Freeman Circus Reminiscent Of Dilfer Era
September 17th, 2013
Joe remembers the Trent Dilfer saga well. Dilfer became a punching bag for fans and media who staunchly believed Dilfer was holding the Bucs back from greatness in the 1990s.
Dilfer was inconsistent. He didn’t have the raw talent of Josh Freeman, but he also didn’t have receivers that compare to Freeman’s.
The Bucs’ organization? Well, they showed their confidence in Dilfer by drafting a quarterback (Shaun King) in the second round when Dilfer was still young and only a season removed from the Pro Bowl. Sound a little familiar?
Former Bucs tight end Dave Moore, a former teammate of Dilfer, hears the fans and media hounds circling Josh Freeman like sharks. And it takes him back to the Tony Dungy era.
“We spent a lot of years with Trent Dilfer in the locker room. They were always trying to bash him about something,” Moore said on WDAE-AM 620 recently. “After every game he played, it was the same conversation [like about Josh Freeman]. ‘We know. We don’t trust Trent Dilfer to win it for us. We’re going to win it on the ground with Mike and Warrick. It was the same conversation. And then he goes to Baltimore and wins a Super Bowl.”
As for Freeman, Moore summed up the QB’s Bucs future well. “His fate is really in his own hands.”
(Listen to the entire Moore interview below. Joe’s already quoted lots of good stuff from it.)
September 17th, 2013 at 1:04 pm
Unfortunately for Josh there are no tems with elite defenses who need a QB that he can gravy train to a ring like Dilfer.
September 17th, 2013 at 1:06 pm
My stance on Freeman is this. Is he a top 5 QB? No. Can he win a super bowl? Absolutely. I think Freeman is just as good as Flacco or Eli Manning. He is definitely no Rodgers, Brees, P. Manning, or Brady. But can he produce Eli or Flacco results? Absolutely. People like to give Freeman a lot of flack but the dude is solid. He is not the best but solid. I do not understand why people are not more frustrated at our DE’s. Clayborn hustles and all but the there is 0 and I mean 0 immediate pass rush from our DL outside of when GMC goes hulk mode. Our DL is still pretty embarassing to watch and most of our sacks this year have come off blitzes where our LB/DBs get the job done. I understand people expect more out of freeman but if he gives 55%+ pass completions and a Qb rating of 80+ I am fine with that. But why is there no hate for our apparently non existant DE’s?
September 17th, 2013 at 1:10 pm
At least with Dilfer, I always felt he was giving 110% (though his 110% wasn’t very good) and actually gave a crap about things.
September 17th, 2013 at 1:11 pm
And what did shaun king win ? More food ?
September 17th, 2013 at 1:14 pm
Still can’t believe he has a ring. I hope he calls and thanks his agent every single day.
September 17th, 2013 at 1:18 pm
Add steve young and Doug Willis to the list of qbs that left here and won a Super Bowl …. You see a lot fans here are not very bright !
That might be an understatement tho
September 17th, 2013 at 1:20 pm
*williams*
September 17th, 2013 at 1:20 pm
It’s what I have been saying for 2 days on here. The Bucs are essentially reliving history. They have a good D on the cusp of a great D and no offense. Bucs fans we’ve been through this before. How some of you cannot see it is beyond me. As of right now. Freeman = Dilfer, Schiano = Dungy in the making. Don’t get all crazy on me now, I’m not even comparing Dungy to Schiano. All I’m saying is this looks and smells like a team we fans have already seen before. Great defense, good running game, no passing game.
September 17th, 2013 at 1:24 pm
No passing game is totally inexcusable with the weapons this team has, Bring up Steve Young and Doug Williams all you’d like Raphael, they never had weapons on the Bucs as good as VJax, Mike Williams and the Dougernaut. Josh does and he’s wasting them and setting himself up to a backup next year.
September 17th, 2013 at 1:26 pm
What’s the point of the article..Freeman would get bashed in any city if he played this way.
September 17th, 2013 at 1:34 pm
point of the article:Freeman Circus Reminiscent Of Dilfer Era
September 17th, 2013 at 1:36 pm
Bucright ? Really ? Kevin house , Jimmie Giles , Ricky bell ??
1987 …. So our defense is great now ? They were on the field we we lost both games …. Your wrong
September 17th, 2013 at 1:42 pm
Raphael none of those guys were at the top of their position like Doug or VJax. This is by my count the only time in Bucs history where they’ve had 2 such potent offensive weapons. And blaming the defense more? Just stop dude, its been pointed out multiple times but the Bucs have 0 TDs this year that didn’t start with the defense. The defense has elite potential. The offense has Pepto Bismol potential.
