Which Dirk Koetter Does Lovie Want?
January 8th, 2015
The Bucs’ new offensive coordinator has a diverse background
Man, Joe wishes he could have been a fly on the wall when Lovie Smith interviewed new offensive coordinator Dirk Koetter on Saturday.
Joe can only imagine the giant grin on Lovie’s face when Koetter talked about handing the ball off to Maurice Jones-Drew a whopping 956 times in just three seasons (2009-2011), when Koetter was the Jaguars’ offensive coordinator.
Now that’s Lovieball!
In those years, Koetter was doing his best to keep pressure off veteran David Garrard, and later rookie Blaine Gabbert in 2011. Gabbert was injured but grinding through starting 14 games after that lockout-shortened offseason, following jumping into the NFL at 21 years old out of a spread offense at Missouri. It was ugly.
But there’s another Koetter, the guy who marched into the Falcons’ OC job in 2012, and finished the season about 10 yards shy of going to the Super Bowl.
He helped take Matt Ryan to another level, spread the ball around evenly to dynamic receivers and a Hall of Fame tight end. And Koetter found plenty of touches for rookie Jacquizz Rodgers and others.
Obviously, Koetter had no problem carving up Lovie Smith’s defense in 2014.
Joe’s really wondering where Koetter and Lovie found common ground when it comes to a philosophy of offensive football. That will be key.
Joe and others watched Koetter on Hard Knocks this past summer. So did Lovie. He talked about it in the summer.
In one episode, Koetter drew praise for his 1-on-1, personable-yet-tough approach with rookie quarterback Jeff Matthews, who was cut.
Joe sure hopes Lovie truly hands the keys to the offense to Koetter and doesn’t ever ask to drive or map a route.
January 8th, 2015 at 9:56 pm
He better or he will have another coordinator walk put on his stupid ass
January 8th, 2015 at 9:58 pm
Laughable on all fronts. 5-11 here we come
January 8th, 2015 at 10:01 pm
Joe are you telling me that Koetter never ran the spread offense before?
Surely that must mean the Bucs want Mariota…smh at some of you people.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:04 pm
DB55….I’m not expecting much more than 5-11 anyways. This team has a long ways to go, whether they fire Lovie or not next season.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:06 pm
‘Joe sure hopes Lovie truly hands the keys to the offense to Koetter and doesn’t ever ask to drive or map a route.”
Preaching to the choir there Joe. DB55 why so pessimistic. Seriously. Yes the Bucs were bad this year but as awful as they were it took a real losers mentality for them to snatch defeat from six potential wins. That would have left them 8-8 with no QB. A couple of dropped INTs that would have ended games…ASF’s fumble in OT after getting a first down on the first play.
I just don’t think the Bucs have it in them to be that truly horrible. I give them 8 wins next year and I do not discount 10 and a sneak into the playoffs for a one and done. Remember we play in the NFC South. The Dixie Chicks have an OL as badly as ours…they need a new HC and now a new OC.
New Orleans is a mess and Brees isn’t getting any younger and Payton seems bored. Carolina is the only team to beat.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:11 pm
I like the higher!can’t make everyone happy, opinions are like assholes everyone’s got one
January 8th, 2015 at 10:11 pm
@StPeteBucsFan
Told You Koetter was the guy…
January 8th, 2015 at 10:12 pm
Mariota bring your surfboard bruhhh It’s going to be great in FL
January 8th, 2015 at 10:16 pm
any word on his assistant coaches?
January 8th, 2015 at 10:17 pm
@StPeteBucsfan
To add to your point we had no offensive coordinator either 9 wins is definitely not a reach. I think we have the nfc east this year. I cant remember off the top of my head which afc division we have I think it’s the South but not sure
January 8th, 2015 at 10:17 pm
Is 5 wins next season with a rookie QB and new OC being pessimistic or realistic? 5 wins more than doubles the win total from 2014 after all. Then we bolster the OL hopefully keep improving. I just know I would love to see another Bucs Super Bowl championship before my eventual dirt nap.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:21 pm
7-9 or 8-8
January 8th, 2015 at 10:27 pm
“…Joe’s really wondering where Koetter and Lovie found common ground when it comes to a philosophy of offensive football…”
A little of “been there, done that”. If I am coaching a team and someone kicks my a$$ on the other team. I WANT to hire them badly. There is your “common ground”
January 8th, 2015 at 10:28 pm
@BeeMoney
Ok we give you scoreboard on that Koetter call. Care to go on the record with any other predictions?
