts in the trenches. The line played well for 5 consecutive games, starting with Seattle and what happened? Wins!!! I’m not saying Glennon is the next Montana, but I think the kid deserves a shot to show what he can do with a real line in front of him.

  27. d-money Says:

    “Everyone that’s apart of the MGM needs to realize if we draft a QB in the 1st round it doesn’t mean your Giraffe neck boy wonder can’t beat him out for the starting job and then we can trade either him or the rookie QB”

    this the dumbest thing Ive ever read.

    If a GM uses a top 10 draft pick on a QB and he isn’t starting within 2 years not only willyou not get anthing of value for him on the trade market but the GM would be and should be fired.

    If the Bucs pick a QB in the first round it will be because they do not believe in Glennon..period.

    If they think there is any chance that Glennon would beat out the rooki then they would be foolishto us suh a high pick on a maybe.

  28. Tgreg Says:

    Poor Joe is running from one national expert to another trying to get even one to bash Glennon…but no luck.

    Please don’t make up stuff. Feel free to read before you comment. That’s sort of the point.–Joe

  29. Oil Derrick Brooks Says:

    Man, I have never seen a deceased equine take so much repeated abuse.

  30. PRBucFan Says:

    Again, if Glennon can learn to compensate for his lack of escapability I think he can succeed in the NFL as our QB.

    I am not too sure I believe he can though.

  31. Patrick in VA Says:

    Keep in mine that glennon hadn’t gotten a chance to go to one of these off season NFL gurus that put them through the brutal training. If one of those guys get ahold of him this off season and work with him on his escapability he could improve on it quite a bit. He won’t ever be a sprinter but he could be better than he was.

  32. FLBoyInDallas Says:

    Joe’s QB campaign continues, but at least he’s giving the appearance of being balanced on the issue. Appearance being the key word. I actually think he’d rather have a hot tub session with Rosie O’Donnell than supply us with credible expert pro-Glennon material, but at least he’s trying. Gotta give him that.

  33. The_Buc_Realist Says:

    Joe is just all over the map of who he thinks is a good player and who is not. I can respect that he does not think that Glennon can grow and become an elite QB. But there is just no rhyme or reason of who he thinks can play in this league.

  34. spanishbuc Says:

    @PRBucFan
    Escapability is not needed in order to be a good QB in the NFL. Don’t get me wrong it a plus, but not needed. Payton, Marino, Brees, could not escape out of a wet paper bag. They overcome their lack of mobility with a quick release, great pocket presence, and reading route progression. Before I get killed on here, I am not comparing Glennon to those great QB’s those are just examples of some of the greats who are statues in the pocket. If Glennon can become better at these things, he can become a good pocket passer.

  35. Patrick in VA Says:

    It’s funny to read these, and I know i’m just as guilty as everyone else, and seeing how somehow we’ve all convinced ourselves that any of this back and forth we’re having matters to anyone but the Joes. The scouts, coaches and GM have no interest in what we’re saying and none of us have budged an inch on our positions since the season ended so we’re all just going round and round with the only plausible happy ending being that a pick is made that we said for months that we wanted. A consolation prize might be that you are able to say in a year or two that a player that was taken despite your calls for another player was a mistake and you called it.

    just wanted to put that out there since there seemed to be some heated toned posts and I thought I’d try to offer a little perspective

  36. Jeagan1999 Says:

    @Phillip

    Wow, what NFL world do you live in…”Long gone are the days when hitting the 4000 yds and 25-30 TD’s were Franchise caliber stats..” SERIOUSLY? This is a silly statement.

    Tom Brady (3,300 yds, 25 TDs) Joe Flacco (3,900 yds, 19 TDs), Cam Newton 3,300 yds, 24 TDs) Andrew Luck (3,800 yds 23 TDs) Eli Manning (3,800 yds, 18 TDs) Tony Romo (3,800 yds, 31 TDs) Russel Wilson (3,300 yds, 26 TDs) Jay Cutler (2,600 yds, 19TDs) Alex Smith (3,300 yds, 23 Tds) Ryan Tannehill (3,900 yds, 24 TDs). Are these guys not “franchise caliber”?

