Possible COVID Collateral Damage

August 2nd, 2020


When the NFL decided to slam the pedal to the metal and go ahead with the 2020 season (thankfully), Joe immediately thought of two people.

They would be Bucs coach Bucco Bruce Arians and offensive assistant Tom Moore.

As we know with “The Sickness,” the younger someone is who is infected, the better the chances of being unscathed after the virus runs its course. In addition to age, pre-existing health factors also seem to multiply the severity of the virus and in too many cases cause death.

Arians is 67 and battled cancer, one of the virus’ multipliers. Moore is 81.

If they are working with players, it is a real heightened possibility each could could end up with a disastrous result.

And it isn’t just Joe thinking of Arians and Moore’s risks. Bucs tight end Cam Brate, who did catch The Sickness this summer and got through it with minimal complications, admits he’s sort of frightened for coaches and support staff who are not as physically fit and young as players.

“Yeah, I think that possibility is definitely really scary,” Brate said last week. “Not just for the players but for the coaches and personnel in the building who are around the players, as well. Not everyone involved who is at the building is going to be young and healthy.

“There are going to be people who have some underlying risk involved, so it’s going to be super important for everyone to do the best they can to try to avoid any interactions outside the building – really don’t go out to eat [and] obviously don’t go out to the bars or anything like that.”

Brate added that players have to take ownership of following social distancing guidelines, so they can help personally keep guys like Arians, Moore and others virus-free.

“I think a lot of it just falls on the players and coaches doing the best job they can to kind of isolate themselves outside the building,” Brate said. “Everything that [the Bucs] done at the facility is pretty incredible the way they transformed it to try and eliminate the risk and exposure we are going to have to each other while we are there.

“I think that’s going to be the main thing for everyone is just being smart when you’re away from the building.”

That’s just it. Veterans players (Tom Brady?) need to make it clear to younger players that they can’t do stupid sh!!, like NBA players who used a funeral as an excuse to hit up a strip club, among other things.

Basically it boils down to discipline. If players have the discipline to sort of self-isolate, it would go a long way toward players (and coaches and support staff) staying healthy.

87 Responses to “Possible COVID Collateral Damage”

  1. Tampabaybucfan Says:

    “I think that’s going to be the main thing for everyone is just being smart when you’re away from the building.”


    But there is always some fool who breaks the rules…..always.

  2. Mort Says:

    Sure would make sense if those businesses were just concerned about the public health and either require masks and have a bunch of safeguards set up, or just closed altogether.

  3. PSL Bob Says:

    And it’s not just the Bucs that need to display this discipline. It’s players on every team the Bucs face this year. You can be the epitome of discipline, and then on Sunday you get down in the dirt and root with 300lb sweaty beasts grunting, wheezing, and exuding all sorts of bodily fluids on you. If they haven’t followed the same rules you have, all is for naught.

  4. Roy T. Buford Says:

    I’ve been saying all along it was about having not just discpline, but military-style discipline–you have made the “command decision” and it’s inviolate. If the rest of the population could better comply with guidelines, the spread would not be so bad. You can’t blame the government for stupidity of individuals, and you can’t “make” them not spread COVID. Hopefully these (mostly very) young guys can keep a level head on this and show disclipline for 5 months. If not, they make their own bed a whole for the NFL season. Fingers crossed.

  5. Roy T. Buford Says:

    @TBBF….you are right…always someone. Hopefully the peer pressure alone, and if that fails, the real possibility of their contract being voided is a deterrent.

  6. Bucnjim Says:

    A very high number of people have had it and don’t even know it. If Brates girlfriend didnt have it he would have never even paid attention to the symptoms. Florida is testing out at 100,000 tests average a day with around 10% positive. Experts have estimated that up to 10X the amount of people tested have been exposed to Covid. You know why NY and NJ numbers are down from what they were? Because so many were exposed athe same time and that creates herd immunity the hard way. Young adults are going to get it no matter how much people complain or even go so far as calling police. Makes me laugh.

  7. Bucnjim Says:

    I can almost remember when it was the nightclubs fault cases were rising! Its been six weeks and cases are still the same. They were scapegoats! I havent been to one in over 20 years but feel bad for bar owners. Not to mention hotels, airlines, vacation rentals, and restaurants. When this is over a good portion of these businesses will be gone forever!

