Three Thumbs Down On Winston
March 6th, 2015
Joel Klatt, the former University of Colorado quarterback who now is a top NFL analyst for FOX, has been consistently a pro-Marcus-Mariota guy.
And now Klatt has cemented himself as anti-Winston.
Klatt did a bullet-point breakdown this week of why he wouldn’t draft Winston, if he were Jason Licht or Bucs overlord of football operations Lovie Smith.
In a nutshell:
1) Decision-making on the field. (“Too many interceptions”)
2) Decision-making off the field. (In the era of social media, “Your quarterback has to be rock-solid.”)
3) Jimbo Fisher (His QBs, JaMarcus Russell, Matt Flynn, Christian Ponder and E.J. Manuel haven’t been good NFL starters.)
Joe finds only the last point to be a very fair concern. Joe respects Klatt, so Joe’s sharing the video below.
March 6th, 2015 at 12:52 pm
Because Oregon QBs have TORN THE NFL UP…
March 6th, 2015 at 12:55 pm
the whole coach thing is just so damn stupid. Especially considering that Jimbo told NFL coaches that EJ Manuel was NOT an NFL quality QB.
By that rational, we should only draft a QB who went to Tennessee or Michigan? It’s so idiotic I can’t even waste any more energy typing about it
March 6th, 2015 at 12:56 pm
Klatt is a very smart man
March 6th, 2015 at 12:56 pm
Thanks Joe…..for “Keeping it real”…..
March 6th, 2015 at 12:57 pm
Cue the “hater” rhetoric. ” This guy doesn’t know anything” sentiment.
March 6th, 2015 at 12:58 pm
Decision making off the field is not a “very fair concern” with Winston? Ok
March 6th, 2015 at 12:58 pm
Wouldn’t it be ironic if Winston passes all of the off-field questionmarks but isn’t selected because of his on-field issues.
There is certainly enough for the Bucs to justify not drafting him. Even though they don’t need justification, it helps to have it.
March 6th, 2015 at 12:59 pm
Funny how Jimbo, who was Jamarcus Russell’s OC at LSU, said exactly the same things about Russell coming out as he is now saying about Winston. At least he’s consistant
March 6th, 2015 at 1:01 pm
I don’t think the last point is valid. How many quarterbacks are starting in NFL from Oregon and Chip Kelly system. Did Manning, Breese and Brady make it because of their college coaching. It is the individual and their skill set and especially football IQ and drive to excel. I think Winston has those qualities.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:01 pm
I worry about what’s going to happen when things don’t go right. Because FSU was so good during Winston’s time there, we didn’t get many opportunities to see this, but when we did in that Oregon game, it wasn’t pretty.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:02 pm
Stanford wanted Winston….he chose FSU. I am not a huge Winston or FSU fan, but that is what was reported. Not sure if it’s true or not, but goes with #3
March 6th, 2015 at 1:03 pm
28-1, national champion, heisman trophy winner. Did I mention winner? That is all, thank you n good day.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:05 pm
The 3rd one is the least of my concerns. The first 2 are legit.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:09 pm
3) Jimbo Fisher (His QBs, JaMarcus Russell, Matt Flynn, Christian Ponder and E.J. Manuel haven’t been good NFL starters.)
if MM succeeds as an nfl quarterback he’d be the first from Oregon or from chip Kelly’s system. I will say this chip Kelly is absolutely tearing up the league with his system but don’t tell me it’s an easy transition into a traditional offense because it’s not. RG3 wasn’t a turnover machine in college but what is he in the nfl…..im not against MM just for Winston and I don’t think you can get this pick wrong I just think one will be ready sooner than the other so that’s the one I want
March 6th, 2015 at 1:09 pm
What’s with the worry about the interceptions? They weren’t all his fault. He also had young receivers. That can be fixed. I think people are racist.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:13 pm
I agree. Not sure about the last one, but the first two are reasonable. I also like Mariota’s throwing mechanics and athleticism more. I’ll support whomever we take in the Draft, but when two guys (Mariota and Winston) are so close together in skills, I think it makes more sense to choose the one with fewer ?’s.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:14 pm
too much common sense in there. we gonna see some heads explode in here.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:15 pm
Luke Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 1:01 pm
I worry about what’s going to happen when things don’t go right. Because FSU was so good during Winston’s time there, we didn’t get many opportunities to see this, but when we did in that Oregon game, it wasn’t pretty.
——————-
So Jameis didn’t win every game in college. This is so funny. Let me get this straight. The one lost in Winston’s career was in your opinion what happens when “things don’t go right” Yet, you overlook the fact that the man has at least 7 come from behind victories in his college career including a come from behind national championship victory. Wouldn’t these victories also serve as an indication of how he responds when “things don’t go right”? You Jameis haters are too funny. Keep the jokes coming because we are a long way from the draft and I could use the continued entertainment!! “When things don’t go right” hahahahaha stop it. I can’t take no more hahahaahah
March 6th, 2015 at 1:18 pm
WS99 Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 1:03 pm
28-1, national champion, heisman trophy winner. Did I mention winner? That is all, thank you n good day.
_________________________________________________________________
So you’re saying we should sign Tebow, with as strong a record in a much tougher conference? Ok then…
March 6th, 2015 at 1:18 pm
Everytime I see these idiots bring up interceptions I wonder if they watched Winston’s film. His first season as a starter he threw 10 and last year 18. What these “experts” don’t mention is that around 8 of those int’s last year were on his wideouts, because of their youth. They won’t mention that though because it doesn’t fit their “Anti-Winston” narrative.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:18 pm
Bucs4lyfe…”if Mariota succeeds as an NFL QB, he’d be the first from Oregon….”
Not true. Remember a guy named Dan Fouts? I know it was a while ago, but he was an awesome QB in the NFL a and a pretty great Oregon Duck!
March 6th, 2015 at 1:18 pm
and there’s the race card
here’s yer sign
March 6th, 2015 at 1:20 pm
You can obviously question the decision-making issues, but I’m not sure I am buying into the Jimbo angle. Flynn was middling college QB, if I recall, and Manuel and Ponder, while phenomenal athletes, were nowhere near as polished as Winston in the pocket. I can’t imagine there are many people shocked to see these guys struggle in the NFL passing game, as all three showed severe deficiencies/inconsistencies in college.
I have to admit that I am a bit foggy in my recollection on Russel. I recall that he was big and had a very strong arm, but also recall that he didn’t show near the accuracy, anticipation and leadership shown by Winston in college, and that he wasn’t required to carry the team through the air the way Winston has. In fact, didn’t he really only cement himself as a top NFL prospect in the Bowl game and combine? By contrast, plenty have been touting Winston as the #1 overall since last season, and for good reason. Like Mariota at Oregon, Winston has shown more success and promise in Jimbo’s system than any of his predecessors have. Difference is that Jimbo’s system more easily translates into the NFL.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:22 pm
There hasn’t been ANY quarterbacks under Jimbo that have become “FACE OF THE FRANCHISE.” This has diaster written all over it! Jamarcus 2.0 and Jimbo can say whatever they want… JW couldn’t even beat the 2nd best quarterback in the draft, what a shame.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:22 pm
That’s a pretty lazy way to write someone off imo. Oh well it’s expected.
The guys who criticize for his interceptions last year seem to pretend 2013 never happened (40 TDs 10 Ints). Should that not factor at all into his evaluation lol?
The Jimbo Fisher argument is lazy and a waste imo. Ponder / Manuel were not anywhere near Winston’s pedigree. Manuel had terrible pocket pressence and not the best field vision and Ponder was always hurt and inconsistent.
Ponder didn’t play well overall in the NFL but he had some solid games when healthy. Manuel has been hurt too much to make an impact but it’s not like these 2 guys are Ryan Leaf like busts. Hell Manuel may still end up being a serviceable starting NFL QB.And they were no where near as good as Winston was at FSU. I laughed when Buffalo took Manuel that high
March 6th, 2015 at 1:22 pm
That is a good point and I never knew about that (#3)
March 6th, 2015 at 1:29 pm
I don’t get #3, Thats just stupid:
1. Where are all of the Oregon QB’s?
2. Matt Flynn, EJ Manuel and Ponder are ALL still in the NFL… What is wrong with him consistently producing NFL talent? Sure they arent superstars, but there is still a skill level involved based on each individuals born talents.
3. Jamarcus was a nutcase. We should applaud Jimbo for being able to get what he got out of him.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:29 pm
Jeagan1999 Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 1:18 pm
Bucs4lyfe…”if Mariota succeeds as an NFL QB, he’d be the first from Oregon….”
Not true. Remember a guy named Dan Fouts? I know it was a while ago, but he was an awesome QB in the NFL a and a pretty great Oregon Duck!
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WOW YOU BRING UP A GUY WHO RETIRED IN THE 80’S LOL THANK YOU FOR PROVING OUR POINT
March 6th, 2015 at 1:30 pm
CNN just posted “Mob fatally beats rape suspect”
March 6th, 2015 at 1:31 pm
Point 3 is ridiculous because name a school that is a pro QB factory. Every HC in the NCAA will have a ridiculous looking list of failed NFL QBs for the simple fact.. it’s hard to be a good QB in “THE NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE”.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:32 pm
“Jamarcus was a nutcase.”
and JW’s actions sure define him as a guy with lots of common sense.
(that’s sarcasm)
March 6th, 2015 at 1:32 pm
Winning in college does not always translate to winning in the NFL. See Matt Lienhart or JaMarcus Russell as 2 examples.
My BIG concern with JW is maturity and I just do not see it happening anytime soon; some of his RECENT comments are arrogant ie Baseball; Superbowl and Tom Brady. Really? Young Jedi QB??? He should have stayed at FSU one more year and he would have been a lock at #1 assuming he stayed out of Publix and the tables on campus.