    Good thing you are not the GM or you would have us drafting a rookie QB at #1 each year waiting for one to finally get get to your “franchise” 5,000 yds and 30 TDs level! Mike Glennon may not be the long term answer….but based on his rookie performance, he is right on pace with some guys named Manning, Rivers, Brees, Flacco, Luck, Ryan, Roethlisberger, Cutler etc… Stick a solid O-line in front of him and give him another weapon or two and he will surprise you!

  37. joseph mamma Says:

    Glennon has about the same ceiling as Matt Ryan. I heard that from Greg Cosell and I buy it and I don’t see why anyone would think otherwise. Maybe he hits that ceiling and I’m hoping he does.

  38. Kevin Says:

    We should have two new QB’s in here this year. One vet and one rookie. Give Glennon a fair shot. If he looks good he’s our starter. If not he’ll ride the bench simple as that nothing more to talk about. We just gotta wait and see what happens. It would be FOOLISH to just say there is no way Glennon will be our QB. We don’t know that. Nobody thought Foles was gonna do what he did last year. You gotta give the guy a shot with a good OC and some playmakers. Id like to see them get a little Tavon Austin or Victor Cruz like guy. Or maybe a welker type. someone that gets open and creates mismatches. We need BIG targets on offense. Our D will be good with Lovie in town.

  39. PRBucFan Says:

    Brees is a master at escapability it is very hard to bring him down with the ball in his hand and Manning is the ultimate exception.

    Manning has compensated for his lack of escapability by being elite in everything else.

    Escapability is crucial in today’s NFL and again unless compensated for you simply won’t survive in this league as a QB.

    Again, IF Glennon can learn to compensate for his lack of escapability I believe he has the rest of the tools to be our guy but if he can’t and goes down after every missed blocking assignment he won’t last.

  40. pick6 Says:

    5 of those 12 were either irrelevant or looked overwhelmed by the league in their rookie season. 6 if you count kaepernick

  41. Shane Marco Says:

    I think Glennon did enough to earn another shot. That being said if Johnny falls to us at 7 I don’t think we should pass him up, we have way to many holes to fill to trade up for anyone though. You can still win in this league with a strong defense and a game manager at qb who is capable of delivering a few big plays a game. I think Glennon can do that now, who knows what he can do if you actually slow him to gain some experience

  42. Shane Marco Says:

    Allow him to gain some experience that is….

  43. Orca Says:

    @PRBF-

    Escapability is desired, but not necessarily crucial. Joe Flacco won a Super Bowl. Peyton Manning might win one this year. Tom Brady gets the Patriots into the playoffs every year, and to the conference championship most years. So escapability is definitely *not* crucial. Accuracy is crucial. Consistency is crucial. The ability to lead a team is crucial. Mastery of an offense is crucial. Reading a defense is crucial. Escapability is nice to have.

    I refer you to Kaepernick, who can escape a rush, but can’t escape his multiple interceptions in the 4th quarter of the NFC championship game.

  44. spanishbuc Says:

    I agree with Brees, after I typed it I knew I made a mistake. But you made my point for me, “unless compensated for…” If your a statue and you can’t read defenses, and have a slow release, etc… you wont make it in the NFL. Think about it this way in the last ten Superbowl winners how many are “escape artist” VS “statues”…
    04 – Tom Brady – STATUE
    05 – Tom Brady – STATUE
    06 – Roethlisberger – ESCAPE ARTIST
    07 – Peyton STATUE
    08 – Eli – STATUE
    09 – Roethlesberger ESCAPE ARTIST
    10 – Brees ESCAPE ARTIST
    11 – Rodgers ESCAPE ARTIST
    12 – Eli STATUE
    13 – Flacco STATUE

    60% of these guys don’t have it. So how can you say it is essential in todays NFL?

  45. Testing Says:

    @PRBF-

    Escapability is desired, but not necessarily crucial. Joe Flacco won a Super Bowl. Peyton Manning might win one this year. Tom Brady gets the Patriots into the playoffs every year, and to the conference championship most years. So escapability is definitely *not* crucial. Accuracy is crucial. Consistency is crucial. The ability to lead a team is crucial. Mastery of an offense is crucial. Reading a defense is crucial. Escapability is nice to have.

    I refer you to Kaepernick, who can escape a rush, but can’t escape his multiple interceptions in the 4th quarter of the championship game.

    QED.

