“It’s An Institutional Problem”

November 8th, 2017

Former Super Bowl winning coach Brian Billick. defensive coordinator Mike Smith’s brother-in-law, talks Bucs brass.

Well, here’s some intrigue, a call for Team Glazer to empower its head coach ASAP.

One of the more astute and interesting minds in pro football is retired Ravens head coach Brian Billick, who happens to be Bucs defensive coordinator Mike Smith’s brother-in-law. Smith worked under him for four seasons in Baltimore.

Billick does a lot of national radio interviews and he was hit with questions about the Bucs’ implosion on The Rich Eisen Show this week.

Billick said “it’s an institutional problem” when an organization doesn’t stand up and publicly back its head coach. A move like that now, Billick said, would empower Dirk Koetter or any struggling head coach to command full control of his team and grab players’ full attention for a potential turnaround.

‘That coach has gotta, you know, jump on it right away and some with more strength than others,” Billick explained. “It’s an institutional problem. The institution can drop in and say, ‘Look, this guy’s not going anywhere.’ That gives the coach latitude to say, ‘Look guys, one thing I do know, I’m going to be here next year. So the questions is, are you? And you’ve got to show me over the next eight weeks why I should keep you on this team.’

“Now if the coach doesn’t have that strength, now you’re getting into it; you’re getting into a tough dynamic.”

Great take by Billick. Team Glazer could easily step up and back Koetter’s job security today, which would stabilize the team (though not the general manager). It would give Koetter firm legs to stand on in the locker room, where players have to be wondering whether Koetter will be out of a job in eight weeks.

Of course, there’s the flip side. Why would Team Glazer make a bold showing of support for Koetter when his team has been embarrassed in four of eight games this season? They probably want to see the bleeding stop before considering that kind of stand.

In the meantime, players have to be wondering about Koetter’s job security. As Eisen said in his lead-up question to Billick, ownership in Tampa has shown “an itchy trigger finger” with head coaches.

58 Responses to ““It’s An Institutional Problem””

  1. tmaxcon Says:

    Should not surprise anyone…. quiting on coaches is the signature of all GMC captained teams. history proves it and organization obviously approves.

    Now we get all the posters living in the past that start dropping names of unqualified has been players and coaches who underachieved or down right failed in the case of dungy… thats what bucs need previously failed retreads and unqualified popular has beens to save they day…

  2. darin Says:

    His comments would be greeat if dirk wasnt the main problem. Whats dirk gona step in and say to the guys? As weve seen he doesnt even pay attention to whats going on. He could have stepped in the middle of jameis and evans little immaturity fit, but he was in lala land. The coaches are the main problem. I wish they werent but they are. Anyone doesnt believe it go back and watch the arz game again. Youll see a coach who quit in the 1st half, then when his players almost won in spite of him he sabotaged them. Worst coached game ive ever seen. Also the same time the players started to quit. Dirks gota go. Not a head coach

  3. ChanEpic Says:

    I agree with the Joe(s) on the point that there is too little of a positive track record that demands that the Glazers back Koetter because if they do go out on that limb and next year is the same OR WORSE than this year then Koetter will lose ANOTHER year’s team in less than 3 weeks into the 2018 season. My gut is that the silence is deafening and Koetter and Smith are not long for Tampa bay. Maybe even Licht.

  4. StPeteBucsFan Says:

    We can all debate how we feel about Coach K. But one thing is certain…it the Glazers fire him this year it will be more about the Glazers than Koetter.

    The Glazers are the ones who made all these coaching decisions. IMHO Koetter has been there best choice but I get the dissension with our current record and struggling QB.

    Knee jerk responses….responses made during desperate times..rarely turn out well. Virtually all of the Glazers coaching responses have been knee jerk and desperate and it’s shown up in the record.

    I actually like the Glazers but the “Bucs” stop at their desk. They have NO success to show for their last ten years with plenty of failure.

    If we gotta talk about firing let’s begin with the Glazers!!!!

