Patriots 19, Buccaneers 14

October 5th, 2017

(Photo courtesy of Tampa Bay Buccaneers)

Well, the Buccaneers’ defense lived up to the hype tonight, the grand stage. Nineteen points is always a great night. Always. But the rest of the Bucs dropped a huge ASJ for the home fans and a national television audience.

The mighty Patriots looked mortal, and the Bucs offense had some fans wondering what Marcus Arroyo is up to.

What a hot mess that was.

The 2017 Patriots simply aren’t that good, and the Bucs couldn’t beat them after forcing two turnovers and holding them to 16 points.

Jiminy Christmas!

How much blame does Dirk Koetter deserve? He’s got a load of weapons all over the field. Yeah, it’s America’s Quarterback, Jameis Winston, missing throws, but somehow Koetter has to find a way to get more out of this offense and his electric players.

We all finally saw what can happen when DeSean Jackson gets the ball in space; he rocketed for 41 yards with a lot of that “YAC.” How bout more of that and fewer pitches? And how about more up-tempo offense?

On Sunday, Koetter said “play the percentages” when he put the Giants game on the foot of struggling kicker Nick Folk. Well, today the Koetter math got fuzzy. Joe’s just not a big fan of taking the ball out of the hands of the No. 1 overall pick QB and all those weapons — in exchange for a kicker. And that happened at least twice.

The Bucs are 2-2, and they haven’t started this well since 2011.

At least it’s something.

128 Responses to “Patriots 19, Buccaneers 14”

  1. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    Well, it was a good try.

    Folk cost us the game. 9 points would have won it by 7.

  2. Gobucs Says:

    This team sucks. Always something.

    Every game it’s something. Absolutely pathetic display.

  3. AlteredEgo Says:

    Jameis BLEW so many passes…..
    and has always

  4. Mike Evans GOAT Says:

    Fire Dirk
    Pathetic game plan. Chiefs and panthers showed u the way to win. HE11 tony romo knew what kind of defense belicheat would run all night. No adjustments just pathetic.

  5. NJBucsFan Says:

    Nothing about Martin?!?!

  6. orlbucfan Says:

    Why is our team cursed like this? Unreal. Kicker problems. Someone put a hoodoo on us years ago.

  7. BucFanForever Says:

    would have won without FxxK

  8. Blake_Bucsfan Says:

    These are the kind of games that hurt the most.

    Had every opportunity handed to us on a silver platter, right up until the last play even, yet somehow managed to choke.

    I feel like a beat dog right now.

  9. Chris Says:

    Well, two of them were 50, 56, shpould have gone for it or punted, by the third miss, it was in his head. Koetter sucked, Winston sucked until the 4th, Brate sucked until the last drive. Winnable game against a vulnerable Patriots. Close games in the NFL comes down to coaching.

  10. I Bleed Red Says:

    That last pass was “boner deflating”

  11. SteveK Says:


    Americas QB is the problem today. Inaccurate as hell!

    Play calling can’t be evaluated when your QB lacks precision and your kicker sucks out loud.

  12. DB55 Says:

    Great game! Everyone counted us out and we almost got it. Fml it’s a Bucs life.

    I got hope though. In a few weeks we’ll have our full squad back and balling out.

    Great game! Btw the raiders have a backup kicker that may be better than Janowski

  13. Captain Crunch Says:

    the offense scheme is the problem DK is too busy trying to force the deep ball to djax just get him the ball in space slant/crossing route and let him make a play. this offense has to many weapons to be struggling against the worst defense in the league

  14. King C Says:

    Pats played worse than vs the Chiefs when they got blown out — and yet they still won on the road.
    Oh well. 2-2 isn’t all that bad.
    Doug Martin looked very good
    If Defense can get healthy and Koetter calls a whole different type of game, maybe we can come alive in 2nd half of season

  15. daveman Says:

    The defense played lights out really. Much better than expected. Jameis did his usual thing. He looks great in flashes and mediocre during long stretches of the game. Folk sucks. Kotter was god awful. The on side kick attempt tells me he can’t math. 2:10 left on clock, 2 timeouts, 1 40 second run down and you get the ball back with 1:10 down 2.

    Final comment. Going against the grain I’m sure, but I liked Romo. He has insight and I like his style. He’s kind of like Brian Anderson w/ the Rays broadcast IMO.

  16. Bucs fan #7423 Says:

    Anybody else notice how good our punting special team is?

  17. Bucs14 Says:

    How many points did VH3 cost us? If you are going to blame Folk and Jaboo, you have got to blame VH3 as well.

  18. NJBucsFan Says:

    @Chris… I disagree. A rookie kicker plucked from a practice squad makes a 62 yard game winner winner against a division rival. No excuse for Folk

  19. THETRUTH Says:

    2-2 will take it now need 3-1 2nd quarter of season.

  20. NewTampaChris Says:

    Not the least bit entertaining. Brate’s TD (his first non-drop of the game) just made the pain worse.

  21. Gencoimports Says:

    Offensive game plan was terrible. Can’t just blame the kicker. With the exception of Doug Martin’s running in the 2nd quarter, the offense was totally asleep until the last 10 minutes. With all of the penalties plus two Brady turnovers, the game should have been ours,

  22. Tbbucs3 Says:

    It’s amzing how we can cry out 4 quarters and still somehow have a chance to win. Really should’ve won if we make those kicks. The talents there, just have to coach and play better.

  23. Rojas Says:

    Dirks play calling is horrible. Plain, and simple.

  24. Mike Evans GOAT Says:

    I’m sick of this bullspit. Hire a real proven coach. Get gruden in here, get jimbo in here. HE11 bill cowher even said this O was vanilla. Like beating your head on a wall expecting to create a door. We are a cursed franchise, in kicking and coaching. Mike Smith has no idea what a press is.

