“Why Is There So Much Noise About Jameis Winston?”
June 20th, 2019
Down on America.
In the recent past, Hall of Fame general manager Bill Polian has been rather objective or at least was not ready to close the book on America’s Quarterback, Pro Bowler Jameis Winston.
That sure didn’t seem to be the case this week.
While making his weekly appearance co-hosting “Late Hits” with Alex Marvez, Polian previewed the NFC South. There, he took the Bucs apart in a very honest, blunt and rather harsh tone (as should be expected for a team that is entering what could be its 11 straight season without a playoff appearance).
Polian is a big fan of Bucco Bruce Arians. But Polian is less optimistic Arians can turn this team around. And when it comes to Jameis, Polian doesn’t understand what Arians is supposed to accomplish that former Bucs coach Dirk Koetter couldn’t.
“Why is there so much noise about Jameis Winston?” Polian asked. “He is a below-average quarterback at this stage of the game who really has done nothing in his career except show flashes of physical ability. If Dirk Koetter, who is every bit the quarterback whisperer that Bruce Arians is, couldn’t get it out of him, I am not sure that Bruce is a miracle worker. I mean, [Arians] is a great coach. Don’t get me wrong. He is a tremendous coach. He is why the Colts went to the playoffs the first year he was there [2012].
“Bruce has always had good, solid veteran quarterbacks to deal with. Andrew Luck was not a veteran but nonetheless an outstanding quarterback. I don’t think Jameis Winston will be mentioned in the same breath as any one of those guys. At least not yet.
“The bottom line is, the jury is still out on Jameis Winston.”
Yeah, Jameis needs to have a respectable season, no question. Joe isn’t doubting that. But Joe sees much bigger holes on this team than Jameis. Running back and pass rush spring to mind. Rookies and young players with no or limited NFL experience is another worry.
Jameis is maybe No. 4 on Joe’s list of Bucs concerns.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:04 am
“Why is there so much noise?”
“The jury is still out”
Answered your own question there buddy.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:07 am
Go Bucs!
Agree with Polian. No excuses, now or never.
And don’t make excuses. Defense or running game be damned, Jameis needs to behave off the field and avoid turning the damn ball over too frequently.
It’s not like Jameis isn’t the former #1 overall pick. Number one picks are supposed to be game changers, not guys that need to be carried by other parts of the team. We need our first overall pick to play like a #1 pick. If not, no extension- no franchise tag- and thankfully no more excuses!
June 20th, 2019 at 10:09 am
Polian is correct, of course. Jay-Miss is among the league leaders in INT rate, throwing into tight windows, turnovers, ect…He’s a younger version of Ryan Fitzpatrick. He shows flashes of brilliance followed by flashes of ineptness and inconsistent play. One day he’ll have 10 wins for another team and the mouth breathers will say “Ah ha, you see” but then he’ll flame out with a 4 INT game where he’s literally passing to the other team.
I hope he proves me wrong this year, but I’m putting my money down on the fact that he won’t.
6-10.
I’m taking the under.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:12 am
Always been pretty telling that the pro Jameis #1 stance is… “Jameis isn’t the biggest problem on the team” or “there areholes on the team bigger than Jameis” …. yeah, so ? who cares? He has tremendous skill postion players and adequete line…. time to put up and take care of the ball. Every qb in the nfl shows flashes. Flacco and Jameis are the only two guys in the nfl were you hearthat argument. If you take ANY average qb in the nfl and surround him with a great roster, he will look great.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:17 am
Price vs production
Does the price of a QB contract match the production on the field? No.
And he’s one off the field goof up- which he’s proven multiple times to be unable to help himself- from a year suspension.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:21 am
Jameis has his issues. The team has its issues and its clear this is a make or break year for Jameis. But to imply Koeter and Arians are basically on even footing as coaches is asinine and tells me this guy is not very informed on the Bucs. Koeter is a good OC but terrible, TERRIBLE Head coach. Arians is a huge upgrade. Now, I repeat, NOW Winston has no excuses for the first time in his career. At the least, hopefully he doesnt have to deal with having the worst defense, special teams and running game in the league. As much as the haters play stupid and pretend none of those things matter, clearly it does.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:26 am
Couch Fan,
No playing dumb here. We had a top
Passing offense last year, but Licht is inept and we have more holes than ever and no cap space.