  46. spanishbuc Says:

    @Orca
    Glad we see eye to eye!

  47. PRBucFan Says:

    You guys are saying the same thing for me lol.

    It is absolutely essential if a QB is unable to compensate for it by being elite in the other areas.

    That is what I’m saying and your rephrasing what I’m saying in different ways.

    I do not see Glennon elevating the other areas in his game to the point to where he compensates for his statuesqueness.

  48. Patrick in VA Says:

    @prbucfan – especially since glennon was coached up so well and we’ve seen everything that he has to offer. I mean, every qb that makes it to the pros is all set on mechanics work and all of those guys on those lists that are bouncing aground this thread haven’t had to work on their mechanics since college.

  49. The_Buc_Realist Says:

    I don’t see how this team can win next year, as the Bucs have had the worst D-line in the NFC south for the last 5 years. Major changes need to happen,

  50. PRBucFan Says:

    Could he? Sure, IMO I just don’t believe it will.

  51. LUVMYBUCS Says:

    I like how posters are busting out with the STAT’s now..lol

  52. SAMCRO Says:

    “He who is so deaf or so blind is one that willfully will not see or listen?”

    Abraham Lincoln

    “Being ignorant is not so much a shame, as being unwilling to learn.”

    Benjamin Franklin

    “It’s sad how some will stick to their guns regardless of the consequences.”

    SAMCRO

  53. IdahoBucsfan Says:

    I am beginning to feel the same way about JoeBucsfan that I felt about Josh Freeman… lots of potential, much too often let us down. I know it is the slow time of the year,.. but only a certain kind of person could continue to do this Every day! Jonny Clown promotion 15 times in past few weeks,.. too many people point it out and joe moves on to several strait days of Glennon Bashing! TDs to Ints over 2-1 JOE! As a rookie on a team using a 4th string RB, 4th string TE and only One starting calibre WR. Not to mention the O-line problems! Seriously… Please use as much creativity when looking for something to write about as you do when concocting reasons to waste a draft choice on a QB!

  54. SteveBucsFan Says:

    @Phillip

    The fact that you think QBR is a viable stat for QBs renders your entire argument moot. All you need to do is see Geno Smith’s 90 QBR rating in a game to know that it is complete nonsense.

  55. Rrsrq Says:

    The problem is the Bucs somehow got stuck with the 7th pick eventhough teams in front have the same record and then traded away the 3rd pick (ok worth that since we got Revis), but did we get for that 6th round pick which could’ve been used for draft ammonition. The quandary is simple, best available player, OL, pass rusher, the right qb, right receciver(Sammy Watkins) or trade back and recoup a pick

  56. james west Says:

    i am all in on doing whatever the hell it takes to get manziel. i’m tired of -game managers-and boring offensive play and play calling-i think the fans,as well as i do, deserve expect and demand a product on the field that is exciting to watch.

  57. Getaclue Says:

    Whats the average tenure of said quaterbacks? 6years? Glennon has started 16 games yet. Articles like this remind me why its called joe bucs fan and not joe bucs sports writer

  58. Getaclue Says:

    Hasnt start 16 games*

  59. spanishbuc Says:

    @SteveBucsFan are you talking QBR or Quarterback rating? because those are two different stats. QBR is actually a very good indicator of how good a QB is. To give an example Geno Smith has 35.6 QBR vs a 66.5 Quarterback Rating.

  60. That Guy Says:

    Not to change the subject, but Gerald McCoy is going to be on Stephen Colbert’s show tonight. Comedy Central, 11:30 pm.

    Now go back to discussing whether the worst offense in the entire NFL needs a better QB or not.

  61. Tgregs Says:

    @getaclue.com
    That’s why I said yesterday, and meant no offense, that the Joes aren’t reporters. This site puts beer in their mugs, food on their tables, and a couple deductible football trips a year. To do that requires “hits” which in turn requires sometimes taking controversial positions. I expect that’s at least one of the reasons Joe reports his continued failure to get an expert to level some hate on Glennon.

    Controversy makes good media response in any form. And this site allows us all to rant about things as if we are experts. Not many places we can do this. That’s why the Joes fare well.

  62. gotbbucs Says:

    The best offenses in the NFL will almost always come down to the o-line and a scheme that matches up well with personnel. Glennon will do just fine.

