“Start Over”
February 15th, 2023
Former Bucs QB Shaun King and Tampa Bay GM Jason Licht.
One of the world’s biggest Bucs fans, former Bucs quarterback Shaun King, who also was a local high school star and a coach at the University of South Florida, has a little advice for Buccaneers general manager Jason Licht.
“Start over.”
King explained on WDAE radio last week that the Bucs maximized the Tom Brady years and now it’s time to let it go.
“As frustrating as it may be, I would start liquidating assets,” King said. “I would start trying to find out what pieces we have that could bring back the most value from a draft-capital standpoint and a young, team-control contract standpoint. And figure the quarterback position out, while I’m getting younger on the other areas of the roster. That would be my approach.”
King is correct. That’s a “frustrating” approach. Joe might even call it “painful.”
But like King, Joe also wants a quarterback. If the Bucs see one they covet in this draft, then they have to explore going to get the guy now and making the decisions to get there. Same is true for 2024.
Regardless, the Bucs don’t look like a Super Bowl contender in 2023, so considering every players’ immediate and long-term value is necessary.
The worry-about-it-later fun of the past two offseasons is over.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:09 pm
Heartbreaking but true
February 15th, 2023 at 12:16 pm
Get liquid, I like it!
February 15th, 2023 at 12:20 pm
I would wait one more year to do that.
See what we have in Trask, absorb the brady cap hit and keep as
many good young free agents as possible.
If Trask doesn’t work out you start over next year
firing Bowels, getting new head coach and QB.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:20 pm
Agreed
February 15th, 2023 at 12:22 pm
The sooner the better.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:23 pm
The good news is we don’t have to wait to start looking at who will be available in the 2024 draft.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:24 pm
My opinion is and opinions are like rear end everybody has one is, to cut the players they need to get under the cap. Bring in someone like Brisset if he’s willing to take a deal like ( bridge QB ), draft a QB in the draft to complete with Trask next season and I think we will be just fine. Not a Super Bowl contender but at least the playoffs. However, the main ingredient a good OC and QB coach
February 15th, 2023 at 12:25 pm
Don’t look like a Super Bowl contender not knowing what the roster looks like is asinine. How about we wait to see what the team does. You don’t know who could revive their career, but a breakout player or anything at this point. We could blow the team up and have a helluva a team. We have no idea what will happen until we field a team and then see how good or bad we are. We get surprised every year by a player or a team doing better than expected. Doom and gloom is the way of JoeBucsFan.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:28 pm
This is quite surprising to me, I agree 100% with King for the first time in my life
February 15th, 2023 at 12:28 pm
I believe the Bucs need to draft OL/DL/Edge/DB in 2023. In 2024 they can address QB/WR/RB/OL in the draft.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:28 pm
Arian Foster says the script doesn’t call for a rebuild lol
February 15th, 2023 at 12:35 pm
Bingo.. what so many of us have been trying to say while the “forever hopeful” dream of another SB run with this roster.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:41 pm
Me too ZZ.
Strange times.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:45 pm
Also need a NEW head coach that is a teacher, leader & motivator!!!!!
February 15th, 2023 at 12:46 pm
BA did Todd Bowles no favor.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:47 pm
Gotta check with Arian Foster to see if a rebuild is in the script
February 15th, 2023 at 12:53 pm
I don’t agree with King that often, but on this subject I agree with him 100%
My fear is that the Bucs try to put a band-aid on things to try to win what still may be a weak NFC South next season and screw themselves up for the next 3-5 or so.
It’s time to get the cap mess straightened out and build for the future.
King makes a lot of sense on how he suggested they do things.
February 15th, 2023 at 12:58 pm
Also, as so many people have said this season the Bucs look old and slow.
Bucs need to add some young speed to the skilled positions and unfortunately you can’t do that without replacing who is already there.
Bucs may have to get rid of some of their big name Fan Favorite players who still have some draft capital value. Then use those picks to build your future roster
February 15th, 2023 at 1:02 pm
The thing is, we don’t even have that many rostered guys to “blow it up”… I’m not touching Godwin, Evans, or Wirfs. I’m resigning Lavonte, and I’m holding onto most of our recent draftees (they’re still cheap) from the last few years. Every other guy is absolutely available in trade, if we’re doing the blow-up scenario. I don’t think they are actively seeking to blow up all but a small core… but some guys could go for draft picks. I’m trying to trade Devin White ASAFP. Get that guy outta here.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:10 pm
Starting over sounds like a good plan
Imo that means head coach, who actually knows how to build and mange
a team. Bowles isnt it.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:10 pm
I wonder how many folks trust JL to actually build a roster from the ground up.