Still, Jameis is not a $30 million salary player at this point, and he’s one off the field “hassle”, as joe calls it, from being suspended for a year or barred.
How do you invest in a guy that doesn’t live up to the hype of being the number one pick, turns the ball over too much, has inconsistencies and flat out doesn’t win enough?
Barring s strong year, id rather start over with a rookie qb, making rookie $, and we can afford more help other places.
You can’t pay Jameis a King’s Ransom for less than sufficient results.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:31 am
Why is it that other QB’s have entered the league since JW and played well beyond JW in their 1st or 2nd or 3rd year?
Are their coaches better than BA?
Or are the other QB’s better than JW?
5 years is a looonnngggg time to decide if you can or cannot deliver.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:31 am
I agree with SteveK.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:32 am
former #1 overall picks shouldn’t need 5 seasons to prove they are worthy of a second contract. Joes and Ira have stated first round picks should be yearly Pro Bowl level players especially drafted high
Jameis was an alternate one year and has yet to play consistently well to be considered anything other than average
Writing is on the wall to educated fans
June 20th, 2019 at 10:32 am
franchising and/or paying a below avg qb 30 million will not help a team that is already against the cap, fix all those holes!!!!!!!! the fold like a lawn chair qb does not make anyone better on offense!!!!!!!!! This is honestly a wasted year and if true wasted coaches that are only here for a “reload”!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Its is past time for the FULL REBUILD!!!!!!!!!!!!! and keeping the lying inconsistent qb only to try to fix ALL the faults just sets this franchise back ever further!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2019 will reveal answers to the sheep, that the “real” fans already know!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
June 20th, 2019 at 10:34 am
You are worried about the future and paying Jameis. How about we just worry abothe here and now. I agree as of right now Jameis isnt worthy of a huge pay day. But how can you honestly come to that conclusion knowing that NOBODY especially any young QB we draft could perform much better with this same team. Yes Jameis has some great passing targets. But when you are down by 2+ scores every game by the 2nd quarter, your game plan completely changes and you have to start taking chances that you wouldnt normally make which would obviously lead to more turnovers. Not an excuse, just common sense.
Jameis’s off the field issues hopefully are in his past now. No need to comment on that unless something else happens which we then would get rid of him and I would be ok with that.
I ask again. Who would live up to the hype of a #1 pick on a team that basically is the worst at everything exept 1 element of the game? If you are being honest with yourselves, the answer is obvious.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:44 am
Couch Fan,
Good points and I see your side of it. However, how often does Jameis come out flat/slow starts, and we fall behind?
I don’t remember any quick starts from him, but I do remember Fitzmagic hitting DJax in stride on the first play of the game. Why can’t the #1 overall pick hit one of the best deep threat WRs of the last decade?
And the interceptions and fumbles are too frequent. Jameis needs to take care of the ball.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:50 am
Maybe Polian is hoping JW shows up in the AAF so they can pay a fraction of their debts
June 20th, 2019 at 10:55 am
Boy Polian is reaching to try and act like DK is anywhere near the level of BA. Calling Jameis below average? Come on now, objectively he’s an average QB who has shown flashes of greatness.
June 20th, 2019 at 10:58 am
“Which NFL QB can win with this Bucs roster?
No One”
Kobe Faker
June 20th, 2019 at 10:58 am
Its not just jameis that comes out flat, it was the whole team and thats been happening before Jameis even got here. And when its the whole team that comes out flat, that tells me its the coaching not having them prepared to play. Just look at the 10-6 season we had. Every single game we were down early to both the good and bad teams only to need to pull out comebacks in the end. That was one of the easiest schedules we’ve had.
You mentioned Fitz but how long did that last? 2 games? Then Fitz went right back to his old terrible self. Theres nothing special about that. Just lucky plays that happened to work during a 2 or 3 game span.
I do completely agree about the fumbles. That dates back to his college days and clearly is something he needs to fix. Im not saying Jameis is great, Im simply saying we need to round out a better team before we can legitimately say Winston isnt the answer at QB. Its easy to say he sucks and we need a new QB but finding a QB that could win with what Jameis has had to work with would be incredibly difficult.