Hence why I have said all along–neither guy to me is fully NFL ready but I would take a chance on MM over JW.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:34 pm
College Career stats
Winston: Games played: 27, 47 TD 28 INT 150.4 Rating (Heisman/Nat.Chmp)
Russell: Games played: 46, 52 TD 21 INT 147.9 Rating (No Heisman or champ)
Flynn: Games Played: 41, 31 TD 13 INT 133 Rating (no Heisman/ Nat. Chmp)
Ponder Games Played 35, 49 TD, 30 INT 132 Rating (no Heisman or champ)
Manuel Games Played 43, 47 TD, 28 INT 150.4 Rating (no Heisman or champ)
March 6th, 2015 at 1:34 pm
@Nick
That was going to be my #4 but i forgot to put it. Lol. Where is this coach that is pumping out superstar NFL QB after superstar NFL QB?? The fact that Jimbo consistently produces QB’s that play in the NFL for more than 1 year is impressive in itself.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:34 pm
Joe….FYI
You continue to use this combine pic of Winston & Mariota (may be your only one of them together) but, it makes Winston appear to be six inches shorter even though we know they are the same hight….
So…even with a picture….things are not always as they seem…
March 6th, 2015 at 1:37 pm
Sounds like he’s repeating the samethings the uniformed are spewing. Does he list that nobody has ever made a successful transition from the oregon offense as a negative for Mariota? What about the fumbles which are just as costly as INTs. I’d like to see what he said about Mariota if anyone has the link.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:37 pm
Bucrightoff
Would you be happy with a playoff win this year? That is all Ty n good day sir.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:39 pm
Those are all 3 very valid concerns, Mariota is a risk as well. But I think he’s a risk worth taking. Winstons risks outweigh the rewards
March 6th, 2015 at 1:41 pm
@bucs4lyfe….the only thing I pointed out was the inaccuracy of your statement! You implied that there were no QBs from Oregon that succeed in the NFL ….you were wrong! You’re welcome!
P.s. I made my point without having TO SHOUT WITH ALL CAPS!
March 6th, 2015 at 1:42 pm
Great point about Jimbo Fisher QBs… Following that logic, let’s take a look at Oregon QBs in the NFL…
Denis Dixon
Jeremiah Masoli
Joey Harrington
Darren Thomas
They are went on to have very successful NFL careers.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:49 pm
@Jeagan1999
no big deal bro it’s ok….and they say Winston fans are sensitive, lol sorry I just didn’t think you would go way back to the 80’s to point out a successful Oregon quarterback, I have no idea what offense they were even or do I even care considering I was like 10 but it’s ok lol your right and yea you did make your point hahhaha
March 6th, 2015 at 1:50 pm
Current Successful QBs listed by school only:
Michigan
Tennessee
Cal
Purdue
NC State
NC State
Miami of Ohio
Stanford
Eastern Illinois
Boston College
Georgia
Nevada
Ole Miss
Auburn
Utah
This list proves nothing other than the randomness of where these All-Pros come from. If anything, FSU should be lauded for consistently putting its starting QB in the league for the past 2 decades.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:56 pm
I’ll even add a Delaware and a TCU to the list to be generous.
Random.
March 6th, 2015 at 1:57 pm
For the peeps posting stats…How about these rankings??
NCAA QB ranking:
MM>>2013 #2; 2014 #1
JW>>2013 #1; 2014 #17
With the first pick, who wants the 17th ranked QB in the NCAA last year?
March 6th, 2015 at 1:57 pm
I think the glazers should let some of know it all mo fo make the picks this year because your so smart! lol.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:00 pm
“If anything, FSU should be lauded for consistently putting its starting QB in the league for the past 2 decades.”
Yes if you want mediocrity pick the FSU QB….
March 6th, 2015 at 2:00 pm
@bucs4lyfe…no worries. My point was that good QBs come from lots of different places. I disagreed with your statement about Oregon QBs, the same as I’d disagree with someone saying no good QBs ever came from Florida State. Seems to me I recall celebrating a Bucs championship with an FSU a QB! Brady came out of Michigan, Peyton from Tennessee, Big Ben and Romo both came from small schools….all are good QBs. Just like there are a lot of good college QBs that don’t make it in the NFL a…Russell, Akili Smith, Leaf, etc.. Good QBs can come from anywhere, just like bad ones! You obviously are a big Winston supporter, andI am in the Mariota camp. At the end of the day, I’ll support whomever the Bucs choose, and I hope you and everyone else will too!
March 6th, 2015 at 2:03 pm
Tampabaybucfan Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 1:34 pm
Joe….FYI
You continue to use this combine pic of Winston & Mariota (may be your only one of them together) but, it makes Winston appear to be six inches shorter even though we know they are the same hight….
So…even with a picture….things are not always as they seem…
**********
Nah, there are more pics of them together.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:03 pm
you*
March 6th, 2015 at 2:04 pm
Mariota>Winston Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 1:57 pm
For the peeps posting stats…How about these rankings??
NCAA QB ranking:
MM>>2013 #2; 2014 #1
JW>>2013 #1; 2014 #17
With the first pick, who wants the 17th ranked QB in the NCAA last year?
———————————————————————————
i want the Heisman trophy winner, the guy who threw for 4057 yards and 40 touchdowns to 10 interceptions as a freshman since your bringing up MM sophomore season
March 6th, 2015 at 2:04 pm
@Mariota>Winston
Please don’t misrepresent my point. I spelled it out pretty clearly. It’s one thing to get QBs drafted but it’s completely random, dumb luck where elite QBs attended school.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:05 pm
The player to player comparisons are idiotic.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:06 pm
KJ Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 1:42 pm
Great point about Jimbo Fisher QBs… Following that logic, let’s take a look at Oregon QBs in the NFL…
Denis Dixon
Jeremiah Masoli
Joey Harrington
Darren Thomas
They are went on to have very successful NFL careers.
***********
Darron Thomas was never in the NFL.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:08 pm
“I’m hurting this team, I really am,” Winston said after throwing 12 INTs last year to start the season…they were 9-0 at that point
He really showed his maturity and seriousness as a QB by following this up by throwing another 6 INTs in the last 3 games to finish the season. I do not see a pattern of learning from his mistakes.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11848063/jameis-winston-florida-state-seminoles-says-interceptions-hurting-team
March 6th, 2015 at 2:09 pm
All Winston does is win! So did Tebow how did that turn out FSU homers. How many National Championship QB’s are starting in the NFL right now?
March 6th, 2015 at 2:10 pm
We have never seen a QB that is as big and athletic as Mariota. And to top it off, he is a great leader, person off the field, and real role model for kids everywhere. People say we don’t have the personnel for Mariota, 2 words= BULL $HIT. He is the best QB to come out since Andrew Luck. He is everything Winston is not.
L&L, it’s not a tough decision. Draft Mariota, let him learn behind Glennon and let’s start getting fans excited again!
GO BUCS!
#MariotaorBUST
March 6th, 2015 at 2:10 pm
the ongoing questions about each QB leads to this decision. pick Leonard Williams (a can’t miss prospect) OR trade pick to Chip for a ship load of picks and build a DYNASTY!
March 6th, 2015 at 2:15 pm
The Player comparisons are crazy!! Who cares what Jimbo Fisher does in football??
The Coach comparison is what makes all the difference in the world. I do not hope the Buc’s choose another QB than the Rapist other than his belief that he is entitled to anything or anyone he chooses and he will be protected.
The Question you have to ask is a Lovie Smith comparison. IT DOES NOT MATTER IF THE #1 pick is Winston! Lovie Smith can’t coach Friday Night Tykes, let alone an NFL franchise!
The odds of picking a franchise QB with the #1 or #10 pick is very long. A Coach like Belichick, Arians, Pagano, Kelly, etc. can coach whatever QB they get….and fit the players to a system. The Patriots got Brady, but if they had any idea he would be this good that would have taken him in the 1st round. Belichick fits players into a system without the #1 draft choice and without high picks.
Trade the #1 pick for an outstanding coach and then the Buc’s will have a team….Winston is just a woman abusing criminal….he is a great football player, but why take a chance on someone with poor moral judgment when the HC can’t win with or without him?
Greg Schiano
March 6th, 2015 at 2:15 pm
Bye Felisha
March 6th, 2015 at 2:21 pm
Jim Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 1:34 pm
College Career stats
Winston: Games played: 27, 47 TD 28 INT 150.4 Rating (Heisman/Nat.Chmp)
Jim – Winston had 65 TDs – not 47.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:24 pm
You right Pickgrin. Makes the point even more obvious that Winston is not like the other QBs, and the jury is still out on E.J.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:25 pm
The only QB to ever lead the Tampa Bay Buccaneers to a Super Bowl championship was from Florida State. So… there’s that.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:25 pm
BF4L well said man, that’s the same message I’ve been saying.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:31 pm
vorbs Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 2:25 pm
The only QB to ever lead the Tampa Bay Buccaneers to a Super Bowl championship was from Florida State. So… there’s that.
**************
Did you really just say that? LEAD? hahaha that is funny.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:31 pm
It will be quite humorous to me if Lovie trades for Cutler and then drafts Leonard Williams, so all of this endless Winston/Mariota speculation and bickering is for naught.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:32 pm
They could both be products of their respective offenses… Anyone think of that?
Just think it could be a repeat of the 2007 draft.. We got a lovely choice of JaMarcus Russell, Brady Quinn, Kevin Kolb or John Beck… Yuck
Or 06’… Vince Young, Jay Cutler, Matt Leinart, Kellen Clemens, or Tarvarius Jackson… Excuse me while I puke some more..
02′ – David Carr or Joey Harrington.. Them poor kids got ruined from a terrible O-line and coaching
Or the 13′ class – EJ Manuel, Geno Smith, Mike Glennon… Wait didn’t we draft one of them?!