  63. Cody Says:

    Ive said this before and I’ll say it again…Glennon was not the problem last season…Our O-line grossly underachieved pass blocking and run blocking…Personally I like Glennon and think he can be a lot better next season…fix the O-line, let’em play with a healthy Mike Willams/Doug Martin…Also something has to be said about the coaching staff we had here under Schiano; the play-calling was sad…I wanna see what he can do under Telford….

  64. SteveBucsFan Says:

    @spanishbuc

    Geno’s average QBR for the season was 35.6 but he had a 90 QBR game against th Dolphins:

    CMP ATT YDS CMP% AVG TD INT QBR
    17 27 190 63.0 7.04 0 0 90.7

    QBR is a stat to make the running QB look good. That same game Geno ran for 44 yards and a touchdown.

    To contrast here are the stats and QBR for Glennon from the St. Louis game:

    CMP ATT YDS CMP% AVG TD INT QBR
    16 26 158 61.5 6.08 0 0 20.4

    The passing stats are comparable but Glennon only had 3 rushing yards with no touchdowns. I rather let QB rating rate my QBs and rushing stats rate my running backs. We don’t need a hybrid stat to try to explain that running QBs are good. Plus, who likes ESPN and think they are viable for anything?

    And if you still think QBR is viable here are Terrel Pryor’s stats and QBR from his game against the Steelers:

    CMP ATT YDS CMP% AVG TD INT QBR RAT ATT YDS AVG LNG TD
    10 19 88 52.6 4.63 18 0 96.2 25.7 9 106 11.8 93 1

    He posted a 96.2 QBR…

  65. SteveBucsFan Says:

    Those stats all lined up well before it posted….

  66. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Sorry to rain on everyone parade, but…

    “O’Hara went on to say defenses caught up to the Bucs after their midseason run of wins. O’Hara credited the Bucs’ late-season struggles on the offensive line to injuries and Glennon and the offense’s inability to counter the multitude of blitzes and looks thrown at Glennon.”

    In that line right there, O’Hara admitted the problems were NOT on defense, but on offense. He says we do not need a QB, but then he says the defense is lacking.

    He’s contradicting himself. Sorry, Mike Glennon Mob.

  67. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Touchdown Gus Says
    “This isn’t the last draft to have good quarterbacks in it.”

    No, but it might be the last time for a while that we get this high of a pick. Not because Glennon is great, but because he could win just a couple more games and drop us WAAAAY down the list.

  68. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    BucsFan007 Says
    “My goodness, Glennon’s only a rookie. Wonder how many on the above list didn’t have any better credentials than Glennon after their rookie campaign either?”

    I wonder how many of them were not first round picks.

  69. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Jeagan1999 Says
    “Now let’s see how Glennon did in comparison in his first 13 games. Mike Glennon 19 9 59.4% 6.3 ”

    The problem with your logic is that Sullivan switched to mostly short easy passes toward the second part of Glennon’s games. Those are usually very high percentage passes. That corrupts your figure a bit.

  70. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Glennon Mob Says
    “Any QB would look bad with no OL or WRs.”

    The irony in that statement is that the last few games the oline gave Glennon a lot of time. Also, he had WRs. He had Vincent Jackson, Underwood and Wright (TE). All of which were catching almost everything thrown at them the last few games.

  71. spanishbuc Says:

    QBR is supposed to take into account the total value of the QB, it does not make running QB’s look better it just accounts for their production. Off the top of my head I believe that was Terrel Pryor’s game vs the Steelers in which they won (please correct me if i’m wrong) he had a 90 yard TD run. So was he that valuable to his team in that game. absolutely! If you look at the top 5 QB’s it’s: Manning, Rivers, Brees, Foles, and Rodgers. I think that is a pretty accurate indication of the top QB’s this year (Even though I hate Rivers).

  72. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Here’s what the Glennon mob does not get.

    It doesn’t matter what Brees, Ryan, or whatever NFC QB you mention did in his first, second or third year.

    What matters is that we have three very good QBs in our division, and not one is on our team.

    So, assume we give Glennon 3-4 years of development time. First off, Lovie Smith would be gone by the forth year if the Bucs are not getting to the playoffs.