September 17th, 2013 at 1:43 pm
Raphael, now I know you’re an absolute idiot!
Steve Young was never even given a chance. Josh Freeman is in his 5th year and still sucks!
Doug Williams led the Bucs to an NFC Championship and three playoff berths.
They never had the weapons that Josh has right now.
Dilfer won only because the Ravens had an outstanding defense. Check his stats for the Super Bowl in 2000, he played horrible!
September 17th, 2013 at 1:43 pm
And if it wasn’t for our defense we wouldn’t have scored in the game against the Saints.
Freeman is worst than Dilfer. Dilfer did more with less. Freeman has all the tools but the football IQ of a chimp.
Start Glennon ASAP!
September 17th, 2013 at 1:51 pm
If we start out 0-4 or 1-5, I say just tank the season for Bridgewater/McCarron/Manziel. We need a quarterback, one that actually has the potential to be elite and be a pro bowler. Even if Freeman plays mediocre, he still wasn’t worth the 1st round selection. We’ve seen too many mediocre quarterbacks in Tampa for 37 years, why can’t we finally be a team that has one of the best quarterbacks in the league?
September 17th, 2013 at 1:55 pm
Raphael is an idiot and will say anything to make Freeman out to be some stud, which he isnt.
September 17th, 2013 at 1:57 pm
No one ever gained anything by “tanking the season”. Loser mentality…..
September 17th, 2013 at 1:58 pm
Exactly what this reminds me of. I’m so glad Dilfer came back and shoved it down everyone’s throats. Glennon looks terrible. You guys really want to relive having Shaun King at the helm?
September 17th, 2013 at 2:05 pm
Dilfer is a super bowl winning quarterback. What don’t you fools get about that? I hope that either Dominik ignores you all our there is another Brad Johnson out there to bail us out of a bad move.
September 17th, 2013 at 2:23 pm
I know what to do:
Have Glennon play the first 3 quarters.
Then put in Comeback Josh to finish the game.
September 17th, 2013 at 2:27 pm
CouchFan, Bucrightoff, and Lightningbuc,
Lets the four of us start a write-in campaign to get Josh traded or cut. You guys will get Glennon for QB and I will get Schiano run out of town. Voila’, we all get what we want. Like Don King, Shaun King’s uncle says “Only in America”. Lol
September 17th, 2013 at 2:27 pm
Here’s a solution…
Send Freeman, a 2nd and a 5th to The Skins for Cousins.
Freeman is a talented QB, he really needs a new start, to many OCs and not good enough coaching, he needs a year to sit and absorb an offense. The Skins need to do something about the fact they gave up to many picks for a QB who is not going to make it to season 3. The only way they restock picks is to trade someone like Cousins who is starter material. Skins get a backup and two picks they didn’t have and we get a game ready starter…
September 17th, 2013 at 2:28 pm
I think I’m pretty much done with the comments section of this website. I’ll read the posts by Joe, nothing else. Because the fandom in Tampa is very disappointing.
September 17th, 2013 at 2:31 pm
@BucFanForever
That idea actually might work because Freeman starts slow and finishes well…..Glennon really can’t do much worse.
You and I know they would never do that, but it would be interesting to see it.
September 17th, 2013 at 2:37 pm
I don’t want Glennon to play. Him playing means Freeman sucks. Freeman sucks means our season is lost. I’m not happy about that.
But when the season is lost, and if the Bucs aren’t keeping Freeman, they have to go to Glennon to see what they have. No point in trotting Freeman out there if he’s not gonna be here anyways. Time to look to the future of guys who will be on the roster.
September 17th, 2013 at 2:37 pm
I always find it interesting that posters who don’t want to post anymore have to make an announcement about it, as if for us to come back to them begging for them not to leave.
September 17th, 2013 at 2:44 pm
Flmike,
Cousins is a game ready starter why? Because you saw him start one game against the Briwns last year?
September 17th, 2013 at 2:51 pm
lol Dilfer was definatly a worse QB than Freeman, but their stories are similar and probably will end the same way, with Freeman leaving Tampa.
September 17th, 2013 at 2:51 pm
BuccaneerBonzai Says:
September 17th, 2013 at 2:28 pm
I think I’m pretty much done with the comments section of this website. I’ll read the posts by Joe, nothing else. Because the fandom in Tampa is very disappointing.