    BTW I agree 100% with Billick. The Glazers should call a press conference and state they are behind coach K. That’s the public persona. Behind the scenes they call in #3 and hit him with some tough love. They bring in Koetter and explain what they are looking for and that Coach K is in charge not #3.

    I love #3. But he clearly has some issues which IMHO are largely from immaturity and “could” be cleared up if #3 is able to grow. But for those who believe #3 is untouchable remember he’s still on his rookie contract which basically makes next year #3’s contract year. The Glazers are well aware of this. They are paying him 5 million a year now…after next year they’ll have a SERIOUS decision to make.

    Do they pay #3 the going rate of roughly 25 million a year…5X his current salary in 2019….do they give him five years of that like Stafford?

    It seems to me they have an obvious choice. Keep Koetter and #3 and point out the obvious to both of them. 2018 is a contract year for both!!!!

  5. Mike Says:

    What if ownership thinks the head coach is not up to the job, and is already looking at a new head coach next year?

  6. DB55 Says:

    Sounds like he’s talking about Schiano. Sad part is he’s talking about ALL of the former coaches. The major problem is that GMC is the only person who has the latitude to say, ‘Look guys, one thing I do know, I’m going to be here next year.

    Lol, sad but true.

  7. Lakeland Says:

    The Glazers has done this to every head coach since Jon Gruden.

  8. Destinjohnny Says:

    Dirk will never be confused with parcels
    But if u give him a player that is capable of getting say 4 sacks in a season….
    Or lineman that can stop the run…
    Or more then one corner. How about a safety that is at least average?
    He will win some games
    I can coach bamas talent

  9. ChanEpic Says:

    Malcolm Butler, CB, New England Patriots
    Ezekiel Ansah, DE, Detroit Lions

    LICHT better bring these in here in 2018 or….

  10. DB55 Says:

    If we gotta talk about firing let’s begin with the Glazers!!!!
    Amen! I hear diddy and Jay looking to buy up sports teams. That would be so dope. The Bucs or probably The Sharks would be soooooooo dope.

    Erase the entire history of this pathetic franchise and replace it altogether. Black is the new orange. Trademark 2017. ML.

  11. SB Says:

    Bill Cowher quit coaching to spend more time with his kids. Kids are grown now. Just a thought

  12. Blake_Bucsfan Says:

    Absolutely no merit based reason to back Koetter at this point when all signs point to him being ill-suited in the role of Head Coach.

    He is a Norv Turner/ Wade Phillips type of guy. Really good as a Coordinator, but a below-average HC.

  13. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    Brian Billick nailed it.

    If I were the owner of this team, I would extend Licht right away. Make it clear that he is going to remain the GM.

    Dirk Koetter has a 5 year contract, so no point in extending him yet. However, the Glazers should come out and back him to make it clear to the fans and the players that he will remain the head coach.

    They do that, and Koetter has the power to do what Brian Billick said.

    I agree with him 1000%!

  14. Lamarcus Says:


    Lol it funny how this pattern of this mess of players quitting every other year and coach. Gmc and his band of rejects on that defense needs to go. I like Justin Evans, lvd, kwon, vh3, McDonald but the rest is TOAST

  15. tnew Says:

    The big mistake the Glazers made was not learning about the Mike Tomlin mistake. They were so distressed over missing on Mike Tomlin, they hired Raheem Morris, solely because they feared another team hiring him as a head coach. Raheem really needed a year or two as a DC. Same thing with Koetter, he was hired not because that he really needed to be the head coach, but they feared someone else would hire him.

    Joe had it right too on the DC. He was all in for Schwarz. I like Mike Smith, really do. I think he has great philosophies. However, the game and the players appear to really have passed him by.

    This is a top down failure.