June 20th, 2019 at 11:04 am
polian is right that JW has only showed flashes…..but he’s dead wrong about dirk being on the same level as a QB whisper…..that comparison aint even close…..
BA has to develop players and create an identity for the team….something dirk never did…..
with that said, their are no more excuses for any player on this roster….everyone has something to prove and its time to win now….
#REALISTKNOWSNOTHING!!!!!….GO BUCS!!!!!
June 20th, 2019 at 11:07 am
OBP
I AGREE!!!!
GO BUCS!!!!
June 20th, 2019 at 11:11 am
I’d love to Hang these on Bill Pollians Wall and ask him what his problem is:
Andrew Luck – Perfect God Choir Boy QB per Pollian first 4 seasons (55 games):
1224/2106 (58%) 14,838 yards (7.04 YPA), 101 TDs, 55 Interceptions
Average TD % per attempt: 4.8%
Average INT % per attempt: 2.6%
Jameis WInston – the Why Are We Talking About Him Because he Sucks? QB per Pollian first 4 seasons (56 games):
1183/1922 (62%) 14,628 yards (7.6 YPA), 88 TDs, 58 Interceptions
Average TD % per attempt: 4.6%
Average INT % per attempt: 3.0%
WOW WINSTON SUCKS AM I RIGHT?!?!?!!
GO BUCS!
June 20th, 2019 at 11:13 am
This is why you can’t miss on a top five pick, especially at quarterback. The teams draft capital investment basically marries you to that guy for five years, leads to increased spending to”support” that guy and at the end of that time if you miss, you have no quarterback and a maxed out salary cap from bad and desperate contacts trying to win in that window. Sounds a lot like or current situation.
June 20th, 2019 at 11:24 am
Mort
Exactly my thought. He makes it sound like Winston is a bad qb then says the jury is still out. I guess when ya talk for a living you are gona say some weird things. The jury is still out on every player Bill. There’s a lil nugget for ya.
June 20th, 2019 at 11:58 am
Koetter was a terrible HC…JW went 9-7 and earned Koetter an extra year. QB whisperer maybe but sorry head coach definitely. This year hopefully ends the debate on what’s more important in the NFL: coaching or players. I thought Rams with McVay answered that but I guess not.
June 20th, 2019 at 12:01 pm
Those other holes don’t count 30-35 mil a year
That investment has to be worth it.
You need to find franchise QB for that amount cause it restricts from getting quality players in other areas to fill those holes you are talking about.
June 20th, 2019 at 12:04 pm
Andrew Luck is there boy . That’s why he gets a lot of passes. When the Colts lose it’s never Andrew Luck fault. When they win it’s because of Andrew Luck. That’s how the national media roll . When they hate you and you are on a bad team then it’s your fault. When they love you and on a bad team then it’s team not you .lol lol … That’s why if you notice they never bring up the defense or the running game when comes to the Bucs.
June 20th, 2019 at 12:07 pm
Lord corn,
Good points about the stats!
I wonder how many fumbles Winston vs Lick and how many fumbles lost Winston va luck.
All fumbles, recovered or not, should be treated as equally bad bc putting th ball on the ground is an error- whether the team recovers it or not is a chance of the roll of the ball. Also, drives get killed with fumbles.
I am curious of what the TD:Turnover ratio for Lick Vs. Winston in four years?
June 20th, 2019 at 12:23 pm
Whats w the love fest for old Billy Joe?
The game has passed him by just like it did Mike Smith.
Maybe he can have Mike smith coach one of his bankrupt AAF teams.
I know is slow season but you can do better than this
Go Bucs!!
June 20th, 2019 at 12:28 pm
Lord Corn,
Did some digging on stats for the first four years- Winston vs Luck.
Winston had 38 fumbles on four years, losing 16.
Luck had 32 fumbles, losing 14.
Looking at the TD to Turnover Ratio:
Winston 88:74= 1.19 TDs for every Turnover.
Luck 101:69= 1.46 TDs per each turnover.
For every two turnovers Luck has 2.92 touchdowns and Jameis averages 2.38 TDS for two turnovers.
