Bill Polian Talks Brady Effect, “Philosophical Synergy” & The Jameis Downfall

March 29th, 2020

The Hall of Fame GM weighs in.

Say what you want about Hall of Fame general manager Bill Polian, but he is a friend and former boss of Bruce Arians (Arians calls him Coach) and he has a firm grasp on what it’s like to have elite quarterbacks in an organization.

Polian joined Friend of Joe host Alex Marvez on SiriusXM NFL Radio last week for an extensive chat about all things Bucs and Tom Brady, and America’s Unemployed Quarterback, Jameis Winston.

One thing Polian said about Brady’s leadership effect is valid and firmly believed by the powers at One Buc Palace. However, the inevitable months of lost offseason together time means Brady’s impact will be lessened.

“He’s the tide that lifts every boat in that locker room,” Polian said after telling a Peyton Manning story tied to young players in the Colts locker room.

“Aside from the vocal leadership he may or may not provide, his very presence changes the entire chemistry and approach of the team.”

Joe buys that, and the many prime time games coming because of Brady also will change the Bucs’ urgency and approach. But Joe’s not buying that Brady is going to raise the entire boat during April and May if the NFL doesn’t permit players to be together at One Buc Palace because of Coronavirus.

And that is critical time. Yes, it’s possible Brady invites all teammates to his secluded Montana ranch for a couple of weeks, but that’s certainly unlikely.

Polian talked about the “philosophical synergy” Brady will have with Bucco Bruce Arians, Tom Moore and the rest of the staff. Arians’ offense truly is structurally very similar to New England’s, Polian said, and that part of the Brady transition will be a “rousing success.”

Polian’s concern lie on the Bucs’ offensive line and the Bucs securing a running back that can really “tote the mail,” and that running back is very much about the 2021 season (2021 is not a typo) and the playoffs.

As for Jameis, working and failing with Dirk Koetter and Arians’ staff is a huge red flag, Polian believes because those top flight QB coaches and developers. He called Koetter a top-10 quarterback developer in the NFL.

Overall, Polian said there is no great shame in Jameis’ failings because 40 percent of first-round picks are busts. Jameis, he said, should seek the best possible QB coach for his next team, and for chances to get reps in practice and in games.

Polian referred to Jameis as potentially the next Jim Plunkett, who was a mess of a quarterback through the 1970s before getting another starting shot in Oakland’s downfield offense at age 32 in 1980. Plunkett went on to win two Super Bowls and his 8-2 record in playoff games remains a mind-blower.

However, Polian added he doubts that kind of opportunity will find Jameis in the modern game.

179 Responses to “Bill Polian Talks Brady Effect, “Philosophical Synergy” & The Jameis Downfall”

  1. Ndog Says:

    The way people talk about Jameis is simply ridiculous, absolutely crazy. They act like he was surrounded by this perfect team and was just an abomination, which is simply disgusting and about 100% false as you can get. But that’s what happens when the media only brings up the negatives over and over and over again but has nothing to say about all the things he does well.

    Why do you never hear about his red zone%, 3rd down%, his % of yards per team, his production outside the pocket, his production off of play action? Oh because ALL of those things are elite!

    So Peyton Manning’s numbers and Jameis’s numbers are about as similar as you can get but all you hear the media say is “yeah but Peyton won”. But do they also tell you what Peyton’s winning numbers looked like with and without a HOF running back? Well take a look below as to how much difference a running game helps:

    35-17 with Edgerrin James

    7—21 without Edgerrin James

    Now can someone please show us the HOF running back Jameis has ever played with?

    So yes Jameis is gone but he is getting screwed and that is an absolute FACT, and this should both everyone cause it is simply wrong.

    But when you think about it with the media both local and national ripping him at every chance, real or not, and Bruce Arains tearing him apart, for no good reason cause they didn’t want him, I guess we should not be surprised. Everything about this is wrong and what is sad is it will just be accepted because everyone that steps up and says anything is just told to pipe down or they are a “Stan”.

    But think about this does anyone in their right mind truly believe that Dwayne Haskins, Gardner Minshew, Jared Goff, Kyle Allen, Marcus Mariota, Duck Hodges, Mason Rudolph, Blain Gabbert, and many others are all better than Jameis?

    It is clear he is being treated differently than the other players in this league and it is just wrong regardless if you like on our team or not.

  2. DavidBigBucsFan99 Says:

    Say what you want about Winston. Busts dont score 131 tds in a 5 year period and break every passing record in a franchise’s history even if it’s the lowly Bucs offensive records. Too many people are using their eyes and hearts and prejudices to judge him hatersand supporters alike. He’s a different kind of dude that people can’t accept on a personal level. His total turnovers are another reason. His college antics and things he did in his first year on the team is another. I would say his biggest problem is in the heat of battle his decision making is skewered by his faith in his abilities. If the day comes when he realizes he shouldn’t make every throw just because ur seems like it’s there then he wil make a very good qb. Don’t forget Mitch Gannon was not the best until some guy by the name of Jon Gruden took him to 2 AFC Championships and 1 Superbowl(should’ve been 2)

  3. YucLife Says:

    Didn’t even have to look at the name before seeing all the Winston support ? Bro he wasn’t a good fit here and they made the change, but look at his numbers because besides the yards ( that meant nothing because we were already behind by 21) he really should of had 51 interceptions this past year!! Look at the video of the other players drops, but yes go back to the Giants game, but so glad he’s gone and let him Ball somewhere else !! N Dog are you a season ticket holder or pay hundreds for games ? I’m going to assume not, but if you did I promise you wouldn’t look at JWhoo like you do because his play since coming here was beyond erratic and can’t wait to see what next season holds !! Going to be exciting and if this guy is so good why can’t he get a job ?

  4. El Buco Realisto Says:

    Jay-miss = black jeff george!!!!!!!!!!!

    go bucs!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  5. YucLife Says:

    131 TDS and Yards in a lot of Garbage Time and don’t forget the suspension while here ? He had so many opportunities, but failed tremendously and the news conference at the end sealed his fate !! So cocky and had no sense of reality because good luck getting 8-10 million because he balled out ?? Give me a freaking break and ride the pine and learn from true leaders because if not he will be out of the league in 3 years !! Guaranteed

  6. Tampabaybucfan Says:

    @ Ndog

    No, Blaine Gabbert is not better than Jameis…..but will Jameis work for $1.5 million?

  7. Ndog Says:

    So what the difference between Manning and Jameis in their first 5 years? Why was one being looked at as possible being on their way to the greatest of all time and the other is being talked about as possible being out of the league?

    Reminder below about the important factor of a running game:

    35-17 with Edgerrin James

    7—21 without Edgerrin James

  8. Ndog Says:

    Cocky? Really cocky where do you get that from?

  9. YucLife Says:

    You look at my numbers, I’m ballin’,” Winston said. “I got to stop giving the ball to the other team. I’m focused on how I can get better. Because I know if I eliminate those, I’m going to be the best. That’s bar none. You better check your sheet. Winstons last words as a Buc ?? What a joke

  10. Ndog Says:

    It is very simple, Jameis Winston is easily a top 15 QB in this league right now, yet can’t get a starting job. What does that tell you about the influence of media and perception? This country is weak and disgusting is what it tells me

  11. YucLife Says:

    NDOG look UP and I really hope you follow Jamiss to whatever team that might take him and go stand up for Crab legs like you did this one !!! Oh and sure likes Uber drivers hand on his C too !! Lmao, but you definitely are a ride or die chick for the Dude !! Give you that !!! It’s over bud
    Bye Felicia

  12. Ndog Says:

    See Yuclife you fell right into my trap. He has been getting ripped for the past FIVE YEARS and you take one quote from FIVE YEARS and that is who he is. So now I’ll give you another chance find something else where he was anything but team first.

    And by the way if there is a joke in there it you trying to us one line from 5 years to paint a picture of a periwhen EVERYTHING ELSE says the exact opposite. But that’s ok you are just doing what the media has done from jump street.

