Disruption Vs. Production

March 20th, 2019

Rare talent or over-hyped?

If you are one of those folks who want to see a quarterback crumpled on the ground with defensive players doing choreographed dances around him, Rashan Gary may not be your kind of player.

If you are the type of fan who wants a defensive lineman to frustrate a quarterback and maybe force him to make bad throws, Rashan Gary may be your kind of player.

In a teleconference NFL Network talking head and former NFL scout Daniel Jeremiah had just before the reality TV show produced by the NFL Network live from Indianapolis, Jeremiah discussed the conundrum of Michigan defensive lineman Rashan Gary.

Gary has football guys who love measurables drooling. But on a schedule where he played against some of the biggest patsies in college football, Gary’s production is borderline embarrassing for someone supposedly as gifted as football folks want you to believe.

Jeremiah tried to tackle the riddle that is Gary. He basically said Gary’s talents are in the eyes of the beholder.

Rashan Gary to me is — he’s a little bit more athlete than football player at this point in time. You’ll see a rare, rare, rare combination of size and speed. Very explosive. The production doesn’t necessarily match the skill set. So that to me kind of going back through, watching more tape on all these guys, as you go through the process, I view him as a top-10 player. Wouldn’t shock me if he was the second pick in the draft because there’s tremendous upside with him from a skill set standpoint. I think the ceiling for him is like a Cam Jordan, who seemed to be one of the better defensive ends in the NFL. He was a big heavy end. I know some people say he should kick inside. I like him better on the edge. That’s where he fits for me. But kind of the — a lot of disruption, not a lot of production. That’s why he dropped a little bit on my list.

Gary may be all of that but gosh darn, you look at Michigan’s schedule last year and it makes you wince as if you are staring at the Bucs’ uniforms. And yet Gary had only 3.5 sacks all of last year. Joe just cannot get past that.

Gary had 1 1/2 sacks against Indiana and one each against Western Michigan and Nebraska. Against decent teams (Notre Dame, Penn State and Ohio State), Gary was a total no-show.

If Gary comes up with goose eggs against quality opponents in college, how are we to expect this will somehow improve if he’s playing the Saints, Stinking Panthers and Dixie Chicks twice a year?

In Joe’s eyes, pass on Gary, unless he freefalls to the second round.

36 Responses to “Disruption Vs. Production”

  1. josh Says:

    Over Hyped….no freaking way we draft him at 5

  2. 813bucboi Says:


    i agree…..

    imo, he’s a mid-low 1st round player…..

    hopefully gruden drafts him at 4 leaving QW on the board at 5…..


  3. Doctor_berto Says:

    God no! Not even with a trade back. Bust written all over him.

  4. bucsince79 aka bumaneer Says:

    No Way. Maybe we get lucky & 2 qb’s are drafted before us.

  5. Pickgrin Says:

    Who wants to spend their high first round pick on a “conundrum”?

    No Thanks!

  6. BetterBucFan Says:

    Like Ronald Jones. No production vs good teams in college and expected to perform at a high level in the NFL? Almost anyone looks good playing in the Pac-12…

  7. rrsrq Says:

    Joe Jackson from the U produced 9 sacks as a junior, he may be available in the 3rd, but unlikely

  8. Bucsdelight Says:

    It’s a No for me….

    Combine notes:


    -Freaky triangle of height, weight and speed
    -Active and strong with NFL size
    -Has all the tools to set a strong edge
    -Forceful into initial contact at point of attack
    -Good contact balance, thanks to sturdy base
    -Has disruptive qualities when he bends and plays low
    -Very good pursuit speed from backside and makes tackles down the field
    -Fires out of a track stance with energy and twitch
    -Can make conversion of speed-to-power look easy
    -Uses long-arm bull-rush to collapse the edge into quarterback
    -Strong enough to overtake tackles in late phase of the rush
    -Quick laterally and it shows up on twists