Yes… this… LOL
September 17th, 2013 at 2:53 pm
@Bucrightoff
You are a true Buc fan….that is the exact way to look at things…we absolutely want Freeman to succeed…if he does, we do…..but if he doesn’t, there comes a time when you have to move on and that means playing Glennon to help him develop and see what you have….Do you need to bring in a FA or draft a QB next year?….does Glennon need a year or two in development?…etc.
The problem with inconsistencey is half of that is good…and the real Josh Freeman creates a situation where you just don’t know…..I predict he will play well in 1 of the next two games….just enough to keep him starting….Glennon probably won’t start until there are 4-5 games left in the season. And, if that happens…Freeman is gone for good.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:00 pm
Lightningbuc,
Sounds like rightoff has written us off. Looks like you and me will have to do the dirty work. We have got to get Glennon in there. It is the only sure way to get Schiano run. As long as Freeman is here, Schiano will continue to use him to cover up his losses. I know Couch is in. Let me know if I can count on you.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:00 pm
Let me help you out about Dilfer. The receivers would run 6 yards down field and wave their arms. He would throw a bullet 4 feet over their heads. If they could catch the ball, they would have their backs to the defense and would get creamed.
The word out on his running back, Errict Rhett, was that he had bad hands. He held NCAA records for receiving at UF. Rhett would go out into the flat and Dilfer would fire a bullet at his Achilles. To Rhett’s credit he would actually catch many of these but would be lying helpless on his backside for linebackers to blast.
The thing that makes me want to puke is that Dilfer is very intelligent, very athletic (scratch golfer) and does have a great football IQ. He just couldn’t hit a moving receiver in the hands.
He threw a TD in the SB where his receiver went 6 yards downfield, waved his arms, actually caught the ball and guessed the right direction, spun around and ran 80 yards for a TD. That’s all the Ravens needed to win.
Josh has flashes of brilliance but his mechanics are a mirror image of Tebow.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:09 pm
Starting Glennon might mean a mid-season mutiny by the veterans. Last thing we need is more malcontents. NFL.com is already reporting Revis is unhappy with Schiano. You think he’s going to like it when we bring in the frail thin, super raw Glennon? Please. The team this year has to live and die by Freeman. We’re NOT in rebuilding mode. The qb verdict needs to be revisited only in the 2014 draft if the season really does go south.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:17 pm
@Vern4499
Yeah….that’s it, you found me out. I watch random games and then proclaim people starter material.
Don’t be shocked to hear this floated about in the weeks before the trade deadline….
September 17th, 2013 at 3:22 pm
@ Splengo
a run at Schiano? you obviously need to relive the 2011 season if you dont think Schiano has improved this team, especially on defense. I can remember a time when our freakin defense would allow 200 yards rushing a game! and that was directly before Schiano arrived. our pass defense is also improving, but it takes time dammit. Schiano cant just snap his fingers and fix everything all at once, like this damn fan base expects. things will get better.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:27 pm
It took one of the best defenses in history for Dilfer to win a SB. Baltimore was much like the Bucs in those days. Run the ball and rely on the defense. Freeman is a different QB. Although we’re having the same result.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:32 pm
Whoop, whoop! bucbucbucbucbuc! What day is this? Don’t you see? They will mutiny! That’s why we have got to get Glennon in there. This will be the coup de etat for Schiano. With Darelle Revis calling for his head, if he looks over his shoulder too fast, it will fall off. The wheels are turning now.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:32 pm
Splengo,
No, you can’t count me in to anything running the coach off. Want JFro gone, but not Schiano.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:40 pm
Splengo
let me get this straight, you have a scheme concocted that says bench Freeman, play Glennon who should fail, which will intern get Schiano fired. bucs fans- home of the most unstable people on the freakin planet. go watch soccer.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:44 pm
What I love the most is everyone who complained all last year about “If we just had a defense” are the same people who want to run Schiano off despite the fact out defense now looks like it has elite potential. The offense is and has been in total disarray since they 6-4 start last season. Its unquestionably the reason the Bucs are where they are right now.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:45 pm
“And then he goes to Baltimore and doesn’t do anything to cost that defense a Super Bowl.”
Fixed that for you, Dave.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:50 pm
Raphael,
Stop being a freeman homer. Please. A HOF qb has even said he’s terrible. What are your credentials.
September 17th, 2013 at 3:55 pm
He was a pro bowl alternate in 2010 ….what’s your credentials ?
September 17th, 2013 at 3:58 pm
He had us in winning position 2 games in a row. What is your guys problem ?He didn’t lose either game . IN Fact we were winning when the defense took over both games……Those are the FACTS …. Dispute all you want but it’s still the facts .