  13. BigHog Says:

    This is nothing lore than the NFL throwing its weight around to make an example of Mr. 5,000 for that uber driver BS…yes that BS that they found no proof (I damn sure didn’t see any)..never charged, never found guilty, so this is the NFL’s way of punishing the (BROTHER) now can you say BLACK BALLED…treated worse than a run away slave….but that’s just me and how I feel!!!

  14. Ndog Says:

    There is no standing up for anyone it is pointing out facts that are irrefutable yet people constantly get away with just looking at one part of his game while ignoring the rest. It simply is wrong.

  15. Ljsolutions Says:

    So why does he not have a job?

  16. Ljsolutions Says:

    no team would pass on a top 15 rated quarterback unless there where issues.

  17. Kgh4life Says:

    Jameis wasn’t on a dominant Bucs team throughout his 5 years, however, that doesn’t account for his high rate of turnovers. Jameis still has trouble identifying the underneath coverage, which is why he threw a record high 7 pick six’s last season, he also goes through his progressions slowly and from time to time has accuracy issues. The talent is definitely there it’s mental aspect he needs to work on.

  18. Joseph Mamma Says:

    Ndog Says:
    March 29th, 2020 at 1:20 pm
    There is no standing up for anyone it is pointing out facts that are irrefutable yet people constantly get away with just looking at one part of his game while ignoring the rest. It simply is wrong.

    The 32 general managers of the NFL do seem to be refuting these irrefutable facts.

  19. El Buco Realisto Says:

    Fitz-magic was also a “top 15” qb as well, when he played with the Bucs!!!!!!!!!!

    go bucs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  20. BigHog Says:

    Ljsolutions:. Have you ever heard of BLACK BALLED? Free your mind and your a** will folllow!!!

  21. bucfor life Says:

    I think it would be great if the Bucs were to sign Winston as their backup for the next 2 years (I doubt Winston would take that kind of a paycut). I think his problem in turnovers could disappear learning from the best QB in the history of the game. If that happened, we could have a football dynasty for years to come.

  22. El Buco Realisto Says:

    @bigdog fraud

    The so called innocent, does not write that many settlement checks!!!!!!!!!! Better stay in your lane rather than checking ur sheet!!!!!!!!!

    go bucs!!!!!!!!!

  23. TBUC North Carolina Says:

    NDog……. Koetter and Arians has spent much more time w JayMiss than you(no Ndog, sexually doesn’t count!) ALL NFL teams are out to Win!! Look at all the teams that took on Antonio Brown etc!! He is not a Winner… LOSER!!!

  24. BigHog Says:

    The 32 general managers of the NFL do seem to be refuting these irrefutable facts. —————————————————————————————-Black Balled…..plain and simple!!!

  25. geno711 Says:

    Peyton better than Jameis.
    Comparing Jameis to Peyton Manning just continues to be stupid. I am sure in 5 years from now Ndog will continue to say the whole NFL was wrong about Jameis and he is correct. I think the Joe’s must warn him when there is going to be a negative article on Jameis so he can be the 1st to reply.

    Joe Flacco’s stats at Baltimore compare favorably to Johnny Unitas.
    I think those fans are smarter than some on this site. They do not compare the two players.

    By the way, Peyton Manning’s worst year for record was his 1st year and he had HOF running back, Marshall Faulk on his team. So the premise of what Peyton was like without a HOF running back was incorrect. Ndog tried to disguise his opinion in a false fact. But if you did not know, Marshall Faulk is a HOF running back.

    Don’t let people mislead you that there is only one way you can win in the NFL. Not true. By the way, Pat Mahommes had garbage this year for running backs.

    Jameis does not have a job because of his own work not because of the running situation.

  26. Ndog Says:

    Again what is the difference between Manning first 5 years and Winston’s? Simply answer the question, why does everyone avoid that question?

    The numbers are freaking crazy similar BUT Manning had TWO HOF running backs to help him.

    Why wasn’t Manning a bust a not starting in his 6th year after throwing MORE picks than Jameis in his first 5 years?

  27. Bird Says:


    Yah. …bucboi had pulled up some of your facts (comments ) going back to end of last year

    It made you look pretty bad
    But yah …you present facts 😂 and call people clueless

    Whats this laying down a trap for someone?
    You literally say the same thing every day x 100 like a broken record

  28. Ndog Says:

    Thats correct Geno I was being kind Manning went 3-13 with a HOF running back but I was being kind since he was a rookie. Bro you’re not going to get me cause I know more than you and most so can give that crap up. Just accept it Jameis is getting screwed and you idiots just accept it.

    And if that’s correct on Jameis as to why he doesn’t have a job then why did Manning after his fifth year Geno?

  29. TBUC North Carolina Says:

    Manning has something JayMiss (Scarecrow) doesn’t!! A Brain!! Being a successful QB in this league is way more than a big arm!! Brainless!!

  30. LaMarcus Says:

    It’s highly suspicious in the case of JW. And it’s not even about him having a job

    Is he too talented to be a backup? Its sure looking like it

  31. Ndog Says:

    TBUC North Carolina Says:
    March 29th, 2020 at 2:03 pm
    Manning has something JayMiss (Scarecrow) doesn’t!! A Brain!! Being a successful QB in this league is way more than a big arm!! Brainless!!

    Then why did he throw more picks in the same amount of years with better support?

  32. JimmyJack Says:


    Yet nothing that you said addresses a very potential reason why Winston is not here……and is not anywhere as a starter right now. Leadership

    And while you are comparing Winston to Peyton please take it upon yourself to compare them as leaders. Nobody has every questioned Peyton as a leader nor has he ever displayed anything on the field that would lead you to question him.

    If you want a real fact I’ll give one to you…….Winston has been questioned as a leader numerous times…….and fact 2 is he has displayed very questionable behavior on the field(on I said….not off) that is very unbecoming for a leader.

    There is a real difference there buddy. And it’s indisputable.

  33. #1 Pick QB 2 Cent Brain Says:

    Did I miss Jameis getting signed?

  34. BigHog Says:

    El Buco Realisto::: there is no lane for me …I move as I damn well please …check your sheet the people who have, has always written checks in this country can you say STORMY D.

  35. JimmyJack Says:

    I have convinced myself that leadership is/has been the bigger part of the problem with Winston. It’s more important then the picks.

    Stats cannot make up for a lack of leadership……Not at the QB position. Never have never will.

  36. #1 Pick QB 2 Cent Brain Says:

    Can we compare Winston to Mahomes and DeShaun Watson both drafted after him both without a great run game yet still win games

    Stop comparing Americas Unemployed Qb to Hall of Famers and compare him to his contemporaries who all have progressed faster and don’t make dumb mistakes weekly

  37. TBUC North Carolina Says:

    The Coaches and GM’s know who is too stupid to be a great QB in this league!! They know Manning had a brain to change and adapt his play!! And the Know that JayMiss doesn’t NDog!!

  38. Hethrew 30 Says:

    NDog, keep yelling down a well, because at the bottom is you man Jameis. 320 million Americans, including hundreds of pro football top executives, and YOU are one of very few people still pushing how great Jameis is. Even JulyJoe, aka Jameis 1of1, has resorted to fingerpainting and writing books about race horses.

  39. TBUC North Carolina Says:

    NDog. Everyone on this site are tired of trying to explain it to you!!! Your brain must be very similar to JayMiss’s!! You just don’t get it! Just like Winston!

  40. Hethrew 30 Says:

    Well, I eat my words, as I just got info that the Patriots could be very interested in Jameis Winston….yup….ain’t no lie….

  41. Hethrew 30 Says:

    ^^^That is, the Lincoln High School Patriots, of Sioux Falls, South Dakota, USA, need some help with their football team.

  42. Al da pewter King Says:

    My opinion is Jameis is not as good of a quarterback as we want him to be but definitely not as bad as many people think of him to be. He’s both. You either love him or you hate him. No in between.

  43. TBUC North Carolina Says:

    Would Love to see JayMiss being throttled by Belichick after his INT’s!!! Please let that happen!!!! PLEASE!! I beg you!! PLEASE!!

  44. BigHog Says:

    Payton M. was not all that clean …check your sheets and he will be a first ballot hall of gamer in 2021 ….get my drift treated differently!!!

