Buckner Pumped To Coach 4-3 Defense; Wants “Rabid Dogs”

February 21st, 2018

“Call it whatever you want. Just do your damn job and stop making me look bad.”

Lots of chatter has been circulating about how the signing of new defensive line coach Brentson Buckner, introduced to local media today, might mean the Bucs are preparing to transition to a 3-4 defense.

Don’t bet on it.

Buckner talked today about he’s fired up to be in a 4-3 system, Mike Smith’s system. Buckner spent the past five years as the Arizona defensive line coach, where he was primarily in a 3-4 alignment.

The former Panthers defensive tackle/end, who played in a 4-3 during his career, is pumped to get back to “four true down linemen,” he said.

“My experience in Arizona, you know a lot of teams kept us in nickel personnel, which really put us into four down linemen. It’s actually great for me,” Buckner explained. “I had some great training at that. I get to keep those four guys on the field. Techniques are the same. You want four guys that’s going to get it, you know, being physical, being rabid dogs out there. And now getting to coach those guys, four guys, all the time, rather than a linebacker coming in and out, it’s going to be great.”

Sure, the Bucs will run 3-4 looks again, maybe even more than last year if Noah Spence gets healthy and the Bucs pick up a beast or two in the draft and in free agency.

But Mike Smith believes in his defense, and the regime believes in him, despite owning the 32nd-ranked defense last year. Not a lot is going to change scheme-wise outside of the names on the jerseys.

75 Responses to “Buckner Pumped To Coach 4-3 Defense; Wants “Rabid Dogs””

  1. DB55 Says:

    being physical, being rabid dogs out there.
    This I have to see. Lmao. McDonald Ayer Gholston Spence sure but what about the rest? Ain’t no other dogs here. If Buckner isn’t careful Netflix is going to give him 20mil for his own stand-up show.

  2. Lord Cornelius Says:

    It’s not the scheme imo. It’s soft coverage + no pass rush + not putting people in the best positions.

    You can still play soft off-coverage in a 3-4 and you can still have a sh1t pass rush in a 3-4.

    Also I’m not sold on the idea that Kwon or Lavonte would even be decent 3-4 OLBs. They aren’t pass rushers. Most their sack stats came on blitzes where they were well timed and didn’t have to make a move on an OT or anything. It’s not like Lavonte or Kwon are bending around the edge Von Miller style on a blitz lol.

    Small speedy LBs fit 4-3 schemes moreso than 3-4 which requires bigger OLB that can take on blocks and have pass rushing skills

  3. DB55 Says:


    Beckwith isn’t a terrible pass rusher. Seen get get past a tackle or two. Maybe with some coaching, idk.

  4. Pickgrin Says:

    I liked his line about – “and if the 1st guy’s not getting it done – then the next guy is coming in right behind you…”

  5. Bird Says:

    Have you seen the Noah Spence recent workout pic.

    The dude’s shoulders look inhuman /unnatural.


    Hope that is just from a lot of protein shakes?

  6. Bird Says:

    Did you ever see the Laron Landry pic from the side showing off his arm/shoulder It’s the size of some people’s waist.

    And he was holding a jug of Protein powder to make you think …yah you can look like this naturally with some good hard work and plenty of protein?

    I wish I could find that pic. ( he later was busted and admitted to steroid use several times ).

  7. Dewey Selmon Says:

    Is there anyone from the Cards that could potentially follow Buckner to Tampa?

  8. Lord Cornelius Says:

    @DB55 Yeah I’d think Beckwith could pull it off actually as either an OLB/ILB in a 3-4.

    I guess my main point is I don’t think our 4-3 undersized speedy LBs would fit well as 3-4 pass rushing OLBs. Then again we might as try anything at this point lol I am not a big expert on defensive alignments honestly

  9. Capt.Tim Says:

    A primarily 3-4 coach, to coach a 4-3.
    Just saying

    “ But Mike Smith believes in his defense, and the Regime believes in him, despite owning the 32nd ranked defense last year!”

    Un-Fu*king -believable

    If you want to know why crappy team are always crappy? That paragraph says it all.
    If the Bucs really cared about winning- they would have canned Smith as soon as the last game was finished.
    They dont.

    Einstein said that” the definition of insanity, is to repeat the same action, and expect a different reaction.”

