“That Culture We Had Pre-Tom-Brady”

February 3rd, 2022

A former Bucs receiver has chilling words of caution for Tampa Bay fans.

If Bucco Bruce Arians and general manager Jason Licht opt to replace Tom Brady with Kyle Trask, a rookie or a never-been-there quarterback, then the shock to the locker room will take the team back to its Lost Decade mentality.

Retired Bucs receiver Michael Clayton, the blocking icon, hopped on WDAE Radio this week and said bad things will happen if the Bucs go with an inexperienced QB in 2022. Essentially, the Brady-spoiled roster will look at the new signal caller and lose faith.

“We’re going to go back to that culture we had pre-Tom-Brady, you know, struggling to win games any given Sunday, not having the confidence that we can go out and win every game [without] a veteran quarterback,” Clayton explained.

Joe’s not fully on board with Clayton, but certainly the logic is there. The contrast from Brady to anyone will be a shock to the team’s system, but it’ll certainly be worse if it’s not a quality veteran QB.

No matter who quarterbacks the team, Joe is sure the Bucs will have enough talent to win the NFC South by a game or two, and have playmakers that can do damage in the playoffs. So Joe is not against a starting quarterback with limited or no experience. Joe trusts Arians and Licht’s QB decision.

70 Responses to ““That Culture We Had Pre-Tom-Brady””

  1. D-Rome Says:

    Even Clayton waved the white flag in believing Jay-Miss could have been the long term solution at QB in Tampa.

  2. mike Says:

    No, we aren’t going back to that culture. Hopefuly that’s gone forever. We are champions, and guys on that roster know what it take. We have a good enough roster towin the south right now and what we did the past two years will stay with us.

  3. HC Grover Says:

    Why do I think Ariens is going to go out with Gabbert? He thinks Gabbert is the perfect fit for his offense.

  4. doolnutts Says:

    I dont like that take at all. Tom Brady is the greatest QB of all time. That said the greatest QBs of all time arent just readily available. If there is someone on the team that thinks they can only win with Brady maybe they shouldn’t be on the team.

  5. zzbucs Says:

    I understand perfectly well what Clayton says, but forget abour Rogers Wilson Watson Carr….wich are the other options? Bridgewater? Winston..nahhh I go with trask….

  6. Lamarcus Says:

    See that a difference between Patriots and BUCS. Tom left the Pats, they adjusted and did pretty good with Cam and then this past season they did very well. So I believe they recovered quickly from Tom. The Bucs has to be terrible after he leaves? Crazy

  7. mike Says:

    @HC… no he really doesn’t.

  8. SB~LV Says:

    PTSD !!!!

  9. DBS Says:

    If Gabbert was that good he would be a starter somewhere. Not attached to BA’s hip as a backup.

  10. Pewter Power Says:

    Where did all these drama queens come from???? Typical from the one hit wonder of the nfl.

  11. ElioT Says:

    It’s going to be a shock no matter who the QB is. Plain and simple.

    You have to trust that we have veteran leaders who now know what excellence is and will settle for nothing less than that mindset from everyone on the team.

    Evans, David, Vea, White, Marpet, Wirfs, etc.

    Go Bucs!

  12. BucsMinisiterFuller Says:

    There should be a huge sign in the locker room that says “What Would TB12 Do?”
    All players should get those silly wristbands on game day with WWTBD on them.
    Coaches should always be stressing this.

  13. Craig Says:

    It would be much easier for a 0-0 QB with aplomb to win a locker room than a 15-31 guy who was replaced by Blake freaking Bortles.

    Clayton is full of some that smells bad, always was. He claimed to be a receiver, but was just a downfield blocker.

    Trask will win the locker room by being calm and self assured. Then he will cement it by his actions on the practice field. He showed great poise in the pre-season, and, though he risked a few receivers, was really accurate.

    That is more than could have been said about the lost, W eating, decade.

  14. Kalind Says:

    Well Joe, I don’t usually disagree. But if Arians has to start Trask cause they can’t secure a top10 QB via trade….then I’m w Clayton all the way. Not to mention the biblical exodus that will take place in FA cause no one believes in a 4th string QB who looked like dog —— in the preseason.

  15. Jon Juergensen Says:

    What a load of BS.

    1. Clayton hasn’t played for with the Bucs in 13 years.

    2. Clayton wouldn’t be saying this if Trask were black. He’d be 100% on board with giving Trask the ball.

  16. Matt Says:

    There was a story Shady McCoy told where Brady yelled to him after practice “Stay here, we have stuff to work on…” McCoy waved him off and kept walking. Brady got in his face and said something to the effect of “I’m not asking. Get back here.”

