Bucs Aren’t Just Leftovers
July 18th, 2025
Credit where credit is due.
Yes, we are inching toward training camp next week — next week!
Joe has typed a lot about disrespect this summer. This player is disrespected, that player is disrespected, hell the whole franchise is disrespected from national know-it-alls who scoff at the Bucs despite them having a 3-1 record against the Eagles and Lions since January 2024 (and that one loss was a one-score game). And the Bucs have made the playoffs the past five seasons.
NFL humorist/data man Mike Tanier, typing for Aaron Schatz’s FTN Football Almanac 2025. believes a big part of the widespread dissing of the Bucs is a misperception.
Tanier noted the Bucs are not living off the 2020 Super Bowl win and are not “classic rockers touring the state fair circuit without their lead singer.” Instead, Tanier noted, the Bucs are a solid young team that just happens to have two or three veterans still playing top-shelf football who remain from that magical 2020 season.
And for that, Tanier said Bucs AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht and Bucs coach Todd Bowles deserve a lot of credit.
What Bowles, general manager Jason Licht, and the Bucs have done in the post-Brady era should not be trivialized. They gave their fans not just wins to enjoy and playoff games to attend but long-tenured stars such as [Lavonte] David and Mike Evans to root for: guys whose jerseys can proudly be worn to the tavern on game day forever.
The 2023-2024 Bucs also took the legacy of Super Bowl LV back from Brady to a degree. That 2020 championship was not just Brady’s final grace note or the work of some mercenaries for hire, but part of a sustained period of excellence for homegrown stars. Bowles has pivoted out of Arians’ shadow and now sends his offensive assistants out into the world as hot young masterminds. Licht has proven that a team built for short-term success around a living-legend quarterback could be rebuilt without some sort of purging/tanking drama. All it took was some mutual respect. And a state with zero income tax. And an easy division. But it’s wise to leverage all the resources at your disposal.
Well, there is one guy who gets it. Joe thinks Tanier hit the nail on the head saying too many people think the Bucs were just Tom Brady and his 52 dwarves.
The Bucs were not. And are not.
July 18th, 2025 at 10:42 am
There’s not many NFL teams wins their 4 consecutive seasons in a row. Especially while undergoing a major rebuild.
The Falcons, Panthers, Saints were also going through a rebuild. But they had a difficult time keeping a HC.
Jason Licht and Todd Bowles deserves a lot of credit
Credit for maintaining a good, solid football team while rebuilding
They deserve credit for maintaining a quality coaching staff
Credit for drafting players that fit their culture
They deserve credit for developing these young players
I give them credit for turning a notorious 13 year (bottom feeders) into a consistent playoff team with Super Bowl aspirations
July 18th, 2025 at 10:51 am
Disrespect should be showered on those with zero Super Bowl trophies.
July 18th, 2025 at 10:54 am
I have possibly called Tom Brady a few names in my lifetime. But one thing I have not called him is dumba$$. He knew what kind of team he was joining. I’ve also called Baker a few names. But he’s not dumb either. He said yes to the Bucs and folks say he had no other options. Hogwash. He also knew what kind of team he was joining. Drafting a QB is generally a crapshoot. A good QB could see from a mile away that Tampa Bay was doing things the right way. These last two QBs of ours have a passion. For winning. They said yes to Tampa. For a good reason.
July 18th, 2025 at 10:56 am
Everything LaklandBuc said is right on the money. A decade of winning seasons would be a nice way to make that rough patch of losing even smaller in our rearview. Another SB appearance and/or win in the next 2-4 years , I might forget about the lost decade altogether.
July 18th, 2025 at 11:06 am
… and in return for these QBs services, we have a second super bowl trophy and a couple career years from Baker… Who also led all QBs intotal touchdowns during that time. Pretty solid trade-off from both sides!
July 18th, 2025 at 11:24 am
Lakeland Buc … Exceptional analysis! I think that winning the division over these past 3 years especially has resulted in many forgetting that we did it ‘while undergoing a major rebuild’.