I’m in the draft Mariota camp but I do see the bust potential with BOTH top QB’s coming out this year (long release, careless with the football, and a
‘just having fun and knows how to party”player and on the other side a QB who has fumbled too much and whether Koetter can form an offense for the kid for more than one year ).. Wish people on all sides of the fence would see that as well instead of turning a blind eye to it. Or running to the defense no matter what the situation is.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:33 pm
@Greg Schiano
in your entire rant you mentioned two coaches that have gone to the superbowl and one of them is lovie smith….everything chip Kelly and arians has done has to do with the regular season, arians inherited a great defense, pagano inherited Andrew luck.
lets say for the sake of argument that lovie smith had the worse coach year in the history in the nfl….basically a greg schiano type coaching year lol if greg schiano can get 2 years are you saying lovie smith cant? he’s obviously going to get a 2nd year so whats the deal?
March 6th, 2015 at 2:34 pm
people! when it comes right down to it how many QBs have we seen have great collegiate careers. and then not so good NFL careers? a lot! you just have to have good coaching and a smart player. and go from there also I think jw and mm are smart and good college QBs. and we have decent OC and QB coaches. that is a start. hopefully which ever QB we take picks it up and runs with it we shall see.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:34 pm
vorbs Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 2:25 pm
The only QB to ever lead the Tampa Bay Buccaneers to a Super Bowl championship was from Florida State. So… there’s that.
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you seriously killed the Winston momentum with that post
March 6th, 2015 at 2:35 pm
“He (Mariota) is the best QB to come out since Andrew Luck.”
9 out of 10 NFL experts disagree with your assessment bucsfan4lyf. If Winston hadn’t come out this year – then that would be a true statement – but Winston is obviously the best QB. Especially when projecting to the NFL. Tape don’t lie.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:37 pm
You people are losers and need a life and job, I bet your all fat unemployed losers posting on this website
March 6th, 2015 at 2:41 pm
Buctebow Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 2:31 pm
It will be quite humorous to me if Lovie trades for Cutler and then drafts Leonard Williams, so all of this endless Winston/Mariota speculation and bickering is for naught.
*************
If that happened I think a lot of us would blow a gasket.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:42 pm
@Dave
How dare you. I’m not unemployed.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:42 pm
how much you want to BET! dave. and wtf are you doing on here?
March 6th, 2015 at 2:43 pm
If every great qb coach had to produce a great nfl starter, before being trusted in producing another, we’d factually have ZERO credible qb coaches..that specific argument is remedial, at best. It takes out the human element entirely. All those great irish qbs after montana(mirer) or cal after rodgers(longshore) what about fulmer with peyton(tee)or lloyd with brady (qb U, right?) Roflmao!! See how dumb that sounds? Wow…its getting hard to substantively criticize jameis, i see
March 6th, 2015 at 2:44 pm
hey BUCSFRLYF- jets just picked up Brandon marshall from bears yahoo! lol.
March 6th, 2015 at 2:47 pm
Bucs4lyfe
Pagano didnt inherit luck he was the one who drafted him and choose him over manning
March 6th, 2015 at 2:48 pm
Winston=Inconsistent and only played 2 years, so is he a 1-year wonder?Marcus=Consistent has a larger sample size and more numbers are not all over the place. Besides, Marcus not only proved it in the stats who is better but also head-to-head
March 6th, 2015 at 2:51 pm
It’s early March. And last year at this time the same people knew little Johnny was the next Savior for the team also. Three first round picks and a couple players thrown in and it’s over. You think the Glazers got rich from one deal?
March 6th, 2015 at 2:52 pm
Speaking for Pablo
“Pablo is getting dizzy with all these QB comparisons……Brees, 2 Mannings, Russell, Brady, Rothlesberger, Leaf, Johnson, Wilson, Rodgers, Moon, Newton…and many others. Pablo is very disturbed that Pablo’s favorite QBs have not been used for comparison….Sanchez & Garcia….Pablo thinks there are many racists posting on JBF!!!”
March 6th, 2015 at 2:56 pm
@ Pickgrin
The same tape where Winston threw 18 interceptions this past season, cried to his coach, was overweight AND lost to Mariota. Yea, ill take Mariota any day, any week, month and year.
😉
March 6th, 2015 at 2:59 pm
Wow,
Joel Klatt has 3 thumbs
March 6th, 2015 at 2:59 pm
Anybody that thinks off field decision making isn’t a concern is very wrongheaded. It’s a concern because people will take advantage of who he is and his reputation. Think about this, what if he goes out for an innocent with friends and has a couple of drinks, meets a woman and goes home with her. She realizes he is Jameis Winston, next day the police are knocking on his door saying a woman reported that he sexually assaulted her. He has to be very careful not to put himself in bad positions. There are plenty of bad people out there who will take advantage of his reputation. Right or wrong, this is something that will follow him for his whole career. So yes, off field decision making is a monumental concern.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:02 pm
Winston played better than Mariota in the Rose Bowl loss bucsfan4lyf. More importantly – he was making NFL type throws throughout the game which Mariota was not. If you can’t see that then I can’t help you.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:04 pm
“What these “experts” don’t mention is that around 8 of those int’s last year were on his wideouts, because of their youth.”
Do people think if they repeat this canard often enough it will eventually become the truth. And so who did Fameis have to toss the rock to? Who were these YOUTHFUL…INEXPERIENCED receivers. Well his number one target was a SENIOR the all time greatest FSU wideout, Rashad Greene!!! In addition to which Fameis had an entire year during the championship run to blend with…they were enjoying their SECOND year together.
More on Fameis “YOUTHFUL” number one target.
As a senior in 2014, Greene set the school record for career receptions and receiving yards, passing Ron Sellers in both categories.[7][8] He also set the record for receptions in a season with 99. He also had 1,365 receiving yards and seven touchdowns in 2014. For his career, Greene had 270 receptions for 3,830 yards and 29 touchdowns.
How about a possession receiver with experience. Nick O’Leary is arguably one of FSU’s greatest Tight Ends ever!!! At least statistically. Again a second year teammate of Fameis. These three should have enjoyed awesome chemistry!
As for youngsters taking kelvin Benjamins place? How about 4 and 5 star plug and play recruits.
Fameis played on a team with SEVEN teammates projected to go in the first two rounds and O’Leary in the third.
You Saint Fameis people cant have it both ways. You can’t claim 28-1 was all because of St. Fameis with the seven NFL pick teammates having nothing to do with it, but his interceptions were the fault of a receiving corps that included FSU’s all time leading receiver and an all time Tight End both of whom were coming back for a SECOND year with Fameis.
The Int’s were bad and there’s NO FREAKING EXCUSE!!! The only hope is that Fameis is more like the wreckless gunslinger Brett Favre and the feasts will outnumber the famines because there are going to be interceptions with Fameis count on that! Your rebuttal should no be to excuse his ints but to promise he’s going to toss so many TD’s that the int’s will be worth it like with Favre.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:05 pm
Actually maybe I CAN help you if you can’t see it bucfan4lyf. This excellent analysis should help you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYa6S6UA0MU
March 6th, 2015 at 3:08 pm
StPeteBucsFan – Jimbo Fisher said only 8 of Winston’s INTs in 2014 were the fault of the QB. You are welcome to take that point up with him but the coach is the only person not in the huddle who knows for sure what play was called and who had what responsibilities.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:10 pm
Pickgrin Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 3:02 pm
Winston played better than Mariota in the Rose Bowl loss bucsfan4lyf
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Clearly, you don’t know math dude!
Winston=348yards passing 1 passing td 1interception and -15 yards Marcus=338yards passing 2 passing tds 1int and 62 yards rushing +1 rush td
This is why Marcus won the game, not Winston
March 6th, 2015 at 3:15 pm
Pickgrin Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 3:08 pm
StPeteBucsFan – Jimbo Fisher said only 8 of Winston’s INTs in 2014 were the fault of the QB. You are welcome to take that point up with him but the coach is the only person not in the huddle who knows for sure what play was called and who had what responsibilities.
Yeah,
I see, the 8 picks you were referring had nothing to do with the defense who had to be in position to make the interception.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:16 pm
LOL…..I came home for lunch to a Riveting comment thread. Thanks for the entertainment guys.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:16 pm
Lol I love how experts come out against winston and all you biased morons say things like “all the interceptions weren’t his fault”. Just excuses. But any excuse for mike glennon or mariota you all just ignore and say he sucks lol.
And I love how all of you act like you know more than the people that get paid to do it everyday lol
Most of you don’t know anything and thank god you all aren’t running anything other than you mouths. Idiots.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:17 pm
But he’s a great person as he says!
March 6th, 2015 at 3:18 pm
AND WHO ON THIS PLANET BELIEVES WINSTON OUTPLAYED MARIOTA IN THE ROSE BOWL.
If you think winston outplayed mariota in the rose bowl first go check the stats secondly go kill yourself
March 6th, 2015 at 3:23 pm
The Jimbo thing is a joke. If anything, it shows what a great coach he is. I went FSU a fan and watched EJ and Ponder play every game. I was just just as surprised as anyone that they were taken in the 1st round. The were both very average talents that were coached up to play solid. Winston is different. He is the real deal talent and has been coached well.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:23 pm
“28-1, national champion, heisman trophy winner. Did I mention winner? That is all, thank you n good day.”
Tim Tebow?