  16. Mike Johnson Says:

    Outstanding comments and observation by NFL former coach Billick. The Glazers are not going to tell Koetter he has full control or that he’s definitely going to be around next season. Because..he’s Not!! IF..IF Koetter can turn this losing around and come up with say 6 wins? He might save his job. But that ain’t happening. The Players are gonna now play NOT..to get hurt. And the Glazers KNOW Koetter cannot turn it around this year. Trust me, they’ve already started their search. I would’nt be surprised if Gruden and Dungy have not already been consulted by the Glaziers. Koetter will be Ok. He and Smitty will land into a nice little Division 2 College coaching job. Just watch the Jets come in here and become…King Kongs.

  17. Lakeland Says:

    The Bottom Line, no one want to come to Tampa
    Unless they come here for the FREE million dollar vacation

    LakelandBuc Says:
    June 12th, 2015 at 8:49 pm

    I have a question for the Lovie haters, Do you all actually think that the Bucs Head Coach job is a hot job? No one want’s to coach the Bucs especially after they fired John Gruden. They had no choice but to hire Lovie( he was their most qualified candiate) it’s not like coaches are waiting in line to coach the Bucs. Raheem Morris and Greg Schiano was coaches that the Bucs had to settle for after the coaches of their choice turned them down. You all have to get it in your thick skulls that the BUCS have destroyed head coaches careers. Go back and look at Sam Wyche, Ray Perkins, Tony Dungy,John Gruden, Raheem Morris, Greg Schiano. Only Dungy has been a Head Coach after leaving the Bucs, Gruden has had offers but he love the booth(less pressure and stress). Get off Lovie and just be thankful that someone actually wanted the Bucs job. These are the Bucs, but you guys are going on like we are the Pittsburgh Steelers. SMH. You guys are always complaining about the free agents we bring here, HELLO no one want’s to play here, Jason and Lovie are doing the best they can to get players here, and you all was all on Marcus Mariota jockstrap, Mariota never wanted to play for the Bucs. We need players who want to be a BUC!

    Deja Vu
    Now it’s Dirk Koetter
    Who will be the next victim

  18. Conte Piscateli Says:

    I hate the Steelers, but I credit their ownership as the best this league has ever seen. That organization hasn’t had many coaches through is history, usually coaches retire from the Steelers, I can’t remember one being fired. They do their homework and they hire a coach they like and believe in, then they back the coach without question. Steelers coaches are never on the hot seat and the players there know it. Start players have come and gone in Pittsburgh, but the coaches are always there. Guess what, the Steelers are consistently a competitive team in the league because they are constant from the top down. I don’t care if Koetter is the coach next year, but I wish the Glazers would finally decide who the coach they want is and just sorry them and believe in them regardless of what anyone else says. That is how you build a consistent winner.

  19. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    The Falcons went 6-10 in 2014, 8-8 in 2015, then went to the Superbowl the following year.

    The Panthers went 7-8-1 in 2014, then went to the Superbowl the following year.

    The Saints have gone 7-9 three years in a row, and are now finally good.

    What do they all have in common? Their owners back their coaches.

    As. Simple. As. That.

  20. 813bucboi Says:

    Of course, there’s the flip side. Why would Team Glazer make a bold showing of support for Koetter when his team has been embarrassed in four of eight games this season?


    GO BUCS!!!

  21. 813bucboi Says:



    2014 the falcons were ran by SMITTY!!!!!….2015-8-8 under DQ…SB last year…

    the thing they have in common is that they improved in their second year as HC and they all have a SB appearance!!!!!….GET YOUR FACTS STR8!!!!….GO BUCS!!!!

  22. 813bucboi Says:

    wise man once told me, when your boss says, “your job is safe”, your about to get canned….LOL…GO BUCS!!!

  23. StPeteBucsFan Says:


    but they feared someone else would hire him.

    Great point…should have added it to my mix. Fear…horrible reason for decisions right there with desperation and kneejerks.

