Arians: Bucs Have Ultimate Leader On Defense
November 13th, 2019
This is both encouraging and frustrating.
The Bucs lead the NFL in points allowed. Some points can be pinned on America’s Quarterback, Jameis Winston. But in all, without the somewhat meaningless dissection of its components, the Bucs’ defense is dreadful.
You see it. Joe sees it. Heck, the Arizona Cardinals just racked up their biggest passing day of the season on Tampa Bay’s home turf, their biggest overall 2019 offensive output on the road.
Bucs fans are working on three consecutive seasons of garbage defense. Three!!
That covers three defensive coordinators, two head coaches and one general manager.
Ex-Bucs middle linebacker Kwon Alexander was lauded for being the quarterback of the defense and its heart and soul. Stellar leadership by Kwon, it was said often. Meanwhile, the defense was bad and Chris “Swaggy” Baker happened on his watch (2017), followed by Brent Grimes (2018).
Gerald McCoy was in the same kind of boat. Dude was praised for being a leader of men, yet those men accomplished little or nothing together.
Now, the man whose praises are being sung in a similar way is Lavonte David, the never-quit, eighth-year linebacker who turns 30 in January. He’s grinding through another strong season and climbing up the NFL record books.
Speaking on Buccaneers Radio yesterday, Bucco Bruce Arians called David a prototype leader in the NFL.
“Off the field and on the field, he’s exactly what you’re looking for in a leader. And the young guys, they go to him,” Arians said. “They get great advice, whether it’s how to practice, how to take care of your body, how to study film, and he can give them the great advice. Just All-Pro.”
Arians will tell you Jason Pierre-Paul brings tremendous energy and leads with his will. The head coach will tell you that Ndamukong Suh is the ultimate professional and a great leadership complement to JPP. And we all heard this spring about the natural-leader way of Devin White.
All that leadership and what’s it getting the Bucs?
This is a good example of why Joe often writes here that leadership is overblown in the NFL.
Remember the 2011 Bucs. We all heard about how that team fell apart to go from 4-2 to 4-12. Where was Rondé Barber?
A better example is 2008, when a team loaded with special leadership fell apart after opening the season 9-3. Joe still can’t believe the Bucs lost out on the playoffs in Week 17 by falling to JaMarcus Russell and a crappy Raiders team in Tampa.
Yeah, it’s encouraging that David is being a rock for young players. But there’s still an unidentified something — something more than talent — that’s missing from this defense that allows it to keep getting trampled.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:07 am
JPP’s been gone, Suh is new, White’s been hurt, and LVD cant cover for three rookies and a dud (VH) in the backfield. I think it’s coming together.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:08 am
can you imagine what it would be like even without their leadership?
You’re wrong Joe
November 13th, 2019 at 10:19 am
Bruce Arians= Joe Gibbs, the Redskins already tried this experiment guess what it didn’t work.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:25 am
Its mainly on the DB’s and most are rooks….cant blame them too much (and JW’s turnovers, some are not are also not his fault).
Its ok, we needed this year to figure things out and cut slack where it was needed. Rooks and some 2nd year DB’s needed some experience.
We need a vet in the backfield (CB), keep JPP, SUH, find a way to keep Barret. Yes, i wanted to blow this thing up other than 15-20 players….but just step back and pinpoint where we’ve improved (Run D and pass rush) and where we havent (pass D).
We’re getting there, slowly.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:31 am
The leader of a strong D must be a terrifying maniac.
Lavonte is not that guy. He’s a role model.
Bucs haven’t had a leader on the D since Sapp.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:36 am
More importantly, why haven’t we worn the red/orange variant of our white pants (as pictured above) at all this year? In the complete abomination that is our current uniform set, they’re a tiny step in the right direction.
As for David, he has been a very solid (and at times, spectacular) player for us…it’s nice to hear that he’s stepping up and becoming a veteran leader.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:44 am
Joe – I believe you have mentioned your father was in the military. I wonder if he shares your view that leadership is meaningless.
This take, along with a few others, proves the troll in you is alive and well.
In BA I Trust!
November 13th, 2019 at 10:44 am
Maybe with Dean and Davis on the outside, we’ll suck less
November 13th, 2019 at 10:47 am
its hard to tell just who are the leaders on this team. JPP gets everybody inspired and fired up. Maybe it is David. He’s just quiet about it.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:49 am
@Joe … “This is a good example of why Joe often writes here that leadership is overblown in the NFL.”