I am not sure he is the guy to do that…
February 15th, 2023 at 1:11 pm
Think about it… cap going nowhere but [significantly] up for the coming years. Trim the fat NOW and get rid of dead old weight (Donovan Smith, Lenny Fournette, etc.). Roster management is how this team won a Super Bowl. Now it’s time for roster management cleanup to set themselves up for the middle to back half of this decade. See what trade value you have with some key players like Evans or D White. Sorry. Just football reality. And part of roster management is accumulating more draft capital. Because lets face it, besides being in cap hell with NO QB this team is OLD and SLOW. The Bucs most explosive player is LB Devin White. While he has his moments White is NOT worth a 2nd contract. We need more draft picks this year and next. Time to make some bold moves and rebuild this roster.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:17 pm
Pretty much the writing is on the wall; the bucs cannot sign an OC, the QB the bucs will have is either Kyle Trask or Baker Mayfield. 2-15 in 2023, 1pm games and the ray jay full of opposing teams fans..welcome to the 2010’s
February 15th, 2023 at 1:18 pm
Bowles will go for it. This is his last chance. Once that fails Jason can draft all the kickers his heart desires.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:18 pm
Agreed, this team is old, slow and expensive. The only issue is that we have a head coach that can’t develop and inspire players.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:19 pm
You almost have to draft two defensive backs in the first four rounds that is if you lose Dean and Bunting. If they go the first three picks in the draft almost have to be 2 DBs and an offensive left tackle.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:20 pm
If you start over do it with a new coach.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:22 pm
Ray Jay will be packed. Glad they put those extra seats in to make it look worse on TV.
I guess I am not sure if I would rather win 1 every 20 years and suck between, or be better operated as a franchise to have more shots. Sounds like we zero blitz our long term strategies and sell out. It works, then it hurts. Modern day for some nfl teams like us and the Rams i suppose.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:23 pm
JN
Exactly.
Old and Slow does not win in today’s NFL
February 15th, 2023 at 1:25 pm
Trade; Devin White, Shaq Barrett, Russell Gage, JTS, Ryan Jensen
Let Go; Either SMB or Jamel Dean, Donavan Smith, Akiem Hicks, Lenny, Rudolph, Logan Ryan or Keanu Neal
build the team through the draft
February 15th, 2023 at 1:27 pm
King is right .. Lenny , Evans , White , Jensen (if he dosen’t retire ) others could all be traded .
February 15th, 2023 at 1:30 pm
Of course the Bucs have NO chance! NONE of the other teams have ANY problems to deal with!
Some of you guys are surrender monkeys. Freaking Detroit came within a whisker of making the playoffs, but the Bucs suck so badly that playoffs are out of the question, chirped Chicken Little.
The moral of the traditional Chicken Little story is to have courage, even when it feels like the sky is falling. Suck it up!!!
February 15th, 2023 at 1:32 pm
Sinking Ship
“I guess I am not sure if I would rather win 1 every 20 years and suck between, or be better operated as a franchise to have more shots. Sounds like we zero blitz our long term strategies and sell out. It works, then it hurts. Modern day for some nfl teams like us and the Rams i suppose.”
Would you rather have the last 22+ years the Bucs did or have the last 22 years any other franchise in the NFC south?? The Saints had been consistently good since Peyton & Brees arrive, but all they have to show for it is 1 SB.
Personally all of the losses do hurt, but then again the Bucs have 1 less playoff win since 1998 than the saints soooooo……….
Also since 1998 the only other team that has won more superbowls is the Patriots.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:38 pm
Absolutely.
If they do that, they can be relevant within two years and it can last a decade.
If they don’t, salary cap is an issue, they have some older players, and they would have to continually sign veteran quarterbacks that didn’t work out somewhere else… That’s going to get you an average team that occasionally makes a playoff. No thanks. That is what got John Gruden run out of town.
Just own up to the fact that they had to sell the farm for a three year span that made them relevant and brought a Super Bowl. It was a good deal and well worth it.
Now it’s time to clean house. I would do everything to keep Mike Evans and LVD and let them retire Buccaneers, but if they want to go somewhere to have another shot at the ring, you got to let them.