  45. Oneilbucs Says:

    Ndog these people believe any and every thing the media say . They believe people who don’t even watch the bucs . Big Hog that’s what I think is going on for Newton as well as Jamies . Think about it this when Wentz is struggling it’s always because of his team . He need a running game and a offensive line this is what they say about Wentz every time . And by the way I don’t care what they say Payton had a 100 interceptions . That’s facts regardless how yall feel . Dungy came out and said the same thing that Jamies and Payton Manning has the same numbers but you want never hear that from the national media. And no excuses for Brady superbowl or bust ….

  46. geno711 Says:

    So are there others saying Winston is just as good as Peyton Manning or is it limited to Ndog?

    Oneilbucs – are you agreeing that Winston is as good as Peyton Manning?

    Please express your beliefs here.

  47. Dom>Licht Says:

    How about no more Jamies talk until when or if he gets signed. Been reading the same old crap from both sides for 5 years…

  48. Tye Says:

    It seems as though 32 NFL teams (the experts and only ones doing the hiring) have deemed the Bucs former QB a bust, or to risky to hire… Even XFL QBs are getting jobs..
    If he doesn’t even get a consideration by some team to be brought in as a camp arm, then he has likely played his last NFL game and no matter how many articles of Joe’s you continue to flood with your posts, the reality of said QB is going to continue to be the same…

  49. Youngbucs Says:

    I swear I believe ndog is tht jameis1of1 🤡.
    He talks exactly like him. Word for word

  50. Youngbucs Says:

    Stop comparing Jameis to hofers. How about some of the QBs now ?????
    There are rookies with more IQ than this guy top 15 lol why 5000yds 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

  51. Bucsfan951 Says:

    I didn’t read all of NPUPPYS responses bc lefts face it, they’re repetitive. But I get where he’s coming from.

    I wanted jw to work out for the Bucs. I really did. I think the PUP took and takes mine/other ppl’s being critical of jw as hate. Maybe for some, it is. But I just wanted him to do well. I just wanted our Bucs to succeed, dammit!!! I don’t care if it’s jw, Brady, tannehill, or a rookie. I just want to win. I’m tired of our season being done by Halloween.

    As far as jw goes, I know he ain’t perfect but he’s better/the same as some starting qbs. You can’t tell me he’s better than tannehill. Why he still ain’t signed, who knows?! Maybe there’s something there that we (the fans) don’t know about.

    Do I wish jw well?… of course! I hope he wins every single time he plays unless he plays our Bucs team. I don’t wish any ill will against him.

    Sorry for me going on and on. It’s easy to do talk to text and I’ve had quite a few drinks already this morning! 😜😜😜😳😳😳

  52. Bucsfan951 Says:


    You right! JW has a ton of great numbers and attributes to him. There’s no doubt about that. But he also has a lot of bad(?) things about him as well. He can easily clean up the bad things and become a great qb just as easy as he can get worse and be unemployed. It’s crazy to think he’s still unemployed. I don’t know if he’s asking for too much and free agency passed him by or what. I live in SoCal, owned my own construction business at one point and my business had charger season tickets… I wish the chargers would sign jw. They’d be better off than Taylor being their qb.

    I get your sticking up for JW, NPUPPY. But you gotta see the bad as well. I don’t care how you slice it and think it doesn’t mean anything, but turnovers are a killer in this league. Between that and a really bad agent, I think that’s why jw isn’t signed!

  53. TexBuc Says:

    In my opinion One Bucs Place decided it was too good of a opportunity to sign the GOAT. Just in case we could not get him the Bucs decided to throw a little shade Winston’s way to keep his price and market down. Now there is a good chance you will see us sign Winston to back up Brady. Sitting Winston is a good thing as I believe his biggest weakness is his immaturity.

  54. Ndog Says:

    I ask one question and no one can answer it, I wonder why? I will ask it louder for the ones in the back. WHY WAS PEYTON MANNING NOT GETTING RUN OUT OF THE LEAGUE AFTER HIS FIFTH YEAR AFTER THROWING MORE PICKS THAN JAMEIS WITH MORE SUPPORT?

  55. Youngbucs Says:

    Ndog because everyone knows you’re race baiting. That’s why Jameis so far in 5 years sucks. You do know coaches can evaluate him individually ? Even thou u don’t want to.

  56. Ndog Says:

    YoungBucs why don’t you want to compare two players with almost identical numbers in their first 5 years? Do you think maybe it is because it makes your argument about as weak as you can get? You got nothing but opinion whereas the FACTS say otherwise.

  57. Ndog Says:

    Who said anything about race but you YoungBucs????

  58. Ndog Says:

    Again answer the question:


  59. Youngbucs Says:

    I got a fact Winston is jobless. And yes I feel for him but I won’t make excuses.

  60. Youngbucs Says:

    The Bucs have stood by this dude the whole time. Honestly he didn’t even deserve to finish his contract here. Even if he didn’t assault the Uber driver. He knew it was coming and left the Bucs in the dark. They still stood by his side and pick up his 5 year gtfoh

  61. Youngbucs Says:

    And that’s Facts

  62. BacktaBucs Says:

    NDog and others who support JW, no matter what,

    It doesn’t matter what Bucs fans who are not you think. GM’s around the league obviously consider him something other than Door #1. You don’t agree with their assessment. Fine.

    Get yourself a team and hire the man so that you can prove 32 GM’s, 32 Head Coaches, and their 100’s of staff wrong. Make certain that you get the perfect line, a great RB, a squad of standout WR’s, a perfect kicker, and a top defense, so that JW can achieve what you realize is the greatness that is there, but just being held down by the rest of the team. Leaders don’t elevate a team, they just lead it, amiright? Man, that will show everyone how much more you know about football that those professional football dunces!

    Stay golden, Ponyboy!

  63. Ndog Says:

    BacktaBucs that’s the entire point.


  64. JimmyJack Says:

    951…..The tea leafs certainly suggest that there was more to this then we know about.

    Joe has done a good job documenting all the speculation and it should suprize nobody that our lockerroom may not have been wanting to be led by Jamie’s no more.

    And Joe has relationships with these players. If he had doubts to this speculation I am certain he would make his opinion well know. But he didnt. Instead How posed the hypothetical question if certain Bucs defenders didn’t support Winston no more!!! Where the heck does that come from?

    Winston nugglers can hide behind stats all they like. But they will never bring up these leadership questions because they have nothing to defend Winston about in that catergory.

    At the end of the day we might truely be looking at a situation where Winston coming back has a cost…..It could very well cost us several key players that might not wanna be here anymore with Winston leading us…….So the decision is about more then turnovers or TDs. If we bring Winston back it might mean we gotta rebuild all over again. And the Winston nugglers will continue hiding behind statistics pretending intangables aren’t real.

  65. JimmyJack Says:

    And NDog I answered your little question so pipe down muchambo.

  66. Alvin Scissors Harper Says:

    30 interceptions in his 5th year in the league, and still making CLUELESS (Yes, NDog you are not the only person who can spell a word in all caps) decisions. There is no light at the end of the tunnel for Jay Miss. #31othergeneralmanagerscan’tbewrong

  67. #1 Pick QB 2 Cent Brain Says:

    Jameis is more Eli Manning than Peyton.

    After 5 years everyone knew Peyton was good after 5 years Jameis played like a rookie for stretches. Let it go he just didn’t get it done here

  68. Jeffbuc Says:

    Just look at all of jameis teammates comments this offseason. From them saying his head is messed up. To then all the comments of Super Bowl now with Brady. If he was a great leader and great player his teammates would have been standing up for him. They would all be in disbelief he wants resigned. Not giddy like a 12 year old girl about getting Brady.
    Ndog you keep bringing up that people do t bring up his good stats and just bring up his turnovers. That is the main problem nothing else matters when you turn the ball over like that. A point guard could lead the nba in 3 point percentage assists and free throw percentage. But if he doubles the amount of turnovers as the second in that department point guard. He isn’t going to be a starting point guard anymore either.

  69. Aceofaerospace Says:

    Jameis who?

  70. Ndog Says:

    So the answer is that the guy who is the first in the building, the last to leave the building, organized off season activities, constantly stuck up for his teammates when he could have easily pointed to facts that he was getting little to no help is what your going with JimmyJack?