  8. Gp Says:

    Discipline, responsibility, and respect.
    Wearing a mask is a visible reminder but distancing and behavior are the real deterrent

  9. mark2001 Says:

    No Bucnjim…Herd immunity would require about 90% of the population to be infected. And even based upon their numbers early, not close to that.

    The reason NY is in better shape, is that the people showed some common sense in protecting themselves and their fellow man when the restrictions came down, and their governor has been heavy handed in dealing with those scofflaws that don’t care about anything but their own “freedom”.

    Florida, on the other hand, does neither. So we can expect Covid to have a “spectacular vacation” in Florida.

  10. Cobraboy Says:

    I do not believe a virus can be stopped, and I do not believe this virus is a death sentence.

    I read a piece by a cardiologist and military hospital department head who says their model shows 50X more, not 10x, have been exposed and don’t know it.

    The only reason more cases are not exposed is because so many have not been tested. But currently in FL there is no cause—>effect of “cases” and hospitalizations & deaths. Sure, some have gone up, but at only a fraction of what we were told would happen, not in direct correlation as the “models” predicted.

    And as cases go up, the morbidity drops like a rock. We opined early on the morbidity would be flu-like, and statistically we are indeed grinding toward that result.

    Even the CDC is now lumping flu and pneumonia along with CV19 in their death stats. CV19 is no longer a separate, independant stat.

    Take a peek at Sweden now: they did practically nothing, got slammed all at once, and now are almost totally back to normal. Herd immunity.

    One interesting note is that even though there have been numerous close-contact events around the country, rallies, riots, block parties, a recent funeral, bars, etc., etc., etc., they have not shown evidence in a significant causal spike in “cases.”

    A final note, and one that just pi$$es me off: my 92y.o. mom died in early March. I had her cremnated right away as she wished. But I have not been permitted to intern her, the cemetery has limited even graveside services to 10 people. Well over 100 want to attend and I have pledged to comply with their wishes. But John Lewis dies, and he can have a s#!tload of closely-packed politico mourners…Atlanta GA also restricts funeral attendance…who don’t even have to quarantine for two weeks upon returning to D.C. is direct opposition to D.C. law.

    What a bunch of hypocritical crapweasels.

    We are being played, and some LIKE it.

  11. bucsfaninoregon Says:

    Buford: ” Hopefully these (mostly very) young guys can keep a level head on this and show disclipline for 5 months. If not, they make their own bed a whole for the NFL season. Fingers crossed.”

    And, the chances of all of them on all the teams is exactly—zero!
    Is crossing our fingers the best way to approach this?

  12. hammerhead Says:

    Bucnjim Says:
    August 2nd, 2020 at 9:45 am

    You know why NY and NJ numbers are down from what they were? Because so many were exposed at the same time and that creates herd immunity the hard way.

    Incorrect. Herd immunity takes a much higher level of infection to occur than what has happened. We’re not anywhere close to it in any state from any of the reports I’ve seen. There’s also doubt about the possibility of herd immunity anyway, as there are some indications that people can be re-infected, particularly if their first round was mild.

    NY/NJ bent the curve down because they shut down everything, following the protocols.

  13. Cobraboy Says:

    @Mark2001: incorrect. NY got slammed before they knew it, primarily from folks traveling from Italy. The virus was already slashing and burning before the “authorities” stepped in, and the decision to send sick people to nursing homes, instead of specialty clinics or thate hospital ship set up for this particular virus, simply dumped gasoline on their fire.

    Additionally, many NYers who could left the state by the hundreds of thousands. That is one reason northern NJ got slammed, as many affluent NYers also have a home in Jersey.

    Even the head of the CDC claims that much of South FL’s outbreak was imported from the NE.

  14. SufferingSince76 Says:

    I wouldn’t be holding NY too high above Florida when they’ve had over 37K deaths compared to Florida with a little over 7K deaths. And Florida has had 60K more cases and greater population. 200K plus have been in Miami-Dade, Broward and Palm Beach counties.

  15. mark2001 Says:

    Correct Hammerhead.. have a nurse daughter in NJ… up in NY/ NJ it is very different from hedonistic, “the business of public health is what is good for business”, Florida.

  16. BA4President Says:

    Looking at those pictures on the Bucs site of inside One Buc Place: the players are spread out in classrooms, some lockers are in the indoor practice fields, some of the weight equipment is even outside so the players can be farther from each other.