    If Kyle Trask or Blaine Gabbert said that, they’d be laughed off the field.

    That’s what this team is going to miss with Brady gone. And that’s ultimately why we’re going to see a backslide on this team.

  17. Jackson Says:

    Hey Joe.

    Is there any inside info you can gather from Bucs defenders as to how Kyle looked against them at practice? Maybe they could share some light on his progress or lack thereof.

  18. Jon Juergensen Says:

    “Joe’s not fully on board with Clayton, but certainly the logic is there.”

    That says a lot about Joe.

  19. James Walker Says:

    If the Bucs win 5 or 6 games they will be lucky. The only bright side is that the rest of the NFC South is in complete disarray as well.

  20. Listnfrmafar Says:

    Lamarcus, how do you figure Pat’s did well with Cam Newton. Cam was a MVP and made it to a SB but went 7-9 as a Patriot with the same team Brady was left with. They found a temporary diamond in the rough with Jones but he was soon figured out once DC’s exploited his weaknesses. They lost 4 of their last 5 games and went 1 & done in the playoffs a total blow out. It’s just common nature if the next QB fails early the team will lose confidence and with next seasons schedule, yikes, that’s a tough hill to climb.

  21. Beeej Says:

    Upside of Trask: rookie contract, with a very inexpensive Gabbert in front of or behind him. Between the two, we probably get ‘serviceable’ QB play, and tons of cap money to spend elsewhere

  22. Jon Juergensen Says:

    “Michael Clayton said bad things will happen if the Bucs go with an inexperienced QB in 2022.”

    Does Clayton object to inexperienced blacks getting NFL head coaching jobs?

  23. PassingThru Says:

    The Cam experiment was a failure, drafting Mac Jones was the best (and only) choice in the draft last season. I’m not sure if “The Patriot Way” is destined to survive. Much of that “Patriot Way” was established by the professionalism, discipline, and team-first attitude by Thomas Edward Patrick Brady, Jr. They looked doomed and lost during their playoff loss to Buffalo, that was a very bad look.

    It might be tough for New England to sustain that culture as many of their Super Bowl vets will either retire or leave as free agents this year. Even the locker room culture and “Patriot Way” will be a battleground for “How much of it was Brady, and how much of it was Belichick?”

    That question will also have to be answered by the Bucs as they too will be losing key free agents this season due to the salary cap.

  24. lunchmeat Says:

    Folks, let’s face it. Without the GOAT, no Super Bowl next year. So it’ time to rebuild the defensive front seven. The QB position can wait until we have a Super Bowl defense again.

  25. BBro Says:

    Wrote by a true free shoes u flunky, don’t bring me down jjjoooeeeee

  26. TBChucky Says:

    I’d much rather roll with Trask than trade for Jimmy G and his salary.. Maybe do a cheap trade for Minshew to give him some competition..

  27. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    If we can’t get Rogers, Wilson, or Carr, I say trade up to draft a good option to compete with Trask.

    A couple points though

    • It’s no coincidence that the bucs have only won rings with veteran QBs. If we become known as the ideal place for prime QBs to come to in order to finish out their careers with rings, I’m good with that.

    • It’s all well and good for people to call for Trask (based on what?), but when the season begins, if he bombs, none of you will remember you wanted it. You’ll blame Arians (or whoever the coach is)

    • If we can’t get a proven winner as a veteran, I say trade up for the best we can get, and then have a real competition between that person and Trask.

    • If Arians truly believes in Trask…well then, let the kid prove himself. But that starts with true competition to win the starting role.

    • The only way I would accept Gabbert as a starter is if we all knew it was just to buy time to develop a young guy.

    • Trask is not the only young guy option.

  28. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    We are not in a rebuild. We only need 2 players on DL, maybe 1.

    As long as Jenson sticks around, we are set on OL…and that is a winning recipe whether we go with a young QB or a Vet.

  29. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    Matt Says:
    February 3rd, 2022 at 10:21 am
    There was a story Shady McCoy told where Brady yelled to him after practice “Stay here, we have stuff to work on…” McCoy waved him off and kept walking. Brady got in his face and said something to the effect of “I’m not asking. Get back here.”

    If Kyle Trask or Blaine Gabbert said that, they’d be laughed off the field.


    Yeah, but it would be a VERY good sign.

  30. Jon Juergensen Says:

    “It’s all well and good for people to call for Trask (based on what?)”

    His record breaking two seasons with Florida? His performing equal to, and arguably better than, Patriots-starting-Mac-Jones in the 2020 SEC Championship? You seem not to know this, but all NFL quartrebacks – ALL – enter the NFL with zero NFL experience.