    So your just going to buy into the narrative now that the Bucs are telling you that?

    Well what about when Licht said time and time again that Jameis was one of the best leaders he’s ever been around? So they were lying then but telling the truth now?

    Dude how do you know see these guys are full of crap and lying through their teeth to sell this entire sham?

  71. Ndog Says:

    Then JeffBuc why didn’t all of Manning’s accomplishments not matter sense HE ACTUALLY THREW MORE PICKS THAN JAMEIS?

  72. Destinjohnny Says:

    Some people are so touchy when u call out cams and jameis faults

  73. Ndog Says:

    You guys got nothing man. Just face it Jameis is getting screwed, there’s no two ways about it. Just admit it.

  74. JimmyJack Says:

    And I got news for you……If you bring back Winston and, let’s just say, guys like JPP and Suh say thanks but no thanks and they move on………Well that has a effect on other players. Mike Evans and Chris might just say this situation is hopeless because we can’t keep good players here…….A guy like Shaq Barrett might struggle and think…..I’m going elsewhere to a better situation…..And then prosper elsewhere.

    Winston is a talented player and keeping talent always sounds like a good thing……But when that talent is being asked to be your leader there is much more at stake. And choosing the wrong leader could have devestating effects…….Keeping Winston could very well mean we are stuck as a bottom barrel team if our talent leaves and we gotta keep rebuilding.

  75. Youngbucs Says:

    It’s amazing when you think about ndog. He was doing all of tht and hiding a sexual allegation. That 2face mofo lol

  76. WestChap Says:

    Peyton will be HOF but everyone remembers when he was the Big Game Choker. And who was his nemesis? Brady. Jameis seems a lot more like Favre than Peyton but whatever comparison you make JW hasn’t punched his HOF ticket yet… and may never if he doesn’t learn to protect the ball better.

    The Npuppy, O’Neill and piglet should start another forum for Jameis commiseration. He is undeniably talented (Heisman, #1 pick) but his decision making hasn’t improved an iota and his leadership credibility is low and getting lower every day he’s unemployed. He’ll get another shot eventually unless these young studs continue to play so well so early.

  77. Ndog Says:

    Let’s be clear Jameis is gone and it is what it is, which we will pay for at some point, IF the league stops being scared to give him a freaking job. This is not about bringing him back to the Bucs, as there is no way he would want to play for this backstabbing franchise again, it is about the ridiculous notion that he doesn’t deserve to be a starter in this league. Again the fact that this is even being discussed is flat ridiculous.

  78. BacktaBucs Says:

    He…………ate……………W’s. You can’t un-see that.

    He lied to his teammates about (as Joe insists you call it), his Uber hassle and had to ride the pine for a few games.

    What a leader!

    Ndog, I have hired many people. Resumes may look alike when you see the degrees received, but when you meet people, its easy to see how they are different. Word is around on this guy.

    Let it go. You backed the wrong guy.

  79. El Buco Realisto Says:

    Jay-miss = black Jeff George!!!!!!!!!!!

    go bucs!!!!!!!!!

  80. BigHog Says:

    Jeffbuc:: taking up for Mr. 5,000 would just like kneeling to you people!! Or what you people wrongfully think kneeling is!!

  81. Youngbucs Says:

    Ndog always talking about facts. You do know you saying he deserves to be a starter is not a fact. But simply your opinion right?????????????????

  82. RustyRhinos Says:

    Is it a prejudice thing to want and expect a QB in his fourth and fifth seasons to not turn the ball over nearly 3 times a game? How about a few game winning drives in the Fourth Quarter. And not for the other teams. I have no prejudices against Winston, I just expected him in his fifth season in the NFL, to look more polished in his chosen profession. He did not. Do I think Brady is the answer? Long term no, this season yes. Will he be the same Brady he has always been, I will say yes to that too.

  83. BigHog Says:

    BacktaBucs:::not found guilty …no proof…no charges!! BLACK BALLED!!

  84. Ndog Says:

    First of all anyone that has been on the same team as Jameis says nothing but great things.

    In regards to the suspension Brady has been suspended for more games than Jameis has so I guess he’s not a leader either right BacktaBucs?

    Again you got have nothing but conjecture, everything that is FACTUAL says you’re wrong. I get it you are just believing what you are told to believe but some of us actually look at things for ourselves and don’t rely on being told what to think. In reality I feel bad for you guys that you can’t see that you are being manipulated. It’s really sad the be honest.

  85. BacktaBucs Says:


    The NFL found him guilty.

    Also, he came to a legally binding agreement with the accuser that required him to give her money and not the other way around.


    Don’t worry, not a single NFL GM or coach noticed. Oh, wait a minute…..

  86. JimmyJack Says:

    Showing up early and organizing an activity doesn’t make you a good leader numbnuts…….That’s like saying a boss set up a staff meeting so it qualifes him as a good leader.

    The fact is neither you or I know what is was like to work with/for Winston daily…….Now I will not even bring up all of the examples I easily could that show a pro QB look like a poor leader……And I’m talking on the field stuff…..Things that truely matter and effect real results.

    And I don’t give a darn what Licht says or any of em. They are not paid to shed a negative spin on the team.

    You may wish to think reporters just say stuff without basis that’s completely made up. That’s your prerogative. But there’s some of em out there that don’t just say stuff………Maybe you don’t trust Joe but I do. He’s pretty close to these players so when he questions this kind of stuff I pay attention. You please tell me the last times he has disagreed with a narritive and come come straight out and called it balogney? You can’t cause you won’t.

  87. Ndog Says:

    Also just to be clear on Brady every year he’s won a Superbowl he’s had a top 10 scoring defense. You think that is just happen chance?

  88. Ndog Says:

    The same Joe you “believe” says he thinks leadership is not even a real thing so there’s that. Dude you are talking out of your a$$. You are wrong face it, you got NOTHING.

  89. JimmyJack Says:

    NDog don’t even preach to me about Factual when your first sentence in your 4:13 post is completely and entirely wrong.

    You wouldn’t know a fact if it bit you in the ass and for the past several weeks I have called you out of several of your nonfacts.

    Yet you still continue to pat yourself on the back about facts while much you say is no factual.

  90. JimmyJack Says:

    I’m not wrong and I’m not presenting it as fact numbnuts.

    This is not something that can be proven or disproven…..and it takes a real moron to think it can.

    It’s my opinion and is backed by oddless of spectulive information….and by many real occurances that bring leadership into question.

    Only difference is I’m not setting here patting myself on the back about hard facts……You are so take your little stat sheet and go home. You have no valid argument when it comes to intangables or leadership……..Oh I’m sorry ….you have “shows up on time” and “orginized a practice”……..If I wanted I could name you a couple dozen counterpoints……But I won’t. You know exactly what they are and what I’m talking about.

  91. BacktaBucs Says:

    Scoreboard 0-32. Zero teams hiring him as a starter 32 teams passing on him. Fact.

    These are organizations paid to entertain, and winning is entertainment. There is no conspiracy, NDog. These teams have decided they are better without JW than with him. Fact.

    He may get picked up once the draft is done. That would mean that he is an afterthought compared to rookie potential. Fact.

  92. Blue-footed booby Says:

    Ndog a couple things regarding your Peyton-Jameis comparison. One is that Peyton Manning never missed a single start for his first 5 years in the NFL. Jameis has missed time due to injury, suspension, and being benched for his backup. Another is that the NFL’s league office in 2018 stated that Winston is one personal conduct violation away from being permanently banned from the NFL.

    That’s not a typo, one more conduct violation and he’s likely banned forever from the National Football League. You don’t think other teams aren’t aware of that fact? If Jameis Winston was truly hellbent on proving his innocence regarding his off-field incidents he would’ve gladly taken those accusers to court, instead he wrote multiple checks to avoid shining light on any potential additional details arising from those cases.

    Oh and comparing Brady’s suspension to Winston’s is not even close to comparable since Brady wasn’t accused of assaulting another human being and Brady actually you know, fought his suspension tooth and nail while Winston wrote those checks to avoid civil court appearances.