    That right there tells you Lovie will not resist drafting a QB in the first round this year.

    Second, what if we accept 4 years down the road that Glennon is a bust? That would mean 4 years of HORRIBLE Bucs ball in the meantime.

    UNACCEPTABLE!!!!!!

    We need to do whatever it takes to get an ELITE QB in here. If that means drafting one this year in the first round AND bringing in a good vet to compete, then we do it.

    Because we DO NOT HAVE WINNING FOOTBALL until we do.

    Am I saying a drafted QB will be elite? No. I don’t know that. And neither does anyone know if Glennon will be elite. Or if Sanchez were to come in that he would turn things around and become elite.

    That;s the point. We do not know. But we don’t have the luxury of taking our time to find out. Not if I’m buying tickets. Or any of Tampa.

    So accept reality people.

  73. spanishbuc Says:

    BTW if you look at QB rating Nick Foles was a better QB than Manning this year. Anyone who thinks that is a moron. And I do believe ESPN is garbage, they just get lucky sometimes.

  74. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    spanishbuc, I have to agree.

    And I don’t think a single team that made it to game 2 of the playoffs did it without a solid QB.

  75. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    I completely understand and agree with Joe’s point on this topic. In fact, I really don’t see how anyone could view things differently, unless it’s as to which QB the Bucs take.

  76. spanishbuc Says:

    BuccaneerBonzai
    By your logic we should draft a QB in every round and every draft until we hit the franchise QB lottery? C’mon man get a clue. Great QB’s don’t come around very often in this league. You don’t NEED an amazing QB to win in this league. that is a farce! look at the Kaepernic and Wilson. Anyone who thinks those guys are elite is blind and half mentally retarded. Are they Good? yes, Are they Elite, NO! They have amazing defenses and great coaching. Do you want to bankrupt this franchise like the Redsking to get RGIII? I don’t know if Glennon is the answer, but I do think the guy did an OK job when he was surrounded by absolute crap this year. Horrible offensive line (Both pass and run blocking), One receiver, and a crap offensive scheme. Should we draft a qb in the later rounds and bring in a vet yes absolutely, but lets not waste the 7 pick or worse trade down on a roll of the dice QB. And Don’t tell me Bridgewater or Manziel are guaranteed elite guys, BECAUSE NO ONE CAN PREDICT THIS CRAP!!! just ask the San Diego Chargers and this guy called Ryan Leaf.

  77. Stevek Says:

    Bonzai,

    Glennon is solid.

  78. spanishbuc Says:

    @Bonzai
    Sorry for being agro. I do think you have a clue. We just have a different opinions on the situation.

  79. Stevek Says:

    Bonzai,

    Who can we draft that is as sure fire upgrade from Glennon?

    BPA all the way.

  80. gotbbucs Says:

    @ Bonzai
    “Am I saying a drafted QB will be elite? No. I don’t know that. And neither does anyone know if Glennon will be elite. Or if Sanchez were to come in that he would turn things around and become elite.”

    Why couldn’t you have posted this in the begining of your ten post rant so I would have known to skip over every post of yours from here on out.
    Mark Sanchez? Good Lord. Might as well bring in Rex Grossman too, huh?

  81. Delson Says:

    I think Glennon deserves a chance to start. get a vet qb in FA. if its true that the qbs weren’t taught technique then maybe that was glennons problem. yeah he played cautious but freeman tried to take chances n turned over the ball a lot causing questions about his ability as qb then lost his job shortly following. I say we take the most talented player on the board o line wr d line lb or te with the first pick. remember glennon was the most blitzed qb of last year. schiano ran this team into the ground. thank god for lovie

  82. Ed Says:

    Coach Smith, if you want to keep your job, go and get you a quarterback.

  83. Phillip Says:

    @Jeagan1999

    I’m gonna pick each one apart because you clearly don’t understand that mobile QB’s aren’t going to throw for as many yards and you would need to count their rushing too since they are called DUAL THREAT QB’S you know?

    Also D-bag I don’t need to see another year of Glennon to know hes not the answer.. Just like I wouldn’t need to see another year of Gabbert Sanchez Locker EJ Ponder Weeden

    Brady add another 1k to his passing yards this year idiot and thats what he threw for(4300 not 3300 seriously?) along with 4800 yards in 2012..