Chances are that our 2025 team will only have 8 players left from our 2020 & 2021 teams: Evans, Godwin & Wirfs on offense, and LVD, Vea, Winfield, Dean & Nelson on defense. That’s a pretty hefty turnover in just the past 3 years.
July 18th, 2025 at 11:41 am
Kenyon
While you’re not wrong… we weren’t Brady’s first choice.
July 18th, 2025 at 11:58 am
As a Die Hard!!! agree 100%… great article!!! Go Bucs
July 18th, 2025 at 12:24 pm
Cannot disagree with Tanier. It’s too bad that Todd won’t hire a full time DC to mentor so he can focus 100% of his time on the most important job – being a head coach. And the full time DC would have more time to fix the pass defense.
We’d be 2-3 wins a year better. At least.
July 18th, 2025 at 12:37 pm
PS – love this metaphor, Joe!
“ classic rockers touring the state fair circuit without their lead singer. “
Or, and this happens, the rhythm guitarist who toured with (famous band) for one tour puts together a bunch of scrubs and pretends to be a tribute band for (famous band). They run amongst us in the county fair circuits!
July 18th, 2025 at 12:48 pm
Ever since we hired Bruce Arians we immediately got better. When we signed Brady we exploded. Like Lakeland Buc said: we even won while transitioning away from Brady. Baker has been a godsend. Like that old Joe Walsh song: ” I can’t complain but sometimes I still do”. But this year, assuming Morrison doesn’t hold out till Halloween, we should be a real contender. Heck, even if he does. TBH, I think that situation is going to be ugly. Personally, I hope all 30 of the second round holdouts have to reenter the draft and wind up as 5th + round picks next year. McDonalds is hiring.
July 18th, 2025 at 12:58 pm
HERE’S A QUESTION:
If it’s so easy to win the NFCS, why is it that only the Bucs can do it?
If it’s so easy, shouldn’t any team in the division be able to pivot in the off season and win the NFCS the following year?
July 18th, 2025 at 1:41 pm
I agree with much that is being said. I just can’t agree with the defensive coaching part of the parade. No way I can of good conscience claim that the coaching has been anything but poor at least in the secondary. (It’s his age and physicality) The Big Fail was and IS the lack of a “Full Time DC”. Until THAT changes,…… The results won’t change.
With that said, it doesn’t mean that Bowles doesn’t deserve flowers..
He gets Credit for having a Remarkable eye for picking OC’s! Yes He DOES! He MUST have some type of accomplishment record for that. I’ve Never heard of So Many OC’s (ROOKIE OC’S BTW) being shipped out Immediately to Head Coaching jobs after 1 season! THAT is a True Blue Accomplishment… Impressive!
He (I guess) turned around Back to Back miserablely going seasons to sqeak us by into the playoffs? Nah! That was Baker and the OG’s with Super Bowl rings…
He HAS However been able to keep a “loyal to him” locker room of which I’m Sure had an affect that Helped to translate to getting some Really Good hometown deals from the Best on the team. It didn’t hurt… I Can assure you of that…
His “game time” management lacks excitement and or sizzle. I’m not sure what to say about that other than giving my own “deer in the headlights” look.
But I’m “hopeful” that he’s FINALLY not as scared of big moments and will be able to handle them better. (ESPECIALLY if this “sideline manager” can SHOCK HIM into WAKING UP in the middle of a game enough to react within a timely manner and maybe even make good decisions) The good….. At least there is someone there to try. (Last years “sidelines manager” FAILED so badly that most people don’t even realize There Actually Was One last year!)
I have Very High Hopes that THIS IS the year that Todd looks the part and Dominates.. He Deserves some flowers. He Should get credit for the Good if he has to take hits for the bad.. His eye for OC’s though….. NICE.
SUPER BOWL OR BUST!