    Ladies and Gentlemen- presenting your last place 2018-2019 Buccaneers!!

  10. DB55 Says:


    You right about LVD and especially kwon.

  11. bucs_365 Says:

    ^^ Way to stay positive…

  12. DB55 Says:

    Yo so I know you guys think I’m just a troll which is cool but let me point to why.

    We have Buckner talking about vicious, tough players on the Dline and no more than 20 minutes after the pc ends you have the Bucs own Ryan Russell venting his “feelings” on Twitter. So like I said this dude Buckner is not only hilarious but may be walking into a straight up set-up.

    Ryan Russell tweets:
    No one knows the ins and outs of what we’ve been through, the injuries we’ve played with, and the internal struggles that plagued us. If you weren’t in our locker room you don’t really know. A lot goes into a team becoming a family, and even more into becoming champions.

    Oh boo fckn hoo bro. You have got to be kidding. 11 plus years with no playoffs frankly I could give two chits what you’ve been through. Cry my a fckn river son.


  13. JimmyJack Says:

    I thought the key to switching to 3-4 was keeping Baker to play NT. At least now sensible fans can put the 3-4 talk to bed.

    But I don’t get what he’s saying about rabid dogs. Shouldn’t that be the goal on any DL. Maybe it’s not maybe some coaches don’t preach that…..If that’s the case I’ll welcome that attitude as that’s the way it should be.

    But I’m not sold any coach can make that happen without the right group of players. If these guys don’t push each other they will stay soft on gameday. We all know GMC is not the guy we need leading us, it’s up to Licht to find us somebody who will……….Time for Licht to go all in. Make a big player trade. Bring in Bennett or trade up for Chubb. Figure out whose capable of coming in here and gettin* this line to play a team a high level and do what’s needed.

  14. The Buc Realist Says:

    @Capt Tim

    Insanity is wanting loser lovie for a third year!!!!!! Not a defense that was effected by injuries for 1 bad year!!!!! if it happens after the 2018 season then it is repeating!!!!!!

    And with all that, Coach Smitty still keep the points down!!!!! And that is what is important!!!!!!! Its called a Scoreboard not a yardboard!!!!!!!!!

    GO Bucs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  15. BucEmUp Says:

    I will bet anyone 1000 dollars that if the entire secondary continues to play 12 yards away from the line of scrimmages they will be last in the league again

  16. Not there yet Says:

    Everyone gets the ball out quick if you have a fearsome pass rush, even if what he says is true it won’t help them if your corners are playing soft zone all over the field. Your corners should have the same mentality or they’ll still get eaten alive. Tied for 4th in strength of schedule

  17. JimmyJack Says:

    DB55…….Guess what man. Those are just words. I don’t even know why you care. All that matters is how much the guys we do have on that line are going to step up.

    Russell is a good guy to start with for me. He’s a basic nobody whose worked his way up onto an NFL roster. He didn’t look so bad finishing out last year and if he keeps busting his ass I expect him to earn some snaps next year. Guys like Russell is how you TrueLy build a line. Gotta have guys like him hungry to play and pushing those in front.

    But the example has to start from the top and that’s what we are missing. I appreciate GMC bring his family feel-good mentality cause that’s nice but when these guys hit the field the family nonsense gets you pushed around. We need a field general and we need one one the line IMO. Need more then just Kwon on that side of the ball.

    It might be a blessing in disguise that our GM is on the hot seat so long and he knows that line needs a attitude. He’s shown that he’s got some guts with decisions he’s made and now he’s gotta gear that towards fixing the Dline. You get the right guy on this Dline that’s gonna get these guys playing a little bit pissed off and it could make a big impact.

    If we don’t make a big move on our Dline I’m going to be pretty disappointed.

  18. USFBUC Says:

    The Bucs can be fixed too easy….


    Trade DJax and trade/cut Sweezy, gets us to $86.4m in cap space and hopefully nets us a pair of picks, optimistically a 3rd and 5th rounder.

    Throw $12m a year at Norwell and Sitton. After looking at PFF they actually graded Marpet as the 7th best Center which is better than Jensen so I am sticking with Marpet at C. With those two the line is pretty well set and we are now at $62.4m in cap space.


    Trade/cut Ayers and Gholston. Re-sign MacDonald @ $4m a year. We are now sitting at $70.8m in cap space. Move Spence to OLB to be the heir behind David.