  25. JimmyJack Says:

    All this offense does is make mistakes. Our Defense takes all the critism cause they are on the field all the time whenever we have a big game.

  26. Tbbucs3 Says:


  27. Billy Buc N Brazil Says:

    Why onside kick with 2:08 and a timeout plus 2 minute warning??? Unreal

  28. dmatt Says:

    Koetter called a dumb game Bucs wait till last minute to run the fast offense too little too late. Folks must go!!! What does koetter c n him I’d rather take a chance on trying for a td on fourth down. The defense held its own considering playing against GOAT. Mai g played great, CSims is a waste in the backfield. Brate had a bad game n Humphries is a tough cookie. J Evans played good defense. Will someone explain to me the reason the defensive end #95 was covering Amendola?

  29. THETRUTH Says:

    What’s Folk make $2 million and can’t kick from 56 get out of here.

    Get LB and DB. Back and let real defense turn loose

  30. Matt B Says:

    Curse Folk all you want – and he should be cut tomorrow – but he’s not even trying that 31-yard FG if Brate doesn’t drop the touchdown pass, his second dropped would-be touchdown I believe, a couple of plays before the kick. Lots of blame to go around.

    If you told me we would hold the Patriots to 19 points and lose, I would have said you’re crazy.

    So many lost opportunities.

  31. Rojas Says:

    Even Steve Smith, is saying this game is on Dirks play calling.. hmmm

  32. King C Says:

    As far as the kicker goes, Nobody cursed us.
    We had Matt Bryant and cut him and refused to sign free agent kickers like Steve Hauschka

  33. DB55 Says:

    Statistically Winston played better than Brady.

  34. SteveK Says:


    Take off your FSU Blinders, Winston sucked glaringly until the 4th quarter. His body of work tonight was inaccurate and not up to NFL standards.

  35. Tbbucs3 Says:

    I’m putting this game on Dirk and Licht. Licht for digging a unnecessary hole in our kicking situation. Dirk for calling a JUCO offense.

  36. DislocatedBucsFan Says:

    Dirk gets some blame, but its not entirely his fault. My biggest gripe would be the onside kick. I’d rather of played field position. Fire him!?! c’mon now. Thats ridiculous.

  37. Bucsace Says:

    Yup, this was ugly……this team will be VERY lucky to go 8-8

  38. JimmyJack Says:

    Dirk killed us by squandering opportunities to set the tone in the 1st quarter. His offense looked like a pile of lost morons out there in 1st Quater

  39. EA Says:

    Was at the game, paid big money to get good seats and left after half time. I’m done with Winston, he is like Byron Leftwich, at least I watched the goat play for a little bit. Get Winston some competition to light a fire in his rear end because he way too comfortable right now. All us fans said this will be a make or break season and I’m not smelling a franchise QB here sorry. I’m not even gonna get mad when Tmax starts to call him names. Just overall very frustrated because we were so hyped up this season, Koetter ain’t nothing but a conservative coordinator.

  40. NJBucsFan Says:

    @DB55 the only stat worth a ish…is 1 W and 1 L. So no he didn’t

  41. Should’ve been a jags fan Says:

    Koetter had all the weapons to blow this team out of the water. 8-8 will be a blessing

  42. MikeToledoOHfan Says:

    Yeah the offense played bad, Kicker and ST was bad. I’m just lmao there was no positives in this article about how well THE muscle hamster played. Other than the drop he was lights out and the BEST BACK on the roster.

  43. gotbbucs Says:

    Horrible horrible horrible horrible offensive adjustments. Quit forcing the f*cking ball down the field against a cover 2 defense.

  44. FortMyersDave Says:

    How hard is it to bring in someone who can make a kick from inside of 40 yards? Tryouts start when tomorrow? Of course if the Bucs did get a slim lead late we could be talking about Brady setting up the Pats kicker to make the winner. Folk should have been at least 2 of 3 tonight. Winston had the opportunity late which was amazing in itself but could not be the hero. Time of possession, its like a broken record, Bucs always 28 minutes or less. Frustrating loss. See ya Mr Folk! Many missed opportunities tonight and while Folk is the goat it seemed like many Bucs did not bring their A game…..

  45. SteveK Says:

    Folk’s leg and Jameis’ arm were the culprits tonight. Accuracy matters.

  46. Architek Says:

    Yeah the play calling and Winston reads and innaccuracy keeps showing it’s head.

  47. Rich Sauers, Jr. Says:

    It’s not like Jameis was great tho Joe. Lame offensive plan, Winston sucking it up, folk can’t kick. That’s a wrap.

  48. Bill Douglas Says:

    The loss is tough. However, Martin looks as sharp as ever. Assuming Dirk can ease his love for Rodgers things are looking good.

  49. FireLovieNow Says:

    We need to address the elephant in the room. Jameis is not consistent. Yes the three missed field goals did not help matters. Jameis is single-handedly costing his team games.

  50. JimmyJack Says:

    OJ looked like he belonged on the sidelines tonight. Brate looked like a practice team player. Great job developing TE’s Dirk. You suck hot air BTW

  51. Chris Says:

    Yeah NJ, but you knew, hell Romo knew Folk struggled in warmups. If you see he struggled in warmups, while the hell kick 50 yard field goals.? I mean, Folk is cut, not defending him, but why the 50 yrs field gpals? Why the onside kick? It gave them that field goal. Hell Romo shpukd have coached, he called a beyyer game than Koetter

  52. Eric Says:

    One person to blame this game on and his name is Jameis Winston! I lost count of how many poorly placed balls. Pure hot garbage! America’s quarterback I think not, more like America’s cheerleader cuz that’s about all he is good for!