    And then to hear that the players are wearing some sort of tracing device so that they can see who is getting too close to other players, that is some intense stuff.

    I question if baseball is/was doing all of that stuff? Can the majority of college football teams afford to do all that, I doubt it.

    But yes, if the players don’t take it as seriously as the team is, then there will be big problems

  17. lambchop Says:

    So, I’ve been doing some reading about why “the sickness” affects some healthy people, some young people, along with the obvious people in the higher risk factor category. And researchers believe that it has to do with immunodeficiencies. Basically, they found that 4 young men between the ages of 21-32 shared the same rare form of gene on their X chromosome that was linked to deficient immune response and they all got “the sickness” even though they are not in the risk factor category and they all are in good health. They are obviously still studying this as they need a more robust sample size, but I wouldn’t doubt that our genetics come into play in all forms of sickness. But, along the line of the tough guys on here, it is actually accurate to say that infectious diseases only affect a sample size. But, it sucks if you’re one of the unlucky ones in the wrong side of life and death. So, that’s why it is better to be cautious. We don’t know if we have a genetic susceptibility to certain pathogens.

    If you’re interested in reading about the above:

  18. Roy T. Buford Says:

    No, crossing fingers not how to do it. As I said that you pasted also right before…discipline is how to approach it. I am the one with fingers crossed on that…that is all I myself can do on their situation.

  19. Roy T. Buford Says:

    Mark said:
    “The reason NY is in better shape, is that the people showed some common sense in protecting themselves and their fellow man when the restrictions came down, and their governor has been heavy handed in dealing with those scofflaws that don’t care about anything but their own “freedom”.”

    No one can actually believe this. Here are the non-facts:
    – “NY in better shape.” NY is not in better shape. Look at the deaths. Look at the early response from Gov and NYC mayor. Awful.
    – “People showed common sense.” No indication of that. NY was the first epicenter of the country. It has simply washed through now.
    – “Restrictions?” Like putting infected elderly back into nursing homes? Dumb.
    – “Herd immunity.” Would have to be another strain. Most medical experts will say the issue is some who may have had it and got it again is speculation. Has anyone tested positive, recovered, and tested positive again? I haven’t heard that, nor have I heard of another strain out there.

  20. Roy T. Buford Says:

    Fact: It’s the infected NYers and NJers that fled the States and came where? Florida. As bad as the Chinese in that respect.

  21. BucsFanForever Says:

    The Florida Department of Health is conducting antibody testing at a limited number of locations. The most recent weekly report shows 6,000 tests performed at 5 locations with 15.3% positive. Not much of a sample, but certainly not enough to be anywhere close to herd immunity. NY is also doing antibody testing – The preliminary results show 14.9 % of the population have COVID-19 antibodies. Again, nowhere close to herd immunity.

    Many of the urgent care locations in Florida have begun free antibody testing but I could not find where that data is kept.

    We won’t get anywhere close to herd immunity without a vaccine, and enough people willing to take the vaccine.

  22. All lives matter Says:

    In this day and age it seems we have more immature and entitled players to deal with. Most of the players will act responsibly, but you’ll get a bunch that won’t and they will be the ones who put other players at risk unnecessarily. Plus the lesser paid facility staff who are not secluded and sequestered that live ordinary lives traveling from home to work every day also could put everyone at risk. Seems the only way to make this work has to happen from participation top to bottom to ensure minimal exposure to the outside world during the whole season. Big order to make it work.

  23. james west Says:

    it’s everyone in their organization, from the owners to the groundskeepers, and everyone in between, to the cooks, and the servers, and the janitors, to the bus drivers, and pilots, every damn body that has any inner workings or affiliations with their perspective teams, and think about it, their family’s also would have that cross to bear, if they wanted to go all in for safety against the virus, for their sons, husbands, fathers, grandfathers, wives, daughters, grand daughters, nephews, nieces, cousins, yada yada yada you get my point, there’s 32 teams, 32 owners, 32 training facility’s, i do not have a clue how many players, practice squads, just think about how many people involved here, that should be aware, if they want a season, what it will take

  24. bucsfaninoregon Says:

    Roy: ” NY is not in better shape. Look at the deaths. Look at the early response from Gov and NYC mayor. Awful.”
    Here Is a fact- -NY/NJ was the first big outbreak after the small one in Washington State. While the Dear Leader was downplaying the threat Cuomo was starting to close down NY. Could they have done better? Yes, given foresight. They could have done more and quicker.
    Fact: What Cuomo did is more than your lap puppy governor has YET TO DO! You all are reaping the reward. How many new cases/deaths today in Florida?
    NON-Fact: ” It has simply washed through (NY) now.” I must have missed it. Did Fauci or anybody stated the virus has “washed through” any place?
    In case you have missed it, there are places all over the world where the virus pops up and forced new shutdowns. A virus like this doesn’t “wash through” any place. It will be with us until we get a vaccine. Then with a number of Qanon believers that it is a Bill Gates vaccine it will be with us for years to come.