  31. Defense Rules Says:

    Michael Clayton … ‘Bad things will happen if the Bucs go with an inexperienced QB in 2022. Essentially, the Brady-spoiled roster will look at the new signal caller and lose faith.’

    That’s total BS. What the he11 is a ‘Brady-spoiled roster’? Is that Clayton’s OPINION that the Bucs are weak & will fall apart without Tom Brady to lead them? Horsepuckey. Bucs have some excellent talent on our roster in virtually all position groups, just not enough in some at the present time because of all the FA openings we have. These guys are PROFESSIONALS, almost all of whom understand the BUSINESS-SIDE of what’s facing us. Far as I’m concerned, that’s a Michael Clayton slap in their faces.

    Teams roll with ‘inexperienced QBs’ every year. Some succeed; others don’t. Obviously a lot has to do with the TALENT the individual QB brings to the table, but a LOT also has to do with the TEAM they’re surrounded with and the COACHING that they receive (how they’re used). Getting tired of these talking heads (like Clayton) GENERALIZING in their OPINIONS instead of being SPECIFIC with viable examples to prove (or disprove) their contentions.

  32. firethecannons Says:

    I am ready for Kyle Trask and ready to make our defense great again in the draft and free agency make at least one side of the ball the best in the league we had the best run defense now we should shoot for best overall defense

  33. German Buc Says:

    Bonzai, pick 27 seems high enough to get the best QB of this draft…

  34. sasquatch Says:

    What the hell does Clayton know? Other teams play young QBs and have success.

  35. firethecannons Says:

    I would rather spend money in FA on the defense then on a pricey easily injured quarterback then get Trask to play anyway.

  36. firethecannons Says:

    this sht is what good teams are made of–they overcome and play together and win games

  37. Proud Bucs Fan Says:

    What will hurt the Bucs more than the down grade of Brady the Qb, will be Brady the head coach. Under bruce arrogance the bucs will be top 5 in most penalties again. Bruce will lose the locker room, because he is a sloppy coach that does not put in the work.

  38. Rayjay1122 Says:

    Guys did not loaf very much with Brady under center. I expect to see much more loading and half hearted efforts again on both sides of the ball.

  39. Defense Rules Says:

    Bonzai … Bucs have a LOT of NEEDS based on how many STARTERS have become free agents this year. Some will be re-signed obviously (like Godwin & Whitehead for example), but we MAY very well not be able to afford some others (Davis & JPP for example).

    Draft picks in the Top-3 Rounds are precious IMO because they historically seem to have the best chances of becoming immediate starters or key rotational guys. It sure would be nice to have at least THREE draft picks fill those holes. My preference would be CB (even if we re-sign Davis, which I doubt we will), DT (even if we re-sign Suh so he can mentor him), DE (even if we re-sign JPP so he can mentor him), and then grab a RB & WR with our 4 & 5th Rnd picks.

    IF Kyle Trask was in the 2022 draft class & available when we pick #27, my gut tells me that we’d snatch him up in a heartbeat (although he’d probably be gone before that). Well, we’ve already drafted him; use him. Sign a viable backup QB (personally have no problem with Gabbert or Minshew, as long as they’re relatively inexpensive) to compete with Trask in preseason, but let’s at least see what we’ve got in him. Other than that, why in the world did we ever draft him?

  40. Tye Says:

    It will be a transition period as it would be for any team BUT a young talent can prove themselves and instill confidence… Look at Joe Burrow with the Bengals of all teams…. A young Big Ben when he started with the Steelers..

    NFL does have evidence we never truly know who will have success and who won’t… So many 1st round picks become bust… Brady being a 6th round pick… Romo went undrafted (not great success but was entertaining to watch)…..

  41. Adrnagy Says:

    Jensen is long gone. Suh. Jpp. Gholston are following. Imo

    Licht – we need to get young , faster and athletic.

  42. Biff Barker Says:

    Mark Domnick’s kiss of death was giving this bum big money.

    Spare us the Clayton BS Joe. Please!!

  43. Buc Unto Death Says:

    Maybe for some of Brady’s dead cap money we are eating, he’ll spend time grooming and coaching our next QB into potential greatness. Maybe not. . .

  44. Swampbuc Says:

    Clayhands should just shut up and block.