  53. King C Says:

    Don’t dare blame Brate
    This loss is on Koetter’s vanilla playcalling, Winston’s poor throws and Licht for not signing a real kicker
    Remember the kicker wouldn’t be an issue if we scored TDs on NE like the other teams they played this year

  54. The Anomaly Says:

    Dirk made a huge mistake going to for the onside…gave them three points. You’re D is going to hold or not. Why give up that field position? Bad coaching.

    JW looked like hot garbage. So did Hargreaves.

    Folk should be sent to the pit of misery!

    Dilly dilly!

  55. Rich Sauers, Jr. Says:

    These nfl network guys know what’s up. They’re saying it’s not the pats d, it’s the Bucs lame offense. How you get ramped up for this game and come out with a simple boring predictable offense. It’s beyond me.

  56. JimmyJack Says:

    Dirk took Martin out of the game with his garbage time playcalling and Doug was our best player tonight. Koetter doesn’t know how to handle the rythym of a game. We should have destroyed the Time of Posession and the ScoreBoard from the set,.

  57. DBS Says:

    Stats are for losers. And they did.

  58. Kgh4life Says:

    Why don’t the bucs just fire Koetter, tank the season and use the pick on a QB in next years draft.

  59. Rich Sauers, Jr. Says:

    Anomaly: you’re so right. EVERYTHING

  60. Rico Says:

    Pathetic. Our kicking game was never figured out with Folk. I hope no one actually believed that he’d be our answer. Crazy that we would have beaten the Patriots had Folk made his kicks. But alright, 2-2–let’s get healthy and win some damn games. Not all faith is lost.

  61. DBrooks55 Says:

    HA joe hopefully you make up for all the hate on Martin by having an entire article about how good he looked… you thought they were going to cut him for Rodgers????? Martin actually tries to avoid defenders (Rodgers did have that ONE nice juke on the screen)and Martin has so much more acceleration…….. that is all

  62. JimmyJack Says:

    we need a kicker and an offense

  63. Eric Says:

    Funny how the only player really worth mentioning isn’t even named… hello…. he is the only reason we were even in this game. This has FOX news written all over it. I expect more than that Joe’s, it makes you look foolish that you can’t stand being wrong and compound the matter by ignoring the lone bright spot of the team.

  64. JameisDungy Says:

    Dirk was average….again.

    Licht continues to not know what to do at kicker….again.

    Brate oddly had his worst game I’ve seen.

    OJ Howard…yea he looked like a guy who was mostly a blocker at Bama.

    However, this game is on Jameis. Greatness must overcome mediocrity. He was far too average this game against a bad defense.

    Joe and others continue to give Koetter a pass. Thats nothing new. Our offense was better when Lovie was the HC.

    However, JAMEIS HAS TO OVERCOME THAT CRAP. There have been many great QBs that won with a lackluster GM and HC.

    So disappointed because he reminded me of a QB I thought he was far better than. And thats Josh Freeman.

    Jameis has to cut out the rah rah speeches until he starts completely passes to open wrs consistently. Audible out of these crap play calls from Dirk.

    So disappointed in Jameis, but I believe he will bounce back. Just sucks cause this game could be one to cost us the playoffs.

    Oh well. Lets hope he keeps improving.

  65. The Anomaly Says:

    And stop forcing it to Mesean diva Jackass

  66. orlbucfan Says:

    As a 38-year diehard Bucs nutt, this game was a major disappointment. DK has built this team offensively for 3 years. He throttled it tonight. Why? He is a great OC. Not so sure about a HC. Bucs should have won tonight.

  67. NFLNut Says:


    GREAT GAME and I am now higher on this team that ever before.

    We were the better team in this game despite not having Kwon, LaVonte, Ward or Tandy!

    Brate dropped a TD pass and then Folk missed the FG a play later which cost us 7 points … Folk also missed another easily makeable FG which cost us another 3 points. The 56 yarder at the end of the half isn’t on Folk as that’s a tough kick, but the Brate dropped TD (he had three other drops as well) and the one missed kick cost us an easy 10 points … we had the Pats 24-16 and they would have been playing for the tie and trying to comeback.


    Our defense held the vaunted Patriots offense to just 19 points and was money when the Pats got into scoring range … and did that without Kwon, LaVonte, Ward or Tandy! That is extremely impressive.

    Jameis outplayed the G.O.A.T. … Brady had 308 yards, 1 TD and 2 turnovers (and almost got picked by rookie Justin Evans a 2nd time but Evans dropped it) while Jameis had 345 yards 1 TD no turnovers and was CLUTCH just as he was last week, but this time Folk missed 3 FG’s instead of just 2 … such is life.

    AND DOUGIE IS BACK … dude ran hard and looked great!



  68. BucTrooper Says:

    Sims on 3rd and 1.
    Toss on 1st and G.
    58 yard field goal attempt.

    I’m not liking Koetter. There are too many weapons here for the offense to be this bad and I’m losing patience.

  69. Chris@Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa Says:

    We are being outcoached. Tony Romo hinted at it several times, but Steve Smith and his bunch did not pull any punches.
    A Fish stinks from the head down.
    Our game plan sucked.

  70. JameisDungy Says:

    The more weapons do one of two things. Either it accentuates the development of a QB/showcases the brilliance of a play caller..

    Or it exposes that a QB isn’t ready for the next level and the OC is very average.

    Again. Jameis LOST this game. However, even if we won I’d still feel a bit bad because Dirk is not a good play caller.

  71. Pelbuc Says:

    Koetter proved tonight he’s a coordinator and not a head coach. Terrible play calling and took away the momentum of Martin’s good running. I hope tomorrow Bucs have a new kicker. Winston will never be accurate. Hargreaves is a BUST!