July 18th, 2025 at 1:48 pm
Why does zero state income tax it always come up when national media talks about Tampa Bay as a destination? I mean, yeah it matters, but you know who else has zero state income tax?
Miami Dolphins
Jacksonville Jaguars
Tennessee Titans
Las Vegas Raiders
Dallas Cowboys
Houston Texans
Seattle Seahawks
I wonder if zero income tax is touted as much in those teams’ media coverage as it is in the Bucs?
July 18th, 2025 at 1:52 pm
My point in my above statement, and supported by LakelandBuc’s comments (btw, I’m a Lakeland native myself, lol), the Bucs SHOULD be commended as a well-run franchise, with zero state income tax being a bonus consideration.
Also, the last number of drafts I’ve watched, I’ve seen our draft picks be excited about coming to Tampa. Emeka Egbuka was fired up when the Bucs called his name. That’s because this franchise is doing a lot of things right.
July 18th, 2025 at 2:36 pm
A sllghtly related question attached to this statement that is given wide credence from all here.
“And a state with zero income tax.”
If we have any TRUE professional accountants around here to suss that our for us I’d love to see their details.
My “perception” backed by the “opinion” of knowledgeable people.
The claim that rich people don’t pay taxes in the US is an oversimplification, but it stems from the fact that the wealthiest Americans often pay a lower effective tax rate than middle-income earners due to factors like lower capital gains taxes and the ability to use strategies like borrowing against assets to avoid selling them and triggering taxes.
While the top marginal income tax rate may be high, the EFFECTIVE tax rate (the actual percentage of income paid in taxes) can be lower for the wealthy because of deductions, credits, and how their income is structured.
I just find it hard to believe that “smart” players like Brady and Suh had any problems with Florida’s tax rate. They have great accountants!!! And THEY are themselves very smart! If they can’t work Florida they’ll use that tax expense to work savings out of the Fed bill.
A famous billionaire once said, “I understand the tax code better…I’m smart for paying no taxes.” Who can argue with that?
July 18th, 2025 at 2:40 pm
BTW I selected Brady and Suh intentionally. Suh was known as an incredibly talented mercenary also a talented player.
Brady was known for his hometown discounts for the Pats but it’s unknown, at least I haven’t read, how much of a ‘discount” Brady gave Jason and BA for the chance to QB a SB ready team. Given his enormous wealth and brains I suspect Brady was easy for Jason to land.
July 18th, 2025 at 3:23 pm
We basically won the Super Bowl with Free Agents that Jason Licht signed, or traded for. And the young guys that Licht drafted blended in with them. Licht did a great job of bringing in quality veterans
QB Tom Brady
WR Antonio Brown
TE Gronk
Center Ryan Jensen
RB Leonard Fournette
DT Suh
OLB JPP
OLB Shaq Barrett
Now Licht is doing a better job of building from the draft
July 18th, 2025 at 3:38 pm
“Tanier noted, the Bucs are a solid young team that just happens to have two or three veterans still playing top-shelf football who remain from that magical 2020 season.”
2 or 3?? I count at least 6:
Evans, Godwin, Wirfs, Vea, LD54, Winfield
7 if you want to include Dean….
July 18th, 2025 at 3:45 pm
DR, somehow I would have thought we had more of that 2020 team on the roster. But those eight are a heck of a nucleus to build around! And stpetebucsfan, it’d take a little more space than we have here to discuss tax ramifications for the uber wealthy choosing a state with no income tax versus a state with income tax. But you should know that the famous billionaire of who you speak lost money every year of his life and lost more money than any individual in history in one year. First year he ever made money was thru some show where he fired people. Only year we ever saw a record of his taxes(he leaked that year) was when a Russian oligarch paid inflated amounts for his property. So said billionaire paid about an 18 percent effective rate. But it’s easy figuring taxes for someone losing money at that clip (bankruptcy most years. You are the opposite of smart when you pay no taxes. Smart business men have to pay taxes, they just mitigate the amount they pay through sheltering and other available methods.