January 8th, 2015 at 10:28 pm
@rayjay1122
Think back to the Rams and first Carolina game and how they ended. Now add both saints game, bears, and the browns game. That was with a less than serviceable qb and OC. The division title was in reach with an upgrade at both of those positions
January 8th, 2015 at 10:29 pm
This is a great day for Tampa Bay and also a great day for Lovie Smith. Smith has hired a competent experienced coach that is versitile enough to craft an offense no matter who our QB is. Lovie may be able to have his cake and eat it too…(you figure out what I mean by that)
I can’t remember an off-season this exciting and I’ve been there for every single one of them.
This is the start of something we’ve been waiting for…..Congrats Bucs!!!
January 8th, 2015 at 10:30 pm
Joe do us a favor so we can get the dumb asses off the the site or at least off the comments ask anyone of these A**Holes from a pure football stand point why would you draft MM over JW to be the Bucs QB of the Future and see how they respond!
January 8th, 2015 at 10:30 pm
Personally I see this hire as an indicator that the Bucs plan to draft Winston, not Mariota. Think about it Koetter runs a more traditional offense and a pocket passer, leading me to belive that Winston is the top dog to run his offense. Plus, if they were really trying to shoot for Mariota they would have waited until he declared to hire an offensive coordinator. All signs point to Winston at this point, is it not obvious that the offensive coordinator was announced the exact day after Winston declared for the draft. I say it is.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:32 pm
Way too early to predict wins. Really, I recommend NOT predicting wins at all. Just watch for improvement across the board. Wins will come when cohesiveness comes.
Besides, we only know the first pick now. There are 8 other picks coming our way.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:33 pm
@rayjay1122 Says:
“Is 5 wins next season with a rookie QB and new OC being pessimistic or realistic?”
Not too far off in my opinion. First, if we are grooming a rookie QB, even a “NFL ready QB”, they should not be inserted into the starting lineup until midway thru the season, at the earliest. So that means someone like McTurnover is running the team until then. So, 5-7 wins under Lovieball is pretty darn realistic. BUT, if we FINALLY, FINALLY have our franchise QB, who the F cares!!!!!!
January 8th, 2015 at 10:34 pm
@eric
I answered that with a complete breakdown of each in two different threads in the last day.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:36 pm
QUARTERBACK WATCH
https://www.joebucsfan.com/?p=129642&cpage=2#comment-3494371
Leading up to the Rose Bowl, during the week prior, I watched three games of Winston and three games of Mariota. While watching those games, I took notes, areas of concern for each quarterback.
I also determined to be objective going into the Rose Bowl, not to hold off the field issues against Winston. In fact, check all my previous posts, early on they were a concern (month ago), but in the last month I have not really mentioned those issues much, if at all.
So here is my evaluation.
Winston
Going into the Rose Bowl, I was watching for certain things from Winston. I had concerns about his wind up, his posture while passing, his pocket presence, his progressions, speed of release and leadership. Also, I wanted to evaluate the offense, see if it was truly NFL ready.
Wind up – It’s not an illusion. He isn’t quite as bad as Leftwich or Tebow, but he’s alarmingly close. Given his baseball background, I believe this is the contributing factor. I also have my doubts that it can be de-programed since he has it in both sports.
Posture – He places his weight improperly while passing the ball. This was consistently the case throughout the 4 games (3+Rose Bowl)
Pocket Presence & Release Speed – Winston holds onto the ball too long because he is very slow going through progressions. Watch him closely. He does not do it by instinct, and he rarely reacts quickly. His progressions are almost forced. This is alarming to me, because in the NFL, he will not have the time he has in college. Expect a lot of sacks and fumbles. He’s a statue in the pocket as well. Bad instincts for moving around.