    Russell ran for another 540 yards so that would put him at just under 4k total yards..

    Jay Cutler missed 5 games and most of another(left in the 1st) and came back too early in one and sat out 4th quarter because of his injury moron so put him with McCown you’ll get your number

    Cam rushed for 585 yards so once again that would put him just under 4k threw for 3800 and rushed for 740 yards in 2012

    Andrew Luck rushed for 387 yards so that would put him over 4k – threw for 4300 in 2012

    Eli has sucked for the past two years now so no hes not “FRANCHISE” anymore to me

    Tony Romo was 200 yards shy of it.. soooooo much different from 4k when he threw for 4900 in 2012

    Alex Smith is not a franchise QB sorry.. He’s an extremely good game manager

    Flacco is not a franchise QB either.. He had a very good 4 game stretch in the playoffs but he STILL THREW FOR 3900..

    Tannehill lol really? Stretching there dude

  84. gotbbucs Says:

    I can apprecite guys wanting to upgrade the QB position, I really can, but if you want to make that stand at least come up with a way that doesn’t involve giving up the farm to get Manziel or some other way to accomplish it.
    Don’t just throw out the typical “we need a franchise QB” line, and then ABRACADABRA ZIP BAM BOOM, and he appears out of thin air.
    I do not want the 3rd or 4th ranked QB picked at #7, and that’s what we will get staying put, and I have no desire to give up multiple 1st round picks plus change to move up.

    This is not a great QB draft or QB free agency. Sit tight and accumulate talent elsewhere on the roster.

  85. spanishbuc Says:

    @ gotbbucs
    Preaching to the choir!!! I like how people think that 15 elite qb’s come out every draft. Another thing that people need to realize is that elite qbs hardly ever hit free agency except for 1. injury (Brees and Manning) or 2. old as sin (Farve)

  86. Rrsrq Says:

    Glennon was drafted in the third round becuz the prior coach had a high school crush on him. Third round, could’ve got him in the 5th then we wouldn’t be having this argument, we would realize he is a back up. Not to mntion he played every preseason game, still looking for more than a few special plays.

  87. SteveBucsFan Says:

    He also had 2 picks and 88 yards passing. He also only had 10 rushes for 110 yards while still busting that 1 long run. That deserves a 90+ QBR?

  88. Eric Says:

    We could stand pat, take the BPA, and have him suck also.

    Seen that a time or two.

    All this top heavy QB talk could be smoke screens. Could all change and chances are one of the QB’s we view in the top 3 at this point will fall to 7.

    I’d still try and swing a deal for the number two to get JF, as that would change the whole dynamics of our team and outlook IMO.

  89. PRBucFan Says:

    It’s ok if they do take JF I’ll be here with couch to sit back for 5 years telling you how much of a waisted bust he is like we did with our last JF ;)

    Smh

  90. Couch Fan Says:

    Lol hey but at least Jonny would be fun to watch. That other QB we had was the most boring QB to ever play the game.

  91. Tampabaybucfan Says:

    Getting to this post late….I’m not part of the MGM….but…from where I sit, I hope he works out because rignt now we need lots of parts and if we don’t have to worry with giving up a bunch of draft picks for a QB….then we can concentrate elsewhere.
    That being said, I believe Glennon needs competiton and that we need to draft a QB or bring one in through FA that has a chance to beat him out for the job.
    Two suggestions would be someone like Garoppolo in the draft….perhaps Carr or someone like McCown in FA.
    I am opposed to giving up the farm and trading up because I don’t think that is worth the gamble. If we have to gamble….lets do it next year.

  92. Buc1987 Says:

    The MGM makes up 5% of the fan base. Therefore they don’t really matter.

  93. Buc1987 Says:

    spanishbuc says : “And Don’t tell me Bridgewater or Manziel are guaranteed elite guys, BECAUSE NO ONE CAN PREDICT THIS CRAP!!! just ask the San Diego Chargers and this guy called Ryan Leaf.”

    Well I for one don’t have to ask the Chargers. All I have to do is remember Heisman Vinny being picked 1st overall in the draft as if he was going to be the Bucs savior. Look how that turned out.

    I see no slam dunk QB’s in this draft. To hell with Manziel. Is he as good as Andrew Luck was coming out of college? I don’t think so, Homey don’t play that. Stay put at #7 and draft O-line.