    Find out what it would cost to trade for Marcus Peters, if it’s not crazy, he is willing to sign an extension, and doesn’t impact us this year then make the move (like a 3rd this year and a 1st next year). That would take us to $67.9m in cap space.

    Then go sign Richardson and Wilkerson so they can play together again. We can probably have them for $12m per year. So we are down to $43.9m in cap space. At the other CB position we can re-sign Grimes or go big money and get a guy like Trumaine Johnson and still be at like $30m in cap space.

    In the draft I am going best defensive player available at 7 unless we can trade back and still land that same player. Second round I’m still going defense. Then in the third round I am taking two RBs or a RB and a T. After that it’s more RB, OL, WR, CB.

    Let the Glazers know you have a GM in waiting here on your site Joes.

  19. USFBUC Says:

    Oh and I would bring all these FAs in at the same time so they know what’s up and that we are really trying to build a winning team.

  20. USFBUC Says:

    Also forgot but if we could get a few of the FAs to take a little less and GMC too I would snatch up Bennett if he gets released. He still has some gas in the tank.

  21. JimmyJack Says:

    And all of this glosses over the fact that this team was built to win with offense and pretty much sucks…….Like realist points out it’s the points that matter and this offense didn’t live up to any of our expectations.

    Maybe, just maybe if the offense gets their jobs done it lights a fire under the D. Also, maybe the D wouldn’t be sucking wind every fourth quater.

    What the eff are you doing Dirk? You had lots of pieces to start with when we hired you. We gave you lots more pieces last year and you offense still blows?? Absolute prove it year for this guy if ya ask me.

  22. RawBucFan Says:

    I would love to be able to trade down with Buffalo for #21 & #22 in an effort to get both Vea & Key. We can even trade back up to get Vea. Key should be there at 21. Young rabid dogs & a DL coach who wants them to get after it. Let’s hope Mike Smith will allow them to be aggressive & compete.

  23. SB Says:

    I like the way USFBUC thinks.

  24. Defense Rules Says:

    Maybe I’m missing something here. I was under the impression that Jay Hayes was also a fireball when he first came here. Great resume, etc. I’m sure that Hayes would’ve loved to have a ‘rabid dog’ DLine. Something obviously went wrong on the way to the Coliseum.

    I’m sure that some remember the LA Rams “Fearsome Foursome” in the 1960s, certainly the most dominant defensive line of their era and maybe of all time. Lamar Lundy, Merlin Olsen, Deacon Jones & Rosey Grier (replaced by the great Roger Brown in 1967) were the original ‘rabid dogs’. Would love to see our Bucs DLine receive that type of notoriety, but they’d have to win a TON of games before anyone will crown them ‘The Fearsome Foursome II’.

  25. DB55 Says:

    Question why do people want Vea when there are two beastly DL from Alabama available in the draft?

  26. Destinjohnny Says:

    Poor guy

  27. Pryda ...sec147 Says:

    I’m optimistic everything can change with this team we can be a winning city in no time.

  28. tmaxcon Says:

    Pryda …sec147

    please seek medical attention fast. your ARE clearly ill if you think this pathetic franchise will ever win consistently…. BUCS never have won consistently in history and NEVER WILL

  29. tmaxcon Says:

    cancer93 will run off buckner just like he has every other coach in his failed career

  30. El_Buc941 Says:

    Joe the only thing I’m concerned about is getting actual help for G.McCoy.legit pass rusher that down after down are howlng and breathing down the necks of QBs and relieves pressure off of McCoy and gets him one on ones where he can wreak havoc.

    Also DT Dontari Poe is set to be a free agent as well.i wouldn’t mind bringing him in if we can’t get Suh or Bennett and I’m sure he won’t come pricey either.

  31. tmaxcon Says:


    mcoy is not a legit pass rusher or football player he is a doll playing fraud that is a career loser.

  32. Buccaneer scotty Says:

    Tmaxcon you are a pathetic trolling ass clown! That Joe needs to band from this site immediately! Supposed to be JoeBucsFan and you’re no fan you’re a dumbass

  33. tmaxcon Says:

    Buccaneer scotty

    coming from a low standard clown I appreciate the compliments. I am a fan of winning not of feel good stories or the losers you choose to support.