Hard to win when you score at almost the same frequency of turning the ball over.
June 20th, 2019 at 12:36 pm
@SteveK
Good points for sure. In those first 4 seasons Luck had his breakthrough 40 TD campaign which really helped his #’s. Jameis has yet to have that breakthrough year, but if it’s going to happen it’d probably be 2019 with BA.
Also I am not saying Winston = LUck. Luck is the better QB.
My point is more so that he’s not that far off of Luck’s #’s the first 4 years, but you’d think given the rhetoric of Pollian/other people around here that Winston’s #’s wouldn’t even be in the ballpark. And Luck = a super high bar to set for expectations anyway.
GO BUCS!
June 20th, 2019 at 12:45 pm
I hope some of you don’t do your own taxes. Twisting things the way you do. You can play with number anyway you want. But the real numbers are what get you caught.
June 20th, 2019 at 12:48 pm
Lord corn,
Good points. It’s closer than people think.
June 20th, 2019 at 12:50 pm
I think Jameis is gonna finally make a turn for the best in his fifth year. It’s not like the guy totally stinks. Jameis Winston was 1st in NFL history with consecutive 4,000-yard passing seasons to start career. This great coaching staff is going to make Jameis much smarter with the football. This team looks hyped and looks like they’re putting the work in physically and mentally.
June 20th, 2019 at 12:51 pm
LC
spot on!!!!
GO BUCS!!!!
June 20th, 2019 at 12:52 pm
@DBS
What #’s are being twisted?
Through 4 years – in about the exact games played (56 vs 55)- we’re looking at
attempts
completions
TDs
INTs
fumbles
Yards
Anything else we’re missing on what QB stats people typically look at (other than Wins & Losses – a team stat)?
Nothing is being twisted here. Apples to Apples comparison of 2 QBs first 4 years…
I’m a financial analyst. I’ve seen a lot crazier # twisting than that.
June 20th, 2019 at 12:52 pm
Luck has proven to be a winner. 35 wins and 20 losses in four years. That says it all.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:02 pm
If the Bucs had a GM like Bill Polian, the team would be set up to win much more often!
June 20th, 2019 at 1:03 pm
If Polian don’t understand what Bruce is supposed to accomplish that Dirk couldn’t then he don’t know this team too good.
What Bruce can accomplish is putting a better team around Winston. Let’s start on defense……..Even if Winston makes a bad mistake under Bruce is it too much to ask for the defense to step up and do something to change the momentum? Or how about Special Teams? ST can change the flow of a game & outcomes. Dirk’s STs only had negative affects his entire time……..One look at how we drafted suggests this is a area Bruce is aiming to improve.
Even on offense Dirk never was able to play clash up 3rd &1 and this has nothing to do with QB play. 3rd and 1 has been hurting Winston & his offense for his entire career.
Those areas are just starting a few examples. There are plenty more if you study this team.
So Polian does understand what Bruce can do for Winston that Dirk didn’t do? I don’t think Polian knows what the heck he’s talking about.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:04 pm
Lord C
if you analyze the number of attempts by the two QB’s.
Luck had 184 more attempts. So if Jameis had the same number of attempts with his 3 % int/attempt rate you could also project at least 5 more INT’s.from Jameis.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:05 pm
Or how about Bruce developes one Offensive lineman. That will surely help Winston. And it would be one more the Dirk ever provided.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:07 pm
Bob in valrico,
Great point there. I didn’t even take into consideration.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:08 pm
Jimmy jack,
Our O Line has 3 dudes making $10+ million annually. We are the only team in the league with that $ invested. Here is to hoping we can run the ball.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:12 pm
Jimmy
What BA can do for the Bucs is handcuff Jason Licht. He is responsible for much of the lack of talent in prior years on the defensive side of the ball.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:14 pm
Lord looking at just the numbers doesnt mean much.
Luck was able to get away with INTs. He had a team around him that wouldn’t get blown out because of them.
He also was able to get the ball back and make up for it the next time which Winston doesn’t do enough.
Winston also had quite a few drives where he had a chance to win but instead the offense ran out of time. We were obvisously unprepared when that happens.
When you throw INTs and lose you contributed to the loss. When you win nobody cares what your statline was. No one will care if you throw for only 120 yards if you win.