Stares Down Targets – Winston consistently stared down his targets. Every play. Not once did he fool the defense with his eyes. Yes, he would stare, glance once to another target and then stare back at his WR.
Leadership – Okay, this is a big one. I was hoping he would lose the Rose Bowl because he was undefeated. No one had ever seen how he handled the adversity of losing, and I wanted to see how he did. Being undefeated is well and good, but that doesn’t happen in the NFL. What I saw was alarming. He consistently acted like a child, pointing fingers and screaming at his teammates. He blamed EVERYTHING on them. Even if it was their fault, which was the case at times, that is not leadership and we all know it. He screamed at his coach. Yes, it is claimed that happens all the time. That doesn’t make me feel better. In fact, it raises more red flags.
When he finally got himself under control, he gathered his offense and tried to give them a pep talk, but it was too little too late. You could tell by their expressions that he had alienated them with his behavior. That’s what we can expect if he comes to Tampa.
The Offense – Not as NFL style as people claim. There were often 4 WRs on the line. We rarely, if ever, see that in the NFL. I suspect this is because of his weakness in the pocket and scrambling. He cannot buy time, so they have to give him as many options as possible.
Mariota
After watching three games, I went into the Rose Bowl watching for several things. I wanted to see him under center. I wanted to see if his pocket presence was a fluke from the other games, because it seemed better than I’d heard. Progressions. I wanted to watch his accuracy on short, medium and long passes. I wanted to watch how he scrambled left (blind side). Would he throw on the run well? And Leadership.
Under Center – I did not see him under center once during the 4 games (3+Rose bowl). This is an area of concern, especially if we keep EDS as center, because EDS often botches long snaps. There is no sugar coating this fault. We don’t know if he will adjust to being under center because we have not witnessed it. Neither do we know that he will not adjust. It’s pure guessing.
Pocket Presence & Release – Throughout all 4 games, he remained mobile in the pocket. More than that. He had good instincts as to where to move in the pocket most of the time. He did not have a “run first” attitude like people have claimed. In fact, this was not the case in any of the 4 games. I suspect people pointing at “run first” have not done their research. He has a short, high release. This is a good thing mostly. He could get a little more range if he needed to by lengthening the occasional wind up slightly (not as much as Winston).
Progressions – Mariota detractors claim he does not go through his progressions. This is not what I witnessed in the 4 games. I saw him instinctively go through them very, very quickly. This, I believe, is a bi-product of the Spread Offense. Instead of having a set target, he has several options on each play. To me, this would play into the new NFL Offenses…the ones that are fast-paced. We heard Fast-paced coming into the last season, but it never materialized. With Mariota it would.
Accuracy – He plants his feet properly and he throws. there were a couple floaters that could have been picked off by a pro, but for the most part he was very accurate. What detractors pointed to as inaccurate was mostly ball placement to reduce risk of interceptions. He laid the ball right where it needed to be, consistently. Not every time, but consistently. This points to an instinct that many college QBs do not have. Winston has shown no sign of it. I saw Winston drop the ball right in the prime pick area several times throughout each of the 4 games. Mariota did not go deep much. I think he has the arm, but the accuracy was 50-50 throughout the 4 games on deep passes. Short to Medium were mostly spot on.
Scramble Left & Throwing on the Run – Out of 4 games, I saw him scramble left maybe 7 times. Only 1 or 2 during the Rose Bowl. Of the 7, he scrambled once, through the ball away twice, had one incompletion and the rest were completions (3). I think that’s reasonable because he made 3 of 4 attempts. It may not be his strength, but he can grow into it. Scrambling to the right and throwing on the run Mariota was deadly accurate…even across the field.
Comments
After objectively watching 4 games of each, I came away liking Mariota. I don’t usually watch college ball (boring; hate the rule differences), so I really did not have a bias. I will say this…I was bored watching Winston more often than I was watching Mariota.
Winston looks like Sean Kings younger brother, from the face to the gut. Which also is another similarity to Byron Leftwich.