  25. bucsfaninoregon Says:


  26. hammerhead Says:

    Roy T. Buford Says:
    August 2nd, 2020 at 12:47 pm

    – “NY in better shape.” NY is not in better shape. Look at the deaths. Look at the early response from Gov and NYC mayor. Awful.
    – “People showed common sense.” No indication of that. NY was the first epicenter of the country. It has simply washed through now.

    Fact is, NY got hit before we knew anything about this thing, but they bent the curve down sharply. You can look at total deaths, which is relevant, but if you look at the deaths over the last 2 months, they’ve been low and stayed about the best in the country. So much for that talking point.

    And there isn’t any “washing through”. That’s a trump line of BS. If they had not shut the place down it would’ve continued to go higher.

    Has anyone tested positive, recovered, and tested positive again?

    Yes. Widely reported in the legitimate media, but probably not in conspiracy media.

  27. Jim Says:

    And that’s why Jerry Jones is still cruising all over in his mega-yacht…

  28. Cobraboy Says:

    One can test positive if one has the virus in their nose or sinuses.

    The difference is once a person recovers, they cannot get sick from it again.

    There are NO documented cases of second CV19 infections.

    There ARE documented cases of positive nasal tests, and of course, positive antibody tests, both of which are meaningless as far as sickness is concerned.

    And as of today, there are NO documented, definitive, perr-reviewed cases of asymptomatic spread of the virus, only study with “maybe” and “it may be possible”, and “we suggest caution”, but nothing cause-and-effect definitive.

  29. Cobraboy Says:

    @hammerhead: you seem completely oblivious as to the actual nature of the NY shut-down.

    It was NOT shut down. Maybe an edict, but bodegas still had people dancing on their sidewalks sans masks, the subways STILL ran, and people were moving all over. I know this to be true because I have a dozen + relatives who live in Hempstead, New Rochelle, Washington Heights and Latino neighborhoods on Long Island. None got sick.

  30. mark2001 Says:

    Cobra…I was incorrect about nothing. The virus did arrive from Italy as you said. So the banning of travel from China was a day late and a dollar short. NY had the first cases and got hit hard without much stockpile of equipment and protective gear. Nor did they know about the efficacy of certain steroids and Remdisivir, or the best protocols. That was partially because the feds were asleep at the switch. They ignored the pandemic response plan put in place by GW and others.

    Did people leave NY and travel elsewhere? Certainly. But many of them had places in Florida, so do you blame them for vacationing? I left Florida after Easter for the Northwoods, which was a few weeks earlier than I planned. When you can afford to do so, why not? But what has happened in Florida in the last few months has been Florida’s doing. Did you see the beaches? The bars? It was on national news. Florida is getting slammed because of the lack of rule enforcement and poor leadership at the state level. Clear as day. It has reached every corner of America.

    I said in Feb and March…the key is advancing treatment and not overloading the HC system, until we can hopefully have a vaccine. I said this while some were calling it “just the flu”. And I have seen nothing to make me believe otherwise.

  31. mark2001 Says:

    Cobra…my son in law had it in New Jersey months ago and recovered after quarantine. My daughter is a nurse. Many of us here have relatives out East. So that in itself means little.

  32. Roy T. Buford Says:

    Fact. NY was not hit before “before we knew about it.” Seattle can make that claim to an extent. Federal government had stopped flights from China and as it was creeping up in the news (overshadowed by an impeachment process), NY officials, especially mayor running around early to mid March telling people to go out to restaurants, clubs, shows, et that last drink, to go to shows, etc, 12 March – and governor we discounting the issue. Trump formed the COVID task force in Jan and stopped flights from China late January, ater from Europe well before that. The governor of NY did no better than Deblasio. NYers were stupid enough enough to elect both and then even dumber to believe them.