  72. JimmyJack Says:

    We choked. This team is nowhere near ready to contend

  73. firethecannons Says:

    stop blaming Jameis, Folk lost the game, even if he made 2 of the field goals–he is toast.

  74. Eric Says:

    NFL nut, put down the crack pipe. Winston outplayed Brady?? You can’t be serious. Winstyon SSSUUUCCCKKKEEDDD! Garbage time stats are for losers!! Loser!

  75. JameisDungy Says:



    Maybe Koetter turns it around. However, why oh why didn’t we go outside to find a HC? Why keep someone Lovie brought in? Why keep someone who Falcons fans said for years his play calling was just above average.

    We could have gotten all these REAL Offensive Guru’s to be our HC.

    If Dirk’s teams at least scored points I’d fine. However, he’s slowly becoming the Lovie on Offense. Hired to do one thing yet the team constantly underachieves at it.

  76. Cgmaster Says:

    Again with the Jameis haters. My god you’re all annoying. Was he sharp? No. But with the field goals we win. Brate dropped a td pass. Koetter had terrible play calling. But yeah you all think qbs grow on trees.

  77. Bill Douglas Says:

    NFLNut, I agree.

    We lost to the Pats by 6. Missed 3 FG’s.

    Surely, there are things we need to improve on, but we’re 2-2 and Doug Martin looks like his ‘good’ season form. I’m really liking where the team is at right now, even if tonights loss make it hard to see.

  78. NFLNut Says:


    People ripping on Jameis are … predictable … and so stupid.

    It was Brady that threw one of the ugliest passes I’ve ever seen that got picked by rookie Justin Evans, and Brady that missed a wide open TD pass to Chris Hogan that would have put the game away for the Pats, and Brady that threw another horrible pickable ball that Justin Evans dropped, and Brady that fumbled the ball away.

    As for Jameis … he missed Desean on a deep pass that would have resulted in a 65 yard TD … he also watched as Brate dropped a beautiful TD pass, watched as Brate dropped three other passes, watched as Doug dropped two passes and watched as Evans dropped one pass.

    Brady finished with 303 yards passing, 1 TD and 2 turnovers

    Jameis finished with 334 yards passing, 1 TD and no turnovers … and had the 7 drops been catches followed by immediate tackles with no YAC, he would have been 33-46 (71.7%) for approx. 404 yards, 2 TD’s and no turnovers …

    Jameis is amazing and I am higher on him NOW than ever before, as even with those SEVEN DROPS, Jameis still threw for 334 yards and a TD with ZERO turnovers and beat Brady and the Pats … but Folk stole the game back for the Pats all by himself … such is life.


  79. BuccaneEric75 Says:

    Stop saying the Defense played well. They did not. The Pats drove up and down the field most of the night and shot themselves in the foot when they got close. Belichick played conservative from about halfway through the 3rd and even punted when he could have kicked a field goal. Why? Because he knew our Offense was trash. A total team loss today. Mostly on Winston. Don’t say we would have won if Folk made his kicks. If he did, the Patriots would have kept thier offense in high gear and scored 30+. I blame: 1, Winston, 2 Defense, 3 Folk. The D made some plays, but overall they didn’t play well until we knew the Pats were just trying to get the game over with.

  80. Dizz Says:

    Folk, Hargreaves,Koetter, Sims, the FANS

    Folk lost the game… Hargreaves kept them in the game… Koetter couldn’t win the game… Sims shouldn’t be in the game.. the FANS didn’t show up to the game…

    60%/40% or 70%/30% doesn’t mean fans showed up to the game….

    We need more to represent 100%

    Speak Softly

  81. JimmyJack Says:

    Folk didn’t lose the game……not alone. What about Brate dropping a TD and another 1st?……Simms and Martin dropping 1st’s?…..Winston missing Jackson for 6 on the sidelines?…..Dotson and OJ with horrible pentalties? Dirk ruined every once of momentum our defense gave us through 3 quarters too!!!!!!! Absolute abomination and a wasted Win IMO. #Team Effort

  82. NFLNut Says:


    Eric, YES JAMEIS COMPLETELY OUTPLAYED BRADY. Brady threw an absolute duck that was picked, threw another pickable ball, fumbled away a ball and led his team to just 19 points against our defense without Kwon, LaVonte, Ward and Tandy … Case Keenum and Eli Manning played far better than Brady did against us.

    By the way … Brady’s kicker was 3-3 on FG’s and Jameis’ was 0-3 … and that was the ball-game. Plus, Chris Hogan caught the TD pass Brady threw him while Brate dropped the first TD pass Jameis threw him. Jameis absolutely outplayed Brady tonight and the Bucs absolutely outplayed the Patriots tonight … but Folk (and Brate) handed the Pats the game … such is life.


  83. Mo_Downs Says:

    The Panthers had a kicker on their practice squad until last week.
    He was lights out last Sunday in every phase ( KO/FG/EP) of the kicking game

    How did we pass on him considering how clear it has been since training camp that Folk could be beaten out by ANYONE with a pulse.

    Not Good, FO……

    Can our punter take over K duties???

  84. JimmyJack Says:

    Erik75….The defense was on the field all game. They showed up to -play…especially Dline. Our Offense did not

  85. Bill Douglas Says:

    Eric, we’re missing 4 starters and we held Tom Brady to 19 points.

    This was a good game, somebody had to lose.

    I love this teams future!