Mariota has an incredible hand off. One thing that has bugged me of late (and winston is also guilty of this) is quarterbacks not “selling” the fake hand off. Mariota sells every play. The defense honestly could not tell who had the ball. Heck, he fooled me several times. To me, if you are going to fake a hand off, you need to fake the fake just as well. Do it consistently as though you are selling it or you will not fool anyone. Mariota excels at this.
So I’m now favoring Mariota, and these are the reasons why. Simply put, Winston is a bill of goods that is deceptive. Mariota, you know what you get and the deception is that he’s better than advertised at his supposed weaknesses.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:36 pm
Bring back Earnedt Byner as RB Coach
January 8th, 2015 at 10:41 pm
Lol at Winston being deceptive to every pro analyst and qb and former general managers who evaluated talent for years and get paid to do so. So what’s your qualifications again ? Freaking clown
January 8th, 2015 at 10:45 pm
We’ll revisit this when Scott Frost is hired as QB Coach …then try to spin it.
Booyah ,
From the desk of the late, and venerable Stuart Scott.
May he R.I.P.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:48 pm
Y u mad bruh? That was a decent analysis by BB.
Learn to love Mariota.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:48 pm
@joe
Just curious after we draft Winston will Glennon still be our qb of the future?
January 8th, 2015 at 10:52 pm
ufcguy
Say what you want, but at least I did the research myself and didn’t rely on the opinions of others. And for every “pro” you mention in favor of Winston, I can point to one for Mariota.
And, btw, what makes you assume I, or anyone here, is not a pro? You may be surprised if you knew who some of us are.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:53 pm
🙂
January 8th, 2015 at 10:54 pm
Thanks, Howard 🙂
January 8th, 2015 at 10:55 pm
Joe
I’m curious. Is your opinion of who the Bucs draft changed?
January 8th, 2015 at 10:56 pm
@Bonzai
Very nice and informative post. Thanks for the time you spent watching and sharing your observations.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:58 pm
Glad to see that most everybody likes the new OC hire..Good day for the bucs..
January 8th, 2015 at 10:58 pm
Who they should draft? Of course not!
Joe has no idea who they will draft.
January 8th, 2015 at 10:59 pm
Lol at mariota break down of his accuracy. A few throws I saw him with guys open over the middle which sailed way over the receivers heads he neither planted his feet nor did he step into the throw. Also on the pick he threw still can’t figure out who that throw was intended for but whatever
January 8th, 2015 at 11:25 pm
Joe sure hopes Lovie truly hands the keys to the offense to Koetter and doesn’t ever ask to drive or map a route.
lovie was afraid to ask the interim OC to run the ball more this year. lovie will give koetter complete control.
January 8th, 2015 at 11:27 pm
@BuccaneerBonzai Nice try…thanks for playing NFL scout. You seem to gloss right over the fact that Winston has great ball placement and anticipation. I’m not saying that MAriota CAN’T do those things but I know Winston can. Winston’s recievers were blanketed and somehow he was able to fit the ball in like he will need to in the NFL.
Next time you try to write and biased puff piece, why don’t you just say right up front that you are biased and have skewed your “unbiased” observations that way.
January 8th, 2015 at 11:27 pm
@iamkingsu says,
A few throws I saw him with guys open over the middle which sailed way over the receivers heads he neither planted his feet nor did he step into the throw. Also on the pick he threw still can’t figure out who that throw was intended for but whatever. ….key word: few
__________________________________________________________
I saw Winston throw 3 ints in one half of football ..nana nana boo boo. Hell, I even saw Winston fumble the ball in the Rose Bowl when no-one even touched him. See how silly that sounds? …then you must see how silly you sound? smh Sorry, I don’t usually critique others thoughts but I felt so compelled.
