The Morning After

September 19th, 2016


If your head isn’t pounding this morning, then you are not doing it right… or you ate a handful of Aleve two hours ago.

It’s been a long, long time since Joe felt a nutkick like this. After looking so damned good to open the season, then the Bucs look like one of Raheem Morris’ teams against the Steelers a week later, good grief!

On to Joe’s notes.

* Did someone kidnap Jameis yesterday and Josh Freeman sneaked in wearing his uniform?

* Something is weird with Vincent Jackson and Joe has no idea what it is. Joe’s antennae rose last week when offensive coordinator/wide receivers coach Todd Monken called out Jackson in his weekly press conference. Folks, coaches simply do not do that to seasoned veterans, Pro Bowlers, in fact, just for s(p)its and giggles. That was a very public message sent. An upstanding citizen and teammate that Jackson is, that really got Joe’s attention.

Look, if a wide receiver was going to get outed for running a wrong route that led to an interception, the list of players would be long. Yeah, Rudy Humphries got called out (not right away) by then-offensive coordinator Dirk Koetter last year when he ran a wrong route that led to the first-ever pass attempt of America’s Quarterback, Pro Bowler Jameis Winston, becoming a pick-six. But Humphries was a rookie undrafted free agent for crying out loud.

Then, videos begin surfacing of Jackson being very indifferent — to be polite — to plays happening right in front of him. Readers pointed out to Joe that continued yesterday.

Is Old Man Time catching up with Jackson? Probably. Maybe, likely. Old Man Time is undefeated and offers no favors. Something weird is going on here and Joe sure hopes whatever it may be is taken care of, and soon. The Bucs and Jameis need Jackson.

Tidbits Joe jotted down during the game:

* It’s time to start ranking the Bucs’ offensive line up there with the best in the NFL.

Time to throw was not a problem for Jameis yesterday. Remember, the Bucs virtually returned their line — which featured two rookie starters — from last year intact, and that same line gave up an NFL fourth-fewest sacks for a rookie quarterback. The lone non-returning starter on that line is Kevin Pamphile, who did start a game for Logan Mankins last year at left guard. Before Martin got hurt, the Bucs were moving the ball on the ground and Jacquizz Rodgers didn’t have much of a problem running, either. Right now the offensive line is the strength of the team.

* Bucs AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht must be pulling his hair out. After spending heaps of cash on Robert Ayers and drafting Noah Spence, this friggin’ team still cannot get a pass rush. It’s pathetic. Yeah, Spence got a sack yesterday, but the game was already decided by then. It’s getting to the point Licht might have to start sacrificing chickens in order to get an edge pass rush. This damned franchise is cursed; it simply cannot get regular heat on a quarterback no matter how much Team Glazer loot the front office dishes out and how many draft picks it burns. It is just un-freaking-real. It’s getting to the point where Licht ought to draft nothing but defensive ends next spring and pray that one shakes out among the stack.

* Hey, how about those fast starts Koetter preaches about so often? Yeah, right. At least the Bucs moved the ball on their first drive, only to see Patrick Peterson squeeze Mike Evans’ route and get a pick. In his now 18 games as offensive coordinator/head coach, Koetter’s fast starts (cough) more often than not resemble a race to the head before having an unpleasant accident.

* Cardinals showed why their secondary is so superior. Bucs receivers getting little if any separation and, as a result, Jameis had to be razor sharp, but wasn’t after the first possession.

* How in the world can Lavonte David lay a goose egg, with no tackles? That’s very Danny Lansanah of him. Joe can only imagine he was hurt. Seems improbable otherwise.

* The Cardinals had 416 total net yards yesterday. Seven of their first nine games last year they had 414 or more yards. Only two of those games came against playoff teams: Pittsburgh and Seattle, both wins.

* Surprisingly, the Cardinals converted only 6 of 14 third downs.

* The Bucs defense forced but one three-and-out in the first nine Arizona possessions. Somewhere in the middle of the central Illinois cornfields, Lovie Smith smiles in appreciation.

* Ugh, the injuries. Robert Ayers in a boot. Doug Martin with a blown hammy. Vernon Hargreaves was dinged up. Can’t remember so many injuries to so many key players in one game. What a complete and total disaster yesterday was.

Game balls

Offensive line: The only thing that worked for the Bucs yesterday was the front wall of the offense. It created enough holes for Doug Martin and Rodgers to run through. And until late, gave Jameis ample time to throw. Right now, the offensive line is the lone strength of this team.

(Joe wants to give a game ball to cornerback Alterraun Verner but the defense was so wretched yesterday, he cannot logically give anyone on the defense a game ball. They stunk to high heaven as a collective unit.)