  33. Roy T. Buford Says:

    ^^^ Correction…Post to Hammerhead…not Mark.

  34. Roy T. Buford Says:

    BucsfaninOregon…you must be in the group siding with the nuts saying it’s moms and veterans and peaceful protests in Portland as it burns late into the second month. A bigger sh**hole than NYC, quite honestly. Fact is, and see above, NYC was way late to the game…nothing but whining to the federal government to save their butts…again. I do think Cuomo’s little mural about himself was cute.

  35. gp Says:

    I wonder if sometime in the near future that “Dr.” Fauci might be facing ‘mass manslaughter’ charges for demonizing a 50 year safe, FDA tested and approved, commonly available drug, that has been used everywhere else in the world effectively saving lives?
    Just imagine if we were talking about 80,000 or less as opposed to where we are now?

  36. Roy T. Buford Says:

    @gp, Dr. Faucet is definitely an odd one. Quite the waffler. Worse is some pharmacists overuling treating doctors orders.

  37. Cobraboy Says:

    @Mark2001: My point, which you missed, is the “lockdown” in NY, specifically NYC was effective because MILLIONS ignored the orders and the subway Petrie Dishes still ran crammed with people, and those 20,000+ seniors did not have to die from the virus, except Coumo and de Blasio used then as political pawns in direct opposition to federal mandates.

    Your nephew recovered because 99.96% do…unless you are old and in bad physical health to begin with.

  38. gp Says:

    Roy T
    It’s getting to the point that your political affiliation will be part of admitting documents for medical services

  39. Cobraboy Says:

    @gp: and consider party affiliation for who gets the medicines, care and surgery after The Glorious Progressive Revolution…think Cuba.

    And all encoded on an implanted chip.

    Brave New World.

  40. Alvin Scissors Harper Says:

    Ok, let me try to give a little perspective. I unfortunately live in Pasco County on the water most of the year. However, a couple months of the year, I live in the Adirondack Mountains in northern New York.
    In Florida, we have plenty of dopes who don’t want to wear a mask and believe it’s “a hoax.”
    In Northern New York, everyone, and I mean everyone, wears a mask without any issues. In fact, having climbed 6 High Peaks over 36 miles, trail less, on two separate hikes in the last week, almost every hiker puts a mask on as you pass them and tries to move off the herd path so there is a 6′ distance where possible.

  41. Cobraboy Says:

    @Roy T: Fauci is part of the coup. His waffling over Jordan’s pointed questions in that House hearing, especially about riot and protest crowds vs. church crowds, was clear evidence.

    Crapweasel’s all.

    We are being played, and Loyal Comradeds are enabling them.

  42. Cobraboy Says:

    @Alvin Scissors: So what?

    Some men make better serfs than Free Men. Some are easily snookered.

  43. gp Says:

    I was also wondering how many of the 32K plus in NY are planning to vote in the upcoming election

  44. gp Says:

    In NY, NJ, AND Fl

  45. gp Says:

    Are you sure they’re not trying to avoid you for other reasons?

  46. Alvin Scissors Harper Says:

    gp, do you ever wonder why we lead the world in Covid cases and Florida will soon lead the US in Covid cases?

  47. Roy T. Buford Says:

    @Cobraboy….I agree…..

  48. Roy T. Buford Says:

    @gp….true…it’s already a condition of being able to excercise free speech.

  49. Roy T. Buford Says:

    Alvin, there are “dopes” as you describe everywhere. To be honest with you, I jsbr actually seen them everywhere. So I’d not go so far as to say in NY they all get it, and in FL, they all don’t. I’ll go as far to say, long before we had COVID, some of the biggest losers I’ve ever seen hail from NY. I see a lot of them who think they know it all, and think people want to be like them–and they’re dumber than a bag of hammers. Slaves to living life like it’s a commune. I do realize not all are that like that…so just saying…generalizations are to be cautious with. That said, some of them move here and learn to lead respectable lives.

  50. gp Says:

    I’ve heard one conspiracy theory that DeSantis is increasing testing in the hopes of increasing the number of cases. The idea being that leading the world in cases will scare the NY’ers from moving here when they leave that craphole.
    Sounds like a good plan!

  51. JimmyJack Says:

    I think we can all feel a lot better when Florida gets past this spike. I’m not no mathematician but I can read a graph if it’s simple. If you check out spikes in other States they seem to last between 3-5 weeks typically. Same thing for most countries….that are right about the size of some of our States.