  93. Alaskan Abdominal Snowman Says:

    We got Tom freakin Brady and some of y’all can’t stop talking about Jameis every dang day. What does it matter anymore?
    Go outside…y’all losing your darn minds.

  94. Ndog Says:

    Forget it you guys are missing the entire point. Why am I not surprised you don’t get it.

  95. Ndog Says:

    Joe please let this link through.

  96. JP09 Says:

    Ndogg, let’s hear it, why do you suppose Jameis is getting screwed? Why has he not received a starting offer yet? You say he’s good enough to start, 32 teams say otherwise, so why are they not hiring him if he’s good enough

  97. TexBuc Says:

    Some just do see the difference between a long ball and a short passing offense. All some know is Brady gets rid of the ball fast….lol

  98. JimmyJack Says:

    And yeah…’s the same Joe that told the story of Nassib getting completely enraged that his leader thrown a bad pick.

    I don’t remember ever seeing that but I believe Joe that it was a true story.

    And I’m sorry if you don’t think stuff like that is poor leadership but it is. As a leader you will be no good if your followers don’t believe in you. This is not about fact or evidence…’s really just common sense…….There is nothing on a stat sheet that changes that pal.

    You may deny it if you wish. That’s you. But I got my own.opinion and you have nothing that can change that……….So for once it’s not about whose right or wrong. And there’s nothing to proove either way. So you just gotta face it. This time it’s an argument you cannot win…..Nor can you lose.

  99. JimmyJack Says:

    NDog…..Yes forget it. Cause thats all you can do. And now you have to grow up and realize other people have different opinions then yours and they are fair. Hopefully now you got a little better understanding……..Not every answer can be found on a highlight reel or on a stat sheet.

  100. Ndog Says:

    So you don’t think Jameis was pissed during the Capitol collapse, or during this past years Giants and Seahawks games? Or how bout the night he roasted the Falcons on Thursday night football only to watch the defense let Freeman run all over us or when Gay missed not one, not two, but three FGs in that last Falcons game? So does that make LVD, JPP, Suh etc… bad leaders cause Jameis was pissed?

  101. Oneilbucs Says:

    Geno711 I think if Jamies would have gotten the same chances that Payton had then he would have been just as good . The thing is that the national media backed Payton Manning so that’s why a lot of people didn’t bash him . Second they stop having Payton Manning to throw the ball 10 to 20 yards a throw and they put in the quick slants plays which means short passes which means it gives a quarterback a chance to read a defense and they kept a 1,000 yard rusher which also helps a young quarterback . With Jamies they made him throw down field every throw and with no running game . Think about this he only had one runningback with a thousand yards out of 5 years . And this year they are going to change the playbook up for Brady . And now Bruce Arians is talking about a 3 down back but last year Bruce Arians said he didn’t value runningbacks . He new Jamies was a coach guy means he will do everything the coach says even if it doesn’t work and that’s the problem I had with Jamies . If the play says throw it to this guy or that guy Jamies will did it . Now Brady is letting Bruce Arians know he ain’t doing that he’s gonna throw to the guy that’s open. The lesson that all young quarterbacks need to learn is you can’t put all your trust in a coach especially if he didn’t draft you . If he’s a new coach coming in then you need to research his hold career on what kind of quarterbacks he likes and Bruce Arians like older quarterbacks and if that’s the case for a young quarterback I wouldn’t put all my trust in him . Bruce Arians knew he didn’t want Jamies from the start he just played yall with I took the job because of Jamies . He said it took 2 years to master his playbook but he gave Jamies 1 year . Jamies is probably done in the NFL him and Cam .

  102. Ndog Says:

    So cause someone has a different opinion than you and has FACTS to back up that opinion they need to grow up?

  103. Matt Says:

    This thread needs to be thumb-nailed! I absolutely love most of this commentary, the harsh criticism is edgy but definitely warranted.

    Winston has very few buyers at this point and his market has plummeted to the $7m-11m range. Just 6 weeks ago I thought he would at least get $17m, a little more than Mike Glennon money. El Bucco realist- you’re dead on brother. I always thought he was just like Jeff George.

    As Cam Newton how that ho hum cocky gig worked out for him. He’s broken in pieces. These kind of guys make you appreciate the Chris Godwins of the footballsphere even more.

  104. Bobbo Says:

    Jameis is like winning the lotto the day after you filed bankruptcy

  105. Destinjohnny Says:

    All jameis has to do is get his picks under 10 and he will get paid
    Due to his inconsistency’s nobody is picking him up.
    Bruce wanted teddy over jameis
    Ask yourself why?

  106. JimmyJack Says:

    You don’t have facts about leadership dude stop lying to me. You have he showed up on time and he orginized team activities.. I can ragtle off at least a dozen more facts then you that bring Winston’s leadership into question. And I’ve already told you I will not because you know exactually what I’m talking about.

    Don’t play stupid with me dude. Which is precisely what you are trying to do.

    Just freaking drop it like you said you were going to do. You’ve entered a argument you can’t win or lose. So stop pretending you can somehow win it. It makes you really look….Dare I say…. clueless.

    You have your opinion I got mine. You may think Winston is a good leader and I wager many will disagree. And there is nothing you could possibly say that proove anything either way……..So far the best you got is “he shows up on time”… you can’t see how pathetic that is then you need some type of brain medication

  107. stpetebucsfan Says:


    Really you’ve lost your ability to think critically and so I feel sorry for you.

    “What does that tell you about the influence of media and perception? This country is weak and disgusting is what it tells me”

    Because we do not agree with YOU we are weak and disgusting? LMAO

    You are accusing the entire NFL of being so non professional that they believe the opinions of pundits and media rather than their own scouting?
    That’s just ludicrous. You are a fan…they are professionals with careers and $$$ they could care less about our opinions or what is reported in the media.

    Big Hog Bro I luvs ya but you keep barking up the wrong tree. IF JW is blackballed it’s not the color of his skin. Can you say Ryan Leaf? Jeff George..these guys were white.

    I hope for your and NDOG’s sake he goes somewhere else and blows up and realizes his talent. I hope you and NDOG get to come here and go neener neener told ya so.

    I can promise you this… I shall not be among the group who does it to you if he fails.

    BigHog…again bro…concentrate your frustration and anger about racism on REALITY…like Stacy Abrams having the Ga governors mansion stolen from her.

  108. Destinjohnny Says:

    The question u should be asking is should we have played the long term card for Teddy.
    Teddy can play and he had multiple offers

  109. SB Says:

    Ndog says

    “The way people talk about Jameis is simply ridiculous, absolutely crazy. ”

    Those ‘people’ get paid Millions of dollars to break down film. Not sure if you ask ” would you like fries with that order?” or not but to call Bill Polian clueless just shows that you don’t work in the Football industry.
    Go ahead though. Keep looking stupid. We all like a good laugh in these times.

  110. NOLES Says:

    Jameis is gone get over it… NDOG only time will tell if you are a QB sage or not. At this moment the ones actually deemed as such think Jameis isn’t a starting QB. Maybe you should call him & offer your services as his Agent. You sure pitch it hard in his defense at least this way, you can get paid when you are right

  111. WestChap Says:

    How can anyone who apparently believes Jameis is the same kind of talent as Peyton Manning be taken seriously? After 5 years Jameis is still a bundle of athletic potential and recurring brain farts looking for a reboot… Peyton was “on his way” to fully realizing his talent after year 5. It just boggles the mind that anything other than a bot could possibly attempt to equate those 2 players. Jameis still can’t read a defense without a 5 Mississippi head start and his accuracy is still +/- a yard. Sure, he threw for a lot of yards given the plays called and the players he’s throwing to… but why not compare him more directly to Fitzpatrick. They actually seemed pretty similar for stretches… good and bad.

  112. SB Says:

    Ndog Says:
    March 29th, 2020 at 1:15 pm
    It is very simple, Jameis Winston is easily a top 15 QB in this league right now, yet can’t get a starting job. What does that tell you about the influence of media and perception? This country is weak and disgusting is what it tells me


    It should tell you that you are a complete Idiotic Moron because you are one of two people in the ENTIRE UNIVERSE that believe that.