September 17th, 2013 at 4:00 pm
If the D continues to play this good against the likes of Brees and Brady. Schiano is going nowhere. Count on it.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:02 pm
Andrew1,
It’s like cutting off your hand so you can free yourself from a boulder.
Lightning,
Look up the word dichotomy. You can’t have it both ways – JFro gone, Schiano DOA. Can’t wait, besides an added plus will be reading your comments after he’s been run. Lol
September 17th, 2013 at 4:05 pm
The D played lights out against the saints……the jets not so much …hope they get consistent 🙂
September 17th, 2013 at 4:17 pm
Why do people even bother with Raphael and his love affair anymore? If the Bucs could have beaten the Saints we all would have known the reason why they did. It was the defense plain and simple that virtually shut down a high powered offense for 59 minutes of the game. Freeman’s offense scored 1 TD to match the Bucs great defense. Right now Freeman is at the bottom of the barrel in QB ratings in the NFL he is going backwards. The Bucs D on the other hand is stepping up. Again why does everyone bother with Raphael who is so lovesick over Freeman? That defense kept the Bucs in the game for 59 minutes, what did Freeman do to match it? Just ignore Raphael. Your wasting your time. Kind of like the guy or girl that has all their friends telling them to stay away from dating someone, but they never listen. That’s Raphael in a nutshell.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:18 pm
Splengo…replace Schiano with whom?
September 17th, 2013 at 4:18 pm
Hey Raphael you are aware Derek Anderson made the Pro Bowl once right? Similar career paths too: Had a great season once, looked like the future and then of course he ultimately didn’t find much funny. Now he’s the Panthers backup. I got Josh as either the Bears or Raiders backup next year.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:22 pm
I should take another JBF poll right now. It’s a good time for one. Here’s the poll question.
If you had a choice between the HC leaving or Freeman which one do you choose?
and Splengo it’s a 1 or the other question.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:23 pm
1987. I think josh was rated higher than Brady and kaepernik this week ….FYI
September 17th, 2013 at 4:27 pm
Losers live in the past my friend. 2010 was a long time ago. He’s regressed.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:28 pm
Bucrightoff …I got freeman as the bucs starting QB next year.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:29 pm
Raphael this is also the first games of poor performances for kap and Brady who have led there team to Super Bowls. Josh hasn’t gotten to the playoffs.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:30 pm
Chris… I don’t think so …. The season is young and we would be 2-0 if not for the defense and then Schiano
September 17th, 2013 at 4:31 pm
Raphael, you’re still living in 2010 my friend. Not even close.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:33 pm
The defense gave up 18 and 16 points back to back weeks. Where’s te offense? The firepower we have , should be rock solid right? Look at the top each game. We lost by 6 min each game.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:34 pm
If you had a choice between the HC leaving or Freeman which one do you choose?
September 17th, 2013 at 4:35 pm
Only place Freeman will be starting next year is on raphael’s fantasy team.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:38 pm
The Bucs offense has 2 good WR’s, a great RB, a pretty good O-line that gave Freeman lots of time this past Sunday. What do Buc fans get from Freeman 9-22 125 yrds 1TD 1 INT and a fumble? 1 TD. One. Equal to the defenses points put on the board. 1 TD.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:38 pm
The team and players are with Freeman 100 % ….a lot of players are not happy with Schiano right now.
Too strict
Bad game plans
Bad schemes
Bad play calls
Handcuffing Freeman
September 17th, 2013 at 4:40 pm
I wanna know Raphael’s ties to freeman. I mean according to him all the coaching staff and 52 players on the team are incompetent except the mighty josh freeman.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:40 pm
People are still bothering with Raphael? I just don’t get it anymore. Your wasting your time. Kind of like the guy or girl that has all their friends telling them to stay away from dating someone, but they never listen. That’s Raphael in a nutshell.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:40 pm
1987. The vaunted o line had a 72 yrd td called back. Numerous penalties put us in 3rd and long .
September 17th, 2013 at 4:41 pm
Chris …nope ,… Free can play a lot better …and will
September 17th, 2013 at 4:42 pm
And no I am not his younger brother Caleb .. Lol
September 17th, 2013 at 4:45 pm
It’s only week 2 and I’m at the point of I don’t care anymore who the Bucs have at QB. Freeman or whoever. I really don’t care. They have the makings of a great defense. So I don’t care. As a matter of fact the better this defense becomes the more I’m going to begin to really HATE and I do mean hate Freeman. I’ll just expect him to not show up on gameday and watch what this defense can do, because that’s all the Bucs have right now. I LOVE defense.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:46 pm
I expect Freeman to not show this Sunday too. I think the O will do just enough to squeeze out the win though, but Freeman’s numbers are going to look the same.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:47 pm
The offense is just as good as the defense played ( recently) ..I think they will put it all together ….the season is still young
September 17th, 2013 at 4:49 pm
Bill Belichick will have 10 days to prepare for a QB with zero confidence and regressing ability. I want a 40+ running play day from our offense Sunday, get the Dougernaut around 30 carries and get Leonard and Hillis 5-10 carries each. Old school, 2001 Bucs football this weekend, pound the rock and get the D 21 points.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:52 pm
bucrightoff …yup.