  24. The Buc Realist Says:

    This is what I have been saying for a while!!!!!! That The coaches are excellent X’s and O’s coaches, But do they have the tools to change the losing culture that was formed by you know who!!!!!!! There has been a foundation of failure laid that is very thick to break up!!!!!! Head Coach Koetter even said that they thought they were past the losing foundation of culture!!!!! But it crept back in when a few things did not go their way!!!!!!!!!

    Please Glazers give the tools so the coaches can and will fix this!!!!! Otherwise they will be out with pitch forks everytime something goes wrong!!!!!!!!!!!

    ” Before you pass judgement on to a team that is self destructing, It’s important to remember they aren’t trying to destroy themselves!!!!! The coaches are trying to destroy something inside that does not belong!!!!!!”

    Go Bucs!!!!!!!!!!

  25. I’m with Tmaxcon Says:

    Again I agree, GMC could care less about winning, he’s getting his paychecks to half a$$ his play every year, get rid of him while you can still get something decent! If the Dolphins decide to release Suh, we should think about bringing him in here!

  26. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    Okay, the name changing is getting a bit out of control around here…

  27. Kobe Faker Says:


    Koetter is the worst OC/playcaller in the NFL and you what to extend his contract?

    Are you guys on drugs

    The guys schemes are ancient and his use of players are absolutely terrible

    This is absolutely mind boggling!

  28. unbelievable Says:

    2 reasonable takes from St Pete and Bonzai…

    Billick’s point is that even if they do end up firing Koetter, they should come out publicly and support him now. Give him the backing and ammunition and empower him to lay down the law on the players and see who actually tries during the 2nd half.

    That would be smart, it would be an opportunity to see if Koetter is actually capable of grabbing hold of this team, or if he’s been completely tuned out for good. He had a pretty good pulse of the team last year, I find it hard to believe a couple FAs could change all that. Or maybe he’ll fail at it, and then will know he wasn’t the guy. But at least we would know for sure…

    Personally, I’m sick of the 10 year rebuilding / coaching carousel

  29. unbelievable Says:

    ditto on the name changing…

  30. theodore Says:

    The running game will be fixed and the defense will be stout if only owners made a public statement.

    “I hereby declare the Bucs are great! And so it shall be!”

  31. dooshlarue Says:

    I want to keep Koetter, but if he does get canned we should remember that history says it’s really about black and white.

    Dungy, black
    Gruden, white
    Raheem Morris, black
    Greg Schiano, white
    Lovie Smith, black
    Dirk Koetter, white

    So all of you geniuses probably need to rule out any caucasian coaches for the Buc’s next head coach.

    Black is next.

  32. Lakeland Says:

    And what about

    John McKay
    Leeman Bennett
    Ray Perkins
    Richard Williamson
    Sam Wyche

    They were Tampa Bay Buccaneers Head Coaches

  33. DB55 Says:


    There goes the neighborhood

  34. 813bucboi Says:

    The Buc Realist Says:
    November 8th, 2017 at 11:01 am
    This is what I have been saying for a while!!!!!!


    you’ve been saying it was lovie…
    then it was coaching the lovie out of them…
    then it was talent…
    then it was HARD KNOCKS….
    now its “tools”….

    LOL….you’ve said so much BS your not making sense!!!!….GO BUCS!!!

  35. dooshlarue Says:

    And what about

    John McKay
    Leeman Bennett
    Ray Perkins
    Richard Williamson
    Sam Wyche

    They were Tampa Bay Buccaneers Head Coaches

    I was referring to the Glazers’ ownership.

  36. JJBucFan Says:

    If you guys believe that this vanilla offense and this conservative play calling is going to win the players over-you are all nuts. When it is 4th and 2 from the opposing teams 40 and the coach consistently punts, that says everything to me. If the coach doesn’t believe in his players, then why should the players believe in the coach? Same thing on Defense- vanilla conservative $h@t, no blitzing-when we do the CBs are 15 yards off the line because the coach allows them to play “where they feel comfortable”. We all thought that the bland coaching in preseason was to not tip any plays and we would come out blazing, instead they were just working on the offense and defense they planned on running for the entire year whether it was working or not. Dirk and Smitty have gone full retard and everybody knows…you never go full retard. (Sorry if any of you are offended by movie quotes). These 2 dinosaurs have to go, you will never get FAs to come here next year if these 2 guys are here, IMO.