  113. SB Says:

    BigHog Says:
    March 29th, 2020 at 1:46 pm
    Ljsolutions:. Have you ever heard of BLACK BALLED? Free your mind and your a** will folllow!!!


    Idiot Racist as usual. 75% of the League is black and you think they are picking on JW because he is black??!?!!!
    Stupidity abounds on these boards.

  114. geno711 Says:

    Oneilbucs Says:
    March 29th, 2020 at 4:55 pm
    Geno711 I think if Jamies would have gotten the same chances that Payton had then he would have been just as good.

    I respect your right to have a different opinion on that than most. I agree that circumstances can make a difference. I believe Jameis had a better circumstance than a lot of quarterbacks that have come into this league but probably not as good as others.

    I for one am tired of saying it is some other part of the team that has failed in his ability to succeed here or get a job elsewhere.

  115. Jeffbuc Says:

    To us people huh big dog. And you just group me in who is the real racist here. You not me and my beautiful black princess wife. And my three beautiful mixed children. Your what’s wrong with this whole racism problem. You scream racism every chance when you your self are the racist who play the victim card. That doesn’t work buddy. If he is good he will get a job regardless of skin color. What color is the super bowl champ QBs right now. And what about other playoff QBs Watson,Jackson, Wilson. You ha e no valid point but to use the race victim card because things didn’t go the way you wanted. Can’t be his play on and off the field.

  116. SB Says:

    “With most teams settled at quarterback, Winston still needs a job. More than likely, he ranks behind 2015 league MVP Cam Newton on the free-agent hierarchy.

    According to ESPN’s Jeff Darlington, one general manager said Winston’s market felt “ice cold.”

    We’ll take a look at teams that need a quarterback or clubs and could sign the 26-year-old as a backup behind an aging or inexperienced starter.”

    That excerpt should tell you all you need to know Ndog. But I’m sure it won’t

  117. Bird Says:


    Wow. Do you even listen to what you say?

    March 29th, 2020 at 4:55 pm
    “So cause someone has a different opinion than you and has FACTS to back up that opinion they need to grow up?”


    If someone Disagrees with you …you call them clueless…idiot…moron
    At least that person was being cool about it
    You are the biggest hypocrite on here
    Plus bucboi pointed out some comments you made from last year that were 100% wrong …so these “facts” you claim are just you being a homer …as usual

    Plus , I think its time for you to go night night

  118. SB Says:

    ” Yet, as Darlington relayed from a general manager, the former No. 1 overall pick doesn’t have a market at the moment. We’ve heard and read about the “unlikely” and “no” answers without much chatter about interest in him.

    Wherever Winston lands, he’s going to hold the clipboard as the No. 2 quarterback on the depth chart. However, as Ryan Tannehill showed last year, a new opportunity could arise at any moment.”


    Man…..How does Ndog know so much more than the professionals?

  119. JimmyJack Says:

    SB……As far as I hear the market for Winston remains as a backup. I don’t think there is any big deal that’s he’s not signed right now. I’m sure both he and his agent are holding out to see if a big deal comes along. It makes sense to wait after the draft. Some team might offer Winston a deal or give him a chance to compete in camp.

    But I do think it’s telling in some of the speculation. A few analysts have said his best fit is to learn behind a proven leader……I’ve heard playing behind Rodgers and Bress for example. When I hear that it tells me that these analysts might be hearing that Winston is lacking the leadership abilities that I been talking about. They realize his best opportunity is to learn how to lead men behind a great system & established QB. And it might be the best, and maybe only way, for Winston to become a winner in this league.

    All the pieces fit.

  120. Buc1987 Says:

    BigHog…it’s always about racism with you….

    No matter the topic.

  121. BrianBucs Says:

    By the time Winston is 32 like Plunkett was, he will have already been out of the league for quite some time.

    Winston will end his career as a journeyman backup and go down in football history as a #1 pick that was a bust

  122. Kgh4life Says:

    It’s quiet clear that there isn’t a market for Winston to be a starter. He should try to go to a team with a good QB coach and work on his game, and maybe down the line another starting opportunity will materialize.

  123. JimmyJack Says:

    You don’t up and decide one day that a 5k passer is no good. Teams aren’t just looking at it saying the INTs are too much to bear. Some team would look at all these throws Winston can make and try to put a offense around it that would limit the picks. Somebody would try to fix Winston if picks was the only issue…….and heck, maybe somebody will still do that and give him a chance to start(Bears for example).

    But right now it looks like no team is gonna give Jameis a immediate chance…….Yes, for sure it could mean a conspiracy against Winston. But it also could mean there are underlying problems with Winston aside from picks……And leadership could very well be that issue.

    Don’t never think for a second these high salary executives don’t know what’s going on. They do look at more then just stat sheets when they are looking at free agents……Especially at the QB position.

    So yes it is fair to suggest there is some sort of conspiracy against Winston(this is America)……But to say it’s a conspiracy and also suggest leadership can’t be a factor makes you unfair, unintelligent and basically a creep.

  124. From76 Says:

    Winston would be a good quarterback. Except for one little problem that keeps your team from winning. That would be turnovers. He has not even slowed his roll with them. 5 years and he is captain turnover. You just can’t have that momentum killer on your team. Not even as a backup.

  125. Tampabuscsbro Says:

    Why do people keep comparing Winston and Manning?

    If we wanted to use stats here we go. It has never been easier to play QB in the NFL. When Manning was playing in his first 5 years DBs were allowed to be MUCH MUCH MUCH more physical then they are today. and if a D lineman got to the QB they were allowed to hit them much much harder then they are today. Yet for some reason these facts are being ignored there FACTS.


  126. sincethebeginning Says:

    Man, Polian always drops some hammers, doesn’t he??

  127. Destinjohnny Says:

    SB you owe me a jersey
    Get me a large 45

  128. sincethebeginning Says:

    Wow I should have taken the time to read through these comments before posting the first time!

    What a thread!!

    @NDog if you aren’t Jameis or his agent or that one Joe… then I am truly *impressed* with your commitment to this trolling. The triggers you’re pulling with people are epic. Really amazing to watch you stick with what works. You have reached boss level, dude. Tmaxcon level, just a different syle.

    If you *are* Jameis or his agent or that one Joe… smh. How pathetic.

  129. JimmyJack Says:

    I think there’s a good chance Jason Pierre Paul and Bruce had a 💓 to 💓 and Bruce was told that Jason wanted to end his career chasing another ring and did not see the opportunity In Tampa with Jameis leading the charge. Bruce probably knows that Suh wants a title shot as well.

    I honestly believe if we resigned Winston then we are looking at a different team right now. We are looking at a team that needs a real rebuild on defense with an unexperirnced secondary leading the way. Total rebuild of the front 7.

    Furthermore the lasting effects of seeing good players leave the team has a very real and lasting effect on a lot of other players still here. Bitterness could be created from this. The end result is Bucs stuck in the cellar peddling 5 to 7 wins for the next decade. All because our current core players did not believe in their leader……..For that reason it will never matter if Winston hits his potential. He lost this Bucs team and his chances of winning it back were totally stacked against him

    So forget Winston. His story in Tampa Bay is over and was not ever likely to lead to a happy ending. We have Tom Brady now. And all of our key players still here……Because they want to be. There are no more questions of if anymore…………..The ability of this team is proven. How they can put it together and play as a team is the only question.

    GO BUCS!!!!

  130. JimmyJack Says:

    Tampabucsbro……..Don’t even worry about the comparisons…..If it makes you feel better you can also compare Winston to Blake Borytles and Freeman and find shocking similarities.

    Peyton Manning is just one handpicked comparison. It’s just a lame thing to point at. If Winston was on that level there would be comparisons to Brady, Elway, Young, Bress, Rodgers, Wilson, Mahommes and a lot more other greats ……….The fact that people found just one great QB to make a comparison to and pound the table about is actually quite pathetic. It’s cherry picking to a fault ………The fact that they can bring up one name while ommiting literally hundreds of others is very quite revealing.

  131. Tampabuscsbro Says:

    Thanks Jimmy Jack.

    Also after hearing Ndog rant about the Media I am 100% convinced he is Jameis1of1.