January 8th, 2015 at 11:40 pm
@samcro
I only brought that up because those came on the rare occasions that the defense wasn’t off balanced and set. Remember Oregon snaps the ball within 12 seconds most of the time the defense isn’t he even set. So how simple are those “progressions” he has to make. That’s why I pick those plays specifically
January 8th, 2015 at 11:43 pm
And not 12 seconds into the play clock either. It’s 12 seconds after the play is over
January 8th, 2015 at 11:50 pm
yup and Atlanta and rex ryan will know there offense good move!
January 9th, 2015 at 12:03 am
The common ground was they both see Glennon as the QB of the future for the Bucs. Prepare yourselves for with the first overall pick in the 2015 draft the Tampa Bay Buccaneers select Leonard Williams, defensive tackle out of USC. The Skyline Suicide Watch shall begin shortly after 🙂
January 9th, 2015 at 12:10 am
Super Mariota to the rescue Tampa bay.
January 9th, 2015 at 12:20 am
glennon = matt ryan style offense! book it! and I like it a lot more than Winnie Winston and his bullsh*t!
January 9th, 2015 at 12:26 am
‘Laughable on all fronts. 5-11 here we come’
A 150% increase in wins?
Sign me up!
January 9th, 2015 at 12:26 am
Seems to me the OC played to his strengths in both Jacksonville and Atlanta. If you had the human bowling ball known as Maurice Jones Drew, I’d give him the ball 300 times a season too.
Seems like the man knows how to run and pass the ball. No problems here with the hire.
Now onto to the offensive line.
January 9th, 2015 at 12:27 am
**** YOU JOE! MODERATE THAT!
January 9th, 2015 at 12:29 am
WINSTON S**** KEEP GLENNON! OR DRAFT M&M
January 9th, 2015 at 12:34 am
toesontheline said:
“The Skyline Suicide Watch shall begin shortly after 🙂 ”
isn’t there a line already?
January 9th, 2015 at 12:35 am
@mikeh is drinking/smoking the good ish tonight
January 9th, 2015 at 12:35 am
a police line?
“do not cross”
January 9th, 2015 at 12:37 am
Lovie is hands off of the offense. He always has been. He’s just had a poor track record of OC’s but that is due to bad luck. Every former player including Matt Forte has said that Lovie is completely hands off of the offense. This notion that Lovie gets his mitts into the offense and demands running the ball constantly is rubbish. The notion that he hasn’t been a great talent evaluator… not rubbish. Koetter wasn’t on the top of my list or even my 2nd choice, but I’m really starting to warm to the opportunity. A guy that can mold a rookie QB was paramount and Koetter has a history of success with that. The needs on this team are really easy to spot: QB, OL, DL in that order.
January 9th, 2015 at 12:40 am
hahaha MATT had a couple lol sorry man.
January 9th, 2015 at 12:47 am
@mikeh, ha I don’t judge. you do you. Totally disagree w/ your take on Jameis though.
January 9th, 2015 at 12:57 am
@Bonzai
Strong work with write up you had there but just a bit biased against Winston I’d say.
January 9th, 2015 at 1:11 am
@bonsai,
I’m going against my better judgment and attempting to point out the flaws in your “evaluation”:
WINSTON
Wind up – Yes, it needs to improve, but its not terrible. Wind up is something that is easily correctable with practice. And he’s giving up baseball obviously, so there is no negative reinforcement for him to deal with. This isn’t a huge hurdle.
Posture – I don’t even follow your analysis here. He stands very tall in the pocket. He doesn’t go down with arm tackles. His “posture” is fine.
Pocket Presence – So, you titled this pocket presence, but you start talking about reading progressions. Jameis has very good pocket presence. He knows how to manipulate a pocket with simple slide steps and decisive movements, so he has his weight moving in the proper direction and enough air space to deliver a strike. as for progressions, he probably goes through progressions better than 25% of starting NFL QBs already. if you REALLY want to talk progressions, lets talk about how mariota makes ~70% of his completions to his first read. the NFL avg is 30%. You criticize Winston for going through his progressions slowly, but ignore the fact that mariota hasn’t even proven he can do it at all. and the release speed is pretty good, and will only get better as the wind up is worked out of his game.
Stares down targets – Youre expecting him to be Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers w his ability to move defenders at 20 yrs old? again, comparatively, he is ahead of the curve for a college QB here.