    -Production as rusher failed to match traits and talent
    -Rush plan is somewhat basic at this stage of development
    -Long-arm bull rush is his only real rush tool
    -Hands lack skill and have yet to be unlocked as rush weapon
    -Lacks classic hip bend to dip and run the arc
    -Runs himself around the pocket rather than working back under
    -Plays fast but with no regulator for control
    -Lacks instincts and awareness for misdirections and counters
    -Tends to lose pad level on inside counters
    -Doesn’t come to balance consistently as open-field tackler

  9. firethecannons Says:

    No–enough non production (Ronald Jones, Noah Spence, VH3)

  10. Bucsfanman Says:

    This is the year of the “edge rushers”. We’re paying a lot of attention to guys who, because of their position, we might otherwise ignore.
    There are at least 10 defensive linemen I would take before considering Gary. However, sometimes these overlooked guys pan out.
    I’m not even on the Montez bandwagon so Gary isn’t even a thought for me

  11. Tampabaybucfan Says:

    No thanks……we need an absolute winner with our #5 pick…..

    Bosa, Williams, Allen, White…….

    I really don’t think all 4 will be gone….I believe White will certainly be there at 5….the only question is: Will we have a choice?

    I am becoming more and more convinced (barring a trade down) that Devin White would be a solid pick.

    I know many don’t want a trade down because of what they believed happened last year…..but this year is different and BA/Bowles are in the driver’s seat.

  12. Jamaal Stanley Says:

    Tell y’all what y’all need to do. YouTube 2018 New York Jets defensive highlights. You’ll see 3 down linemen all thru out the video. Stop thinking 4/3 base people.

  13. Bucsdelight Says:

    There was an article by Scott Smith back in January that talked about our D. Talking about how we could run a 3-4 or a 4-3 or even both if we wanted to. Bucs use to be a 3-4 D then we switched to a 4-3. Bowles is has coached both a 3-4 and a 4-3, but could we have a hybrid?

  14. Jamaal Stanley Says:

    They already have the most valuable piece, they drafted him first last year. Vita Vea a passrushing nose tackle. Someone mentioned last week 93 and JPP will be the ends. Actually think 93 gone love it because he be facing less traffic each snap. Nas will be doing a lot of rushing from a two point stance next season. Something I think I saw him do in his Penn State videos.

  15. Jamaal Stanley Says:

    Possibly delight but I wouldn’t hold my breath in that hybrid talk man. Leopards don’t change there spots man. These nfl heads be locked into what they believe gives them the best chance. We saw that klueless.

  16. Jamaal Stanley Says:

    I honestly feel they feel they pretty much have what they need up front. It’s back end that seems to have them scouring the league.

  17. Jamaal Stanley Says:

    Again,YouTube 2018 Jets defense that’ll give you an idea what to expect.

  18. Joeypoppems Says:

    The top 10 talk is why he is overhyped.

    Brian Burns is the EDGE we should draft imo. I like him more than Josh Allen so to me he is worth a top 5 pick, but the reality is the Bucs can trade down and still land him. Sign me up for that all day.

    I cant believe Burns is somehow “under the radar” with his length, technique, and athleticism. Hopefully it works in the Bucs favor

  19. Hamilton Says:

    Everybody said the same thing about Derwin james

  20. Hamilton Says:

    Everybody said the same thing about Derwin james.

  21. straightcashhomey Says:

    @Joe sure sang a much different tune about Gary on here about 4-6 weeks ago, in retrospect, and for sure. No “ascribing motives” anywhere. Because it’s fact in retrospect, so it can’t be, by definition.

    But Rashan thought….he should…..start his own sports representation agency…BEFORE…playing a down in the NFL, yet. That….tells you all you need to know, about the worth of investing NFL dollars or draft picks, in this kid.