March 6th, 2015 at 3:24 pm
yall won’t be seeing me much longer, mom’s just said I gotta move outta the basement, and I doubt my new digs is gonna have the interweb.
just wanted to say peace out, and hopefully won’t be gone too long.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:26 pm
So EVERY one of Jimbo’s QBs that didnt make it in the NFL had a better TD to INT ratio than Winston………………….hmmmm
March 6th, 2015 at 3:27 pm
Yungry and The Kevin – watch the link I posted and maybe you will learn something. Can’t even believe I am even responding to either of you but oh well.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:36 pm
Pickgrin
—————-
Rose Bowl Numbers:
Winston=323 yards(passing+rushing) 1td 2turnovers
Marcus=400yards(passing+rushing) 3tds and 1 turnover
Hence, Marcus won. Please just stop…
P.S when teams play from behind late in games passing numbers can be distorted. I watched the game and saw enough. Please stop saying Winston outplayed Mariota. enough is enough
March 6th, 2015 at 3:40 pm
@robert 9
That literally clears up everything you have ever said.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:44 pm
Whatever Yungry. FSU as a team blew that game. Winston played well and showed in that game why he is the better NFL prospect than Mariota. If you can’t see that then there’s no hope for you. But then anyone who who continually posts “Rapist, Rapist, Rapist” despite all the evidence that his accuser is lying cannot be reasoned with anyway – so crawl back under your bridge and go harass some billygoats.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:50 pm
you know of a bridge with billygoats?????
March 6th, 2015 at 3:50 pm
Whatever Yungry. FSU as a team blew that game. Winston played well and showed in that game why he is the better NFL prospect than Mariota.
—————————————————————–
It was 59-20! Are you mentally stable? Did you see Winston’s fumble. Dude, if Winston played better, then give me the worse quarterback. Since when was more turnovers than touchdowns a positive? Winston supporters say JW is a winner he went 28-1 but fail to mention the other 21 starters. Then they lose and it was the defense’s fault. OMG too funny
March 6th, 2015 at 3:54 pm
@ St Pete
I am tired of your Madden-like analogy of talent surrounding Winston. Just because a dude is labeled as a 4 or 5 star recruit; doesn’t mean he ran every route correctly.
FSU’s run game was one of the worst of all the power teams (80th in the country). The defense was just as bad (77th in the country).
Just because you can point out a single round 2 WR and middle round NFL TE on the roster it doesn’t mean he was on some juggernaught team lol. The o-line has a lot of players going in the draft but they weren’t the best line in the country and underperformed most of the year.
Running pro style offenses require very precise execution by all involved. If you are throwing to a spot most the time and the WR goes to a different spot; bad things happen.
Watching FSU games; with the lack of run game and defense; you could tell the defense knew the pass was coming most the game; as that was the FSU offensive identify last year until late. Despite that; and despite a lot of terrible 1st halves; they still had an undefeated regular season largely due to the fact that Winston could play so well in the 2nd half and 4th quarter when it mattered. That team likely loses 4 games with EJ Manuel or Ponder easily.
Also; a lot of the teams Winston faced were stacked with defensive NFL prospects; if we’re going to go with the Madden style analogy. Florida (6) / Louiseville (9) / Miami (13) / Boston College (11) were all ranked in the top 15 for defense.
Some of his interceptions were truly terrible. Not gonna excuse that. But the difference between the 2014 and 2013 teams is HUGE. Basically; what we saw last year is how well he can do without a running game or defense most of the year; and they wound up undefeated; but without the pretty stats. In 2013; we saw how well he could do with a good run game and defense.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:55 pm
Yea Robert. Its called your residence. Your pad. Your domicile. And your roommates are Yungry, Mr. Patrick and NYBucsfan. Sign hanging down there says “Troll Tribe”.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:58 pm
Dream vision I had.
In this dream, a #5 FSU QB was on top of this drunk passed out young girl, tearing her clothes off. She was crying and begging him to stop. In a closet watching and wanking was a DT wearing an old school Buccaneers uniform, number 76. Then from Heaven Malcolm Glazer was descending, he was wearing a Super Bowl 37 ring. It was hugh and shone like the Sun. Half way down he stopped and pointed to a current Buccaneers QB wearing number 8. At this point the Glazer boys under stood what Daddy Glazer wanted and they bowed down before him. As Malcolm started to ascend back towards Heaven he suddenly stopped turned and asked, “Why is Pear wanking off in the closet?” At this point Malcolm vanished.
March 6th, 2015 at 3:59 pm
@ the people who find it so insane that Winston played better than Mariota in the Rose bowl:
It’s not about the stats. I watched the whole game and Winston had to make a lot more impressive throws due to how tight Oregon’s coverage looked compared to FSU; and his single turnover that was his fault came on a crazy desperation play on 4th down when the game was basically over. The interception he threw was off the WRs hands.
Mariota played fine but his biggest plays typically were to some wide open WRs or quick screens that broke big. He overthrew WRs multiple times and made a terrible throw to end the half resulting in an interception. As pure passers; Winston easily outplayed him; but FSU had 5 turnovers that ALL lead to TDs; and 4 of those turnovers were not Winston’s fault whatsover.
One thing I noticed was that Oregon struggled in 3rd and long / passing situations in general. THat scares me. On the other hand; I’ve literally seen Winston convert at least 3-5 3rds and 20s. Dude is as clutch as anyone i’ve ever seen
March 6th, 2015 at 4:00 pm
Well said Lord Cornelius.
Barry – you thief!! Where’s my car you stole?
March 6th, 2015 at 4:07 pm
If Winston outplayed Mariota because he had to make tougher throws against a good defense (which is hilarious, Oregon’s defense is not good), then doesn’t that mean Cardale Jones is a much, much better QB than Winston? He shredded that Oregon defense with even better throws than Jameis made.
#FailForCardale2016
March 6th, 2015 at 4:08 pm
Can they charge #TheCreepCrab with a Hate Crime? I don’t see why not.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:13 pm
Nick Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 1:50 pm
Current Successful QBs listed by school only:
Michigan
Tennessee
Cal
Purdue
NC State
NC State
Miami of Ohio
Stanford
Eastern Illinois
Boston College
Georgia
Nevada
Ole Miss
Auburn
Utah
This list proves nothing other than the randomness of where these All-Pros come from. If anything, FSU should be lauded for consistently putting its starting QB in the league for the past 2 decades.
———————————–
And for every Brady from Michigan you have five Denard Robinsons, an Elvis Grbac, Drew Henson, Brian Griese, and a Jim Harbaugh.
We could go through the entire list of schools and come up with names of marginal NFL QBs that came through there and far more guys that never got a sniff.
Thank you for posting this list as it proves very little of point 3… there are no longer modern QB factories, just QB success stories that are few and far between.
Peyton Manning can’t be compared to Erik Ainge or Tee Martin or Casey Clausen… he was clearly better.
Just as Drew Brees was clearly better than every Purdue QB to come through (Curtis Painter for example).
And there are more Cal (and Jeff Tedford) failures at the NFL level than Aaron Rodgers could ever make up for.
College head coaches don’t make great QBs, great QBs make themselves.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:14 pm
lord cornelius……….lol
someone is making up for his shortcomings……
barry, brings those cars by the bridge tonight, we gonna have us a good ole hillbilly , taliban tag team up on some goats pickgrin is loanin us.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:15 pm
Lord Cornelius Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 3:59 pm
@ the people who find it so insane that Winston played better than Mariota in the Rose bowl:
It’s not about the stats. I watched the whole game and Winston had to make a lot more impressive throws due to how tight Oregon’s coverage looked compared to FSU; and his single turnover that was his fault came on a crazy desperation play on 4th down when the game was basically over. The interception he threw was off the WRs hands.
Mariota played fine but his biggest plays typically were to some wide open WRs or quick screens that broke big. He overthrew WRs multiple times and made a terrible throw to end the half resulting in an interception. As pure passers; Winston easily outplayed him; but FSU had 5 turnovers that ALL lead to TDs; and 4 of those turnovers were not Winston’s fault whatsover.
One thing I noticed was that Oregon struggled in 3rd and long / passing situations in general. THat scares me. On the other hand; I’ve literally seen Winston convert at least 3-5 3rds and 20s. Dude is as clutch as anyone i’ve ever seen
——————————————
Agreed 100%. Winston was far from perfect in that game but he was quite a bit better than Mariota, whose worst pass was dropped by the FSU safety when he threw across his body late and high over the middle.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:16 pm
@Barry
Please seek help.
First, return my car. Then seek help.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:36 pm
Straight from Tomorrow’s headlines –
“Robert9, barry, NYBucsfan, Yungry and MrPatrick arrested in SWAT raid for running a large auto theft ring. Additional charges include lewd and lascivious actions with not one but 3 underage billygoats and also unfounded and unlawful slander against an NFL franchise QB prospect – namely one Mr. Jameis Winston”.
Robert9 was quoted in his own defense – “Hey – Barry is the ringleader here. We were just hangin at the bridge pad drawing up new plans to make Winston look bad on the white board when Barry shows up with all these cars. He said the goats were ‘ready to party’ and we were all drunk anyway cause we don’t have jobs or nuthin – so we ran the goat train never thinking we’d have to explain.” “Besides” said Robert9 – “”you gonna tell me these goats look underage??? – Look 2 of the 3 have horns that are already budding out. – My daddy always taught me if there’s fur on the field – its time to play ball.”
March 6th, 2015 at 4:37 pm
Maybe we don’t need a QB at all…..if a QB can lose and be considered better than the opposing QB….we have a QB like that on our roster.
I think there have been many games that Glennon played better but we lost because of no running game, no o-line and poor defense.
To use a one-game critera for choosing a QB is absurd….either QB.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:38 pm
How many Oregon QB where select in the first round and how many first round QB did kelly or the current QB coach have. That is the dumbest argument I have ever heard. Jimbo has first round bust Consistently.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:43 pm
Skyline Crew Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 2:41 pm
Buctebow Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 2:31 pm
It will be quite humorous to me if Lovie trades for Cutler and then drafts Leonard Williams, so all of this endless Winston/Mariota speculation and bickering is for naught.
*************
If that happened I think a lot of us would blow a gasket.
**************
I’d but money on the fact that is exactly what will happen. We will see if lovie is still in charge of the draft.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:43 pm
Pickgrin, Nick, Pear you need to fine Jesus for only he can cleanse your sins and purify your evil souls. Idolizing an accused rapist, and the stoning of a innocent young girl is a great sin. I’ve been saying prayers for you all. Don’t let Winston lead you to Hell. God bless you all.