  37. Tackleblockwin Says:

    As the owners…if you have the guts to promote a OC to a HC then you have to understand there will be a learning curve. Dirk has never been a HC in the NFL, so you gotta back him. The Glazers must step up and back him up.

  38. westernbuc Says:

    How about the fact that Dirk got us within one game of the playoffs last year. He’s earned extra time.

    Keep firing coaches and rename this team the Tampa Bay Browns. Go ahead and rehire Gruden and get Lovie 2.0. Or quit running this franchise off of the whims of commenters and journalists and make it a winning team. Only way that happens is consistency.

  39. RustyRhinos Says:

    JJ, What does it matter if we have “vanilla offense and this conservative play calling”, Players still need to perform on the field, not just on the practice field on the game field. If we have a multicolored offense and unconventional play calling, will that make the players play better? Make better decisions with the ball, improve ball placement and accuracy, will it make the players catch everything thrown their direction? I would not hold my breath. We have had several missed opportunities where our guy is wide open and we miss that play again and again and again. We have a super fast WR who gets overthrown nearly every game and underthrown as well. So we keep hearing this is the coaching staffs issue? How so is it their issue? The game of football is played by the players, not the coaches.
    Go Bucs!

  40. Marc Says:

    This team is done and the coaching staff/front office is probably done too. Time to face the music, fellow Bucs fans….. yet another era down the drain. Time for another “rebuilding period” (I use quotes here b/c the last time this franchise BUILT anything was in the mid to late 90’s). But the last thing we need is ANOTHER ‘has been’ for a HC. I know he won us the SB, but Jon Gruden was a good ball coach GENERATIONS ago. The game has certainly changed since then. Besides, wasn’t the Lovie experiment enough? Aren’t you tired of watching McCoy/David fail at impersonating Sapp/Brooks? It’s time for this franchise to stop living in the past and time to look toward the future. Who should the next era belong to? The answer to that question is ultimately up to the Glazers. But, as The Commish suggested during his podcast, the Glazers need to turn the reigns over to a team President who is an accomplished and knowledgeable pro football mind….. someone who will be given full autonomy to make the changes that NEED to be made. If the Bucs ever want to win again, it has to START by hiring an unquestioned evaluator who will be given EVERY and ANY tool necessary to change the losing culture that has plagued this team since Gruden served as the HC ages ago. #newdaytampabay should be the new team slogan. Just my $0.02.

  41. JJBucFan Says:

    Rhino- It matters because we do not play the games in a vacuum. There is a defense on the other side of the ball that is ready for everything we do. I’m as frustrated as you with Jameis, but there are multifactorial reasons why these plays don’t work. Jameis being flushed, having to step up, internal D Smith going off, Jameis being overhyped, D Jax not going up and fighting for the ball, etc. We never have anyone wide open, except for 1-2 times on D Jax fly per game. Slants are covered, hooks are covered. Square ins are covered. No separations-some of it is on the players and some is on the scheme. Watching other games, the WRs get open because of the route trees put in place by the coaching staff. The players have to buy into a coaches system. BTW, if you are relying on a couple of big down the field plays to win you games- you will be sadly disappointed. Games are won in the trenches. Defenses do not have to game plan against our offense, they know what we are going to do already. Offenses know they have nothing to fear from our vanilla defenses and how to pick them apart which we have seen consistently other than a 5 game stretch last year. Inexplicably, he went back to the same vanilla defense for 2 of the last 3 games and it contributed to us not making the playoffs.I can appreciate your frustration with Jameis but don’t kid yourself, the coach is the biggest problem. His plays are out dated with no innovation. IMO. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is the definition of insanity. I liked Koetter and was all for his hiring, but this isn’t getting better anytime soon, there is a reason other teams have let the 2 guys go. At least with Chucky-we “bought” him away- Raiders just couldn’t pass up the deal we offered. You are correct when you say Players need to play but the coaches are the ones that put them in the positions to succeed. Just my opinion. Go Bucs!!