  86. chipbuc Says:

    You people blaming Winston for this loss wasn’t watching the game. Sure he made some bad throws, sure he made some bad decisions. But the one to blame was the man calling the plays. You’ve got a running back gashing the patriots defense for big runs for their first score. Does he continue to feed him the ball? No, does he mix in a quick slant or a screen pass or a draw play, no it’s getting to the point that Koetters offense is getting predictable. I watched one play when they showed the end zone look, everybody was standing still looking back at Winston. No movement at all. Even with Winstons so called bad game ( 334 yards 1 td ) the reason they lost the game was field goal kicking or lack there of. It’s a game they could have won with a little help from the kicker.

  87. daveman Says:

    NFLnut, you are insane if you think Jameis outplayed Brady in this game. Racking up 150 yards in the 4th quarter while down 2 scores may pad his stats, but Brady moved the sticks all night. The Bucs D put on a pretty good pash rush on Brady while most of Jameis wild throws were from clean pockets.

  88. Pawel Says:

    4 and 2 , no lets hope Folk makes a 49 yard field goal after a last miss, really? I would of went for it.

  89. Mike Johnson Says:

    Ladies and gentlemen, without further adue, Come on, Get your hands in the air, lets hear it…Lets have a warm round of applause for Florida’s finest..THE SOB’S!! (Same ole Bucs)

  90. Capt.Tim Says:

    Other than Sims(what did he do wrong? )
    I agree with your list

    This loss is mostly on Folk.
    Koetter kept forcing passes down field to Desean Jackson. Doesnt work.
    Winston and Jackson doent have timing yet.
    To bad Desean was too busy to show up for OTAs!

    They havent worked out the long stuff.
    So throw him short stuff- and let him run.
    But also throw to Evans, Brate, and Humphries!!
    And mainly- Run the damn ball!!!
    Martin averaged 6 yards per carry!!

    Hargreaves cant cover anyone

    Bright spots.
    OLine played outstanding
    DLine got pressure tonight!
    Justin Evans turned in a great first start.
    Despite 3 missed Field goals- we still had a chance to win the game

  91. Ed Says:

    The thing that bugs me about Winston is the throws that he has trouble with require touch. He is great throwing into tight windows at stationary targets but his misses are way off and he never can lead his receiver.

    DeSean Jackson torched a corner for an easy touchdown and Jameis threw another uncatchable ball. Missed a little screen to Martin for easy first down.

    Yeah there is some firepower in these receivers but between Koetter not making adjustments and the offense being predictable we just leave too many points off the board.

    All I see is an average team on the field, not ready to beat good opponents.

  92. NFLNut Says:



    DEFENSE: They gave up a lot of yards but just 19 points, against a Patriots teams that AVERAGED 31 a game against three of the best defenses in football (KC, Houston and Carolina) … our defense also picked Brady, recovered a Brady fumble and sacked Brady 3 times … our defense played well.

    DOUG MARTIN: Doug is back and ready to roll … nuff said!

    JAMEIS: The greatest and most accomplished 23 year old ever and this game was just more proof of that … 345 yards, 1 TD and no turnovers with 7 drops and about 75 yards lost due to those drops … he missed Desean on a 65 yard TD pass (Brady also missed a wide open Chris Hogan on a wide open TD pass that could have put the game away) but had Jameis not had the drops and hit Desean, he would have been 34-46 for about 470 yards, 3 TDs and no picks … if that is what you’re “expecting” you’re expecting Jameis to be GOD on a football field and he’s not that …

    KOETTER: He’s a 2nd year coach and sometimes that shows but while people are complaining about him getting “outcoached” by a guy most consider the greatest coach in the history of football, a guy who outcoaches EVERYONE, the fact is that if Brate doesn’t drop the first TD pass Winston hit him perfectly on and Folk just makes 1/2 on the other FG’s, the Bucs have a 24-16 lead and it’s the Patriots needing to score and get a 2 point conversion to merely force O.T. at the end of the game. Koetter is fine and hopefully he’ll continue to improve as a coach the same way young players improve year to year.

    MY CONCLUSION: This team is ready for primetime and a SB run. They outplayed the defending champs and if not for Brate and Folk, win this game. There is not a single team in the NFC that is “obviously better” than the Patriots, so this team has a legitimate shot at making a realistic SB run even though they are extremely young.


  93. BuccaneEric75 Says:

    NFLNut, Winston played well in the 4th, too many bad passes in the first 3 Quarters. The D got stops once the Pats drove the field and and had to settle for FGs. Brady wasn’t perfect, but but was on point most of the game. Belichick was playing safe in the second half because he knew we couldn’t do anything. We almost made that a bad choice, thanks to Winston, DJax and Brate. I love Winston, but I don’t see how anyone can say that he had a good game. He had a good quarter when the D was just trying not to give up a big play. Brate had a lot of drops on balls that Winston hit him in the hands, I’ll give you that, but Brate was TIGHTLY COVERED on those. You can’t tell me that no one else wasn’t more open than Brate. To me, Winston gets 60% of the blame. Folk and the D share the other 40%. This was not one of Winston’s top 10 games, no matter what the numbers say.

  94. Bill Douglas Says:

    We lost to the SB champs by 6, missed 9 points of FG’s, and got our starting RB back who looked clearly better than the alternatives.

    We’re 2-2 with 4 games in. Are we not looking good?

  95. EA Says:

    Give Brady our offense and see what the result would be.

    This was a very winnable game against the champs, I’m not sure if they can win any of the next 3 games.

    How can you NOT put this on Dirk and Jameis when you’re playing against the worst defense and your defense on the other hand is playing lights out??

    Jameis is the worst QB in our division right now, you can’t argue otherwise, all other 3 QBs have put much better numbers against NE recently. I don’t want to hear this leader BS anymore, just win.