If Luck was a losing QB with that statline he would be on the hotseat too. Same standard apply to all QBs in the league. Nobody cares about losing statlines and nobody ever will.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:15 pm
Badaboom badabeem. Polian gets it.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:17 pm
LC. Twisting numbers and making it look like it is always the fault of the defense. Down by 2 and 3 scores. Who turned it over? Where and When? The defense may not have made the stop but the number of turn overs and fumbles is what lead to or contributed to being down. Yards passing ? When were the accomplished? These are twisted numbers. How many in garbage time? Now break them down. You will See why people are seeing what we see in Winston.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:18 pm
SteveK that should be the expectation. Bruce didn’t pay D.Smith that much cash only to pass block. If that was his plan he is lesser of a HC then I have been giving credit for.
Nobody wants to admitt it but we do have talent on the OL. Thats why they are getting paid handsomely.
It’s time to start expecting these players to at at full potential. Not continue to keep underachieving like they have been.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:20 pm
Some like Winston and some don’t that is my analysis.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:24 pm
Bob I’ve got issues with lack of talent argument.
I’ll go back to what Joe wrote about for years and he was right. We didn’t develope a single CB under Dirk Koetter his entire time. The talent excuse can only get you so far. If you fall with every player you try to coach then at some point the coaching itself has to take some blame.
Damming evidence was seen last year when we got guys off the streets(D.Harris, A.Adams) with minimal talent who outplayed any players Dirk’s staff ever tried to develope.
You can’t fail with every player you touch and say it was only talent to fault. Same problem said for OL and other groups.
Now we got an accomplished staff in town. Let’s see what the difference will be.
June 20th, 2019 at 1:28 pm
Blaming only the defense is naive.
Consider the Redskins s game and the Ravens game.
The defense wasn’t great but did enough to win………..They were at least at average level(yl say if they were average we would be a will ning team). Our offense was bad in them games. Weren’t good enough.
This goes back years too. We’re they good enough against the Packers in 2017?
June 20th, 2019 at 1:45 pm
@TexBuc
Thats all there is to it!!!
June 20th, 2019 at 2:22 pm
is it too early to tank for Trevor Lawrence? lets see if we can beat clevelands 1-31 record over a 2 year span and draft lawrence in 2021!
Tank for Trevor 21′
June 20th, 2019 at 2:29 pm
@Lord Corn… Jameis 1st 4 years of #’s is pretty simillr to Blake Bortles wouldn’t you say?
June 20th, 2019 at 2:29 pm
Polian is an old washed up d-bag whose most recent accomplishment was bankrupting the AAF. The guy is done, his brain was burnt out years ago when he did his top FA list and didn’t put Michael Bennett in the top 100 or the extra 50 mentionables. He might have, at one time, had an eye for talent, but that was decades ago. Now he just goes around destroying stuff.
June 20th, 2019 at 2:31 pm
There is definitely bigger holes there really is no debating that. BUT Polian brings up great points. Sure Koetter wasn’t a great HC but he is a damn good OC. Bruce Arians is both a proven Hc and a great OC. If BA can’t get Winston to cut down on his mistakes and turn this thing around then there will be no bigger hole than QB.
It is no longer about filling other holes on the roster it is becoming is Winston worth 30 million a year or do we roll the dice and draft someone else?
Personally, I think BA gets the job done. 9-7 would be a win imo.
June 20th, 2019 at 2:43 pm
Rod Munch not for nothing but if Polian had spent some time with the Bucs orginazation you would probably be head over heels in love with him.
The dude is pretty danged ackomplished.
June 20th, 2019 at 3:08 pm
Below average QB who has shown flashes of Physical activity. Sounds like a remake of..The walking dead huh?brilliance. Yep, that bout sums it up Mr Polian.
Thats what WE got..for a No 1 pick fellow Buc fans. As always, This is going to be the year..he..expodes onto the scene. And the next yr, followed by the next..and the next…Rinse, repeat wash…..I’m just..the watcher and observer of my Bucs.