July 18th, 2025 at 4:28 pm
Kenton
You made a great point. I picked a bad example for sure. Furthermore let’s leave the person whose name shall not be mentioned for fear of triggering anybody.
And yep you’ve got the concept down pat. I think the real question is how difficult, how much money do you need to just laugh at tax codes? I certainly don’t know but from my original bad triggering example how about this list from the Googles. All please note, there are people on this list that offend others on BOTH sides of the aisle so IT’S NOT POLITICAL. I’m honestly curious why this is always trotted out when it’s probably minimal at most.
Jeff Bezos: Paid zero federal income tax in 2007 and 2011.
Elon Musk: Paid zero federal income tax in 2018.
Michael Bloomberg: Paid zero federal income tax multiple times in recent years.
Carl Icahn: Paid zero federal income tax twice.
George Soros: Paid zero federal income tax three years in a row.
This is NOT a political thing where one side does and the other doesn’t. It’s the American way and probably has been since back at least to the Gilded Age.
I’m not BLAMING these men or anybody who simply avails themselves of our laws.
July 18th, 2025 at 4:57 pm
One note about the zero state income taxes – someone more well-versed in the area may correct me; it’s my understanding that the state in which the game is played in is the basis for that game’s check for tax purposes. For example, when the team plays in any of the FL stadiums, there would be no state income taxes for that week’s game. If they played in say, California that week, their game check would be subject to California state taxes.
It’s more than just where the Bucs themselves call home, but also the friendliness of their schedule and if those states also don’t pay state income taxes.
July 18th, 2025 at 5:33 pm
Bowles should be as smart on Defense and recognize his ideas and game plans are not working and hire a defensive coordinator that has established success. Thats what a true head coach would do.
July 18th, 2025 at 5:34 pm
The fact that we had so much player turnover ie we were “rebuilding” and have managed to be competitive and successful by most accounts is being overlooked by more than a few critics and that is unfortunate. The narrative that Todd took a Superbowl team and turned it into a loser is incorrect at best. That team (the SB winner) disintegrated rapidly after the SB season and a new team is started growing from the ashes….. This time without the short term rentals and mercenaries.
I have not been a lifelong Bucs fan… But it’s hard to imagine there being a better time to be a fan of the Krewe 👍🏼
July 18th, 2025 at 5:59 pm
BucYou
You are absolutely correct. Decades ago California set the precedent with what was called the “jock tax”. Michael and the Bulls were coming to the Forum and they wanted their share, 20 + other states have followed suit.
So sign with the Bucs you’ll pay taxes for all home games, no state tax when you play in New Orleans or Carolina (no jock tax) but Atlanta will tax you. Of course if you decide to live in Florida you save there.
The Falcons love playing in Tampa…IF 1/17 of their state income tax bill is erased I guess.
July 18th, 2025 at 5:59 pm
Taxes for NO home games typo
July 18th, 2025 at 6:07 pm
Long time Buc fans have lived through long “droughts” for this franchise. (Being a non-native and becoming a fan in the 90s I’ve only lived through one, the one up to 2020.)
I contend that we are in the midst of a great era. We have continued to be relevant. It is going to take at least an improved record and more than an appearance in the post season to reduce the stigma that has been assigned us because of the past. This 50th anniversary season and subsequent seasons should do the trick.
Go Bucs!!
July 18th, 2025 at 6:13 pm
GoneGator … ‘The narrative that Todd took a Superbowl team and turned it into a loser is incorrect at best. That team (the SB winner) disintegrated rapidly after the SB season and a new team is started growing from the ashes….. This time without the short term rentals and mercenaries.’
I love the way you phrased that Gator. It’s taken us 3 years to rebuild this puppy, but I think we’re on the verge of having a truly special team. Our 2022-2024 regular season records have shown steady improvement, especially on offense admittedly. I’m hoping (and anticipating) that this is the year we turn the corner with our defense. We’re young & hungry (visions of Raheem just crept in), and I don’t think there are any teams who we couldn’t beat as long as we can stay healthy.