    3 takes so far this season.
    1. Winston needs competition just like every other positions.
    2. Kicker obviously stinks.
    3. D-Jacks has been a distraction so far and IMO was a bad move, there was a reason Philly and redskins let him go.

  96. Captain Big Stick Says:

    As soon as this game was put on the schedule everybody pegged this as a possible loss. We are 2-2 in the first quarter of the season. Why aren’t we celebrating? The offense will figure it out, and our 2’s on defense just held brady to 19 pts. I can get excited about that.

    PS I am over Vernon Hargreaves.. and nick folk obviously..

  97. NFLNut Says:


    DAVEMAN … you’re just wrong and your bias is extremely transparent.

    Had Jameis thrown the DUCK that was picked that Brady threw, or the other bad pass that Justin Evans just happened to drop that Brady threw, or fumbled the ball away like Brady did, or led his team to just 1 TD against a defense missing 3 starters and 2 of their 4 best defensive players, you would be ripping Jameis a new one.

    Brady had a nice completion percentage with his short routes (he was 17-19 to RBs and Amendola but was just 61.9% to everyone else on his team) but that’s about it. He had more turnovers that TDs and missed a wide-open TD pass as well by overthrowing Hogan.

    Jameis watched SEVEN of his passes get dropped, including a perfect TD pass to Brate that resulted in ZERO points as Folk then missed the chip-shot FG.

    Without those drops Jameis goes 33-46 (72%) for 400+ yards, 2 TD’s and they win.



  98. Captain Big Stick Says:

    Jameis did alright tonight.. remember, the goal this season is less INTs on consistent basis, I will take his above average production for now. accuracy, touch and timing will come, and then he will become great. He is showing progress and that is good.

  99. BuccaneEric75 Says:

    NFLNut, you can’t just say that if Folk made all of his kicks and if Brate doesn’t drop a TD pass that we would have won. The game would have played out completely different, and the Pats would have been trying to score every drive instead of going into turtle mode. Bottom line: our D made a couple of big plays, but overall wasn’t good, just lucky in the red zone: Winston was bad the first three quarters and didnt heat up until the Pats knew they had the game and just tried to hold on, also known as “Bortles stats”, and Folk was “Aguayoesque” and didn’t give us a real chance. Full team loss. I’m just glad the score looks close so I don’t catch too much hell at work tomorrow. Next game will be different! Let’s start our streak now!!

  100. c-spann Says:

    I think the DK needs to be more creative. There is to many weapons not to be. why dont we bootleg or more screens to DJ11. Find a way to get OJ involved. Also we should have given the ball to DM22 more. He was on a different level. I felt like DK was playing scared on offense. He is way too predictable. I get tired of him opening up when we are behind. open that crap from the jump!

  101. Idahobucsfan Says:

    Jw3 you suck away
    no one likes you you had every chance to win josh freeman all over start new while its not to late !!!!

  102. NFLNut Says:


    EA … I’ll respond to your points:

    A.) Brady with out offense: Brady’s stats would be much worse than his stats in NE … he plays in an entirely different system and would want to kill Koetter! He relies on a ton of high-percentage dump-offs to RBs, short crossing routes, etc. He would hate Koetter’s system and his numbers would suffer imho. Also, if you’re actually taking a dig at Jameis with this silly question … um … do you know what Brady was doing at Jameis’ current age? HE WAS A HOLDING A CLIPBOARD AS THE BACKUP QB TO DREW BLEDSOE … get a grip.

    B.) Putting this loss on Dirk & Koetter: You’re insane. If not for Brate’s dropped TD alone, we win this game. If not for that and Folk’s other 2 missed FG’s, we easily win this game. That’s what you want. If you’re “expecting” this team led by a 23 year old QB and a 2nd year coach to DOMINATE & BLOWOUT the defending champs led by the G.O.A.T. QB and the G.O.A.T. COACH … you’re insane anyways, so, carry on.

    C.) Saying Jameis is the worst QB in the division: Firstly, even if this were true, that’s not much of an insult when the other three QBs are the last two NFL MVP’s both of whom are at least 6 years older than Jameis, and the other guy is a future first ballot HOF’er in Brees. However, this isn’t even true … Jameis is a far, far, far better QB than Cam Newton and has been since last year.


    Your Point #2:) Yay, you said one sensible thing, good job!

    Your Point #3:) You might be right, but simply having him in the offense as a decoy is helpful to the offense


  103. NFLNut Says:


    BuccaneerEric75 … you have a point about had Brate not dropped the TD and had Brate not missed both of the other 2 kicks the game could have “played out differently” … however, one never knows. All we know for a fact is Brady and the Pats could only put up 19 points … they didn’t just run out the clock … they passed at the end of the game and went for the kill but couldn’t get it done and had to settle for a FG.

    So, from where I sit, the Pats put up 19 because that’s all they could put up … and Jameis led the Bucs to 24 but Brate and Folk gave back 10 of those points.

    As for “Bortles stats” … you’re just wrong. This wasn’t some 35-10 game with the Pats playing prevent the whole 4th quarter like Bortles got to go against for 3 years. Jameis shredded them as he does to just about every team when in the hurry-up … I wish Koetter just let Jameis call much of the game himself honestly.


  104. Matt B Says:

    You optimists make me want to puke tonight. Great game my a$$. That was an ugly football game. Just because it came down to the wire doesn’t make it a great game. Lots of missed opportunities by the Bucs’ offense. Tell me what a great game it was when we miss the playoffs by one game like last year.

  105. NFLNut Says:


    Matt B … try to take a LONG-TERM view on a team where many of it’s stars are under 25 years of age and it’s QB is just 23 … it’ll be better for your heart.