  94. spanishbuc Says:

    @Buc1987
    Just another example of when drafting a QB goes bad. I have to give you props for an In Living Color reference.

  95. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    spanishbuc Says:
    “BuccaneerBonzai
    By your logic we should draft a QB in every round and every draft until we hit the franchise QB lottery?”

    That is not my logic, guy. That isn’t even close to what I said.

    “C’mon man get a clue. Great QB’s don’t come around very often in this league. You don’t NEED an amazing QB to win in this league.”

    Hey, fella, guess what? Those teams do not have great to elite QBs on every other team in their division. WE DO.

    I don’t know if you people understand this, but if we don’t beat the teams in our division, we don’t go to the playoffs. It is that simple.

    We have the toughest division where QBs are concerned, and you Glennon Mobsters seem to like ignoring that.

    steveK, Glennon is not solid. At all. He may be in the future, but he is NOT SOLID now. If you believe that, you are fooling yourself.

  96. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    How many wins did Glennon have out of his 13 games last year? What’s that? You say it was because of the team around him?

    He had a better team than Freeman did when he won 10 games. Stop making excuses.

  97. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Rrsrq Says:
    “Glennon was drafted in the third round becuz the prior coach had a high school crush on him. Third round, could’ve got him in the 5th then we wouldn’t be having this argument, we would realize he is a back up.”

    CORRECT!!!!!

  98. lurker Says:

    Lou. Said:
    January 29th, 2014 at 4:13 pm

    “Further, the national types seem to think Glennon had a nice year. Not great not earth-shattering, but best of the rookie crop with potential to improve…”

    love this. lol. 3rd qb in the third round of a very poor qb draft.
    so it’s like mike won 3rd place in the special olympics with potential to improve. but he is still in the special olympics!

    no offense to special olympiads, anywhere, intended.

  99. lurker Says:

    we need a better qb. mike “geoffrey” glennon has no strength on deep passes. he can’t elude a 3 legged dog with 2 broken legs. he does not have a quick release.

    qb is our biggest hole that cannot be addressed in free agency this year. there are many better qb’s coming out. many say glennon has “potential” but the qb’s coming out have more potential.

    defense has been addressed (revis, goldson, 6 high draft picks) and can be filled in free agency this year. oline has been addressed with a free agent (nicks)and we can go to free agency this year. tightend can be addressed in free agency this year, if needed, but we have stocker coming off injury. receiver can be addressed this year in free agency, but we already did in jackson.

    so the most important position was addressed in the third round by the third qb taken in a very poor qb-class draft. there are no decent free agent qb’s this year. none coming available in the near future. we have a high pick this year at 7 and many think we will win 8 or more games for years to come, so we will not be picking this high again. we need a qb.

    if one of the top guys on their board is there they need to do what they can to get one. the teams in front of us who need and pass on one will draft one before us in the second (e.g. Cleveland, Jacksonville).

  100. PRBucFan Says:

    Freeman blows

    That tis all… Move along

  101. SAMCRO Says:

    @BuccaneerBonzai

    That’s funny It wasn’t long ago you were gushing all over Glennon, and if you want proof I’ll go back and grab those comments to prove to you. You seem to change your opinion which ever way the wind blows. When The Buc’s went through their mini win steak last year you warmed up quite well to him. Although you did say it was because the team was playing well around him, and you gave most the credit to the teams effort.

    Then when his supporting cast began to wane you now want to make it all Glennons fault. You are one fickled dude. That goes for several of you who don’t want to give Glennon a fair chance to win the job in camp. If we take a QB with our 1st pick Glennon will be relegated to backup or traded. He will not get the chance to earn the job unless our #1 pick totally stinks up the place.

  102. Patrick in VA Says:

    I like it when guys reference the other qbs in our division as a justification for us needing to go out and get one that’s at their level as if they’re lining up across from each other and going head to head. Our quarterback isn’t playing their quarterbacks. Our defense is playing their quarterbacks. We saw in the playoffs that good defense I’d the formula for beating their quarterbacks so why would we give up the farm to go get a new qb? That’s trading the symptoms and not the problem. That’s trying to match them point for point when we should be stopping them from scoring points.