July 18th, 2025 at 6:15 pm
Licht did am absolutely amazing, spectacular pivot from renting tons of mercenaries to building through the draft and seems to have pulled it off rather seamlessly proving you can win using either method but consistency using the draft is MUCH easier. He should be considered a living GM Legend.
As far as paying taxes there is no justification for paying no taxes or a lower tax rate than the middle/lower classes. It’s gluttonous and disgusting. All the loopholes- especially living off bank loans and writing off the interest while all your money explodes in the market needed closed ages ago. Getting rid of trickle down economics could save the middle class before they go extinct, but we are running out of time and available money.
July 18th, 2025 at 7:12 pm
SPBF
Thanks for confirming. That just goes to show that at the minimum, 10/17 games yearly will have no state income taxes for the players (same also goes for NO and CAR). Since the NFL rotates the divisions the teams play, it’s fairly easy to model a contract in such a way that the player receives the most tax benefits possible over the duration of the contract.
I’d be stunned if that didn’t factor in in some way for Godwin when he was deciding between TB and NE. The familiarity, the weather, the camaraderie of the locker room, and the teams immediate ability to compete and further his legacy were certainly much bigger factors for taking less money, but the tax benefits would have definitely been a plus in his family and team’s decision-making.
July 18th, 2025 at 7:16 pm
No kidding!
July 18th, 2025 at 7:35 pm
Joe, a follow up to the discussion of contract structuring we’re having, perhaps you’ll know the answer. Once a yearly salary is agreed upon, do the checks get split equally amongst all games? Example, a player signs for $17M/year, would each game pay that player $1M, or could the contract be structured in such a way that Week 1 in a no state income tax state pays $1.75M and Week 2 in a state income tax state pays $250K, etc? I’m just using arbitrary numbers for this example.
July 18th, 2025 at 9:26 pm
@DR
💯 Agree
July 18th, 2025 at 10:10 pm
St.pete
Concerning your post “Who can argue with that”…..
They are KNOWN AS…..
Socialists
Marxists
and they All eventually end up being known as “Communist”…
They can’t stand personal freedom or understand the notion of the government WAS NEVER intended to hold the power it Already Does over our heads and “Not Much the Less” the Freedoms they STEAL from us whether it be a small local government or the All Mighty Federal Government, “Every time they meet”!.. You Lose a portion of YOUR FREEDOM “EVERY TIME” THEY DROP THAT GAVAL!
Don’t EVER FORGET that TRUTH!
If you’re wondering, ask ANY Argentinian how they feel about “socialism” And “Who can Argue with That”…
Apparently they aren’t thrilled with their new “Lifetime, Self Appointed” Dictator under their new Communist ways. Apparently, they get to stand in line on bread and toilet paper day. Well, until it runs out. And when it does??? TOUGH SH!T COMRADE!
Don’t Even ask about medical care. The older folks SURE WON’T LIKE TO GET Q LOAD OF THAT!
So Pete, you Won’t get an argument from me… God Bless America
SUPER BOWL OR BUST!
July 19th, 2025 at 3:32 am
What a nice love fest.
The coaching on the defense, on player substitution, situational football and on game management has been dumpster level and we still win the B league division.
Thanks to Jason and roster building and to Todd for being fabulous with people.
Time is past to fix the Vomitous pass defense. Let’s see it.
July 19th, 2025 at 8:39 am
the defense showed flashes of brilliance last year only to have the offense fumble away 2-3 games, and that was not a good defense… bowles can occasionally have brilliant defensive plans …this year the defense should be improved with reddick, dennis back and more comp at db…. some of these new players have to become the new sapp brooks lynch and barber or suh jpp devin white if were going to get back to the sb…
if Ronde was a rookie he does not fake out and jump donovan mcnabbs pass for a pick 6 in 2003, that came from years of experience and study, we maybe a year or three off from getting back this team is still young