  42. JimmyJack Says:

    Billick is right. The Glazers are the problem. The Glazers have always been the problem. What has been their answer every time this franchise hits a crossroads? The answer to that question is a major factor in all of this. That answer has also led to a lack of results.

    Football is a business and proper business relationships are huge in terms of success. Has anybody here ever quit a job because management treated you poorly? I know I sure have and I also know I would have worked harder and produces more results for those companies had I been treated better. It’s not always about money respect goes a long ways.

    Dungy is a good example because cutting ties with a HC is one thing. The way it was done, however, is a telling sign how our ownership treats its employees. It didn’t surprise me that Lovie didn’t even bother showing up for his final sit down…….something tells me that Lovie was told one thing and given another by the Glazers. You guys can cuss our management and players because the money they make should lead to greater efforts but it’s not always about money……..when an employee is treated unfairly a likely outcome will be a lack of commitment and effort.

    Now of course I am just a fan and all of that is just assumption. I have no fact to suggest that the Glazers treat their employees unfairly. But I do know their has been a lot of smoke coming from One Buc Place over the years……..assuming their is a fire doesn’t seem like a longshot

  43. Duke Says:

    Lot’s of opinions about the old outdated offense .
    Anyone who agrees with that the question is what scheme should they have and what coach do you want?

    How many of you would be in favor of a college coach like Swiney, Franklin, Meyer or Kelly. Would you be in favor of a gimmick offense . I say gimmick because that’s what most of the “it’s DK and his outdated scheme” crowd calls college offenses.

  44. JJBucFan Says:

    Duke- No on Kelly, Meyer- Something like what Fisher runs at FSU or Clay Helton at USC, both pro style. Dabo is a young guy with great schemes but he hasn’t done it long enough. I’m not saying I want a college coach but those are a few examples if we went that route. Look at the Rams, Texans, Bills, Eagles all young guns not re-treads. All of this is just my opinion and what the hell do I know…My opinion is that Jameis is not the same player he was because Dirk essentially “coached the Jameis out of Jameis” and he is hesitant and thinking too much instead of just playing the game. Jimbo allowed Jameis to be Jameis and yes, he yelled at him a lot, but it he allowed him to make those mistakes because he knew eventually he would do make up for it. Who cares if he throws 2 interceptions if he throws 5 TD’s. Take the good with the bad, Jameis 29-1 in college. We knew what Jameis was when we drafted him which made him the #1 overall pick, why would we want to change that?

  45. tmaxcon Says:


    Dungy failed and should have been booted 2 years earlier than he was…

    move on people from the past. dungy sucks and failed it’s a complete disgrace he is enshrined in hall of mediocrity. Most importantly stop with the ex player fetishes none of the has been ex players are qualified to run a franchise. leave the past in the past the future could be bright if bucs make real changes which do not include repeating past mistakes by bringing back underachieving failures. the past was not very special outside of grudens year.


    BUC fanbase is equally as clueless as ownership which is why it’s a match made in heaven… Owners have no desire to win and fanbase only cares about a bunch of underachieving has beens and making excuses for a bunch of choirboy losers. bucs will always be basement kings until glazer clowns sell or give up on recreating a failed past.

  46. Mark2001 Says:

    That is why the Bucs need to hire a HC with an unquestioned pedigree. And give him an iron clad four or five years.

  47. John Lynch Says:

    Dooshlarue: But who won the Super bowl for Tampa! The white man,
    That red neck, the blue eyed demon, that cracker, don’t be jealous brotha!!

  48. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    Or they could give Koetter an iron clad 4-5 years (he does have a 5 year contract) and show the rest of the NFL that they are willing to stick it out.