  45. Mike Johnson Says:

    Say Joe, I am fully on board with Mr. Clayton. He is spot on. We Buc fans have now become use to winning. Hell, it feels good on Sundays knowing your team has like a 90% chance of winning. Its outright happy time. Ans I do believe Arians and Licht love that feeling also. Arians is not a loser. Even in Arizona he won. They are gonna get us a winning QB somehow. Even if they gotta bring back ..I hate to say this but..Winston. Licht kinda hinted to us Trask is not ready. And Arians pet Gabbert is just that. He’s here for backup. Stay tuned Buc fans, we have major surprises comin our way. We will keep winning.

  46. HomerSimpsonRocks Says:

    That picture says it all. “You can’t keep throwing the ball to the other team!”

  47. Tacklebockwin Says:

    Trask will start and Fitzmagic will return as backup is my guess 😀.

  48. HC Grover Says:

    W/O Brady defense is the key.

  49. Buc king Says:

    Winston vs Trask preseason let the best man win

  50. Defense Rules Says:

    Adrnagy …. ‘Jensen is long gone. Suh. Jpp. Gholston are following. Imo’.

    Personally think that there’s a very good chance we’ll see ALL FOUR on our 2022 roster. Jensen’s tough as nails, didn’t miss a game in the whole 4 years he’s been a Buc & is the undisputed leader of our OLine IMO. But he’s 31 in May & this’ll probably be his last contract. His Market Value is right at $10 mil, and I expect that the Bucs will pay that (or slightly less) but keep the CAP hit to around $5 mil or so.

    Suh is a beast, and had an excellent year IMO. IF he decides to play another year (he may not), then the Bucs will re-sign him too IMO, I’m guessing for around $7-$8 mil based on a reduced workload (hey, he is 35 now). In any event, we NEED to draft his replacement this year, preferably with a Top 3 Rnds pick.

    JPP is a huge question-mark far as I’m concerned. My guess is that he’ll have a long recovery (been there, done that) and may very well not be ready until season start. How many other teams would take a chance on a 33-year-old coming off a major surgery? At the right price, I’m thinking that the Bucs will, although we’d still NEED to draft his replacement this year with a high draft pick.

    And Will Gholston is still one of my favorite Bucs, and continues to play at a high level. He’ll be 31 when the season starts, but he did very well I think as a key rotational player this past season: 4.5 sacks, 17 pressures, 36 tackles in barely 500 def snaps. That’s pretty good productivity I think (actually better than Vita Vea who’s making I think $18 mil per year now), and Big Will hasn’t missed a game in the past 4 years. I’d re-sign Will to a 2-yr contract for around $5 mil or so per year without blinking.

  51. Buc king Says:

    Sign winston

  52. stpetebucsfan Says:


    Most of the mock drafts I see will please you…the have the Texas AM DL going to us in the first and the Miss. St. CB in the second. And I agree with you those would be two excellent positions to fill.

    The ONLY difference between Clayton’s opinion and the trolls here at JBF is that he gets paid for it. I give him that…he is a professional troll.

  53. lambchop Says:

    Agree 100% with MC. With Trask, you won’t get FAs interested and most likely many of our own FAs will nope the F out for a better opportunity and better money.

  54. lambchop Says:

    How long do you think players will want to continue deferring their payday and play on 1-year incentive laden contracts? For basically a rookie?

    Trask better be baby Jesus if he’s going to convince anyone.

  55. CalBucsFan Says:

    Got to agree with your last sentence Joe, at a minimum: “Joe trusts Arians and Licht’s QB decision.”

    They just did it better than any GM/HC had done before in Buccaneer history, now go do it again!

  56. T REX Says:

    @ calbucsfan – no they didn’t. It was Tom freaking Brady not some old guy driving around a golf cart. Please. You think Licht got Gronk here? LOL. What was Licht’s record before Brady? Hint: It was one of the worst in franchise history. I would hold off on trusting Licht.

  57. Nathan Says:

    Squeaking by with a barely average free agent QB will get the fans their pre-culture look too lol the Bucs even when looking to draft a invested top QB ..that’s what happens when you just had a #1 Qb got nothing for him won a Super Bowl beating him … ughhh we need a josh Allen problem is no qb close to that level coming out…. Rolled the dice with jameis came back to bite us💯

  58. Izod Says:

    Trask is going to be a HUGE downgrade not from TB12 but from jameis winston. Is that really what we want to do? If our goal is to throw more INTs than Winston and only half the yardage, then by all means, go with Trask or Gabbert.

    There are a handful of very good veteran QBs available. We should go after them. I doubt we will.

  59. DBS Says:

    You do not know what you will get with Winston now. Payton had him on a leash. Is BA that smart? And how much did Winston learn from Payton? He would probably be the cheapest of them and if he did not work you could go to Trask quickly. But once again the No Risk It No Biscuit crap has to stop. I am an never was a Jameis fan . But right now he has worked with Evans and Godwin.