Leadership is vital to BOTH the offense AND the defense IMO. And right now we’re not seeing enough on EITHER side of the ball, although it seems to be limited to certain position groups. For instance, imagine what a difference a CB like Patrick Peterson would’ve made to our Secondary. Or what a difference a tackle like Joe Thomas would’ve made to our OLine. Or even what a difference having Russell Wilson or Drew Brees would’ve made to our offense. Leadership, coupled with great performance, makes a difference..
November 13th, 2019 at 10:52 am
Holy chit I can’t believe LVD is about to turn 30!
Pretty sad how much of his career has been wasting playing for a lousy, under performing team…
JPP still a leader of men
November 13th, 2019 at 10:55 am
You need a leader on every level in Defense. Once they get a proven leader in the secondary the Defense could be scary. In the late 90’s early 2000’s Lynch and Ronde led the secondary, Brooks led the LB’s and Sapp led the D-line. Lb’s and D-linemen work together which is why the run D is so good. Once you get that leadership at the second level then you’e playing complementary football on Defense.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:55 am
Your constant bashing of the Bucs’ defense and constant applauding of Jameis & the Bucs’ offense is beginning to make sense Joe. Apparently total points and total yards on the season, either gained or allowed, are all that count.
Totally unimportant that an offense benefits directly when its defense takes the ball away from opponents, and either scores directly or puts the offense in a better position to score, enhancing the offense’s stats. Also totally unimportant that it’s the defense that pays the penalty when the offense turns the ball over, oftentimes allowing the opponent to either score immediately or giving them a short field to operate from, hurting the defense’s stats.
GamStats can give a jaded picture of what really went on. And part of what results is that they normally don’t tell anything about how you got there. Oftentimes things aren’t as rosy as many think, or as desperate as others think.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:59 am
What’s missing on the team you saw from JPP on the sidelines Sunday. An attitude when things go wrong. I loved watching him pissed and showing emotions on the sideline. Also loved to see SMB visually upset when he got beat.
November 13th, 2019 at 11:01 am
setting the leadership bar pretty low considering his inconsistent play through the years and self admitting to being mentally weak unable to recover from big plays or bad calls… pretty low bar for leaders in Tampa next we will be talking about the fireworks / drivers ed expert being a leader after letting his team down for half a season… bucs lower the standards bar almost as fast as public schools
last complete great season was under schiano… great players excel in any system. just another mediocre player low standard bucfan clings too…. he has a hell of a collection of basement titles and blowouts I’ll give him that.
November 13th, 2019 at 11:06 am
Defense Rules Says:
November 13th, 2019 at 10:55 am
Your constant bashing of the Bucs’ defense
dude they have earned the bashing pull your head out…… since schiano they have blown leads, been blown out and have set nearly every worst in nfl history defensive record. those are undisputed facts. your defense for the indefensible defense is right with 813 support of vh3bust and bad character lovie smith’s success at Illinois
this defense outside of sapp and gruden’s glory year has sucked…. regular season queens and post season choke artists during their hey day… pretenders never contenders. you talk like you are following the steel curtain era which ironically the steelers put more offensive players in the now meaningless hall of fame.
November 13th, 2019 at 11:08 am
The Defense is dreadful, so lets get the Quarterback whisperer. The Defense is dreadful so lets spend 70% of the salary on the Offense. The Defense is dreadful so lets go get the best receiving corps in the NFL. The Defense is dreadful so lets mount a #WEAPONS4WINSTON campaign…
November 13th, 2019 at 11:10 am
Well, speakin’ of the devil?!! Of course, LVD is the leader of the defense. He is also a team leader. He’s one of the top 3 players in the NFL at his position. How many HCs has he suffered through, huh?? He deserves to be in the playoffs, and the HOF. Go Bucs!!!!!!!!!!!!
November 13th, 2019 at 11:15 am
Joe’s back on the “who needs leadership” train after a brief respite yesterday.
November 13th, 2019 at 11:20 am
I think Arians is talking more about David stepping up rather than that he’s been leading for years
November 13th, 2019 at 11:37 am
Leadership won’t teach Hargraves how to hustle or the young DB’s how to cover. LVD is making play after major play there is only so much one man can do in a team sport. As bad as the defense has been I love LVD’s approach this season. I would ask yourselves a better question, do we miss McCoy? LVD I think we would miss but McCoy’s play was ok and as a leader, we stunk. At least we can say LVD is an all-pro. (Kwon has been hurt so I don’t have anything to say there)
November 13th, 2019 at 11:40 am
Jaymiss Winsnot’s market value is 8-10 million a year … any thing more than that dooms us to salary cap hell …. and he proved that’s what he is worth …we are not going to the promised land with him!!