  34. tmaxcon Says:

    db55 durbon poison and Grape Ape in your honor tonight… 27.8 and 26.5% peace my man.

  35. Tampabaybucfan Says:

    All we need to do to fix the D is to get rid os GMC..,,and doing that will also end school violence and the opioid crisis.
    The world according to Tmaxcon

  36. SB Says:

    I Totally agree with you Scotty. Joe has banned people for less than the constant drivel that Tmax presents. I think Joe keeps him around because he generates clicks.

  37. JimmyJack Says:

    It is pathetic isn’t it Scotty. Any fan who knows a lick about football knew McCoy was no leader years and years ago.

    This guy comes on the site a half decade too late telling us stuff we’ve already forgotten about. Acts like he’s smarter then everybody when most either just laugh at him or choose to scroll right by his outdated points.

    But don’t call for him to be banned. Tmax actually has use I’ve found. If your having a crummy day or nursing a hangover just give him a piece of your mind to blow off some steam.

    He is Tampa Bays official punching bag.

  38. tmaxcon Says:



  39. tmaxcon Says:


    I don’t act like I am smarter than everybody…. I AM SMARTER THAN EVERYBODY!

  40. SCBucsFan Says:

    Tmax you are to this blog what you think McCoy is to this team.

    If you need help understanding that I can expand.

  41. LakeLand Says:

    Brentson Buckner is the Bucs 7th D-Line in the last 10 years. I wouldn’t get too hype over this hire.

  42. LakeLand Says:

    7th D-Line coach

  43. tmaxcon Says:


    You could learn a lot from me sir. I have not been wrong on a single player. NOTHING i have posted is inaccurate or not factual…. you delusional optimists need to accept that the team we love has NO hope and NO future until the ownership group starts demanding excellence…. 6 playoff wins in 42 years is freaking pathetic yet you low standard fools call the ignorant 1 dimensional tony dungy’s 2 playoff wins in 6 years glory years. you fools with such low standards are the jokes not someone who only accepts winning.

  44. LakeLand Says:

    I’m not saying that the 6 D-Line coaches before Buckner wasn’t good coaches. I’m saying that the Bucs has lack talent on the D-Line. And I don’t see talent on the D-line now.

  45. tmaxcon Says:


    the reality that people refuse to accept is the fact that every free agent and coach that has came to Tampa in the last decade plus has regressed and failed. that is not negativity that is reality. you can’t fix a problem until you accept what you have been doing for over a decade is wrong.

  46. SCBucsFan Says:

    So you want me to expand?

  47. JimmyJack Says:

    Buc941 I agree with you but I think it’s going to take more then just talent. We need somebody in here that’s going to bring an attitude and an edge. The mental approach of this line is weak at best…….Now maybe you can find 2-3 guys that can bring enough talent to make up for that but that’s a long shot at best.

    We need a general on this line that’s going to demand more intensity. You aren’t finding that in free agency. I’m calling for a player trade or trade up for Chubb. Some way some how they need to find a cure to the weak mental approach.

  48. Issic Haggins Says:

    Let’s get one thing clear, NSpence is not a linebacker and really isn’t that fast. He is an undersized d end with fantastic hands and body control , has decent quickness but isn’t fast enough to fly around most tackles. He is far to slow to play linebacker and gets eaten alive once he gets pushed backwards, can he play some linebacker in rush situations, sure he can but he really isn’t the guy you want taking on o linemen flat footed , that’s not his game , his skill is rushing / moving forward not shedding blocks a few yards down field in traffic.

    Spence can be very effective on passing downs , great arsenal of moves and great body control………… haven’t seen him play the run worth a darn and at times he has been a liability getting locked up and dominated!!

  49. JimmyJack Says:

    Whatever tmax…..you done now? Your a waste of space with your unwante$ irrevelant posts

  50. tmaxcon Says:


    i clearly understand you are the one that needs facts expanded on. there is no denying all the flat performances and quitting on coaches. that can not be denied and if that is the type of player / captian you want on your team you deserve to love the basement dwelling bucs. Winning is all that matters you win or you fail everything else is BS and all cancer93 as done is lose, make excuses and run coaches out of town. those are undisputed facts that do not fit your feel good agenda for that I am truly sorry…. no buc captain in history has captained as many flat uninspired performances as the cryin clown cancer93

  51. tmaxcon Says:


    tell mommy its time for you meds and bedtime… night night

  52. JimmyJack Says:

    Issac…..as the article said they are gonna use a 4-3.

