Cornerbacks Playing Big

December 20th, 2019

Leading a turnaround.

For too long the Bucs’ pass defense was so horrible, you just wanted to punch someone.

The fact Team Glazer didn’t pull a Bobby Knight and toss a suite chair onto the field of the Den of Depression in complete and total outrage was an impressive act in self-discipline. After all, they were paying millions of dollars for this tripe.

Joe was convinced in recent years, when the Bucs ran a nickel package on passing downs, five lawn chairs could have put up a better defense. At least a receiver had a chance to trip over one of the lawn chairs.

In a move that is at best interesting given the timing, the Bucs began to show signs of an NFL secondary just after former first-round pick Vernon Hargreaves was thrown off the team for loafing. Coincidence?

Well, Joe is noticing stat geeks seem to be really liking the Bucs’ young secondary, post-Hargreaves.

Per, the Bucs have two of the top corners with passes defended in Carlton Davis (who leads the league with 18) and Jamel Dean (tied for No. 3 with 16).

Now the PFF tribe has a subjective stat which is called “forced incompletions” which allegedly is different than passes defended in that it factors in all passes defended including pressures.

In this stat, both Davis, in his second season, and Dean, a rookie, rank in the tribe’s top-five.

Also, rookie Sean Murphy-Bunting has three picks. He is two away from tying for the Bucs’ rookie record for picks with five.

Two of the three players ahead of SMB on this rookie category turned out to be pretty decent corners and you may have heard of them: Donnie Abraham and Aqib Talib.

So at long last, Joe is starting to see some light at the end of the tunnel for what was atrocious secondary play by the Bucs which has lasted far too long.

35 Responses to “Cornerbacks Playing Big”

  1. richbucsfan Says:

    I wish them well on Saturday. It’s good to see improvement.

  2. Robert Says:

    defense is the reason for the turn around. props to them!

  3. whats the bucs plan 2020 Says:

    In a move that is at best interesting given the timing, the Bucs began to show signs of an NFL secondary just after former first-round pick Vernon Hargreaves was thrown off the team for loafing. Coincidence?

    That is what Bill Parcells used to do…. and it worked … HELLO !!

  4. Dewey Selmon Says:

    Read that Davis tweaked his ankle, any word on his status?

  5. 813bucboi Says:

    secondary has played very well lately for being so young…

    JPP has helped the secondary just as much as he’s helped the pass rush….

    once he came back and got into football shape, pass rush and secondary took it up a notch…..

    gotta bring him back…..he’s the MVP of the team….

    GO BUCS!!!!!

  6. orlbucfan Says:

    Hey Joe(s); will Whitehead being out hurt the secondary? What’s with all these pulled hamstrings??

  7. Sport Says:

    Band of Brothers! (18 & 19 Draftees) this is our core for a long time to come.

    Talented athletes, scheme is becoming familiar and the coaches are getting through. They just keep improving, keep this defensive unit together as much as possible, get a new RT and RB in the draft, the rest should be spent on depth and we have ourselves a competitive team!

    Go Bucs!

    In BA I Trust!

  8. Brandon Says:

    Don’t forget the link I posted the other day. Both Deab and Davis are allowing less than 47.9% of passes thrown their way to be completed. I think as far as CBs are concerned, they rank 4th and 6th in the NFL in lowest completion percentage in the NFL. They’re also 1st and 3rd in pass breakups, considering Dean has missed half the games, that’s pretty impressive. SMB has given up 63.6% spending most of his time on the inside where completions are easier… has 8 PBUs and 3 INTs. This young secondary is on it’s way to being a special unit. Whitehead and Edwards will be back, hopefully add in a still young and talented Justin Evans and the future is very bright.

    That being said, Carlton Davis sprained his ankle and is questionable for tomorrow. I like Ryan Smith as a 4th CB on game day, don’t want to see him as the 3rd.

  9. Joe Says:

    Read that Davis tweaked his ankle, any word on his status?

    Unlikely any update until inactives are listed tomorrow morning.