    Looks like Florida is right at about 3 weeks so hopefully the numbers drop off soon. It could be this week or possibly the. That seems like a good bet based on the spike numbers elsewhere.

  52. lambchop Says:

    I don’t understand herd immunity when there are cases of ppl getting it twice. There was a murse who got it the 2nd time and was paralyzed waist down because of complications. He was young. If you end up like the few with an auto-immune reaction where your immune system starts attacking itself, you’re as good as toast. And we don’t even know the long-term damages yet.

  53. lambchop Says:

    I don’t know any flu that can cause paralysis, blood clots, and auto-immune reactions.

  54. Roy T. Buford Says:

    As it turns out, based on what I had been reading (someone above said it’s been confirmed one can get it twice–no), it is non-conclusive at best as to whether one can get COVID twice. As of July 24, there are no confirmed cases of “re-infection” but the CDC is reluctant to flat out say it’s not possible. At worst, they say it could be another strain of COVID, but the more likely medical explanation is the virus laid dormant and re-emerged. That is, they never got over it the first time.

  55. mark2001 Says:

    Buford…I don’t think I said NY was hurt before we knew about it. I knew in Jan from watching the national news and made good money when I saw it coming because of it and because I thought the market was overvalued. I said they were hit hard before we knew the best treatments and how to deal with patients. We have changed treatments and methods since.

    Regarding NY… From Healthline… Fact Checked…

    New York City got a handle on the virus by a complete and total shutdown, according to Maureen Miller, PhD, an infectious disease epidemiologist and adjunct associate professor at Columbia’s Mailman School of Public Health in New York..

    “They stopped all businesses. They insisted that there be no social gatherings. They had shelter-in-place laws in place and enforced by fear. People were terrified. We had watched what had happened in Europe and then suddenly it’s happening in New York City, our home,” she said.

    When the healthcare system first reached a breaking point in March, measures such as physical distancing, mask wearing, and limiting the number of people allowed in essential businesses were “rigorously adhered to,” Miller said.

    That helped bring numbers down…. .

    “New Yorkers know what’s up, so they actively, voluntarily participated in these efforts,” Miller said.

    Dr. William Schaffner, a professor of preventive medicine in the department of health policy and a professor of medicine in the division of infectious diseases at the Vanderbilt University School of Medicine in Tennessee, said something else helped New York on its course.

    “Leadership, leadership, leadership,” he told Healthline. “Clear, sustained communication so that you have a plan and everybody knows what the plan is and you update everyone as the plan has to change, as you learn things (are) changing — and New York state had that leadership from the governor.”………………….

    New York City is reporting less than 20 COVID-19 deaths per day now, a stark comparison to the more than 700 daily deaths in April.
    Experts say New York was able to eventually get control of the outbreak by locking down the city and providing daily information to citizens in a clear manner.
    They warn, however, that the city could see a resurgence of the disease if people become less vigilant about wearing masks, maintaining physical distance, and not gathering in large groups.

    Obviously some of you disagree…

  56. Cannon Says:

    Annnd I have the damn disease right now! Whee.

    Enjoy your ability to taste. You’ll miss it while it’s gone.

  57. mark2001 Says:

    Cannon…hope that is the extent of it for you. Good luck.

  58. mark2001 Says:

    Thanks…I’m convinced…I’ve decided to move up from a mask to a 3m p100 filter respirator I found at Menards. As long as we have large numbers of people that won’t wear masks, that thing they are worthless or infringe with their basic human rights, I’m pretty sure this disease isn’t close to being finished with us. Some of you have convinced me that this disease is just getting started, and I’ll have to be ready for that likely next step when my loved ones start developing this disease. A small investment.

  59. bucsfaninoregon Says:

    You got it, Mark. I suspect that the virus-hoax crew posting here are representative of significant minority or even a majority of Floridians. You guys are in deep, deep water. Until a vaccine comes you will never get rid of it or even slow it much. Until there is new leadership in the US this country we are all condemned to live in this be careful/no problemo country.
    The rest of the world is looking at us with jaws dropped.
    I haven’t heard any of these brave guys talking about European vacations, have you? Maybe because they wouldn’t be let in. We are banned due to the virus. Is that considered “winning”?