Every year….we are Gonna…
June 20th, 2019 at 3:09 pm
I love how in the first paragraph, Polian is basically saying Jameis is unsalvagable without divine intervention and if Dirk couldn’t fix him, why should anyone bother? In the next two paragraphs he offers hope that all is not lost. Make up your mind dude or go run for office where talking out of both sides of your mouth is more acceptable behavior.
June 20th, 2019 at 3:11 pm
He stopped drinking and he’s a father. He’s not the same person he was before. Much more mature and we will see that on the field like we did at the end of last year. This time his play will stay solid.
June 20th, 2019 at 3:19 pm
JimmyJack – I’m aware of his history, but it’s pretty clear to me he checked out of full-time study and all-in football many many years ago. ESPN had a huge write-up on the AAF last week, and while they didn’t focus on saying anything bad about Polian, reading the article he comes across as completely detached from reality. In my mind he’s an old guy living off past fame and doesn’t put much effort into what he does at this point. Reading his ESPN stuff from a few years ago it was often embarrassing in how generic it was, and of course him doing things like not mentioning Bennett in his FA list that year. That was the first time I read his stuff and just said, wtf. Then after that the more I would read, the more detached from reality it sounded. The guy is old and I just think he’s lost it. Happens to everyone sooner or later, but at this point I don’t think Polian could pick Winston out of a lineup if the other guys around him were Craig Erickson, Jeremy Lin and Lady Gaga.
June 20th, 2019 at 3:21 pm
At the end of last year he was “neutered”. So do people think BA is going to do that to him now?
June 20th, 2019 at 3:32 pm
I’m no where near ready to give up on Jameis. To place on him more than a sliver of the blame for 10-22 is like blaming You-Know-Who for the ineptitude of the D line. Thanks Lord Corn for doing the research.
I am as frustrated with the losing as anyone and it’s real easy to hammer away at the guys making the most money, but it’s not even close to fair. I remember the home game against the Saints last December. In the 4th quarter when we were down by multiple scores, we had guys laughing, joking and slapping each other on the bench. That, in addition to predictable schemes was the problem. The culture said losing was OK. I am expecting this to change under the new staff.
June 20th, 2019 at 3:41 pm
Rod I hate to say that an NFL icon losing his mind is a good thing but in this case it probably is since he thinks Arians cannot ackomplished anything w/Jamies.
Just wanted to chime and give Polian a bit of respect that he has earned………..Given the choice I will rather hear the opinion of a great once successful NFL man who has lost his mind. I’ll pay more attention to that guy then the 90% of blowhards they put on my television set.
June 20th, 2019 at 3:44 pm
If We traded future draft pick for a good running back
June 20th, 2019 at 4:23 pm
“Winston also had quite a few drives where he had a chance to win but instead the offense ran out of time. ”
I remember 1 – Rams game. THat’s it. Can’t think of literally any other.
@DBS
I’ve charted all this type of stuff before. I literally charted every interception from a YT video breakdown of all his interceptions. I should have saved it but it’s somewhere in some JBF comment section.
My conclusion was he still threw too many bad picks even after considering ones off WR hands / ones in hail mary situation / etc. THere were still too many simply bad decisions that hurt the team. At the same time he rarely threw them in critical situations / with games tight and on the line late – per someone else’s comments.
In general he scores about the same amount in 1st halves as 2nd halves. Most of his good games have been in games we won, not garbage time games we lost. IF anything that trend is the opposite.
I don’t get why people have to see this as black and white – either pro winston he’s the best QB ever or winston sucks let’s move on. Or that fi you don’t think Winston sucks you are some homer. I’m in between. He’s an average QB IMO at worst with the potential to be above average / elite.
Per ESPNs QBR which takes into account situation football/how much the QB is doin gon his own/ they rated him #8 last year. I don’t know any other rating that tries to contextualize the #’s the way you are askingl.
June 20th, 2019 at 4:33 pm
Jimmy’
Think about it, if guys off the street are better than the ones Licht put on the roster ,then talent is a very large part of it, IMO When your supposed best
cornerback is a fading Brent Grimes then you got issues. He was falling down and getting pushed out of plays as long as two years ago.
Licht has to get it right the first time. This team can’t move forward if he is constantly trying to correct a draft pick or free agent signing. Lots of holes on the team.