  10. Brandon Says:

    Again, not interested in signing a vet CB. No need to steal valuable reps and roster spot from young players. No available CB will have the wealth of knowledge and experience as DB coach Kevin Ross anyways.

  11. Joe Says:

    Hey Joe(s); will Whitehead being out hurt the secondary?

    Of course.

    What’s with all these pulled hamstrings??

    Arians talked about this.

  12. Brandon Says:

    Wow, my previous comment on Davis and Dean was up for moderation and now it’s gone. WTF, Joes? There was nothing even remotely inappropriate or touting another site.

  13. Rodney Munch Says:

    I have no idea what those PFF fake news stats mean – but I know from watching the game that the defense overall has improved greatly, at least against bad offenses. That is a huge improvement over the the recent past when they’d perform terribly against all offenses no matter how bad they were.

  14. Brandon Says:

    And now it’s back. SMH. All my comments are now awaiting for moderation. what did I do?

  15. james west Says:

    hell yes and a big right on

  16. Rodney Munch Says:

    Hey Joe – Have you guys ever asked Arians about Ray Perkins? I know everyone will say he was a Bear Bryant guy, but that was for like one year (I think), he worked with Ray Perkins for years (I think). Perkins, of course, is known for running the most brutal camps in Bucs history with the good old 3-a-days. In any case the Bucs connection has seemingly never been brought up, or I managed to miss it somehow. But, how much of Arians take on practicing is taken from Perkins – if there was anything, how was it modernized for today’s sissy players.

  17. Joe Says:

    WTF, Joes? There was nothing even remotely inappropriate or touting another site.

    Joe is not a computer programmer and doesn’t write code for WordPress. 🤷

  18. Iamabuc Says:

    This hasn’t being mentioned ; but right now, Arians should be looked at as a big consideration for Coach of the Year, once again…so far he has been breathing life to this dying franchise….I know there’s work to be done, but compared to previous coaches, at least he knows what he’s doing..just saying and in ny humble opinion

  19. bradinator Says:

    Much tougher test this week, in both the WRs and Qb they have to go up against, than the last two weeks. I’m feeling more confident in them for sure. Dean being up there in Passes Defensed when he’s hardly played this season is an achievement. If they are for real imagine how good they will be in coming years. Please make it true! DBs that can play? How long have we wished for this?

  20. Joe Says:


    Not sure why Joe would ask Bruce Arians about Ray Perkins. What is the connection that Joe is missing other than both worked/played for Bear Bryant?

    NFL teams have very specific rules about practices set by the collective bargaining agreement with the NFLPA. The Bucs couldn’t have the same practices that Perkins ran with the Bucs because of this.

  21. J Says:

    Man..when something dumb needs to be said Robert doesn’t disappoint. Nice job there buddy.

  22. Defense Rules Says:

    Joe, just a thought. Would it help if we all chipped in to send you to anger management classes? Every time you mention the defense I see words like ‘You want to punch someone’ or ‘You want to throw one of your craft beer bottles through the TV’. Sometimes worse. Our defense is playing better. You can come down off of the ceiling now. Don’t be afraid; JBFers are here for you. Well, until we’re not.

  23. Bucsfanman Says:

    It’s good to see this young talent grow. Lord knows we have enough draft capital invested!
    At the present rate, our secondary should be pretty good for years to come. Fingers-crossed!

  24. stpetebucsfan Says:

    We’re getting close to judgement time…grades for everybody.

    Only two games left…most of the grade is in.

    As far as BA and his staff…they are moving up rapidly…if they win tomorrow I gotta give em an A.

    They were basically right and we were wrong about the DB’s. Their only mistake was to expect these guys to play this way from day one without the usual rookie mistakes.

    But overall it certainly appears that BA/Bowles/Licht have largely fixed the secondary. Now imagine another upgrade in our pass rush.

    I think our OL has graded out reasonably well…our front seven on defense have played very well and with the continued play of LVD and the emergence of White…our front seven next year could be special with two ball hawking LB’s.