    By the way, by “great game”, I don’t mean “pretty game”. If we advance to the SB this year and win the game 13-12 and have horrible stats, that would be a “great game” for a Buccaneers fan, no? Think Roethlisberger’s first SB win when he played like actual garbage (seriously, look up his numbers from that game or better yet go watch the game … he looked like a poor man’s Tim TeBow!) but the Steelers beat the Seahawks!


  106. Idahobucsfan1145543 Says:

    Jw3 and folk fired tonorroe pleasethey were both horrible tonight and every season for jw3 he will always suck

  107. NFLNut Says:



    Jameis is on pace to finish this season with 4,792 passing yards, 28 TD passes and 12 picks … if he does so, he will have 12,924 passing yards and 78 TD passes before his 24th Birthday.

    Do you know how many passing yards and TD passes Brady had at the same age? SIX passing yards and ZERO TD passes.

    In fact, Tom Brady didn’t hit the 12,924 yards passing and 78 TD pass marks until he was … wait for it … TWENTY-SEVEN YEARS OLD.

    STOP demanding Jameis to play like the G.O.A.T. QB in his prime at the age of 23 … and age when Tom Brady was HOLDING A CLIPBOARD and backing up the immortal Drew Bledsoe!



  108. NFLNut Says:


    Step away from the meth slowly and go to a treatment center immediately for your own good.

  109. BuccaneEric75 Says:

    NFLNut, I’ll give you that it wasn’t completely like a Bortles game, but the Pats weren’t playing D like they did the first 3 QTs. I think Belichick called the dogs off to soon and it almost cost him. Winston, Jackson and Brate made a hell of a try at the end. Winston had drops, but he also misfired a lot, especially in the first half, and had bad passes that that were caught for completions also. Brady made some mistakes but most of the game he was accurate and hitting guys in stride. Our D made some plays, again, but I think they killed themselves in the red zone more than we stopped them. Folk is what he is, I guess. He’ll be gone in a few days. Goodnight and go Bucs!

  110. Idahobucsfan1145543 Says:

    @nflnut Jw sucks a lot he needs to make plays and can’t even find djax down the field that’s a horrible qb fyi kirk fing cousins looks better then him time to move on period

  111. NFLNut Says:


    As for Desean Jackson:

    Last year he had 56 catches, 1,005 yards and 4 TDs

    This year he’s on pace for 56 catches, 996 yards and 4 TDs


  112. Eric Says:

    When the Pats were actually playing defense and not just playing not to lose your treasured Jameis was 8 of 16 for 71 yards at halftime. That is abysmal for a supposed franchise quarterback. That says all you need to know.
    NFL nut apparently never heard of the words garbage time stats. That what they were. I hear all of your If’s but If he would actually not throw balls behind his intended targets they would have what is called YAC. IF my aunt had a set of nuts she’d be my uncle. If you had a brain you would be intelligent… Looking at the final stats tell you nothing about how the game really went, kinda like your garnet and gold sunglasses. Bottom line stat is Brady won without Gronk and without Edelman. I think that neutralizes your claim that we had players injured.
    News flash Captain Dumba$$, every team has players injured, not every team has an accurate quarteback…mic drop

  113. Idahobucsfan1145543 Says:

    Two words deshaun watson end of story franchise my a$$

  114. BuccaneEric75 Says:

    NFLNut, I just read some of your other comments. Just for the record: I’ve never said Winston should play like the GOAT. This is just my assessment of him from this game. Winston is young and should improve. If he keeps on the path he’s on he’ll be great. I’m also an FSU fan and am glad we picked him over Mariota. The one thing I will say is that comparing Brady’s early numbers to Winston doesn’t really mean much, just that Brady stayed in college longer and had to sit behind an established QB. I do think that if Brady was a starter at 21 he wouldn’t have Winstons numbers, but that doesn’t mean he’ll be as good in the long run. Could be, we’ll see. Now it’s goodnight! Lol

  115. Bill Douglas Says:

    — “STOP demanding Jameis to play like the G.O.A.T. QB in his prime at the age of 23 … and age when Tom Brady was HOLDING A CLIPBOARD and backing up the immortal Drew Bledsoe!


    Well said. We’re still very early in the career of Jameis. He has some mechanical issues he needs to iron out. He needs to improve his decision making. But, he’s a legit franchise QB unlike the other 2/3 of the league.

  116. Idahobucsfan1145543 Says:

    And honestly I hope I am wrong but we need jw3 to put the game on his shoulders And not choke like Carson Palmer please man.. That’s all just once when its in his hands..

  117. Duke Says:

    NFL nut

    Tom Brady was the youngest QB to win a super bowl at age 24. His second season. He was not a first round pick nor was He the most pro ready QB to enter the draft in years. But what He did do was Win the Super bowl in His second season. Jameis is ahead of the age curve but He’s not even in the conversation about who is the most accomplished 2nd year QB to ever play the game.
    His 4,000 yard seasons are impressive until you consider that a third of active QB’ s hit that Mark.

    A conversation about the best 2nd year starting QB starts and ends with Dan Marino. I think he was 24 and already an all pro and league MVP. Jameis isn’t on track to accomplish either one of those accolades. Not to say He won’t or can’t.
    I am not a hater and I hope He is the guy for us for the next decade. But that’s not the point, the point is that He’s not the best 2nd year player ever. Age is not as important as experience and his head start on the competition is too His advantage as He’s not backing up anyone at any point so far. Brady, Marino and Favre were not the #1 pick in the draft and they had to wait. When they got the chance, they balled. Winston has been a starter at 23 or 24 far longer than those guys. So He should be better than they were at that age. So far…….not even close

  118. I'm tired and 87 is right Says:

    Made me realize the only reason I ever watched these guys was because they were the underdog and so was I. I told my wife that. Well I am not anymore so shouldn’t I just move on? I mean I saw some heart but does anyone really care? Self reflection ride home. After all we do pick and choose our battles.