  60. Cannon Says:

    It’s a tough disease. Strong, strong flu, with symptoms that vary from person to person. I am fortunate to be married to a doctor, so I was put on a cabinet full of meds immediately. They have held it in check. Headache, fatigue, labored breathing, and complete (and i stress complete) loss of smell and taste. Fever is gone, so that’s a plus.

  61. mark2001 Says:

    Cannon…glad to hear you are moving forward to a recovery. And I’m sure your “Doctor/Wife” is keeping a close eye on you. Thanks for your story… amazing how many still don’t get how serious this is.

  62. Cobraboy Says:

    NYC did NOT have a “complete lockdown. That is a total myth!

    The GUBMINT said “lock down” but many did NOT “lockdown”…and the infection tubes STILL ran!

    There were street parties galore all over the various ethnic hoods and barrios.

    And do NOT forget that early on de Blasio said “no worries” and promoted parades and celebrations in NYC, including the huge China Town party.

    I swear, some will do anything to re-write history.

    Di Blasio and Coumo have blood on their hands.

  63. Cobraboy Says:

    My nephew’s wife, a physician, a rheumatologist, is in the hospital with covid. She is also very morbidly obese and brutally diabetic.

  64. mark2001 Says:

    Sorry Cobra. I’ll trust Healthline over your word.

    And BTW..everyone will never comply. But when they don’t, they need to be hammered..just as NY just did with over a hundred and seventy people on a party boat,The Liberty Belle, and charged the skipper. That is how you deal with it seriously.

  65. gp Says:

    **Di Blasio and Coumo have blood on their hands.**

    I agree wholeheartedly, but don’t forget Fauci and his demonizing of HCQ.
    He’s probably responsible for as many as 100K all on his own.

    To your nephews wife… I wish her good luck and proper medication

    Doctors make some of the worst patients!

  66. bucsfaninoregon Says:

    GP and Snake head, so your stance is we should blame Di Blasio, Cuomo, Fauci and (maybe Brix?) for all the problems? The ones trying to do their best to prevent illness and death.
    I would assume that you feel the people that said it’s a hoax and “let’s open up” are the heroes? Is that what you both contend? Looking for an answer.

  67. mark2001 Says:

    Fauci simply said…. “”The Henry Ford Hospital study that was published was a non-controlled retrospective cohort study that was confounded by a number of issues, including the fact that many people who were receiving hydroxychloroquine were also using corticosteroids, which we know from another study gives a clear benefit in reducing deaths with advanced disease,” said Fauci, the nation’s leading infectious disease expert advising the White House on the coronavirus response.

    “So that study is a flawed study,” Fauci said after Missouri Republican U.S. Rep. Blaine Leutkemeyer asked him about the trial. ….. None of the randomized, placebo-controlled studies have found hydroxychloroquine to be effective, Fauci told lawmakers.

    If they did, he said, “I would be the first one to admit it and to promote it, but I have not seen yet a randomized placebo controlled trial that’s done that.

    “I don’t have any horse in the game one way or the other,” he said. “I just look at the data.” ”

    That isn’t demonizing. More like saying that until it is scientifically analyzed and proven to work on Covid, there is no proof that it helps treat Covid.”

  68. mark2001 Says:

    Oregon…I do blame Brix to some degree…for not laughing her backside off, or crying, when Donald suggested possibly putting light inside of the body, and injecting disinfectants or bleach to cure it, as well. She sat there like a puppet and let is wash over her.

  69. gp Says:

    LOL I laugh my A$$ off every time you bring that up because it only proves where you get your talking points from. As if I needed proof. I’d try to teach you about ‘context’, but you’ve already proven how locked tight your mind(?) is.

    And yes, If a viable treatment is withheld causing death, THAT IS manslaughter at the very least. Even more shameful, it was done for purely political reasons.
    Congratulations for choosing the sick ‘Mengele’ side of the argument.
    And one of you even has the GALL to call himself a Christian. SMDH

  70. mark2001 Says:

    You don’t understand the scientific method. You should be laughing…at yourself. Don’t you get it? It isn’t a proven viable method. It doesn’t meet basic scientific method criteria. Fauci said he wishes it passed scientific study and worked….but there is no proof. And you have a gall to call yourself a Christian..or the least bit educated? I think you must have some financial interest in that snake oil. Malaria? Sure. But Covid? Quackery.