  103. BFFL Says:

    So if the bucs had any of those other 14 QBs then they win? Sorry Joe..it’s not that simple. You still need a good team and good coach..Just ask Brees last year and Matt Ryan this year. I’m beginning to think you don’t no jack about football.

  104. Jeagan1999 Says:

    @Phillip

    You are hilarious dude! I’ll ignore the insults (Dbag, Moron, idiot) because I assume you realized you were going to lose the argument based on facts and decided to just sound tough instead! But then you double down on your silly argument! On the one hand you state that “4k yds passing and 25-30 TD’s doesn’t make you franchise caliber” and in the next breath you try to justify why those QB’s who had less than (or right around) your “franchise” numbers are still elite! (“Well if you add rushing/ if you add what they would have thrown for if they hadn’t been injured/and if you look at what they threw for 3 years ago, blah, blah,blah!!) HILARIOUS!

    If you don’t understand football very well, might I suggest you take up watching golf…it’s much simpler…hit the ball…walk a little…hit the ball again….walk a little more…then putt!

    I hope you enjoy rooting against Mike Glennon this year!

  105. gatorbucs77 Says:

    In today’s NFL you cannot win without a QB than can make big plays at important times. The rest of the stats I’ve seen in this thread don’t really matter, if your QB cannot come through and win a game when it’s on the line.

    You cannot ‘game manage’ to consistent winning any more.

  106. Patrick in VA Says:

    @Jeagan – Agreed. He came off as a guy that doesn’t like that other people are allowed to have opinions that might conflict with his

  107. Jeagan1999 Says:

    @ Patrick in VA

    Yep! I would hope at the end of the day that EVERYONE would like to see Glennon succeed since he is our starting QB! We can all discuss whether or not he is THE QB of the future for this team, but some people (like Phil) seem to be actually rooting for him to fail! Maybe the Bucs will draft a QB…let’s face it, in today’s NFL you have to have at least a couple of quality signal callers on your team because injuries can and do happen…but even if Tampa does get Manziel,Bortles,Bridgewater, etc.. I think the job is still Glennon’s to lose! Given the fact that we have a lot of other holes to fill, my hope is that Glennon can continue to grow into a solid NFl QB, so we can concentrate on other priorities in the draft and free agency! Just my opinion :)

  108. Jeagan1999 Says:

    @ gatorbucs77

    I don’t disagree with you that QB’s need to make big plays when it matters most, but I think there is still a role for the “game manager” type QB on some teams. A perfect example this year was the K.C. Chiefs. Alex Smith is not what most would consider the upper echelon of NFL QB’s, but he had a very steady year, and that combined with a strong defense and a great running game (Jamaal Charles is awesome!), got them double digit wins and a trip to the playoffs. This style of QB play is certainly not as flashy as the pure drop-back players like Peyton, Rodgers or Brady, or the “hybrid” guys like Kapernick, Wilson, RGIII…but it certainly still can be done effectively.

  109. buchead407 Says:

    Johnny football is a better version of Russel Wilson

  110. Trubucfan22 Says:

    Look at the stats for Glennon on 3rd down. Look at his stats in the 4th quarter. That’s why people dislike Glennon, he sucks in crunch time. You can suck in 1st or 2nd down. But you can’t suck on 3rd down. And Glennon is the worst QB ever on 3rd down and 6-10

  111. Trubucfan22 Says:

    Anybody who thinks Glennon actually deserves the starting spot should get their head checked. Or watch a bucs game. He did nothing to deserve the starting job. He was horrendous at everything that makes a QB great. Please stop looking at generic stats and watch the freaking games. Watch how successful he was on 3rd down. Go ahead. If you watch all of his 3rd down plays, you will be appalled at how terrible the film will be. Freeman is twice the QB Glennon is, and freeman was lazy and sleepy. That doesn’t bode well for glennons future.

  112. Hawk Says:

    @ Jeagan1999
    Wrong sport. Golf is still too complicated. Bowling is my recommendation. You throw the ball out, and it comes back to you. And keeping score is easy. Each time you throw it, you don’t have to count past ten (pins) , so there’s no need for him to remove his shoes and socks.

  113. Jordon Says:

    @Hawk

    LOL! You may be right. Any counting over 10 and this guy may need to take his shoes off!

 
 

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