    Hey Ndog I know you wrote that book and all buy why do you go on Twitter trolling and berating every single last journalist around here when all they do it report the facts you hold (albeit cherry pick to an extremity) so near and dear?

  132. Stanglassman Says:

    Now the story is JW lost the respect of his teammates. This is a new story I’ve never heard this one before. When and why would this narrative be made up. What a bunch of crap. Jameis is getting screwed. I don’t get why they’re being so low class about it. Just say you had a chance to get Tom Brady and leave it at that. Belichick will pick up Jameis put a decent team around him and win and everyone will say what a genius he is. The Bucs might get one maybe two years out of Brady and we will be on another long quest for a decent Qb.

  133. Stanglassman Says:

    As far as the 2020 season goes it maybe better for Tampa in general if they called off the season because they might just push everyone’s SB host year back. That would be better than hosting some crappy abbreviated year that had only 8 games with no offseason preparation.

    As far as getting rid of a 26 year old Qb for a 43 year old (lower Qb rating ‘19 than JW) is looking a bit short sited. A 43 year old taking the year off and coming back is going to be much more difficult than a 26 year old. If 2020 is canceled will contracts just be voided? What a legal mess. Will that mean the Bucs will go into 2021 with a 44 year old Qb who sat out a year with one year on his contract?

  134. J Says:

    The Jameis experience is over thank god, so there’s ZERO REASON to even talk about it any longer.

  135. Ndog Says:

    The professionals let Warren Moon not play for quite a while, they let Drew Brees walk, they let Kurt Warner bounce around to the arena league, they let Doug Williams go play in the USFL they passed upon on Tom Brady in the draft time and time again. So I know the “professionals” are never completely CLUELESS, you guys are correct.

  136. Blue-footed booby Says:

    I bet Belichick thinks Jarrett Stidham is a better quarterback than Jameis Winston. Stidham was a 5 star quarterback coming out of high school and Belichick might see Stidham as the next Dak Prescott who can be an above average starter who will follow the Patriot way and not bury his team with turnovers like Jaymiss.

  137. Ndog Says:

    You’re right K there really isn’t a reason to bring it up other than people keep slandering him over and over again and the people that want people to do the right thing are not going to stand for it. I said before free agency even started, that Arains and the Bucs were bad mouthing him to keep his price down in the event Brady and Bridgewater (what a joke) said no, but in the process they screwed his value across the board. It was simply wrong and they should be embarrassed at themselves, buy this is nothing new for this organization see Bo Jackson.

  138. Ndog Says:

    Blue, Jameis is better than Dak there is not a doubt in my mind about that. I know I know you’re going to say he doesn’t have a team, and that is what my entire point was which everyone hear is completely missing. The fact that he doesn’t have a team is complete and utter BS.

  139. Tampabuscsbro Says:

    >Jamies is better then Dak
    >those 8-8 cowboys were just the definition of a complete team

    Man really makes you think.

  140. Bucs Fan Since ‘76 Says:

    NDOG, I appreciate your passionate defense of Jameis, truly. Maybe there’s a different way to view his current situation than simply seeing it as him getting screwed. First, Peyton went to the playoffs in three of his first five years. Second, he had a deep pedigree. Third, he was a four year starter in college so he had more experience when he entered the league. Fourth, he was incredible at the LOS. Yes, he threw a lot of picks, and yes, he had a HOF running back, but he was winning and clearly was on an upward trajectory. No team would’ve viewed him as a mixed bag or an uncertain quantity.

    Jameis has none of those things. Having said that, look around the NFL and very few teams are unsettled at QB. The draft has some serious QB talent. And this Corona uncertainty is likely also having a significant dampening effect on his ability to land a starting job, especially for the money he wants. This confluence of unique circumstances, IMO, is impacting him, not collusion or a blackball.

    He will get a job after the draft. People who are saying he’s done I think are mistaken. He has elite arm talent and is a gamer. He’s still young. He will get another shot. Hell, he was third on the Bucs list. Patience.

  141. CharlotteBucsFan15 Says:

    This is all getting out of hand. I Know this has been said numerous times on this site. Why are we comparing Jameis with players form the past. It was a different game. You can’t even breathe on a QB or a WR now. So to compare even Payton’s and Jameis 1st 5 yrs is a joke. Heck Aikman in my option was a better QB then both Manning and JW……and her never threw for 4K yrds in his career. Yes I know he did have a defense and a running game for most of career. Like I said different times. If you are going to compare JW compare him to more current QBs.

  142. Ndog Says:

    The Cowboys have had the best oline in football, the best back in football an HOF TE, along with a top level WR, yet despite all of that balance the Bucs scored more points last year than the Cowboys. Now that came with more TOs of course but when you are predictable/one dimensional that increases the odds of TOs.

  143. Go Bucs 72 Says:

    Great article. I heard that show as well. NFL radio is the best.

  144. Ndog Says:

    The worst part about this is in 2 years we are going to be looking for a new QB yet again. It’s just ridiculous and they better win it all or it’s going to be a unmitigated disaster.

  145. catcard202 Says:

    Here’s my prediction… Bucs buying age 43-44 of TB12 is just another 3-card-Monty sales & marketing racket that will likely blow up spectacularly…While JW3 will be the next in a long line of Ex-Bucs QB’s to go on to MVP/SB seasons with another organization.

    NDog sees the light, while other are blinded by it.

  146. Tampabuscsbro Says:

    you’re talking about the QB like it’s some end all be all. Like Winston was irreplaceable as a starter in the NFL.

    Thing is Winston at best would be just average this is factoring in turnovers at best he is literally just average.

    Also the Manning comparison means nothing because it was much harder to play QB and pass back then. It is much easier to play QB in the NFL now.

    Also in what timeline does Winston win MVP?

    I really want to know he has shown nothing that he can be consistent. he has had some of the best QB coaches in the NFL and for some reason he is being held back.

  147. BigHog Says:

    SB / idiot racist so you say, just what % of power do players hold to black ball another player, let me answer that one…ummmm none! Now you answer this one, what % of ownership (the ones with the hire and fire power) is none-white? I’ll wait?????

  148. Tampabuscsbro Says:


    No seriously why? The buccaneers organization stood up for Winston and defended him at every turn when he should not have been allowed to play out his rookie contract here. But for some reason this is a race issue. the only person Winston can blame for being in this position is himself. No one told or coached Winston to turn the ball over at a historic rate or go get drunk then do what he did to that uber driver and try and get his buddy Darby to cover up for him. and then TURN THE BALL OVER MORE.

    Winston is here because of Winston he has no one else to blame.

  149. Blue-footed booby Says:

    So Ndog and BigHog can you tell me the list of starting quarterbacks for the other 31 teams that are 1 personal conduct violation away from a lifetime ban from the NFL? Maybe 1 in Ben Roethlisberger but the Steelers are more willing to tolerate Big Ben since he has multiple Super Bowl rings and very few if any losing seasons on his resume, while Winston is 28-42 as a quarterback in the NFL after 5 years.

    And please don’t bring up college success because I could point to Matt Leinart, Vince Young, and Tim Tebow as other winning college quarterbacks who flamed out in the NFL.

  150. Greg Says:

    @Ndog obviously no one can question JW’s work effort. I believe the simple answer to your question is PM’s coaches felt he had the ability and merited the investment in more time to work out of it. The BUCs coaches don’t feel he has IT to work it out his propensity to turn the ball over. Yes you can go through the difference in support each had or did not have but again the coaches who know a heck of lot more than we do felt he wasn’t worth the investment in more time. i hope like I think most here feel that JW eventually gets it but it was time to move on. Best wishes to him:

  151. Robert James Says:

    @ndog… we have been looking for a qb the last 3 years… glad we found one for 2 years. Thats 2 years more than we had.

  152. Aceofaerospace Says:

    Sooooo, 31 other teams are passing on Jameis so far. If you believe that is because of some coordinated effort by the media to sabotage Mr Pick-6’s career or because of racism, you’re an idiot.

  153. RGA Says:

    The offensive line is terrible, piss poor in pass protection ( near 50 sacks a season the last couple years) and absolutely terrible opening holes for the run game. Brady and the running game better hope that the O’line improves.