  60. captivajim Says:

    If the brain trusts wants to go back to “no risk it -no biscuit “crap; They will not attract any good Vet QB……

  61. captivajim Says:

    JOE,, we dam near lost the Dallas, Bills & Jets game WITH Brady.. Looking at ’22 schedule; no way will we win the division…

  62. Defense Rules Says:

    StPete … ‘The ONLY difference between Clayton’s opinion and the trolls here at JBF is that he gets paid for it. I give him that…he is a professional troll.’

    Rats, I overlooked the obvious. You caught me.

  63. Defense Rules Says:

    Izod … ‘Trask is going to be a HUGE downgrade not from TB12 but from jameis winston.’

    And you know that how Izod? How do you know Trask will throw MORE INTs than Winston? (If memory serves, doesn’t Winston hold the NFL record for the most INTs in a season for this century at least?). Trask didn’t have that problem in college; Winston did.

    I’m thinking that if it was up to some JBFers, QBs like Burrows, Herbert, Murray & Lawrence would never have started as rookies and would still be sitting on the bench, as journeymen QBs led their teams to mediocre records. There are no guarantees with any young QB, but when the gamble pays off, it pays off BIG.

  64. Mr Bean Says:

    The “Brady” effect lasts while Brady is there. He is gone and the effect is gone. Look at New England. Totally folded against Buffalo in the playoffs. Just stopped trying at the end. You never saw that for 20 years while Brady was there. No matter the score. Hoodie will retire without ever sniffing another SB.

  65. Just Saying Says:

    Exactly Defense Rules. No free agent expensive QB will be Brady either, and they will all have the history of not getting it done consistently in the NFL. at least with Trask you have a guy with elite talent and numbers when last he played and spent the last year with this team and in the room under the wing of TB12. No outsider has that the rest of the team will hopefully remember what it takes to get it done and support each other and hold the next man accountable. Get younger and build a lasting winner with some of the foundational pieces that learned the TB12 way.

  66. steele Says:

    In terms of QB, it really is end times, post-Brady.

    The next two drafts look horrendous for QB, full of marginal “dual threat” types, and the very few pro-ready ones, who are not great, will go high in the first round.

    Free agency is butt ugly, all mediocre, zero great ones.

    As much as the Claytons and his ilk see a total disaster if they roll with Trask, ask yourselves what better can do with the next two bad offseasons in front of you. Barring the discovery of some small school sleeper types, which requires a miracle, Trask is about as good as any bad draft option.

  67. DrunkInYbor Says:

    Whatever…Pfffftttt. his best play was a missed tackle by Lynch who normally would have destroyed h III m. But pulled up because of all the B.S. calls on defenders who aren’t allowed to hit anybody anymore. He had a great rookie season and fell way way off. He can go root for the Giants. How the hell does he know what this licker room is about? He hasn’t played for us in HOW long. Hey he was a great extra blocker though too bad he was paid to catch footballs

  68. CalBucsFan Says:

    @ T Rex. We can agree to disagree Buc fan. Licht is the best GM this team has ever had, bar none.

    Licht drafted the foundation of the team that won last year’s SB that could very well have done it again this year if not for the injuries:

    The OL that protected TB so well the last 2 seasons? Drafted by Licht.

    Offense with weapons that has been one of the top in the league for 3 straight seasons? Draft picks by Licht, most before TB or Gronk signed on too.

    The Defense? Draft picks and key free agent signings by Licht that went on an incredible run winning 3 straight road playoff games in Washington, New Orleans and Green Bay before becoming the first team to win a championship at home, all while holding down 2 of the top QBs in the league in Rodgers and Mahomes along the way.

    T-Rex, I’m sure you would acknowledge that TB chose the Bucs as his next team BECAUSE he could see how potent the roster was that was already in place. He didn’t build it, Licht did. TB stepped in and did what Winston couldn’t do with pretty much the same roster, coaches and playbook. No doubt adjustments were made once he arrived, but make no mistake about it, the foundation was already in place, and we have Licht to thank for that. He gets created for bringing in Arians, Leftwich and Bowles too.

    And that’s why I trust him and Arians, even riding a golf cart, to make another wise QB choice for next season too and keeping our Bucs team a title contender again.

  69. CalBucsFan Says:

    Typo…Licht gets credit for bringing in Arians, Leftwich and Bowles too.

  70. Buczilla Says:

    Mahomes and Josh Allen are the only qb’s worth the team crippling salaries that they make. I hope that we run with Trask and if he isn’t worth a damn, we should have a high enough pick in 2023 to get a good one.