    Because if they fire Koetter this year, there is no good coach that will come here. Not with such impatient owners and fans.

    The truth hurts.

  49. 813bucboi Says:

    Buccaneer Bonzai Says:
    November 8th, 2017 at 2:44 pm
    Or they could give Koetter an iron clad 4-5 years (he does have a 5 year contract) and show the rest of the NFL that they are willing to stick it out.
    Because if they fire Koetter this year, there is no good coach that will come here. Not with such impatient owners and fans.

    no way in h3ll dirk gets that…LOL…he’s as good as gone!!!….I think the thing that really did him in is his handling of Winston once he got injured….you cant mismanage the franchise….you cant put the franchise at risk in order to save your job….that showed he’s not HC material…along with all the other BS….theirs good coaches out there that can turn this thing around in a hurry….you’ll see once he’s hired on 1/2/18 or after the SB….GO BUCS!!!

  50. JimmyJack Says:

    tmax……Whatever your thoughts are about Dungy have absolutely nothing to do about what I was talking about.

    It’s ridicilous that I even have to explain things twice. The ironic thing is that you call others clueless when you can’t properly read and understand the main idea of a post.

    Dungy’s ability as a HC is completely off the topic of what I was talking about. How that is what you took from my post is beyond me.

    What I was talking about was the manner in which they handled the situation of firing him. I used the firing of Dungy as an example of poor relations between the Glazers and their employees……Just like Billick is talking about in the article(at least that’s what I take from his comments).

    In no way was I trying to start a debate as to whether Dungy should have stayed, gone, or been fired earlier then he was. You started that argument and for no reason other then your own adgenda………..The fact that your can’t intelligently reply to another poster on here without going completely off subject because of the mere mention of Dungy, or a select few other names, tells me that you have a complete obsession(in an unhealthy, stalking type way) that has ruined any ability for you to understand anything about this team. Your constant obsessing posting with your narrow-minded point of view does nothing but make our fan base looks very stupid to any odd who reads.

  51. Duke Says:


    I wouldn’t want QB’ s. I’d prefer to build around Him and to his strengths.
    I’m curious about your thought process on Dabo not being seasoned vs hiring a “young gun” who by definition is lacking in experience. Maybe I read it wrong but I missed it.

    I don’t know anything about USC and what they do but I am familiar with FSU.
    BTW, I think it’s important to go with at least initially with a scheme that’s incorporates as many concepts and plays as a the QB used in college. JW played in a pro style scheme. I think it’s important to go with the system that got him the #1 draft spot.

    Here’s the part that is contradictory to many of the criticisms and comments on the site. JW played in a scheme which is almost 40 years old. It’s old. So when says that DK runs a 2002 offense that is out of date, it’s comical .

    I see what the Texans, Rams and have done and I believe that we’re at a point that the next gen coaches will begin to reshape the game. The typical college program is not offering as many NFL style ready players as in the past. Goff Watson and MM come from one side Wentz JW from another. The latter 2 are traditional and I believe that is what should be a overall philosophy in building a team.

    Last, the only thing that DK is trying to coach out of JW is mistakes
    The NFL isn’t FSU the talent level is to even to make mistakes. College, yes you can make mistakes because of the schedule which pits one or two evenly matched together a season. So far I’d think it’s obvious that DK hasn’t coached anything out of JW. The fact that a FSU game report and analysis is so similar to today that if presented with the two , there’s nothing to distinguish between the two except w’ s.

  52. LargoBuc Says:

    So tmax think Dungy should have been fired two uears earlier. As in, he should have been fired after leading the team to the nfc championship game and held the vreatest show on turf to 11 points. Yeah, Dungy totally should have been fired after what was our most successful season to that point and still our second most successful to this day. Wow. No wonder other fan bases call us clueless.