Leadership – LOLOL. I don’t think I should dignify this w a response… but here goes. 1. You were watching a 20 year old fierce competitor struggle w/ the fact that he was about to lose for the first time since 2011 2. he did not alienate his team. his teammates would go to battle for him any day. if they looked like they had checked out, it was prob cause the score was 20-50. 3. have you every watched Brady, Manning, Cutler, Rivers, Favre, etc etc on the sidelines before? true leaders expect greatness not only from themselves, but from their colleagues/teammates/coaches. Brady yells at his OCs all the time.
The Offense – These are pro sets dude. Its not exactly NFL because its the college game where you can go 4 wide often. And its way more NFL than the Ducks offense. If you think he can’t buy time, you need to watch tape from 2013.
January 9th, 2015 at 1:19 am
Dude Minnesota won 7 games with the first year hc and a rookie quarterback. Get it together boys. You’re supposed to shoot for the stars and land on the moon. Not, shoot for second best and land on zero.
Koetter went 5-1 in the division, that’s great! But against Carolina in week 17 for the division title and a playoff birth koetter’s squad scores 3 points.
#teamcialis
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-gameday/0ap3000000450903/Week-17-Panthers-vs-Falcons-highlights
January 9th, 2015 at 1:33 am
@bonzai part 2 (sic. by the way. it’s ‘bonsai’. unless you fashion yourself a kamikaze pilot, in which case you’d be yelling ‘banzai’.)
MARIOTA
Under Center – Fair enough. If he is the athlete everyone says he is, I don’t see this being a HUGE concern. however, this speaks to the fact that there are some things that every NFL QB must do that mariota has virtually NEVER done, so there’s absolutely no track record here.
Pocket Presence – back to my comment about progressions… mariota, because of the great offensive system he is a part of, gets to throw to his first read a vast majority of the time. if that first read is covered though, the feet get happy. So there are two problems there 1. his first read isn’t going to be open nearly as often in the NFL 2. happy feet don’t work in the NFL, where the defenders are bigger, faster, and smarter. it could easily turn into a RG3, Kaepernick, Manziel situation. It hasn’t proven to be effective long term. Not saying he can’t learn… but do you want that uncertainty w/ the #1 pick? Release is good to very good, but let’s also remember he is getting the ball out quickly w/ either little pass rush, or he has made room outside the pocket.
Progressions – You’re seeing something that nobody else sees. and this would play into the new NFL offenses… the ones you self admit never materialized. Again, youre making assumptions instead of basing opinion on some track record. very dangerous when selecting the #1 pick.
Accuracy – Mariota has very good accuracy. But you conveniently neglected to talk about Winston’s accuracy, which is even better. AND lets not forget Winston is throwing into smaller windows, and before guys are even out of their breaks. text book NFL stuff. Not saying Marcus can’t do it, but Winston’s already doing it better.
January 9th, 2015 at 1:35 am
Bonzai
Excellent as always! Couple things, he does look like Leftwich. He does throw like a pitcher. He does bring baggage. I must have missed the finger pointing but I did see the hugs after all the fumbles.
As for M&M I don’t know enough about him. He looks fast but he better be Mike Vick fast in the NFL. He won’t be reading the DE but rather safeties n lbs, I would imagine that’s harder. And I would hope he’s practiced taking snaps all his life, idk. Thanks for the insight though. My money is on Lovie fking this up like he has with everything else so it should be an amusing next 4 months.
January 9th, 2015 at 1:46 am
@bonzai
COMMENTS
Well, if you don’t usually watch college football, that’s prob not ideal for evaluating college talent. I watch plenty of collegiate and NFL football. but its not to say you can’t evaluate what you see.
I’ll avoid the race card here, because i’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. Jameis is not out of shape if that’s what your insinuating. I’m actually not quite sure what the point of your comparison was there.
Please don’t tell me that “selling a hand off” is high on your list of criteria for selecting the #1 overall QB. Please.