  22. Darin Says:

    I havnt watched him play much but the lack of production is scary. Even if it was a case like the bucs had last year, bad coaching and scheme. If he is a great athlete playing that schedule he still should fall into more sacks. Id pass but then again havnt watched him much. All i know is i dont know. He could end up a hof’er. Only if we pass on him lf course

  23. AfrikaThaRapper Says:

    Hell no. I’m a Michigan Wolverines fan and I never noticed this dude, even when I knew Tampa needed a pass rusher. Tired of mediocre talent on this team. Hoping and praying that we get Q. Williams. Go Bucs.

  24. What the buc Says:


  25. AlabamaBucsFan Says:

    You’ve got to be kidding? Bet he falls to the second round. No way this guy is a first rounder.

  26. Jamaal Stanley Says:

    Be so busy on the gig I sometimes don’t get a chance to give my two scents on a particular thread. But ooh I gotta give my opinion on yesterday’s the one wit Donovan and Ali on the picture. Donovan says something about needing to be held accountable to get the best out him in a nutshell. I said this a few years ago you’re gonna be hard press to get grown men to give it they’re all for someone they don’t view as a legitimate leader. Say what you want about them being well paid and how they are professional and should act according. Joe says they should motivate themselves. If that’s the case why coaches quote great leaders thru out history in the locker room. Why do they bring in seal teams to help wit trainingi.e the falcons last year in case you’re wondering. I don’t think he was alone in that sentiment and I honestly think he can play when motivated. He held his own against some top notch DEs his rookie season.

  27. Jimmy Says:

    Wanna know who is overhyped? Montez Sweat. Regardless of the heart condition.

  28. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    Arians hired two female coaches.

    One will serve as an assistant defensive line coach. The other will work as an assistant strength and conditioning coach.

  29. TDTB Says:

    I’m with Joeypoppems. Before the combine I was hoping the Bucs could trade down and grab White, but now I don’t see White lasting past the Lions or Bengals. The Bucs need so many players IMO. They “have” to trade down and sign an assload of rookies and cut/trade the fat off the roster by the end of preseason to get out of cap jail next year. Picking Burns in the middle of the first and adding an extra second rounder would be win to me. If the Bucs could trade down in the first twice and land a good OL and two second round picks it would be even better.

  30. catcard202 Says:

    Gary has 5* athletic traits, pretender tape & inflated ego.
    That dude has top10 BUST written all over him.

    He’s the kinda guy that folds, when faced with adversity…Takes plays off…Gives 80% effort – held in check by lesser players & just goes hard in spurts.

    In the league, that guy washes out. That’s why NFL teams only bat ~60% on 1st rnd picks. Talent is enticing. Too many think they can coach them up or get them to walk straight-n-narrow…But by this point, it’s baked in the cake already.

    No Thanks! Leave him out there for the NYG @ #6 & see how that works out for Gettleman.

  31. Buccaneerscotty Says:

    Pass! I don’t care what Joe or anyone else thinks if one of the top 3 picks is not there I want Devin White period ! Yes at #5 don’t bother to trade back because we will only screw up the extra pics anyway

  32. Bucs Guy Says:

    Gholston 2.0 with Rojo numbers, good against the little schools, disappears against the best teams

  33. Jean Lafitte Says:

    yeah it seems everybody has sort of soured on Gary. Funny how group think is so prevalent in broadcasting. It’s like one morning they all wake up with a memo on the phone saying Rashan Gary is an illusion and his draft status is inflated and then within a couple hours of the new day it seems that everyone in the know agree in lockstep and barrel that Gary is an impostor. Then of course the minions take this bit of group think information and conclude the same thing and make comments about Gary in many social media outlets exclaiming exactly what they have heard and how they are in the know. So darn comical.

  34. Rod Munch Says:

    Vita averaged 3.5 sacks a year in college…

  35. catcard202 Says:

    Vea is a 350LB run stuffing NG…3.5 sacks from a NG is good.
    Gary is a DE/Edge rusher…3.5 sacks from your primary rusher is not good. (Especially when that Edge rusher has top5 talent & athletic traits.)

  36. SB Says:

    Hard Pass!!