  53. jjbucfan Says:

    Duke- NFL is a different animal, that is all I meant about Dabo. Those other guys I named have NFL pedigree. I like Dabo, I don’t believe the read-option would work for us with Jameis (or in the NFL long term- QB will get killed, i.e. Cam), however, I think he would be smart enough to put Jameis in the hurry up/no huddle and also get him on the move/ outside the pocket. Jameis can throw on the run.

    DK does not run what Jimbo runs or Helton, it isn’t just about the QB, it is about the blocking schemes and routes that his receivers and RBs and TEs run. It is fine for JW to stay in the pocket but not if we are running double moves and routes that take time for our WRs to get open. Our offensive line is not good, especially on the Left (blind side). Move the pocket so JW has extra time, a half second means all the difference. Why hasn’t this been done yet?

    Look it’s not that I don’t like Dirk, but it doesn’t look like to me that he can be a HC. Anyone in their right mind would have to M Smith to blitz, disguise his looks, press cover, etc. He is only looking on the offensive side but he is the HC and he is in charge of O, D and ST.

    I get why Dirk wants the mistakes to stop and stupid plays etc. However, IMO he should have just told everyone, he is young, the only way to learn is to make the mistakes and we are going to have to hope he makes more good plays than bad plays. I graduated from FSU and still go to the games, I saw the mistakes he made (and we all just shook our heads) but somehow he was always able to atone. To try to get him to change who he is, is insane. Only he can learn that for himself. On top of that, he doesn’t need to call him out in the media like he did. Favre never learned and was still one of the best ever. JW may be the best 23 year old QB ever despite all of his mistakes, why are you F-ing with that?

    Good discussion- I can respect where you are coming from, I just have a different read on things. BTW, I think Licht hasn’t helped Dirk out (or Mike Smith for that matter) If you look at our backups at almost every position except LB and TE, we are putrid at best. Most of our FAs haven’t worked out and neither has our draft picks, except for a few. Anyway I could go on and on about the problems this team has but I will spare you all my opinions for now. Go Bucs!

  54. dooshlarue Says:

    @John Lynch

    No jealousy man, just noticed a pattern in the Glazer’s hiring process.

  55. John Lynch Says:

    It’s all good dooshlarue..

  56. Duke Says:


    Thanks for explanation regarding Dabo. I wasn’t suggesting Him or anyone at all just used their names because they are successful.

    I know DO doesn’t run the same scheme as He did in college. That’s why I made the comment about the incorporation of the same scheme from college to pro.
    The Bucs draft Winston and the GM hired a Coach with a different scheme.

    If they change coaches I would prefer a Coach who has run NFL style wc scheme successfully. Put JW back in the same offense He played in college.

    Here’s where I see a larger issue. If your organization is going to Draft a prototypical drop back pocket passer an established offensive line should be in place. If not, then the next draft or FA priority has to be acquiring o line personnel. The fact that JL has not done that is akin a Lamborghini then ignoring the maintenance . The problem is an organizational structure that is out of sync.

    If they DK and that is the only thing that changes I don’t believe anyone should be surprised when the results are the same too.

    You say we disagree, I’m not sure if that’s the case. I think we’re on the same page but still sifting through the details. The place we differ is I don’t believe a scheme change is a cure all. Well, let me just clarify. I have no doubt that the defensive scheme and coordinator should be changed. MS is to committed to his scheme , specifically his cover concepts.

  57. I Bleed Red Says:

    Now there are what seems a big amount of injuries to key players but in the beginning it was Winston’s poor play

  58. jjbucfan Says:

    Very true Duke, I see Jameis as a hybrid of a Prototypical drop back and a weird unorthodox/clumsy scrambler that no one has seen before. His escapability is crazy. Historically he throws extremely well when he is moving. Koetter has no idea about JWs history almost like he has never watched him play, IMO.

    Licht dropped the ball big time on the O-line and D-line, it will probably cost the 3 of them their job. I hate the coaching carousel but they all have to be fired, the sooner the better for me. We need a GM and President that command respect.