March 6th, 2015 at 4:51 pm
Finally a smart analyst who call it as it is not how everyone wants to see it. Specially those lunatic fringe FSU alumni or fans…
March 6th, 2015 at 4:53 pm
WS99 wants Tampa to draft Gino Torretta
March 6th, 2015 at 5:07 pm
I’m so bored of Joe posting every second rate college QB offering up their opinion about this guy.
None of them have the chops to make in the NFL as a player or a scout but yet they think they are qualified to make personnel decisions.
This goes for any “anal-yst” on TV talking about any player.
Please stop posting there boring tiresome stories, Joe. They are becoming mind numbing.
March 6th, 2015 at 5:07 pm
Jameis Winston is coming to Tampa in 56 more days.
March 6th, 2015 at 5:12 pm
Lol.
Career NFL statistics
Passing yards 41
TD-INT 1-1
Rating 35.4
March 6th, 2015 at 5:15 pm
the joes are divided.
and the third point is super silly and has no merit, and yet THAT is the one you find “a very fair concern”.
*eyeroll
March 6th, 2015 at 5:30 pm
87ForJameisNOMariota Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 5:07 pm
Jameis Winston is coming to Tampa in 56 more days.
87,
Why, did he forget something at one buc palace during his visit?
Remember your MGK mob last year?
This is Lovie we are talking about and it will be the GL(insert FAQB) mob this year.
March 6th, 2015 at 5:32 pm
Before Flaco….how many Deleware QB have been drafted into the NFL and won Suprebowls?……argument about where a QB went to school is totally irrelevant. Some are great….some are busts…no matter where they came from…
March 6th, 2015 at 5:37 pm
rflmao pickgrin.
props
March 6th, 2015 at 5:42 pm
“If Winston outplayed Mariota because he had to make tougher throws against a good defense (which is hilarious, Oregon’s defense is not good), then doesn’t that mean Cardale Jones is a much, much better QB than Winston? He shredded that Oregon defense with even better throws than Jameis made.
#FailForCardale2016”
Once again – Anti-winston posters seem to do the laziest evaluations and judgements.
Oregon’s defense was not good statistically on the year; but if you watched that game and thought they weren’t playing significantly better than FSU; you’re a damned fool. Oregon’s plays were wide open all game against FSU’s D for huge chunks of yards. While FSU had to methodically attack Oregon’s defense with a take what you can get – type approach because they were more disciplined and not giving up many huge plays. They also forced 4 fumbles and the team capitlized on all of them.
It’s like when Skip Bayless was saying Auburn’s defense is terrible and that he was dissapointed in how Winston played them. Their defense played lights out the 1st half of that NCG. They were on every WR like glue and literally just sitting in the spots where the WRs were supposed to come out of their breaks (probably because they were stealing signals the 1st half – not even a rumor but just a fact). Then in the 2nd half; without seeing FSU’s signals; the team started moving the ball down the field constantly on Auburn without struggle. It’s stupid to use year long stats and ignore what the actual game looked like.
Might as well just watch box scores next year and cancel your cabel or direct TV.
Also Cardale wasn’t “shredding” the Oregon defense with his passing accumen. They simply ran all over Oregon and his biggest passes were typically huge chunks to pretty open guys. Once again the kind of statement reflecting that you probably didn’t watch the game.
March 6th, 2015 at 5:54 pm
I want thank the FSU/Winston Fanboys.
Until now I was under the complety insane idea that good offensive schemes allowed for wide open receivers and good QB’s would then throw to wide open receivers. Now I understand that such an offense is just a gimmick and the QB’s are bad because they play in a gimmick offense and throw to wide open players.
I understand now from my studying the FSU/Winston fanboys posts that good offenses rarely get wide open receivers and good QB’s only throw to covered receivers. Thus explaining why gimmick offensive QB’s throw so few interceptions and good/Pro style QB’s throw many more interceptions.
March 6th, 2015 at 6:09 pm
@ rdbucfan
No one is saying Mariota is “bad” because he played in that offense. What people are saying; is that running a system like that did not give him the opportunity to show how he’d react and run a lot of NFL style plays and situations.
I think he’s an accurate passer. I’m not really as worried about that as much as whether he can un-learn what he did at Oregon and then learn / train his mind to think like a typical NFL QB does. For 3 years his mind has been trained to usually only make 1 read and then run or pass; and a lot of those decisions are made before the play is called.
I’m worried that he will naturally avoid the tight window throws / risk throws that are required in the NFL; because he has been trained to avoid those throws for 3 years.
He may end up amazing and be the next Rodgers but it’s such an unkown. It’s hard to find any tape of him executing more typical NFL style plays and going through progressions in a typical passing fashion. It’s easier to project Winston because you can find a ton of plays that are incredibly similar to what he would be executing in the NFL.
It’s pretty simple but this debate gets so twisted lol
March 6th, 2015 at 6:14 pm
LOL Joe,
I know that second point doesn’t weight heavy for you (e.g. Johnny Football)… BUT HOW IN THE HELL CAN’T iT?
March 6th, 2015 at 6:20 pm
1) This point is a double edged sword. Winston threw a lot of picks, especially when compared to MM and some recent others. Most others operate in a system where running is incorporated into the scheme. The double edge is this, Winston has experience making NFL-type decisions on the field. People say this is a positive, but it comes with the negative of being in situations where throwing INT’s is more likely. I think it’s fair to expect Winston to throw 20-25 INT’s as a rookie. He threw 18 last year and one would expect him to have learned from it. MM threw 4…. that will be impossible to repeat in the NFL. Even elite vets threw “at least” twice as many. Winston’s 18 is concerning, but I think it’s more in line with what his NFL performance will be. MM’s 4 is great but this statistic, maybe more than any other, is evidence of just how much a system can matter.
2) Yes it’s a concern. In the last two years he’s had the crab leg incident and the student union incident. People want to see an improvement in his maturity, this is a reasonable expectation. If you observe his timeline, you will see that. 3 incidents in year 1, 1 incident in year 2, 1 incident in year 3. The year 3 incident was quoting someone else. Yes it was tasteless and inappropriate given his situation. He’s guilty of nothing but a poor understanding of his own context. For everybody else it’s free speech. He is different though, I get that. It’s not absurd to think he may have learned that too. One of the things that gives me hope he is learning is that none of his mistakes have been similar. We’re not looking at a repetitive history of violence, or drugs, or theft.
3) Jimbo has a history of poor NFL QB’s….yeah, that’s true. I think EJ still has hope, but it doesn’t look good. I didn’t like EJ’s chances coming out of FSU, and was surprised he got drafted at all (I’m not kidding). As many people have already pointed out, what college coach has a good track record of successful NFL QB’s? Nobody. Let’s take it a step further and ask what school does? None. Standford with Elway and Luck is probably as good as there is. Using the coach or school as a predictor for success is really lame.
March 6th, 2015 at 6:40 pm
@rdbucfan,
There’s a speck of truth in what you say. Good offense’s do get WR’s open, and good QB’s throw to open WR’s.
The definition of “open” changes from the NCAA to the NFL. The defensive schemes are better and the defensive talent is “much” better. Both Winston and MM can throw to open guys, any NFL QB can do that. I think the difference between the two is that Winston has shown an ability to throw to guys who are “open” by NFL standards. In the Oregon scheme, that’s a throw MM elects not to take (usually). I’ve seen MM throw some gems, I like him too.
March 6th, 2015 at 6:42 pm
Lord Cornelius – you are talking too much sense for the anti-Winston crowd to acknowledge – much less comprehend.
March 6th, 2015 at 6:43 pm
It would be idiotic to use somebody’s school history as a reference for possible NFL success. Not everybody can be a great QB, but a great QB can come from anywhere.
To say somebody will not succeed because not enough good QB’s have come from Oregon, or a string of bad QB’s have come from FSU is just plain moronic.
March 6th, 2015 at 7:00 pm
I’m a Winston guy, but IMHO the best realistic outcome for the Bucs would be to trade down to 6 with the Jets and STILL land Winston or MM. It seems possible from the outside looking in.
March 6th, 2015 at 7:04 pm
“Not everyone can become a great artist; but a great artist *can* come from *anywhere*
-ratatouille movie
March 6th, 2015 at 7:06 pm
@Bill I’m pretty sure that neither of these guys will be around at 6. Teams that need QBs don’t trade out of the opportunity to draft one even if they are a bit overdrafted. How else can you explain Ponder and Geno or Tebow…nevermind on Tebow but Josh Freeman and Sanchez certainly qualify.
March 6th, 2015 at 7:07 pm
By the way, both of these guys are better IMO than anyone that I listed. I would much prefer Winston of the 2.
March 6th, 2015 at 7:17 pm
@Luther,
I love Winston. If we stay at 1, he should be our guy. There is an opportunity for a good trade down. TEN is not a lock to draft a QB, although it is likely. TEN is followed by the Jags, Raiders, and Skins…only the Skins are a possible QB threat. I think that’s VERY unlikely too.
If the Bucs can get a reliable feel that TEN would not take a QB….this is a theory we’d have to consider.
As much as I love Winston, I’d take MM and a trade package over him. Yes, this theory involves a lot of risk and inside intelligence. Additionally, it might be Winston who falls to 6.
March 6th, 2015 at 7:19 pm
@Bill my opinion is not take the risk and draft the best QB. We can gamble on any pick after that, just not our shiny new franchise QB.
March 6th, 2015 at 8:23 pm
There are too many variables that go into a QB success or failure to correlate their careers to the failures of others.
There are no evidence showing the relationship outside of Jimbo between those guys, just too many variable to bottleneck someone projection like that.
Thank God he’s not a GM.