November 13th, 2019 at 11:41 am
Defense will prob be even worse next season when all of the pass rushers leave. Licht is the most clueless GM in the NFL.
November 13th, 2019 at 11:49 am
Jason licked aka forest gump … winning record under his tenure is 33%… don t change anything……….
November 13th, 2019 at 11:58 am
Linebackers are good d line is good, none of these leaders are in the secondary which is what is holding this team back. Say what you want about winston but dont want to hear it if you wont acknowledge the scored on bucs per game. He’s not someone that can be counted on to go score for score with anyone and neither can a rookie. They will need to spend a lot of money on a veteran corner next offseason.
November 13th, 2019 at 12:02 pm
Salary cap Hell? We’re stuck in hell HELL.
November 13th, 2019 at 12:03 pm
@pewter power… yep. You would have thought we would have brought in a vet to the secondary to lead the young guys but no… really dumb because the front seven is in good shape.
November 13th, 2019 at 12:06 pm
@joe
Why is Sean Bunting behind Jamal Dean on the depth chart?
We are seeing MJ Stewart over Carlton Davis all over again.
November 13th, 2019 at 12:06 pm
More BS from BA
November 13th, 2019 at 12:13 pm
Leadership is just to motivate, it can’t spoon feed you. These are adults who, at the end of the day, answer to their own drive and passion to be great or be trash. It’s the GM and Coach’s job to put the right talent on the field.
As much as letting VH3 go was the right move, someone needs to hold these coaches accountable for their game mismanagement. I hope you journos keep questioning the play calling too, cuz invariably the coaches will realize their mistakes if it’s noticed by people not on the staff. That’s the problem with hiring your coaching tree; it’s a staff full of yes men/women.
November 13th, 2019 at 12:18 pm
Pewter
“He’s not someone that can be counted on to go score for score with anyone and neither can a rookie.”
Kyler Murray looked pretty good going score for score…
November 13th, 2019 at 12:33 pm
“Kyler Murray looked pretty good going score for score…”
Every QB we play looks good going score for score because our defense sucks and has sucked for so long now I think we forgot what an average or good defense even looks like.
Over the years we have made guys like Case Keenum look like Aaron Rodgers. IF Murray had anything other than a very good game it’d have been a disappointment.
November 13th, 2019 at 12:38 pm
@DR
When your offense is top 3 in scoring, your defense is #32, and you are 3-6, these story lines kind of make sense.
The only good thing going on with this team is on offense and run stopping. Those are the positive articles.
The biggest weakness of the team is the secondary and turnovers, and we’ve seen the negative articles on that as well.
It’s easier to forgive having more turnovers when you make up for it with a top 3 scoring offense, hence more attention on the secondary.
For the secondary to make up for their incompetence, they would need to average 2 interceptionis a game and a pick 6 a game at this point.
That’s the big picture difference in why more attention is going to the failure of our secondary than the #3 scoring offense in the league turning the ball over more than NFL average, which really is mostly driven by 1 game (Carolina).
When you remove the 6 turnovers in Carolina – which WE ALL AGREE JAMEIS MELTDOWN GAME – we’re pretty much right at the NFL average in giveways in our other 8 games….
I think Joe is nailing it with his coverage personally on what is going right/wrong this year.
November 13th, 2019 at 12:45 pm
Whats the most common thread in the failures of the defense the last three years?
Jason Licht !!!
November 13th, 2019 at 1:06 pm
LC nailed it!
The defense isn’t the only problem but it is the most glaring problem.
November 13th, 2019 at 1:14 pm
LC
AZ’s defense ain’t no great shakes either…in fact the only pass defense worse than ours I believe.
November 13th, 2019 at 1:15 pm
Maybe David will get recognized by the media and the pro bowl voters now
November 13th, 2019 at 1:16 pm
LordCornelius Says:
“The only good thing going on with this team is on offense and run stopping.”
And the kicking, for the most part.
November 13th, 2019 at 1:45 pm
From calling David a 2nd round “bust” while propping up Aguayo-no to stumping for David’s pro bowl candidacy? And I thought grannies jumping on trampolines and elf erotica was embarrassing.
November 13th, 2019 at 2:14 pm
@Bonzai
Good call on the kicking agree.
And even with our offense – it’s our pass game / scoring since our run game has been below average.
It’s weird that with the # 3 scoring offense in the league, with the #32 scoring defense, and a sub par run game, we still focus so much on the QB position in terms of what so many fans are upset about the most…
November 13th, 2019 at 2:24 pm
@Jmark
You’re right – the Cards pass D is about as bad as ours statistically.