  119. NFLNut Says:

    Marino had the best 2nd year in history, yes. BTW Ben Roethlisberger was younger than Brady when he won the SuperBowl I believe as I’m pretty sure he was only 23, though he sucked in that game and was carried by his Steelers team.

    Anyways … it is an indisputable fact that Jameis is the greatest and most accomplished QB of his age in the history of football. Marino had a great 2nd year and Roethlisberger and Brady played on great teams that won a ring at the age of 23-24 but none of those guys, especially Brady, had the overall resume of Jameis.

  120. NFLNut Says:

    BTW … Brady was a late-round draft pick, drafted to be a backup, and drafted to a team that was just 4 years removed from winning the AFC and making it to the SuperBowl … Jameis was drafted by the worst team in football and drafted to be a franchise Savior … that is a huge difference.

    Jameis is taking the LeBron James path while Brady got the Tim Duncan treatment (drafted to a quality team with a great coach).

  121. Duke Says:

    Jameis taking the LeBron James path……. love the analogy. But I hope that He doesn’t break our hearts and head to Miami. Hey, let me just say flat out …..that The Bucs need more of you and a he’ll of lot less of the “I’m happier when the Bucs are losing” paxil popping mental patients as fans

    Stay strong brother.

  122. darin Says:

    Good call Joe. Yes I know ive said this numerous times but it makes me sick still. Finally a slant, like u said. Hooray, and yes 41 yds that felt like 100. Basic slants and draw plays are simple and productive. I knew before the game theyd have to change up some of those same routes they run over n over n over, they didnt until 4th quarter. Sad, pathetic. Martin running like an animal n they cant pick up a 3rd down to get hin more carries. Gota put that one on dirk. Terrible game plan against that defense. N winston needs to work on his timing to get guys the ball in stride. Folk has gota go and will cuz someones gota be the scapegoat, which he should. But cmon dirk and jameis. What a wasted opportunity. I hope dirk adds in some different play calls from here on out, as we see how productive they are when called. Dam that sucked. Go Bucs

  123. darin Says:

    Oh to answer that question simply dirk deserves all the blame. Terrible game plan. Whatd he expect them to play man all game? Not to mention he is the one who kept folk after thatnightmare last week. Blame dirk, then jameis, then folk. Adios folk, thanks for nothing. We arent getting rid of dirk or jameis this week, n someones gota go. Go bucs

  124. Wes Says:

    I give Koetter a C thus far this season. Idk how Martin goes off for 50 yards in 1 drive and then we run the ball a total of 17 times. I don’t understand all the 15+ yard throws and lack of adjustments when Winston is having a tough night. Finally in the 4th we got a short slant to Jackson and BOOM 40 yards instantly. That should have happened earlier. Mike Evens in the slot was a good move, should have happened earlier. And lastly, we Jameis fans all know he throws BEST on the move. Where are the plays designed for him? Every best throw he made last night were when he had to scramble away from a sack. Koetter needs to do better.

    The onside kick was a bad call too. But I will say that was just a 2nd year coach making a bad decision that he will learn from.

  125. johnnybuc Says:

    why do we constantly take deep shots on 3rd and short it passes me off

  126. The Anomaly Says:

    @nflnut – The condescension is making you look like an ass. Chill out. Take a xanax.

    JW played like trash for most of the game. He racked up numbers while the Pats were playing way off and keeping everything in front of them.

    Anyone who think JW outplayed Brady is probably a family member. I like where he’s headed. He’s young. He’ll learn and get better.

  127. Duke Says:


    Let me be clear about the style of offense the Bucs run………..I don’t like it. Never have, never will. That said, a country things stand out in your post.
    One Jameis Winston is a NFL style drop back pocket passer. Mariotta at the time was the alternative to JW. That is a QB who plays from the shot gun and uses his legs to make plays outside the pocket. I understand the point about JW moving outside the pocket, but that’s because He’s not quick to read and release. Moving out of the pocket is a huge indication that JW is slower than the scheme requires.

    You can blame DK for not doing this or that , I agree with some of that, however the coach is not that easily fingered and assigned blame for the fact that Winston has missed so many open receivers not because He’s inaccurate but rather He never threw the best route option. I see time and again that the play design is creating open receivers and JW fails to “see” them. The slant pass to DJ wasn’t the only time that the route was called. It was the first time JW saw it.

    The offensive coordinator will be “exposed” only when JW is able to pick the right route and throw it on schedule. We ain’t close yet.

    Last, this is a observation. JW is lauded by many as a deep ball thrower. He’s the antithesis of the ck down Charlie characterization that’s made as a pejorative when discussing other QB’ s. Now we are the point that JW’s deep ball ability is not as advertised and the overwhelming majority of comments say DK is responsible. The remedy offer by the slippery Pete’s of the world say DK needs to provide JW more short routes and ck downs. This is ridiculous and it’s been entirely overlooked by fans looking for a substitute for their own lack of accountability and/or lack of ability to understand their own contradictory opinions.

    JW is not a finished product and DK May or may not be able to provide the best scheme for this ball club. Before we have a fire DK party it’s a smart play to see if JW is stifled by the scheme. Today, JW has shown that he’s not been able to maximize the current scheme . So let’s see what happens when He does. Then we’ll know.

  128. Mo_Downs Says:


    Not bad, but not playoff caliber so far.

    The Rams didn’t forget their running game and are winning.
    Doug is fresh and highly motivated and super productive.

    So WTF, Dirk..??

    No mention of OJ’s penalties and drops..??