February 15th, 2023 at 1:41 pm
At least the LA Rams and their bs fanbase have an indoor stadium to go and watch their 4-13 team, the ray jay is so hot in september at 1 pm; and then to top it off the teams the bucs play to not have a the great attraction aside from the Eagles I suppose. I hope the bucs also have to play the Bills in December up in Buffalo and really go back to that 1987 Buccanneer life
February 15th, 2023 at 1:47 pm
Truth from King.
It doesnt have to take forever. Eagles and Jags rebuilt quickly. We do have some good young players now we can build around.
Clean house and get some young guys that can run. Id prefer a mobile QB.
February 15th, 2023 at 2:07 pm
Shaq is untradable.
February 15th, 2023 at 2:08 pm
Um, who do you think built the roster that won the Super Bowl???
February 15th, 2023 at 2:13 pm
I’ve been saying it for weeks now: burn it down and start over.
Should have fired the entire coaching staff, including Bowles.
It’s gonna get ugly
February 15th, 2023 at 2:13 pm
100% DISAGREE (with QB)
1. The QBs in this draft are so-so.
2. Bucs need OL, DL, before a QB.
I like the idea of trading an aging/expensive player for pics. D White and D Smith come to mind.
February 15th, 2023 at 2:13 pm
If you don’t have a quarterback you ain’t going anywhere in todays nfl so build everything and hopefully next offseason will find one
February 15th, 2023 at 2:24 pm
“Shaq is untradable” as is Jensen, for the same reason. Nobody wants JTS, MAYbe White, they might want Gage, but not for $10 mil
February 15th, 2023 at 2:27 pm
That’s not a guarantee for success.
The team blew everything up in 2009, drafted a QB in 2010 in the first round, again in 2015. And the Bucs didn’t get to the playoffs until 2020 (with neither first round QB on the roster).
How many QBs have teams like the Jets, Browns, and Dolphins drafted high in the draft and don’t work out? It’s a crapshoot.
February 15th, 2023 at 2:34 pm
The only way is Richardson in the 1st with him we can be in playoffs with weak division
February 15th, 2023 at 2:35 pm
Licht and Bowles are not going to intentionally put themselves on the chopping block. They know the Glazers and how they think better than we do. They will try to ‘reload’ and be as competitive as possible. If we fired Bowles, hired Bienemy, then the clock would start on a rebuild. Only way we see a true rebuild is to fire Licht too. New Gm would clean house and take a couple of years. Is there anyone in Philly that could make that happen?
February 15th, 2023 at 2:36 pm
The last person JL needs any advice from is a fat, lazy slob like Burger King.
What a disgrace.
February 15th, 2023 at 2:43 pm
I think it makes complete sense to start the rebuild now, in my mind, that was always the deal – when Brady left, you were going to have to pay for keeping the team together after the SB, and that was the price. One exception is if you can get a top tier QB, and no, Derek Carr is not a top tier QB.
But the trouble is Todd Bowles. If the Bucs dismantle the team and don’t even give him a chance to be successful, we all know what the woke media is going to say, and the Glazers want to unload that $7b+ soccer team they own for as much as they can possibly get — and being branded with the scarlet ‘r’ is going to cost them a lot of money.
The other issue, maybe, is that the Bucs told people they had to buy 2-years of season tickets last offseason. If the Bucs literally are tanking in a very obvious way, that’s going to produce a ton of bad will with the fans who actually spend money.
So, factoring that stuff in, I think the Bucs give another go. I doubt they’ll sign Carr, but I think they’ll make an effort. They’ll bring back David, probably sign or trade for some guys who we didn’t think they were in on, and maybe even draft a QB early, just to create some excitement.
February 15th, 2023 at 2:51 pm
Holy cow! King has really let himself go.
February 15th, 2023 at 3:12 pm
Come on Joe, everyone knows it was BA, not JL pulling the strings…
You know better than that…
February 15th, 2023 at 3:43 pm
So you’re saying Arians was telling Licht who to draft when Arians was working for the Cardinals and Licht was in Tampa Bay? Pretty sure Michael Bidwill doesn’t know this.
February 15th, 2023 at 3:48 pm
Finally someone with a brain in his head surfaces. Otherwise we will become Lovieville Houston clones.
February 15th, 2023 at 3:50 pm
Munch they do not care once they unload MU they will dump the Bucs. Its a family affair.