    Back that up now with these DB’s…Grab a monster OL and an RB and we’re playoff bound.

  25. mark2001 Says:

    Have to love what Bowles and Arians did. They didn’t put “training wheels” on these young guys. They made them accountable from day one. And Arians put faith in the Draft Choices. Were there “bumps in the road”? You bet. Did they have to “weed out” a guy with poor work ethic? you bet. But the end result is a group of young guys adjusting to NFL speed, playing straight up, against the best. There will be more “growing pains”. But many of these guys are here to stay…and develop. Another guy might be brought in, but please Joe, no head cases. The only guy Arians and Bowles would consider at this point is a high performing mentor. And there aren’t many of those around.

  26. mark2001 Says:

    It is pretty simple, I believe. Arians and Bowles said we are going to stop the run and make our young CB’s play straight up, and learn to play… no crutches. Sure…they are going to get burned often in the short term and less often as they grow, but there is no better way to learn but by playing. And the Coaches haven’t allowed their confidence to be buried in some of the losses. Now the guys are starting to play like pro’s, the line and LB’s are still doing their jobs, and low and behold, this D looks like the start of something really good. Hats off to the coaches that knew their jobs, worked hard doing their jobs and teaching the young guys, and the young guys that learned that it isn’t called the NFL for nothing, if they want to act like jackwagons rather than professionals.

  27. Adrnagy Says:

    CB have played good not big. Good progress. Tomorrow’s game will be a test for them in which I think the game will be on them. If they play big we win.

  28. Sport Says:

    Brandon – I’m with you on keeping the vets away from our young secondary. They are studying extra film, working hard, playing smart and aggressive. No need for a Vet.

    In BA I Trust!

  29. unbelievable Says:

    Lol DR.

    But seriously Cmon on man, the defense for the vast majority of the last 8 years has been a stinking pile of garbage. Of course there were some valid reasons for this (lack of money allocation, super young guys this year) at times. But I think any sane person who watched it would have wanted to puked or punched someone watching our defense during most of that time.

    Great to see all those young guys coming into their own this year!

  30. snookman Says:

    On Saturday all this hype will be put in the Garbage.
    For the first time since the Saints game in November we will see the following:

    Jameis Winston not be able to complete 3rd downs.
    The running Game shut down.
    The secondary Torched.

    Im sorry but the last 4 games were agains teams that are in a tail spin and are horrible.

    I expect the exact same outcome as the Second Panthers and Saints Game. We will win our last game to be 8-8 but reality is against good teams we will be exposed.

    if I am wrong and we show up and win tomorrow……….That is when I will see the light at the end of the tunnel……………..I just don’t see it.

  31. firethecannons Says:

    Those are amazing stats–thx Joe! Have to think all our corners are going to get better too as they play faster with more anticipation. I like that these guys are young and glad to get playing time, glad to get rid of hargreaves even for nothing. Hope he don’t come alive tomorrow.Go Bucs!

  32. SOEbuc Says:

    Grant Delpit in the first round plllleeeeeeaaaase. All of our young 3-4 DBs that were being used in the 99-yard cushion are looking better. They are going to continue to rise with Bowels and by next season he’s not gonna be putting up with this dropped interception BS. Enter monster hawk Delpit and we could have a serious young secondary.

  33. Buczilla Says:

    Thank goodness.

  34. Brandon Says:

    Sport-seems some vets are cancers. Signing a vet CB to come in and lead a young and hungry CB room could be disastrous. Brent Grimes and VH3 come to mind. Whether you bring in the right or wrong guy, I’m all for these guys setting the tone and being the leaders and taking the reps. If anything, bring in a late round pick or two that will pick up on the ethic and vibe being laid down by the 1st and 2nd year players.

  35. #1bucfan Says:

    JOE YOU ARE SO RIGHT ABOUT HOW BAD THE DEFENSE WAS I LITERALLY WANTED TO PUNCH EVERYONE IN THE FACE. the way the secondary is playing as of lately is awesome to see. To watch these young guys grow up right in front of us is pretty cool to. Go Bucs