March 6th, 2015 at 8:33 pm
Winston had WAAAY better teams around him than EJ or Christian Ponder. Or Jamarcus or Flynn for that matter. As a member of the Trade Down crowd I want to know why Those guys all had a better TD to INT ratio than Winston.
March 6th, 2015 at 8:37 pm
@ knuckledragger:
Here come the reasons:
1. The interceptions weren’t his fault
3. His offensive line was bad
4. His running backs weren’t good
5. Young new receivers were why his numbers were bad
6. He throws into tight windows because of the pro-style
7. Those crab legs and soda thefts were immaturity stunts
————————————————-
Is anything this man’s fault? Excuses, excuses, excuses. You know who doesn’t need excuses, Marcus. At some point you have to call a spade
March 6th, 2015 at 8:44 pm
@Yungry……..Yes I understand that there are FSU fans out there that have a hard time being rational. This said I think his 40/10 vs 25/18 TD int ratio has alot to do with the loss of Kelvin Benjamin coupled with Teams getting film on him. Im not saying that he cant be a great QB in the NFL because his actual throw is Phenomenal. Im concerned with the subtle things in his on-field game.
March 6th, 2015 at 9:13 pm
@Luther,
I see your point. I don’t disagree.
Let me paint a picture, an angle I’ve yet to see expressed here on JBF. Bucs nation is torn on Winston. We have FSU faithful, UF haters, and impartial Buccaneer fans. It’s very possible to be in 2, but not all 3 of the categories I’ve identified, lol.
The Bucs face a fan revolt….don’t draft a rapist. It’s a real thing, albeit ignorant on some subjective level. Most national polls show that MM is favored above Winston. This is not talent-based, this is a very clear indication that the nation views him as a rapist (I could be wrong, I doubt it). On a national level, FSU fans don’t sway the results. On a local level, they do.
What does this mean? The Bucs risk alienating half of their fan base while every other team in the league risks alienating “ALL” of their fan base.
JW brings a tangible fan following to the Bucs that he would not bring to any other QB needy team. He’s worth less to other teams. The Bucs should acknowledge this in their draft plans.
I think there’s a very real chance we can trade down and still get Winston. He’s more valuable in Tampa than anywhere else. If we play it right, we should get Winston and picks.
March 6th, 2015 at 9:29 pm
@Yungry,
At some level all of those things were his fault, and not.
The OL was expected to be good, it was not. The LT moved to C halfway through the year. That didn’t happen because the OL was performing well.
Some of his picks were due to bad decisions. Some were on the WR’s. The tape will identify what was what. As a Nole fan, I saw a handful of both.
March 6th, 2015 at 9:41 pm
Bill – if you trade down you miss getting a top QB – period. High percent chance both QBs will be picked within the top 3 picks. If either one slides past 5 I will be shocked. They are both good prospects (better than any QB in the last 3 years by far). Winston will be picked #1 by the Bucs and if Mariota is by any small chance still sitting there at 4 or 5 – Chip Kelly will come get him if not another team.
If by some impossible happenstance Winston is not the #1 pick – I guarantee you Tennessee will jump for joy and run to the podium with his name on a card. Titans may not take Mariota but they would take Winston in a heartbeat just like most any other team if they thought they actually had half a chance at him.
There’s a reason 9 out of 10 draft analysts are now saying Winston to the Bucs at #1….
And also Bill – FYI – The #1 pick in the draft has NEVER IN THE HISTORY of the NFL been traded for multiple picks. So this year would be the 1st time it ever happened if the Bucs trade down. Guess what that means – it ain’t happening.
Winston will by your new QB and it won’t take long for most everyone to be saying – “Thank God L&L saw his true potential, ignored the chatter – and did the best thing for the franchise”.
March 6th, 2015 at 9:44 pm
@Bill
—-
I understand. However, ALL quarterbacks have receivers that cause interceptions and FSU has 3 linemen projected in the first 2 days of the draft and a tight end as well. Not many quarterbacks can say they played with that much talent. If we get the 2013 version of Winston, I am fine with the pick! But, all quarterbacks have to deal with adversity its what they do with it that matters.
March 6th, 2015 at 9:47 pm
Yungry if you watched the Oregon v FSU game and thought Jameis played poorly then you should find a new sport. Man I wonder why some of you guys even like football as you have no idea watch you are watching.
March 6th, 2015 at 9:55 pm
Yungry Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 9:44 pm
If we get the 2013 version of Winston, I am fine with the pick!
But yet yesterday and every day previous it was “Rapist, Rapist, Rapist!” from you Yungry. You can’t take the slandering, Wnston hating stance for weeks and then just about face and say well – if he plays like he did a year ago then I support him. Which is it waffler?
March 6th, 2015 at 9:57 pm
@ ndog
——–
I never said he played poorly what I said was that Winston did NOT play better than Marcus did. Plain and simple. FSU had many fumbles that wasn’t JW’s fault. Also, thos lead to many scores. 59 points is a lot to overcome. However, Oregon has to deserve some credit too. They played hard and won! So, again if you can promise me the 2013 version of Winston I am sold and will be his biggest fan
March 6th, 2015 at 9:58 pm
Yungry Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 8:37 pm
@ knuckledragger:
Here come the reasons:
1. The interceptions weren’t his fault
3. His offensive line was bad
4. His running backs weren’t good
5. Young new receivers were why his numbers were bad
6. He throws into tight windows because of the pro-style
7. Those crab legs and soda thefts were immaturity stunts
————————————————-
Is anything this man’s fault? Excuses, excuses, excuses. You know who doesn’t need excuses, Marcus. At some point you have to call a spade
Those reasons are straight from former Freemanites. Believe me, I used to be one. The interceptions were not ENTIRELY on him, but holy crap did he make some dumb throws. Watch the Louisville game. His O-line was not overly horrible. He had a GREAT freshman running back FSU fans raved about. Running a pro-style offense is not an excuse for poor throws. And you do not get to break the law just because you are immature.
I actually really like Winston as a possible No.1 selection, but the excuses for his mistakes are beyond idiotic.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:00 pm
LOL at anyone saying Winston had a better game
http://scores.espn.go.com/ncf/boxscore?gameId=400610177
March 6th, 2015 at 10:02 pm
Hey Yungry also Jameis had teams that came back from behind to actually win games. Why did Mariota not ever have any teams that came from behind to win. How about let’s play the game both ways and see why you think Mariota fumbles the ball so much or why when he has no running game his team can’t score at all! Or why his team never won the chip even though James’s team did? All good questions right, so I will be waiting for the answers.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:07 pm
Boxscore boxscore wow this is not fantasy football man use your eyes. But if you want stats look at Mariota’s passing % in the red zone. Or his passing numbers when his team didn’t run for 200 plus yards. Those are stats actually more valid as they stretch over a career not just one game. If you want to look at stats look at them all.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:15 pm
Mariota threw 10 less yards on 9 less attempts. He threw 2 Tds to Winston’s 1 (plus he ran one in). Add to that that while they both threw only 1 pick Winston had this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hhT7j4Vhv0
March 6th, 2015 at 10:16 pm
“Why did Mariota not ever have any teams that came from behind to win?”
HMMMMMM maybe because Mariota didn’t play poorly enough able to to be TRAILING IN THE 4TH QUARTER. Hard to “come from behind” when your team is ahead don’t ya think?
“see why you think Mariota fumbles the ball so much or why when he has no running game his team can’t score at all! ”
You see that’s what happens when you run a spreadead option. The fumbles are inexcusable, just like Jamies’ INT’s. As for not being able to score with no run game, I beg to differ Mariota threw plenty of TD’s through the air.
“Or why his team never won the chip even though James’s team did?”
Jameis had the luxury of playing a very fortunate Auburn team that did not deserve to be there while Mariota had to play Ohio State. Mariota lost and deserves that loss. Jameis won and deserves that win, but tell me what winning a National Championship has to do with succeeding in the NFL? Nothing. Vince Young won it, Greg McElroy won it, Tim Tebow won it twice. Where are they now? Peyton Manning didnt win one. Tom Brady didn’t win one. Brett Favre, Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson, Andrew Luck. The list goes on.
Stop reaching.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:18 pm
@Bill my take on it is this: if not for the rape allegations, we would not have heard or cared about the bb guns or the Publix hookup.
Most people think he is guilty even though there is less evidence than guys who are actively playing in the league. Why should the Bucs hurt their franchise over hurt feelings real or imagined when there are no charges past or future. There may be a lawsuit against him in the future but that has also happened to other guys in the league.
Bottom line, as long as they can check his background, you draft the best QB in the draft.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:21 pm
The Bottom line (for those of you that think that a QB is all we need) is that in the Rose Bowl the stats are …..Mariota 3 TDs to 1 Turnover./ Winston TD to Turnovers.
There is NO other way to see it.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:22 pm
Winston had SIX- 4th quarter come from behind wins in 2 years and was 7-0 in games decided by 7 points or less.
Mariota had ONE – 4th quarter come from behind victory in 3 years and was 2-3 in games decided by 7 points or less.
So which QB’s play was more clutch when needed?
Which of these 2 QBs would you rather have under center down by 4 points with 1:53 seconds to go in the game?
March 6th, 2015 at 10:22 pm
Sorry………..Num lock went off
Winston ONE TD to TWO Turnovers
March 6th, 2015 at 10:25 pm
The logic in this guys piece is idiotic. Don’t draft a QB with a year of high INTs in college. So basically, stay away from Dan Marino or Matt Ryan. Don’t draft a QB coach guru’s pupil because other’s failed before him, ie stay away from Jeff Tedford pupil Aaron Rodgers because of Kyle Boller, Trent Dilfer. Don’t draft a QB who has off-field questions, so stay away from Ben Roethlisberger, Cam Newton.