    I did want the 3-4 but it’s a mute point now……..people will still cry for use to go 3-4 and we will never stop them.

    I guess just let them waste their time.

  53. Lamarcus Says:

    Man. Y’all leave tmaxcon alone.

  54. JimmyJack Says:

    Tmax…..Jeez my bad man. When I called your posts irrevelant I didn’t realize you were about to tell me about my mommy and my bedtime.

    Next time I’ll give you more time to make good points before I call them irrevelant.

    I’m sorry and please forgive me.

  55. SCBucsFan Says:

    Cmon t work on your punctuation and capitalization.

  56. JimmyJack Says:

    You’re right Lamarcus……I’ll just let tmax get his last word and allow him to move onto namecalling other posters. I know that’s his thang

  57. Phillip Says:

    I very rarely scroll down to the comments section but when I do I get a great laugh from reading a few in here.. Why on earth some of y’all even respond to the trolls is beyond me lol

    Anyway.. Whoever said Spence is the heir to LVD you gotta be on something.. Dude is in the mold of an OLB similar to Clowney or Peppers in GB (DE who is standing up in a 34 D and primary job is to rush the passer).

    We also might have a TON of cash under the cap but we also got ME13, Marpet, Kwon, and possibly the QB(fix that horrible knack to turn the ball over and the off the field nonsense) to extend for some major cash in the next 2 years. I wouldn’t get your hopes up for multiple big name FA’s unless we are letting atleast one of the others go. Which seeing as it’s FA and we are the Bucs we are gonna have to overspend to get someone who can make a difference

  58. Phillip Says:

    Also I find myself wondering why I even bother commenting as every one of my comments awaits moderation with no cursing in it but you got kids on here trolling and cursing in their messages.. sigh

  59. LakeLand Says:

    The Bucs has hired Stephen Nicholas as Defensive Quality Control Coach, that might be a good hire.

  60. USFBUC Says:

    Thank you SB!

  61. Oxycondoms Says:

    Things guy can make a name for himself helping turn this pos defense around

  62. ManzielMadness Says:

    Wouldn’t say Spence is too slow to play as a 3-4 OLB. He’s run just as fast (if not faster) than guys like Tamba Hali, Elvis Dumervil, Chandler Jones… Not saying he’d be a stud there (he’s never played OLB in college to my knowledge), there’d definitely be a transition phase but I wouldn’t knock him for speed alone.

  63. Lamarcus Says:

    Spence happens to be too small make a consistent impact in 4-3 DE. He tries. Not a knock on him. I see him as more of a wide 9 guy.

  64. Kord Says:

    Glad he is here, has his work cut out for him for sure

  65. Mike Johnson Says:

    I thought it was the DC’s job to bring attitude and plan to the defense? poor Koettter..trying his best to surround a has been with pesonnel who can do his (DC) job. Mike Smith should have been gone months ago. What a pityful franchise.

  66. USFBUC Says:

    @Phillip – I would love to see us move to a 34 but it is clear that isn’t happening and rather than trashing Spence’s shoulder some more the next best thing would be to transition him to another position. Size wise he is a LB and part of the reason he fits into that 34 mold you referenced. But you are right I must be on something wanting to salvage the career of a talented player…

    Anyhow the salary cap that I laid out gives us room to handle MEs new contract, Marpet is also handled easily, not sure what a MLB makes but it might be able to cover his increased salary as well. That just leaves Winston and while that is a big chunk the Bucs can get creative.

    First we are constantly drafting new players and hopefully one hits and can replace the higher priced FAs I put forward in my earlier post. Second, remember that what we don’t spend this year can be carried over to the next season. I don’t know if there is a cap on roll over money but in my scenario after signing picks the Bucs might roll like $20m to next year’s cap. They can pay out a huge bonus with that money to give a guy like Winston more guaranteed money via a chunk bonus and a lower salary to reduce the long term cap hit. Third, the way the Bucs structure contracts is very smart and allows them to jump out of deals quickly to make room.