September 17th, 2013 at 4:56 pm
Nope ..Free should throw it about 30 – 35 times
September 17th, 2013 at 5:01 pm
Buc1987,
You can vote for me. Either or achieves my goal. Let me be forthright less there be any doubt. I don’t like this guy…that is…as a head coach. Is probably otherwise a nice guy. Maybe it’s that telltale occipital bun or those supra-orbital brow ridges. Look those terms up Buc1987 and you will see what I think of his coaching style.
September 17th, 2013 at 5:39 pm
It’s possible the Bucs will lose the next game. Likely. But that doesn’t mean the season is lost. I know people will say no team makes the playoffs after starting 0-3. But that doesn’t mean it cannot be done. It is just difficult.
Regardless, I never felt the playoffs were a must. To me, strong improvement is a must. We’re seeing it on defense. We saw it on offense for much of last year. These are growing pains.
Things are not nearly so bad as they seem, but emotions are high. Patience is short.
Just cleaning up the penalties would change everything. Consider what penalties led to in the first 2 games. In this last game it was a penalty that cost us the game. Vincent Jackson and Freeman both hooked up for a score. Had that counted it would have been a win and Freeman’s numbers would have been much better. Had it counted there would have been no pick.
So if they clean up the penalties and improve oline play the Bucs will be contending again. No change in coach, oc or qb needed.
September 17th, 2013 at 5:53 pm
@raphael,
Of your statement Freeman throwing 30 – 35 times; you just proved that you know nothing about football. He would average a INT a game and that would be extra catastrophic! Did you not see that backfoot throw Sunday?
September 17th, 2013 at 6:37 pm
Yes and it was a bad throw …. It does happen sometimes
September 17th, 2013 at 7:00 pm
There’s a long history of QBs starting their career with the Bucs, and finding much greater success after they depart – Williams, Young, Testaverde, Dilfer. Dilfer’s actually the outlier in that he sucked even after he left the Bucs; the team around him was so special that it won a Super Bowl despite him.
I think Freeman has a real good shot at being the next one in this line. He started really young — even now in his 5th season he’s only 25 years old. Heck, that’s the same age Tom Brady was in his _first_ full season as a starter.
So yes, I think we could end up watching another Buc QB leave and go on to great success. If Freeman doesn’t turn it around here really quick, that’s just a chance we’ll have to take. We can’t continue with the Josh Freeman we’ve had over the last 8 or so games. He’s killing us. Sometimes a change of scenery can fix a lot of problems, if that’s what happens then so be it.
I haven’t actually given up on him yet. But in my mind, if he plays the next game like the last two (sub-50 QB rating), then I would be okay if the team decides it’s time to give Glennon a shot.
September 17th, 2013 at 7:00 pm
Too bad the bad throws are an every game sort of thing for freeman. It’s laughable bc the bucs are truly a franchise qb away from playoff competition heck even further.
September 17th, 2013 at 7:07 pm
I think Joe should do any article on Raphael’s love affair with Freeman.
Chris are you still arguing with this guy?
September 17th, 2013 at 7:21 pm
The media frenzy is about the same.
People forget Trent had a pro bowl year, and was the QB that led us to a playoff appearance after a 15 year drought. Won that game vs. the lions if I recall.
I’m just not sure Free could ever do that.
Put a gun to my head and I’d pick Dilfer over Free.
September 17th, 2013 at 7:46 pm
Not really arguing with him 1987. Just frustration. This team is so good around the qb. It’s a shame
September 17th, 2013 at 8:58 pm
Lol. …hilarious
September 17th, 2013 at 8:59 pm
Raphael doesn’t even believe the sh#t he says about freeman; he just comments to try and get a stir out of you guys.’HE’S FULL OF IT’
September 17th, 2013 at 9:09 pm
Raphael, just so you know……Freeman has the most interceptions in the NFL since the beginning of the 2011 season (41 INT). What do you have to say about that??