So much stupid packed in such a short clip. It’s actually impressive.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:29 pm
No no no I said when his team could not run he did not throw td passes. Meaning when they put the game on him Oregon did nothing. A good example would be vs OSU where they were down late and still in the game but had to limit the run game due to time, what happened? They did nothing cause when the game is on his shoulders he folded like a cheap tent. Also Auburn did (according to everyone on the planet) win the greatest conference in the world last year but yeah they sucked. By the way over half of Mariota’s fumbles happened while he was in the pocket.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:38 pm
Pickgrin Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 10:22 pm
Winston had SIX- 4th quarter come from behind wins in 2 years and was 7-0 in games decided by 7 points or less.
Mariota had ONE – 4th quarter come from behind victory in 3 years and was 2-3 in games decided by 7 points or less.
So which QB’s play was more clutch when needed?
…………………………..
It is people like you that make me speak out.
Winston threw THIRTEEN first half interceptions.
Should he have ever needed to come back?
Just idiotic to say that he has so many Comebacks on a National Championship teams when he put them behind in the first place. How idiotic.
I have not even looked into how many times Mariota has been behind in the second half because I dont think we need a QB but your rationale is flawed
March 6th, 2015 at 10:43 pm
No College QB has thrown 13 first half interceptions in the last quarter century.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:44 pm
Im not Anti Winston ..per say…..Im ‘Anti QB’
Let the hatred fly though. I welcome it.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:44 pm
knuckledragger Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 10:38 pm
“I dont think we need a QB”
That statement alone renders anything else you say on the subject as likely to be equally incompetent.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:46 pm
Mariota lost like 5 games over 3 years and his offense was very fast-paced run oriented. When he lost games to teams like Stanford and Arizona State, the running did not just fold, so too did the blocking. He didn’t have the time of day to throw and when he did his offense was not prepared to run fast-paced stretched out pass plays, that is not the gameplay at Oregon. (Think Josh McClown).
Everybody and their mother knows Auburn was not the best SEC team in 2013. They had no business beating Alabama had Nick Saban shut his mouth and took it to OT. And they sure as hell had the touch of God help them in the game against UGA. They blew a ridiculously huge lead and won that game on freak chance. Why do you think Nick Marshall and the 2014 Auburn Tigers played so poorly in 2014? The luck ran out.
Again, the fumbles are inexcusable, a lot were his fault, a lot were due to option plays gone wrong, and a lot were due to him getting blind sided. It is a blemish on his draft stock, like Jameis’ INT’s are to him. No Andrew Lucks in this draft IMO. Both QB’s are projects.
March 6th, 2015 at 10:47 pm
How many TOTAL Turnovers does Winston have vs. Mariota?
Now, lets put that in perspective to how many TDs
March 6th, 2015 at 10:47 pm
@ndog
———-
Very fair points. Winston is a National Champion and Marcus isn’t-Great point! Also, Marcus does have a fumbling problem. The difference between me and Winston worshipers is that I admit Mariota has a problem instead of deferring blame onto other’s for Winston’s interceptions. Its time to man up and admit Winston has an int problem just like Marcus had fumbling issues while gaining over 2,000 yards.Maybe Marcus could blame the coordinator, line, running backs or other players for his fumbles. Would that be ok?
March 6th, 2015 at 10:48 pm
@Pickgrin Welcome to the club…I’ve come to that conclusion long ago
March 6th, 2015 at 10:55 pm
WOW!!
Great retort Yungry with Every bit of it being true. Kudos for counterpointing everyone saying that you were only Anti Winston.
March 6th, 2015 at 11:01 pm
I would just rather have a qb that actually throws the ball in a real offense that has proved successful in the NFL. The Oregon offense has never worked in the NFL over a period of time and in its short run (eagles) both years the qb got hurt. I don’t think Mariota can win at the next level like Jameis can period. Nothing in history shows that it will happen.
March 6th, 2015 at 11:06 pm
Both QBs are are very talented – but what you just said ndog is exactly why Winston is so widely regarded as the better pro prospect and also why he will be chosen before Mariota.
March 6th, 2015 at 11:08 pm
The Oregon offense does work in the NFL. The Eagles had a top 10 offense with Mark Sanchez! Also, Seahawks are consistent run similar formations. Other playoff teams are snapping from the shotgun but don’t run as much. Running too much is a concern, I agree. If the Bucs go with the traditional pro style Winston or Mariota would fit because they are both good in the pocket. I wonder if the oc will go back to the Oregon plan or stick with the NFL style like Atlanta ran last year also Top 10 with pro style. We can’t lose either way
March 6th, 2015 at 11:12 pm
@Pickgrin,
I’m an FSU fan, strong Winston supporter, AND lifelong Bucs fan. As a Bucs fan, if we can trade down AND STILL get the best QB in the draft…we gotta consider that path. I absolutely love Winstons game. The point I’m trying to capitalize on is that nobody outside of Tally does. Everybody outside of a 200 mile radius of Tallahassee hates this guy. He’s worth twice as much to the Bucs than he is to the Titans, or Jets, or Rams, or anybody.
All the negative PR crap that has been posted on this site over the last six weeks is real….but it means JW is worth more to the Bucs than any other team. Worded another way, the Bucs expose themselves to less fan loss than any other team would.
March 6th, 2015 at 11:16 pm
And since we are talking a lot in this thread about the Rose Bowl and which QB played better –
The way I watched that game was in looking at the QBs with an eye for – “Which of these guys looks more like a pro QB – and which of these guys would I rather have leading the Bucs next season.” That’s how I watched that game and evaluated the 2 QBs with my own eyes. Winston was better. He was more accurate on actual NFL type throws.
I encourage anyone who really wants to learn something to watch 2 videos. Excellent analysis of both QBs in that same game – and you can tell from the breakdown and detail that this guy knows what the heck he is talking about.
Here’s the breakdown of Mariota in the Rose Bowl with commentary as to how what he shows relates to the NFL.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCcm2Vl4TNs&feature=iv&src_vid=PYa6S6UA0MU&annotation_id=annotation_1614568351
March 6th, 2015 at 11:17 pm
and here’s the same person breaking down Winston’s performance in the Rose Bowl and how he thinks what is shown relates to the NFL.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYa6S6UA0MU
March 6th, 2015 at 11:23 pm
@Yungry,
It is questionable if the Oregon offense works in the NFL. It scores points, it gains yards. It has a 20-12 regular season record. It has “0” playoff wins.
March 6th, 2015 at 11:27 pm
Hope L&L chooses from: Williams or Mariota or Trade Down.
Williams >> If he is in One Buc Place, please get a picture with GMC & Big Cat!
Mariota >> Again, congrats to you (42/4) & Aaron (38/5) for being the MVPs together…P.S. Love both of your quick twitch smooth delivery release from the SHOTGUN
March 6th, 2015 at 11:32 pm
Bill Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 11:12 pm
As a Bucs fan, if we can trade down AND STILL get the best QB in the draft…we gotta consider that path.
That’s what I’m trying to help you understand Bill – we can’t. If you want Winston – then you pick him at #1 – no other way to get him. He is a generational QB talent. If the Bucs trade down even 1 spot – Winston will be off the board.
The only remote and I do mean REMOTE possibility is to work a 3 way deal with Tennessee and Philadelphia. A scenario where Philly moves to #1 and takes Mariota – Bucs move down to #2 and take Winston and pick up an extra 2nd rounder or whatever and Tennessee gets a bunch of Philly’s current and future picks. The odds of an intricate scenario like that happening are infinitesimal.
And as I pointed out before – the team holding the #1 pick in the draft has NEVER traded down – EVER in the history of the NFL. So the odds of the 1st time being this year and involving a crazy 3 way deal like that are so low its not even worth considering or talking about.
March 6th, 2015 at 11:51 pm
same old story. has anybody changed their mind?
and knucklegragger keeps saying he is not anti-winston but continues to attack winston. not one bad word against mariota or those supporters. lol
March 6th, 2015 at 11:53 pm
if winston is not picked at #1, he will be gone by pick #2. tennessee will take winston over williams. washington at #5 would take winston to replace rg3, and definitely the jets at #6.
March 7th, 2015 at 12:02 am
Only 3 thumbs down!
March 7th, 2015 at 12:03 am
@lurker he almost sounds like he’s on the radio at 3pm. He’s not against Winston either but yells at all the Winston supporters.
March 7th, 2015 at 12:04 am
“And as I pointed out before – the team holding the #1 pick in the draft has NEVER traded down – EVER in the history of the NFL.”
Incorrect. In total, 4 teams have traded out of the #1 overall pick in the NFL Draft. Including the Falcons trading up to get Michael Vick, and the Rams trading up to get Orlando Pace.
The Bucs could very well entertain trade offers with a good possibility of actually going through with it, depending on the offer. Don’t know if you noticed, but our team has more holes than swiss cheese. I for one am all for getting a QB, only because I don’t see an offer good enough to induce a trade, but you never know, some team may shock the NFL.
March 7th, 2015 at 12:07 am
lurker Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 11:51 pm
“knucklegragger keeps saying he is not anti-winston but continues to attack winston. not one bad word against mariota or those supporters. lol”
Lurker – He’s a Gator so he can’t help it.
March 7th, 2015 at 12:13 am
Time will tell on this one, so Im not gonna argue any more. The immaturity level around here is getting scary. Its getting boring. See you guys on draft day.
March 7th, 2015 at 12:31 am
Pickgrin Says:
March 7th, 2015 at 12:07 am
lurker Says:
March 6th, 2015 at 11:51 pm
“knucklegragger keeps saying he is not anti-winston but continues to attack winston. not one bad word against mariota or those supporters. lol”
Lurker – He’s a Gator so he can’t help it.
…………………………
Very astute of you Pickgrin for realizing that Im a Gator grad. Did you forget to mention how my wife is an FSU grad? or how I was never a ‘Tebowite’ because I was completely ready to address all of his flaws where most weren’t?
Did you get where I said i would LOVE to have either QB just not at No. 1?
I hope you did if you want to represent me in any way.