  154. RGA Says:

    Those that continue to bash Winston don’t understand the history of the QB position here in Tampa since 1976. He has shattered all passing records, has made his mark in the history of the NFL as one of a few to achieve the stats he has. He has had absolutely no defense since he has been here, he has had terrible offensive line play giving up close to 50 sacks a season and creating no holes for a rushing attack that is in the basement statistically in the NFL.
    Winston and the receivers were our team, the only highlight we had.

  155. Tampabuscsbro Says:

    A lot of those 50 sacks were on Winston. He held the ball WAY too long too much. Also his pocket awareness was absolutely horrible a lot.

  156. MtBucsfan Says:

    His ranch isnt that secluded it’s in a rather large expensive rich person subdivision. Bill Gates, oprah, tiger woods etc have houses up there. It’s like 25 mons from where I love.

  157. Ed Kerber Says:


    I’ll agree with you that Jameis has potential. I’ll also agree with you that Jameis looks ON PAPER like P. Manning. Here’s the difference: Peyton showed growth and had more winning seasons. in year 5 Jamis had Fumbles, Sacks, and Interceptions all increase.

    Predicted NDOG response: but Jameis was learning a new offense. Also predicted: BA is a bad coach. Well Jameis had two coaches totally give up on him—:\BA and Koetter. Not to mention Tom Moore and Clyde (all three coached Peyton at some point in his career) I liken Jameis to my last two cars (I live in Northeast PA) I drove a Chrysler 300 and Ford Fusion. I got stuck in the snow with both. ( I consider myself an excellent snow driver (coach)). Even though I bought the best snow tires (good WRs and good o-line), when it came to to evaluate for the future, I decided to cut my losses and get a SUV (Tom Brady).

  158. Pete I Says:

    Ndog Says:
    March 29th, 2020 at 3:49 pm
    You guys got nothing man. Just face it Jameis is getting screwed, there’s no two ways about it. Just admit it.

    Jameis is getting screwed but to bad. Life is not fair.

    Manning had led his team to the playoffs, twice by his 6th year and was trending up. No one debated if Manning should be resigned and everyone knew the Colts would be better off with Manning.

  159. Pete I Says:

    “One coach has described Winston as a “slow twitch guy at a quick twitch position.” He holds onto the football too long and should learn how to give up on some plays.

    Winston is right when he says he has to stop giving the football away. And teams are checking his sheet.

    So far, they don’t like what they see.”

  160. Anonymous Says:

    Aceoferospace:: a coordinated effort by the media can’t curtail Mr. 5,000 job status but the owners can, so BLACK BALLED is the term I used.

  161. BigHog Says:

    Aceofaerospace:: a coordinated effort by the media can’t or shouldn’t curtail the job status of Mr. 5,000 but being Black Balled can!! Check your sheet 93.75% of owners in the NFL are white..that in it self is racism (I say that because some idiot pointed out to me that 76% of the players are black), which means what exactly…idiot

  162. Pete I Says:

    Well if Jameis is blackballed then he is blackballed.

    What do you suggest?

    Can Jameis prove it?


    File an appropriate lawsuit.


    Then it is irrelevant.

    Do you call for a boycott of the NFL? Does Jameis?

    Frankly the whole notion he is being blackballed is utter nonesense but even if he is then so be it.

  163. Bucsfanman Says:

    What’s abundantly clear to me is this “safer at home” thing is giving people waaaaaaaay too much time to try and “fill in the gaps”, so to speak.
    Lets try and reel this back in. Jameis is not unemployed because he is “black balled” nor because of some grand conspiracy by the NFL. Jameis simply cannot be trusted in the biggest moments, period. He got way more leeway than any other QB would have gotten and you know that this is true. Who’s going to pay this guy starting QB salary to turn the ball over at record rates? Nobody, because you can win with less talent AND less turnovers.
    I hope Jameis finds a home and succeeds(not against my Bucs, of course!). He has talent. He just needs to put it all together.

  164. Aceofaerospace Says:

    BigHog: you might want to review the definition of racism. Neither 93.75% of the owners being white nor 76% of the players being black is a definition of racism…idiot.

  165. BigHog Says:

    Aceofaerospace:: I know the definition and I’m sure you do to, 93.75% means that there is 2 teams in the NFL that have non/white ownership…that sir is a big ass picture of what racism can do and does …there should be at this very moment at least 10 other team owners that are non-white… at least 10 …people keep saying owners are not going to pay Mr 5,000 starter money to turn the ball over…I don’t see where they have offered him anything and if you say he is just not good enough…then who’s the idiot …BLACK BALLED is the appropriate term…this not because of his play but the NFL feels as tho he stained THE SHIELD, with that uber (hassle) …no proof, no charges, not found guilty in no one’s court of law …I rest my case…propaganda can now have the floor!!!

  166. Oneilbucs Says:

    Pete 1 again they never criticized Payton Manning . They blamed every body else but Payton Manning because of his daddy . So they gave him a chance . And again compare both teams and you will see why the Colts went to the playoffs . But no one wants to compare both teams because they know Payton had a better team overall than Jamies in their first 5 years . Facts……. and all they did is shorten up those routes and he threw a lot of quick slants and you know they ran the ball . And all of that is a proven fact regardless of the emotions that people have about Payton Manning ….

  167. Jmarkbuc Says:

    March 29th, 2020 at 3:49 pm
    You guys got nothing man. Just face it Jameis is getting screwed, there’s no two ways about it. Just admit it.



  168. Oneilbucs Says:

    We are in trouble with Brady and after Brady . Bruce Arians is not drafting a quarterback this year or as long he’s coaching the team .

  169. Oneilbucs Says:

    Jmarkbuc why do yall say Karma ?? That junk ain’t real . That’s what you call witchcraft . It’s fake lol lol ..

  170. Jmarkbuc Says:


    Assault a girl in college, hassle an Uber driver… throw thirty picks and say zi’m Ballin….Act like a Baptist televangelist in pressers.,,,


  171. BigHog Says:

    ^^^check your sheets…Payton did similar things….but the media didn’t POUND on it as munch!!

  172. jmarkbuc Says:

    What does Manning have to do with Winston?

    You are aware that JW is gone right?…just like a lot of other NFL players have come and more no less.

    The man was not a good QB…like Ryan Leaf or RGIII or countless others. Some have it some don’t.

    All the race baiting and crying over spilled milk isn’t gonna change JW’s employment status with the Bucs’.

    Posters here ( and we all know who you are) act like some lovesick teenager, over a guy who made enough money in his pathetic 5 yr career , to never have to work again.

    Times being what they are, your defense of 25 yr old who wasn’t all that great at his job is well..clueless.

  173. BigHog Says:

    jmarkbuc: people think differently…some for the way they were raised…some from the experiences gained through just living but this is as real as it gets (as long as there is Day and Night opinions will differ…you post yours and I will continue to post mine!!! Clueless not a chance in hell!!

  174. Jmarkbuc Says:


    Capital W to the E

  175. Ndog=complete idiot Says:

    Brady gonna be 2020 NFL MVP!!!!

  176. Aceofaerospace Says:

    Learn to pronounce
    prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one’s own race is superior.
    “a program to combat racism”

    BigHog. Name which owner believes his race is superior. You’re just a typical race-baiter. You dummy it down so much it makes people look away when real racism exists. Pathetic. Educate yourself before you throw out derogatory terms. You’re embarrassing.

  177. WestChap Says:

    Slow day on the sports front…

  178. T REX Says:


    In this thread…

    ndogcrap – 0

    Every one else posting – 177

    Dude…fade away. No cares loser. You lost. It’s over.

  179. BigHog Says:

    Aceofaerospace:: This league was started with 10 teams in 1920 and took on the name National Football League in 1922, so it’s been 100 years of a very much successful league, I know there may have been some dark times but it worked out beautifully and has grown to 32 teams and only 2 are non/white owned, Aceo-space you can but that into your definition of racism! Any owner that shared with his team that if they kneeled during the “police brutally” protest they pwould be punished had a race problem, from the White House players were called sons of bitches…with you Aceo-space racism could walk up and slap you in the face and you would probably just look away!! I’m not that person…I will call your a$$ out to the carpet!! If allowed!!