February 15th, 2023 at 3:56 pm
HC Grover – I don’t disagree on them not caring about this stuff once they sell ManU, although they are pretty sensitive people, look at the hissy fit they threw about Gruden because he joked about them hanging out in the men’s locker room (or whatever the joke was, I don’t actually remember).
However I don’t see them dumping the Bucs. NFL franchises are skyrocketing in value and haven’t shown any signs of slowing down (unlike the soccer franchise). If the team can get Tampa to build them a new stadium for free, well, that’s another billion or so in their pocket. If they can’t, well, the team is only going to go up in the value in the meantime.
Personally I have no issues with the Glazers. I remember Culverhouse and the Glazers have been amazing compared to him. Also, regardless of what people think, the Bucs have been one of the most successful franchises in the NFL since 2000, with 2 SBs. So I hope they’re not going anywhere. But, at the same time, I don’t see them not giving Bowles a fair shot, even if it’s not in the best interest of the team longterm.
February 15th, 2023 at 3:56 pm
Under current cap/roster realities…You look to maximize every move.
$55M over cap. Paying a ton in void yrs UFA deals coming due kinda limits options. 26 UFA’s but CAP starting in the $281M range…That means Money Vets got to go & a couple guys might need to be traded, in conjunction with selected restructures to get FO in position to sign a Bridge/Camp competition QB’s (2) & sign draft picks / UDFA / min salary guys on back end of 53.
How does the FO get to that magic #?? Dunno, but I’d look for cuts of:
D.Smith / Mason / Barrett / Brate / Succop / Lenny / Vaughn / Chesley / Laird just to get ball rolling…(Timing for max Cap savings in 2023 – Most Post June 1 cuts)…Getting ~$54M off books.
Look to trade D.White in APR for draft capital & move that $11M off the books…Would be open to moving Jensen in JUNE – if a contender has a C go down for 2024 comp)..But moving 45 puts FO in the Black ($10M under cap)…Under but still need more work to get Bridge QB, Draft Picks & a few lower dollar FA’s to backfill on the roster.
Restructure: Godwin / Evans / Vea / Davis…Guys that fit in the 3yr plan CORE + ME retiring a BUC!!! They help open little over $38M in 2023…That w/ White move puts FO in position to reshuffle positional spending & add pcs needed to fill 53 in 2023 (~$48M)…Without killing 2024 flexibility.
Draft: If the right QB slides in range, go get that guy…If not, see if there’s a trade back opportunity to collect Day2/3 picks. (Trade back is optimal!) if FO can add 2-3 more picks by dropping into top of Rd 2…Take the deal. Prospects 18-35 ~ same value. The more Day 2/3 picks the better. (Block $12-15 max for draft)
FA QB’s: Brissett / Drew Lock – est. $8.5 combined…Cheap/short prove it deals…While leaving $ to spread across reboot signings, back loaded FA deals & save a couple $M for in season moves.
Yes, you have to hit the value FA bin (but not too much. Want make sure Bucs get multiple COMP Picks awarded in 2024)…. Yes, you have to hope the scouting dept. is on point & Licht hits on 5-6 guys in the draft to be immediate contributors (a few of them day 1 starters). But it’s a reset yr & the goal is to get younger, cheaper & with better positional spending trends going forward.
February 15th, 2023 at 4:01 pm
“The plan for Tampa Bay is to retool while still competing. This has been the plan for a couple of years,”
Sound like a plan to me.
February 15th, 2023 at 4:19 pm
We don’t need a 35 – 40 million dollar QB on a rebuild.
February 15th, 2023 at 5:02 pm
Evans isn’t part of the rebuild
We all know it…LVD if he takes a huge pay cut
Gotta be realistic
February 15th, 2023 at 5:38 pm
Well having the worst record in football next year is kinda like starting over isn’t it ?
February 15th, 2023 at 5:38 pm
2 many missed draft pics boys
February 15th, 2023 at 5:45 pm
Trade White. Can’t afford his contract and he’s not the LB we thought he would be.
February 15th, 2023 at 5:50 pm
Sean King looks like he can still play. . .
February 15th, 2023 at 5:53 pm
If you know you don’t realistically have a shot at the Super Bowl then why wouldn’t you blow it up and start the rebuild. Maybe get some extra draft picks via trades and start over.
February 15th, 2023 at 5:59 pm
Burger King. Fat Lazy Tub Of Quit.
February 15th, 2023 at 7:05 pm
Brady recruited many players for the SB
Licht is getting way too much credit
SIX LOSING SEASONS OUT OF NINE