  67. LakeLand Says:

    Mike Evans, Donovan Smith, Kwon Alexander, Ali Marpet, Jameis Winston, Cam Brate, Adam Humphries may cost the Bucs up to $90 million.

  68. LakeLand Says:

    Subtract Hump, it still may be close to $90 million

  69. catcard202 Says:

    Would love to see Bucs swing a trade with AZ for Robert Nkemdiche & Buffalo for Shaq Lawson…Think a change of scenery would work for both those guys & they could elevate their games in Smith’s scheme.

  70. Phillip Says:

    If you mean a 34 olb I’m fine with it.. If it’s a 43 olb and you expect him to drop back into coverage then no that’s ludicrous.. The kid is a talented no doubt but he isn’t talented enough to play a legit sideline to sideline olb

    Inflation when it comes to these QB’s and every position now tbh.. So if you don’t think Jameis is gonna try and get 25 million a year MINIMUM then you are dreaming.. Just like ME13 is gonna break the WR record for guaranteed money. The agents see dollar signs flowing for a kid who played what 10 games in his career and become the highest paid QB in the league(could be wrong the amount of games just trying to remember off the top of my head) and while he looks as legit as they come.. He still isn’t worth the highest paid QB

  71. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    Buccaneer Bonzai Says:
    February 21st, 2018 at 8:46 am

    “We won’t be switching to 34.”


    Told ya. The entire defense is built for 4-3. No way do they change everything to suit one defensive line coach.

    And the 4-3 works just as well. Better, when done right.

  72. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    The man is saying what we all know. The DLine needs some nastiness. Some swagger. It needs to instill fear into offensive lines.

    That’s what good defensive lines do.

  73. The Buc Realist Says:

    @Buc Bonzai

    I have been one for the switch to a 3 4 front, as I think the same number of guys that need to be drafted and signed in free-agency would be the same, but just easier to find!!!!!!! And I hope that the 4-3 front is more because of the number of nickle they run against the division, then just trying to quickly patch up the defense for 1 year!!!!!!!! This is the danger of a “make or brake” year, is that you only think of this year, instead of building somthing good for years to come!!!! Case in point is that this is GMC’s 9th year, Which compared to Sapp was his last year in Tampa with his worst production since his rookie year!!!!!!

    By trading GMC would could have
    1st Mount Vea
    2nd Harold Landry
    2nd Best running back
    high 3rd/low 2nd Guard

    and really give this team something for years!!!!!!!!

    Go Bucs!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  74. Brandon Says:

    Lord Cornelius Says:
    February 21st, 2018 at 5:49 pm
    It’s not the scheme imo. It’s soft coverage + no pass rush + not putting people in the best positions.

    You can still play soft off-coverage in a 3-4 and you can still have a sh1t pass rush in a 3-4.

    Also I’m not sold on the idea that Kwon or Lavonte would even be decent 3-4 OLBs. They aren’t pass rushers. Most their sack stats came on blitzes where they were well timed and didn’t have to make a move on an OT or anything. It’s not like Lavonte or Kwon are bending around the edge Von Miller style on a blitz lol.

    Small speedy LBs fit 4-3 schemes moreso than 3-4 which requires bigger OLB that can take on blocks and have pass rushing skills


    Hey, listen to this guy… he’s not a moron. You can’t just switch to a 3-4 and THINK all the problems will be solved with players already on the roster. Kwon and David are pure 4-3 run around type LBs… they don’t excel on taking on blocks (like 3-4 ILBs do) nor bending the edge and rushing with speed AND power (like 3-4 OLBs do). It isn’t that easy. Sure McCoy MIGHT make a decent 3-4 DE… and then what? No 3-4 NT on the roster, no other 3-4 DE on the roster (maybe Ayers or Gholston) and no true 3-4 OLBs on the roster (Spence can”t be counted on nor can Beckwith-he’s always been a 4-3 ILB). We’re talking about finding five guys to fill out our front SEVEn (McCoy and Beckwith-who would be good at ILB).

  75. Capt.Tim Says:

    Watch Noah Spence’s college tape. He played Lber almost as often as DE.
    And yeah, he dropped back in coverage.

    But that was college. He last some weight last year, he might be able to do it in the NFL.
    But this team doesn’t need a LB. about the only strong position on the team!

    Sooo, why did they draft Spence, who was to small already, and then tell him to lose weight?