We’re still a #3 scoring offense regardless, while facing this schedule of scoring defenses:
1-49ers – 2nd
2-Panthers x 2 – 22nd
3-Giants – 30th
4-Rams – 15th
5-Saints – 11th
6-Titans- 9th
7-Seahawks – 23rd
8-Cards – 27th
Not a cupcake really. Cards/Giants the only really bad D’s. Everyone else about average or better with 3 top 11 Defenses.
Meanwhile those same team in offensive scoring
1. 49ers – 4th
2. Panthers x2- 12th
3. Giants – 23rd
4. Rams – 10th
5. Saints – 16th
6. Titans – 22nd
7. Seahawks – 7th
8. Cardinals- 17th
Pretty similar. A couple great offenses but mostly average. And our defense is last in the league scoring…
November 13th, 2019 at 2:28 pm
LC … You know that I agree that our Secondary stinks. But for folks to tell you every day that you have a problem when you were set up to fail is ludicrous. We went into this season with SIX corners & FOUR safeties. One of our corners was suspended (Ryan Smith) , leaving us with 5 CBs: VHIII, MJ Stewart, Davis, Dean, SMB. One of our safeties ended up on IR (Justin Evans) by Game 1, leaving us with 3 safeties: Whitehead, Edwards & Darian Stewart (he actually started Game 1), then we added Adams later.
So VHIII was our ‘veteran’ CB & Darian Stewart was our veteran safety (61 def snaps in Game 1 and 13 total def snaps in 5 games since then). VHIII is now gone, MJ Stewart disappeared after the Saints game (until the Cards game), and Ryan Smith has only made 2 appearances on defense since returning. With Davis hurt, Dean coming off injury just 2 games ago, and Edwards also spending 3 games injured, it’s amazing that Todd Bowles has even been able to field a Secondary. It’s been musical chairs virtually every week with a bunch of rookies & 2nd year players. All of whom were 2nd, 3rd & 4th round picks to begin with. What could possibly go wrong with a Secondary like that?
Personally I’m proud of these youngsters. They’ve given up some big plays, but they’ve reduced our opposing QBs completion percentages thus far this year by almost 10% over last year. And from what I’ve seen, it looks to me like VHIII & MJ Stewart have given up more booty than the youngsters. It’ll be interesting to see how they perform against the Saints this Sunday. Hope that Carlton Davis is back though.
November 13th, 2019 at 2:50 pm
@DR
Totally agree. I don’t think Joe is taking this out personally on the players themselves if you’re taking it that way.
It was a front office failure, coaching staff failure, Jason Licht failure. Joe himself has mainly been wondering why we ignored veteran secondary help before the trade deadline or why we went into the season with a plan of having no proven experience on the back end.
I like Dean & SMB for the future. Maybe Davis. This might be like the year the panthers went with rookies in the secondar. Their D took a 1 year step back and then those guys excelled going forward.
I’m not even as down on Bowles because I can see he’s at least playing aggressively and getting pressure on the QB.. but someone should have realized we needed vet help before the season on that staff.
November 13th, 2019 at 4:42 pm
Getting Hargreaves off the field is likely to make a positive difference for the Bucs secondary moving forward.
Rookie Dean looks better and more capable of tight coverage in 2 games than Hargreaves ever did in 4 years at outside CB.
Hargreaves had 4 passes defensed in 9 games.
Dean has 8 passes defensed in 2 games.
Nuff Said.
Bucs will be fine at CB between Davis, Dean and SMB – eventually.
They all have some growing and developing to do – but I do expect to see better Defensive play as a whole and better secondary play in particular the second half of this season. Its already started with the return of JPP and the release of Hargreaves.
November 13th, 2019 at 8:46 pm
D.R.
IMO if Russell Wilson had been our QB we would have at least three more wins.
I’m not sure at this point who I’d rather have under center than Wilson. Murray may develop…he seems like a Wilson style player with far more speed.
November 13th, 2019 at 10:16 pm
That’s an easy one Joe… swagger. Great defenses have swagger. Confidence against any opponent. Win or lose, because the offense and special teams play too, it means the offense is in for a low, painful day.
It is much, much harder to have swagger on defense in the NFL now. Take any Hall of Fame defender and most of their highlight reel hits are now flags. Sadly, all you can hope for is a very basketball-like ‘clutch play’ to seal a game. You can’t hope that Lamar Jackson would come into Tampa and get immediately put in his place like when Vick had to face Brooks… and the 2002 D’s swagger. The rules don’t allow it.