In summation, and in my estimation, you cherry picked characteristics/attributes to prove your pre-determined opinion. If you want to get into the convo of the off the field concerns, I’ll begrudgingly go there too. But if we are talking strictly on the field talent. Jameis not only has the higher ceiling in my opinion, but he is the safer pick at #1.
January 9th, 2015 at 1:52 am
http://www.filedropper.com/img6372
January 9th, 2015 at 1:52 am
I am a Bucs fan living in Los Angeles. I do not root for FSU or Oregon. I just want to see us win. I don’t care if I’m wrong in the process. I will try to base this argument on facts as best I can.
Jeff Tedford was Lovie’s guy. He was quoted as saying they share the same ideas of football. What was Tedford’s about? Up tempo, no huddle, “speed in space” It’s safe too assume Lovie shared that belief. Now that offense never came to light. It did not fail so why not try that offense again with a new OC.
Enter, Dirk Kutter. Again Lovie talks about having the same idea’s about football. Could that what he originally wanted. If he wanted a run heavy offense c he would hired Greg Roman. Now when the offense could play with out having to make up for the defense what did he run? Screens out of three WR sets and heavy play action. Which QB runs screens and play Acton better than Mariota?
Who really knows. As Buc fans wither it’s Winston or Maroita as long as we are winning we should all be happy.
January 9th, 2015 at 2:07 am
Whoops, let’s try that again:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/v8wds4jnxvme9a1/Photo%20Jan%2009%2C%2012%2035%2009%20AM.png
January 9th, 2015 at 2:15 am
To sum it up Bonzai, your so called scouting report was nothing more than pure biased garbage.. You clearly have no clue what you are watching or what you are talking about.
January 9th, 2015 at 2:36 am
Hey Joe ! Whatta ya’ know ?
I am excited about this OC addition. Reasons:
#1: even though I (kinda…ya know) like the L & L team, I think it will help to have Koetter’s input for the draft. It seems he has had not only a lot of experience but also experience with different types of quarterbacks…. from rookies to pocket passers to spread qbs…AND he has had success….
#2: His future is tied to the Bucs and also to who they select on offense (God, I truly pray they draft one of the two QBs !) Even another voice about the OL situation is a PLUS ! I am not a PREDICTORj but this hire looks REALLY GOOD on paper !
January 9th, 2015 at 3:26 am
@BuccanerBanzai – excellent analysis – and by the way, cool riff on the famous “BUCCAROO BANZAI” radio/TV show (…unless of course it was an intentional allusion to peaceful contemplation brought on by the careful pruning of midget trees from Japan…but then it would make some of think deeper tan we should about the spelling of words we don’t understand ;)…not to mention it wouldn’t be as cool, and it would have been really hard to catch the correlation/reference to BUCCANEER football…).
I saw similar issues with Jameis – on each point – but I only watched two games this year. You absolutely nailed the “windup” issue, it’s a real killer at the next level. You know that was such an “easy” transition for Tim Tebow that it ended up canceling his professional career. IIRC – Tebow worked on it intensively prior to the draft…but only ever improved it incrementally. You just don’t change throwing motions that easily…no matter what the armchair kids say…
@Eric Hernandez – liked that West Coast insight comparing Lovie & Tedford, and similarities in philosophy with his new hire. Also the insight on Mariota, and the conclusion – in my estimation Marcus Mariota is the more favorable comparison to Andrew Luck. The QB I see when I watch Jameis Winston (and I can’t watch him very long) is Byron Leftwich…
I’m satisfied it will be Mariota…and I’m beginning to get encouraged that because the offensive philosophy is so different from a drop back attack, and the spread system is so prevalent – there may be plenty of lineman available to build out the line THIS year.
My concern is – so much is needed to rebuild/retool the offense – I don’t see the defense improving. Unless we can swing a Simeon Rice deal for an edge rusher this year – I’m concerned the defense may slip…
Well done, both of you!