Hopefully BA will guide Licht to fix things right the first time.
There is a reason we drafted 2 corners and a safety , because the ones Licht
drafted last year
were not good enough, very possibly including VH3. On the surface, every one
has speed and aggressiveness .
June 20th, 2019 at 4:47 pm
To be fair ,Koetter and Smith were probably the reason we kept Grimes. But lets face it, his play and attitude was pretty passive. I will give Licht a pass on that one.
June 20th, 2019 at 4:48 pm
BA has made like 5-6 QBs look good including Drew Stranton whoever that is, Dirk has made 1 QB look good and Matty actually played better without Dirk.
June 20th, 2019 at 4:55 pm
Polian obviously doesnt understand that Koetter undervalues the running game and Arians does not. I respect Bruce Arians mroe than I do Polian. This take showed Polian will speak on topics he has not fully done his work on. Bad take Mr Polian you lost me on this one.
June 20th, 2019 at 5:02 pm
The last relevant thing that Polian did was rip off thousands of employees and leave injured athletes with unpaid medical bills- stand up guy.
June 20th, 2019 at 5:26 pm
@Bob……..And was Licht slamming the table for Brent Grimes. My guess is neither of us know for sure why the team choose Brent Grimes but I would wager good money that the coaching staff said they needed Brent Grimes and could win with him.
He was a former Atlanta Falcon just like Dirk and Smitty after all. It’s pretty much common knowledge that coaching staffs lobby their GMs to sign specific players……..Players they know well that they know they can coach and that they know can be a benefit to the team and locker room. It’s been reported that the Bucs did a lot of coaxing to get Brent Grimes back here. They really wanted him……..Don’t think it’s far fetched to say that the coaching staff was the ones who really wanted him.
The worst part about keeping Brent Grimes here was what Brent Grimes said himself after the season. He said the coaching staff tryed to have him mentor players in a manner that he felt uncomfortable with(by getting load/vocal). He also said they put him in a role he didn’t want to do or couldn’t do……..not sure exact phrasing…..,…………….This is bad coaching man. Especially if Brent Grimes is your guy who you are familiar with. You should know what you can ask of him and what you can’t ask of him. We can debate whether or not he was a good player but their is not much of a debate the coaches put him in a position that didn’t suit him………that’s a coaching problem. And it’s basically unforgivable that they coached Grimes for many years and still couldn’t get the most out of him. I’m disappointed in the coaches for begging for this guy and then not knowing how to best use him. First and foremost.
We saw Dirk and what he got out of his guys…..like Djax and Grimes.
Let’s just see what we get with Bruce and what he does with his guys.
And Licht still deserves a big ole F for the last couple years. But he is not the whole Front Office. The coaches are part of it and if the coaches are failing in their part then the GM will not ever be successful. It’s never happened once in the league.
Damm Licht all you want. I won’t say it’s unfair. But it’s defientally not fair to say that just he is responsible for the results of this team………….You don’t get a losing record on your home field. Get blown out in half of your losses. Lose games based off of mental errors & overall not be a competitive franchise because of one man. It’s never that easy.
Many mistakes we’re made In the decision making process and in physical preparation. That’s why Licht(basically) got demoted and does not have control of the operations no more. It’s not been reported but it seems obvisous that Bruce is the main person in control of the operations. He is the new boss.
Bruce will make a difference here. Be it good or bad it’s a noticeable difference that has already been established………..The coaching staff is now almost twice the size it once was. Our defense is making a radical change from the stragety we have used for the last 30(40?) years now. Several high profile players are gone……..Heck Bruce even went so far as to take a sledgehammer to parts of the lockeroom and the practice field speakers.
This organization is going to be run completely different then it did last year with those awful coaching and GM decisions. Tose days are over and whoever deserves the most blame is fun but is backwards thinking……….The future is ahead of us and we Buc fans are entering a new one!!!!!! Let’s focus on the future and on this new Era………I’m getting on the ride and plan to enjoy it………If we ride off the rails and crash I got my helmet on……and hardened skins from prior Burns!!!!!!
For now I’m a new Bruce fan cause he got that old school mentality. I believe it’s what has been missing and what it takes to win.
First let the Bucs get good then we can be great.