March 7th, 2015 at 12:39 am
Just hilarious. I make it Crystal Clear that I don’t believe in Either QB in this yr’s draft after posting here for several years.
This gets me called a knuckledragger.
I stand my stance and neither degrade nor laud either QB.
I DO raise Questions.
When I raise Questions about Mariota I receive NO hate
When I raise Questions about Winston OR his supporters I have to make a post like this one
March 7th, 2015 at 12:40 am
I am NOT against Winston
I AM against some of his Supporters though. SMDH
March 7th, 2015 at 1:04 am
besides the eagles. whoever takes m.m does not have to use spread. that’s all everybody keeps talking about most teams use both. its not all prostyle. and only pro style really the kid is smart just like Winston. but you FSU fans seem to think this kid is going to come in and play like he did in college your in for a rude awakening! I think both QBs are going to struggle most all do.so bringing up day after day after day how great they were don’t mean didly! THIS IS THE NFL. and Winston did not win those games or championship all by himself. and neither did marcus. my god! some of you really think this kid Winston can not do anything wrong. give it a break!
March 7th, 2015 at 1:10 am
@mikeh.
Good thing it is late at night so you don’t have to stick around very long do defend your point. I have said on many occasions that they are worst than the ‘Tebowites’ Not all of em by any account, but overall I think they are no longer able to rationally discuss the situation after defending him for the last couple yrs.
March 7th, 2015 at 1:15 am
*worse* not worst
March 7th, 2015 at 1:19 am
I hear ya pal it is getting nauseating really. they have one track minds.
March 7th, 2015 at 1:28 am
I was just messing with you gatrbuc – I mean knuckledragger – knew it would get a rise out of you – LOL
March 7th, 2015 at 1:34 am
look at the 2 knuckleheads patting each other on the backs 🙂
March 7th, 2015 at 1:35 am
Cool then Pickgrin.
You mildly got me. I have stopped reading most articles and just watch the comments. You are not my demographic per say, when I had my statement in mind. I understand you are pro WInston and that is cool but you do at least acknowledge concerns that are brought up
March 7th, 2015 at 1:37 am
like the interceptions. who cares if it was the receiver or QB or tip ball it happens to every QB FUMBLES too! but to say oh this one or that one was not winstons fault is Ludacris. some are some not. again who cares the kid did through quite a few picks. but that does not mean he wont be a good QB in the NFL. but these guys he can not do no wrong. if the bucs do take him and he does not do so hot what are they going to say then. I wonder? because he will struggle most do.
March 7th, 2015 at 1:38 am
“they have one track minds.”
again, another ironic post by mikeh.
March 7th, 2015 at 1:50 am
whatever! at least I don’t have a man crush like you and your mob. this kid has done nothing yet in the NFL to tell me he is the second coming of any QB in the league. he has to prove it so do all your wise a** posting toward someone who gives a rats a** cuz I don’t!
March 7th, 2015 at 1:53 am
MariotaOrWinstonOrWalkdaPlank Says:
March 7th, 2015 at 12:04 am
“In total, 4 teams have traded out of the #1 overall pick in the NFL Draft. Including the Falcons trading up to get Michael Vick, and the Rams trading up to get Orlando Pace.”
——————————————————————-
Ok – you got me – upon further research – all 4 cases of #1 pick being traded down are legit.
1990 – 1995 – 1997 – 2001
Its been 14 years since the last time so I forgot any of it happened – LOL
What’s interesting is looking at the details of those trades.
The team that had and traded the #1 pick to move down DID NOT receive very much in compensation in 3 of the 4 cases.
1990 – Falcons did reasonably well. They moved from pick #1 down to #5 and received a 5th round pick and an extra #1 the following year – along with a good Olineman in Chris Hinton and a great receiver in Andre Rison.
1995 – Expansion team Carolina only received a high 2nd round pick (#36) to move down from #1 to #5 and missed out on Steve McNair in the process.
1997 – Jets with Parcells as their coach in his 1st year there traded down from #1 to #6 and all they got in compensation for that #1 pick was an extra 3rd, 4th and 7th round picks.
2001 – San Diego traded from #1 down to #5 and received an extra 2nd and 3rd round pick for moving down. Atlanta got Michael Vick by moving up – but in a miraculous stroke of good luck – San Diego got the only other decent player in the next 20 picks in future HOFer Ladainian Tomlinson.
So in looking at those 4 instances that it did happen – the history is certainly not there to support the idea that you will get multiple high picks for trading down. You cant even consider giving up Jameis Winston for 2 extra picks – one each in the 2nd and 3rd round which is about the average of these 4 instances.
March 7th, 2015 at 2:03 am
So much exhaustive re-hashing and arguing done pointlessly in the comments section after every Jameis post.
They (The Tampa Bay Bucs) are going to draft this guy. It’s probably about 95%. You really all need to accept it and start to cope. Unless something very weird happens, he’s coming. All these comments and analyzing really could be cut to a minimum on the subject. Start preparing for it, and learn to cope. Get excited, if you’re smart.
March 7th, 2015 at 2:08 am
Lol
March 7th, 2015 at 2:09 am
“Right turn Clyde!”
March 7th, 2015 at 2:12 am
Someone have a sign?
March 7th, 2015 at 3:25 am
if you say your not anti-winston, but attack his supporters…
you might be a knuckledragger.
if you only post negative things for winston, but only positive things for mariota…
you might be a knuckledragger.
if you always complain of “awaiting moderation”, but use verboten words…
you might be a knuckledragger.
if you think the joes are out to get you, but you have never been banned…
you might be a knuckledragger.
March 7th, 2015 at 3:25 am
🙂
March 7th, 2015 at 6:55 am
I cant wait till this is over
March 7th, 2015 at 7:07 am
I’m confident the Chargers traded the #1 pick in 2004 (Eli Manning) as well.
5 Cases in the last 25 years? C’mon Man!
March 7th, 2015 at 7:14 am
The league/market has changed since then. We’ve seen lower picks traded for much more than the most recent #1 pick. I think it’s logically safe to assume that the #1 pick today would be worth more than the #2 pick yesterday.
Maybe I’m crazy. (Don’t answer that, lol)
March 7th, 2015 at 7:34 am
Bill Says:
March 7th, 2015 at 7:14 am
I think it’s logically safe to assume that the #1 pick today would be worth more than the #2 pick yesterday.
——————————————————————————-
There’s nothing logical about what the Redskins gave up for RG3. Everyone saw how that turned out and teams are now gun shy about “giving up the the farm” – so that is unlikely to happen again anytime soon IMO. Although – maybe Chip Kelly is crazier than anyone realizes.
March 7th, 2015 at 8:51 am
Bill-Drafting a player and trading him because he refuses to sign with them is kinda different. The topic was trading down out of the #1 overall pick in order to get loads of picks and the player you wanted all along. That Eli pick was more like the Bucs drafting Bo Jackson after he told the Bucs he wouldn’t sign with them.
Either way pickgrin is correct not to get ‘to cute’ by trading down and hope nobody comes up and gets your guy. It’s better to just go get the guy you want. That may work in later rounds but not the top QB coming out in years.
March 7th, 2015 at 8:53 am
“There’s nothing logical about what the Redskins gave up for RG3”
LOL, perhaps.
March 7th, 2015 at 8:59 am
Eli was picked after being “VERY” vocal about his desire to go to NY. It is different….lets go back to the statement that the #1 pick has NEVER been traded.
Times are a changing…
March 7th, 2015 at 9:01 am
Can you imagine the press storm if Jameis or Marcus said they didn’t want to play for a team? LOL
March 7th, 2015 at 9:12 am
Yes it just like Bo Jackson like I said. It was a trade, post draft.
I never had a issue with the 4 the pickgrin posted. I just don’t think trading down and still getting the top QB is very likely or worth the huge risk.
March 7th, 2015 at 11:53 am
I dont get the comparisons to Jamarcus Russell???? THis is the guy that after 2 seasons in the NFL still hadn’t learned his playbook. THe OC gave him a dvd with a movie on it and told him it was the playbook to study at home to see if he was actually studying and the next day said he studied plays all night. Winston already knows more about NFL offensives than Russell did after 2 NFL Seasons yet because they had the same coach at one point theyre comparable? You guys crack me up.
March 7th, 2015 at 12:08 pm
Klatt hits the nail on the head. The first 2 bullet points are the important ones. The third one is notable but not as relevant as the fact that Winston’s FSU teams were absolutely loaded with talent on the OL & skill positions (even moreso than prior Fisher QB busts).
Winston gets way too much credit for throwing some passes up for grabs to Kelvin Benjamin in 2013, and hardly anyone talks about all the passes he threw to defenders when he was bird-dogging O’Leary all of 2014. The media narrative just constantly works in his favor for whatever reason but it’s not gonna last in the pros when he’s playing on an even playing field instead of battling back with an NFL roster against lousy ACC defenses.
It just boggles my mind how overrated this kid is, but then again EJ Manuel was so much worse and he was a top pick, Christian Ponder is helpless and he was a top pick, Blake Bortles, Manziel & Carr (media still thinks he’s good lol) last year, hell there are NFL personnel types who are still getting hot and bothered for Sam Bradford cause they can’t come to terms with the fact that he was never any good to begin with. The NFL & NFL media simply cannot be trusted to evaluate QBs accurately.
Whatever, L&L already passed on Bridgewater and if they pass on Mariota this year then they’ve sealed their fate and exposed themselves as trash evaluators. If that’s what happens I’ll be on Bucs hiatus until they’re gone.
March 7th, 2015 at 10:49 pm
Should be forth bullet point, signed with a agency that deals with predomintely baseball players.
March 7th, 2015 at 11:52 pm
Jameis closed his twitter account. I guess people here won’t be able to stalk him to see if he posts something dumb. Glad he got rid of it. He doesn’t need the distraction or attention.