January 9th, 2015 at 3:35 am
saw this in espn comments…
welcome buc, koetter!
lol
January 9th, 2015 at 4:56 am
I love all the analysis, I have a question? Ready, it’s the most simple question when it comes to seeing talent in football players. Does he love the game so much it makes him crazy? Does he care more about winning than anyone else on the field, and does it show? Does his teammates love and respect him? Does everyone outside of his team, aka media, fans, want him to fail? And last and most important, is he a WINNER? If you read all this, it explains the greatest football players of all time. And who does it explain to the T, Tom Brady. Also, who does it sound just like, Jameis Winston. A football player, is a football player, and it’s something Jameis has over Mariota. Nice guys finish last in a Man’s game my friends.
January 9th, 2015 at 5:44 am
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
and who says Mariota doesn’t possess the same traits? …you?
BS
January 9th, 2015 at 7:14 am
Matt-
Nice analysis, that is much closer along the lines of what I have seen. I read recently that in the FSU-Oregon game that something along the lines of 50% of Mariota’s passes were at the LOS. Then you watch the game and the few times he threw down the field he was inaccurate and too high. Inside the pocket, when he stayed there, he didn’t display any preternatural sense…he was either running or throwing…there was no shuffling of feet or manipulating of defenders. I just didn’t see anything there other than a project that would take plenty of time before we knew if he would be anything in the NFL.
Bonzai-
I appreciate your time and effort (and excellent spelling and grammar) but it was obvious in your write-up that it clearly unveiled your bias against Winston. EVERY expert states that ON the field, Winston is far superior. Now, I’m not one to discount what a person says because they aren’t a so-called expert. During Kaepernick’s senior season I had him touted as a late 1st round pick and potential superstar while everybody and their mother’s called me crazy. On draftcountdown.com, the main writers there, Shane Hallam and Scott Wright thought CK was barely draftable…and they let me know it. That being said, I don’t see the qualities in Mariota that really stand out other than his obvious physical gifts. I honestly see Mariota as another version of CK, CK may have a stronger arm, Mariota might be a little more calm, and even though I know he’ll be drafted far higher than what I see him as, I think at best he SHOULD be a late 1st round pick. Winston, based on his play on the field, is a clear top 3 pick.
January 9th, 2015 at 7:19 am
For those interested in also watching tape til your head hurts, the best site on the net for watching player specific tapes that are cut for only that player, it’s over at draftbreakdown.com. Mariota has 22 complete games there and Winston has 9.
January 9th, 2015 at 7:20 am
Im going to say they will have at least over. .500 season with mariota… hes the andrew luck. Every thought luck would fail and hes in the playoffs playing peyton this weekend.. doesnt seem like a fail to me as a rookie
January 9th, 2015 at 9:32 am
Slow down on the wins for 2015. I believe we did that last year. Predicting 8-8, 9-7 playoffs and some even mentioning SB. And just like last season, these predictions are coming in before the draft and before Koetter can wrap his head around his new offense. Like the hire BTW. Was sure we would wait till all the decent guys were gone.
Gonna be a long off season but Joe will get us through it again.
Go Bucs!!
January 9th, 2015 at 9:41 am
Brandon,
For the record, I did give credit to bonsai/banzai for breaking it down. Just disagree w most of the content and structure. Thx for the tip on the film.
January 9th, 2015 at 12:05 pm
I liked Winston last year. I at there highest potential Winston=Big Ben, Mariota=Rodgers
January 9th, 2015 at 4:21 pm
eric Says:
January 8th, 2015 at 10:30 pm
Joe do us a favor so we can get the dumb asses off the the site or at least off the comments ask anyone of these A**Holes from a pure football stand point why would you draft MM over JW to be the Bucs QB of the Future and see how they respond!
Wow dude take a chill pill! Seriously seek help. You have some real anger management issues. You call people a**holes simply because they have a different opinion than you on something as important in life as football?
Really? Did you think before you wrote that? I disagree with many here as they do me. I respect some opinions (whether I agree with them or not) more than others, but in no case do I consider anyone an ahole for simply holding a sports opinion different than mine!
Of course if someone is calling ME and ahole then that makes them one I guess? 🙂
I don’t feel the need to ask Joe to clear the board of anybody! LMAO