***END RANT***
typos**
11-5
June 20th, 2019 at 5:27 pm
And I will answer my own question……Yes
If the Bucs win this year it means Licht is not a dumbass.
June 20th, 2019 at 5:54 pm
Lord Corn I can remember us running out of time against the Falcons. 2017….the it the Jon Gruden game? On the last play of the game we had to rush our FG unit on the field and barely got the snap off on time. Rushing the snap means you ran out of time to do it properly.
Now if you rewind that game back to when the last drive started had the ball and had enough time to get into the endzone. Great QBs do it every week with same situation.
The sad part was we didn’t even sniff the endzone and the FG try was 50+. The sadder part was the Falcons didn’t make any plays on us. In fact I believe most, maybe all, plays we ran were positive yards. It was just a poorly excuted 1 minute offense.
There have other instances of running out of time. I’ll try to look up more examples.
But I’m not pointing to Jamies here. This is a team problem. It speaks to the overall preparedness of Dirk’s offense……..Unfortunately when the offense is not prepared the QB takes a brunt of the blame ….fair or not…….it’s just part of their job. Same for each 32 QBs. Same for Winston.
June 20th, 2019 at 5:59 pm
The Bucs will draft a QB in the first round of the next draft regardless of how Jameis plays for the same reason they drafted White this year…because it’s the right/smart thing to do. If Jameis stinks it up, it’s a high draft choice so Tua/Hebert, if he plays well Fromm/Eason/Costello. The class is too good to not pluck one.
June 20th, 2019 at 6:03 pm
Polian is an idiot.
June 20th, 2019 at 6:18 pm
Holy spit this is the dumbest take yet. When you utter the words “Dirk Koetter is every bit the quarterback whisperer that Bruce Arians is” you lose nearly every bit of credibility you’ve ever built for yourself. What a f***ing joke!
June 20th, 2019 at 7:32 pm
Polian did not tell any lies. If Winston was a franchise QB, he would have gotten a new contract this off season. The first criteria of being a franchise QB is winning.
There is no question this is the decision making year on him. If BA says he has to go, the Bucs move on and I think they try a vet in FA unless Clemson’s Lawrence falls into the Buc’s lap. This is a business. If he cant win in 5 years, it says enough. QB dictates the NFL game more than any other position. Its too critical to have success there to win games.
June 20th, 2019 at 7:38 pm
Jimmy Jack. The Colts was losing with Andrew luck and his turnovers but they blame the team not him . Remember it was because of the running game and the defense and the offensive line the same Problem Jamies has have. But one of the biggest differences between the two is Luck played in the worst conference in the NFL . Jamies played in the hardest conference in the NFL that’s the differences between the two.
June 20th, 2019 at 7:42 pm
Donut you are a fantasy football guy . You don’t know nothing about football. Anytime I here that the quarterback is the most important position that determines the outcome of a game then I know you know nothing about football.
June 20th, 2019 at 7:52 pm
Don’t be fooled by the hate, BA understands QB’s far better than DK – to say the prior HC is on the same level is literally laughable and makes Polian’s take worthless at best
When JW throws for close to 5k yds and 30 TDs this year, let’s look back at this “projection”
June 20th, 2019 at 9:22 pm
If Winston has decent year this year they need to tag him next year. He needs to put two good seasons together back to back.
No matter what happens, I’ll never be able to unsee the disturbing “eating a W” scene. For that I dont know if I can ever forgive him. One of the all time cringeworthy things I have ever seen.
June 21st, 2019 at 12:06 am
Jimmy, I think I said that in a previous a couple of posts above yours about Grimes. also believe Smitty and Koetter fell all over themselves to keep him.
Here’s my beef with Grimes , 1. He didn’t want to cover the number one receiver.
Two , His idea of pushing the receiver toward another player so he could get the assist is far softer than any thing McCoy could have done, IMO. Koetter made plenty of mistakes here and keeping Smitty and Grimes were two of them.
I wish BA well and if we keep players that have the “want to excel” mentality and continue to add more then this team will start to gel . Players have to buy in to any system .
I will say this ,if Jameis had truly bought in, some of the errors
in judgement and TO’s would have been corrected long before year four
leading to his benching.