  71. mark2001 Says:

    BTW..if Donald Quackery had suggested steroids, I would have said, more power to him. Scoreboard. But what does he recommend? HCQ? And spending millions on cranking it doses. Injections of Bleach and Disinfectant? Sunshine in the body? Only W.S. Walcott or Dr. Snakeoil would say something like that.

  72. gp Says:


  73. mark2001 Says:

    And BTW..you are the Dr. Mengele disciple. He didn’t believe in proven medical practices and chose to expose innocents to drugs and methods harming them, that had no proven medical benefit. That is what you are suggesting. And BTW.. Fauci didn’t outlaw it….or demonize it. Fauci just said prove it, scientifically. Use it yourself if you wish…I don’t care…but your laughing, braying or whatever is really sounding pretty pathetic.

  74. mark2001 Says:

    GP… be careful of this virus. I’ve noticed you post all times and days of the week, which mean you must be retired and at retirement age, as I am, to have that luxury. And since you are in your 60’s, you are among the most vulnerable population. If you contract this disease, please use modern proven medical treatments if you contract this illness. I don’t wish anyone a poor medical outcomes.

  75. gp Says:

    Already had it Dumb@ss. Like a bad cold with a deep cough that lasted two weeks. NBD
    Maybe you should try it

  76. mark2001 Says:

    Too smart to “try it”… old man.

  77. mark2001 Says:

    BTW..hope you are donating your antibodies to those in need. Or are you just “self-diagnosing” that you had it? A humanitarian like you has probably given plasma, like brate suggested, already. Right?

  78. gp Says:

    Over 13 gallons the hard way (whole blood donations)
    Currently deferred due to dental work
    Was going to suggest donating to you. They test every donation for antibodies.
    There’s a 50/50 chance you’ve already had it too.

  79. mark2001 Says:

    I give whole blood…O Neg….prime stuff. Given to Red Cross and One Blood many years. No Out of town but will give when I return. I know One Blood tests everyone..get emails from them about every week or two. Doubt I’ve had it. But if and when I do, glad I’ve avoided it this long…chances for survival going up with better treatments. And when they develop a vaccine, I’ll trust in our Medical experts and get it as soon as I can.

    Unless that dental is major, shouldn’t delay you more than a few days with One Blood. Usually only 24 hours.

  80. gp Says:

    bone graft/one year

  81. mark2001 Says:


  82. mark2001 Says:

    Just recovered from a Lisfranc fracture I had in May… cut down a tree, it bounced, and I didn’t jump far enough. No blood or surgery required luckily..screws and such…so I’ll be ready to give a pint. One Blood if first class compared to the Red Cross. Both have good nurses…but those One Blood red buses are first rate.

  83. gp Says:

    Old men aren’t supposed to cut down trees, especially without a permit.
    Leads to broken ribs, legs, nasty cuts, and bruises that last forever.
    Not to mention the recriminations from the wife.

  84. mark2001 Says:

    In the Northwoods, the only restrictions on cutting trees are near the lake shorelines. In fact, up here you can tell the well being of a man by the make of his truck and the make of his chainsaw. Amazing what the pros get to cut down a tree in Florida. About four times as much as up here.

    Wife is used to cuts, breaks and abrasions on my part. So far, my body had healed will. But that won’t last forever. Would be ironic if a virus got me. Still don’t know how I jumped at least three feet with a chainsaw in my hands..unfortunately not four. It must have been adrenaline induced.

  85. gp Says:

    If you are as healthy as you say, you should have little to fear from this virus.
    Open air!
    Stay away from enclosed spaces, that’s the only way to get a large enough dose to get past your body’s initial defenses. Cars, trains, plane’s, elevators, etc.
    Open air is the very least likely place to catch it.
    6 hour flight got me and my sons way early on.

  86. mark2001 Says:

    I am very healthy…particularly for my age…one of the reasons I can still give blood because I take no serious meds. But still, I won’t take unnecessary risks, especially with something that looks to have seniors in the bullseye. And if it does damage my heart, or pulmonary system, my life could be forever changed for the worse. And for what purpose? And just because I have a good chance of surviving, that doesn’t mean at least one loved one wouldn’t be effected. It isn’t just about me.

  87. gp Says:

    I reiterate…

    Open air!
    Stay away from enclosed spaces, that’s the only way to get a large enough dose to get past your body’s initial defenses. Cars, trains, plane’s, elevators, etc.
    Open air is the very least likely place to catch it.