“As a quarterback it’s my job to be able to go out there and give the receivers chances to make plays. The throw to Mike Evans wasn’t a great throw, but I gave him a chance to make a great play and he did. All the other situations I have to give them a chance to make plays. If you think about last weekend with Chuck (Charles Sims III) a five-yard completion turned into a touchdown because I give him a chance to make plays. The interceptions—other than the tipped ball I’ve got to give our guys a chance to make plays.” — Jameis Winston.

“I was really nervous that we did not have a good practice on Wednesday. I talked to the team about it. We talked about this. I talked about this to multiple people. But you can’t perceive – the first quarter, the way the game started out, we were fine. It was back and forth. We were moving the ball. They were moving the ball. It just came down to those turnovers in the first half. Three turnovers in the first half. Put our defense in horrible position. We didn’t finish drives on offense.” — Dirk Koetter.

“It is a blessing, but we didn’t get the win.” — Noah Spence on his first NFL sack.

“Good teams don’t have many bad practices.” — Cecil Shorts.

“I blame the whole thing on me because I need to set the tempo, that’s on me. I have to do better, if I don’t do better than the defense isn’t going to be right. I’m putting a lot of pressure on me. I’m going to do better.” — Kwon Alexander.

“If you don’t prepare to win and you don’t prepare the right way, you lose. You lose if your mind isn’t mentally focused, if you’re not sharp on your keys and what you need to do which we were not, then you lose.” — Clinton McDonald.

“If you have a good, young quarterback and a great receiver, you don’t shy from anybody.” — Bruce Arians, on the Bucs throwing at Patrick Peterson.


Random quick thoughts not necessarily NFL-related.

So the Rams won a game yesterday. Uh, oh. Joe was in St. Louis to witness first-hand how that Rams defense manhandled the Bucs. Why does Joe have a pit in his stomach? … Joe fears a loss Sunday to the Rams will put this team into an ugly tailspin, setting up yet another top-10 draft. No, no one expected the Bucs to beat the Cardinals before the season, but the chain-whipping by Arizona was so intense, Joe seriously wonders about the mental makeup of this squad. … In the glass-is-half-full view, Licht saved on his dry cleaning bill last night.  … Josh McCown and the Browns. You poor, poor, poor people of Cleveland. … Oh, Gus Bradley, better brush up that resumé. Gotta hunch you will need that come Christmas. … Love the Rams in their 1970s-80s blue and yellow unis. … So the Lions, with 15 seconds left in the first half, had a second-and 16 from their own 30 and two timeouts and don’t even try to get into field goal range? No Hail Mary attempt with Matthew Stafford’s arm? Just kneel down and go to the locker? Oh, the Lions lost by one point. Jim Caldwell, like Lovie Smith, is a Father Dungy disciple. Offense in general and scoring points in particular are a burden for these guys. … In a battle of ex-Bucs coaches Saturday, P.J. Fleck and his Western Michigan Broncos came into Memorial Stadium and laid the wood to Lovie’s Illinois squad. … Speaking of beatdowns, wow, Louisville put a hurt on Florida State so bad it made Jimbo Fisher grow hair. Troubling item for Fisher: He talked FSU into signing defensive coordinator Charles Kelly to a five-year pact at roughly $800,000 a year over the winter. Of the six games in which opponents racked up the most yards on a Jimbo Fisher-led FSU team, including Saturday, all but one of those games came with Kelly as defensive coordinator. And he has been on the job for just over two years now! And how many four- and five-star recruits does he have to work with? Hope for Fisher’s sake Kelly has a buyout clause. … What a dirty friggin’ hit on Florida quarterback Luke Del Rio! … Just when one thought the Longhorns were good again — splat! — they give up 50 to Cal in a loss. Cal! … There was so much football to watch Saturday night, Joe’s head was spinning. … Is Texas A&M good again, or just another Kevin Sumlin tease? … Damn, Ohio State looks like a machine. … No one wants the last wild card in the National League. The Cardinals, Giants and Mets are playing hot potato with each other.

36 Responses to “The Morning After”

  1. lightningbuc Says:

    Bucs aren’t very good (again) …simple as that!

  2. mike10 Says:


    I noticed VJax reacting oddly after the Brandon Myers TD last week. My thoughts (and just a guess) he’s having trouble passing the torch? I agree though, it’s very concerning

  3. The Buc Realist Says:

    On the VJ issue, I spoke about it right after the game last week, and watching the same thing this week, it is pretty obvious!!!!! The Injury from last year is still a factor!!! when he makes his cuts, watch how rounded his routes are, they are no where near a 90, and more of a rounded arc ( pablo would say it was an elongated arc) on his cuts!!! So when no the leg injury is still bothering him and no sense jumping up and down in the endzone to waste energy!!! Most likely he is “numbing” it so he can block and run on it!! VJ87 is not a huge celebration guy to begin with, and just being on the field is an accomplishment at this point!!!

    The question is, Is it going to get better??? Because we can not force feed the whole offense thru ME13!!!! This is the second game with no effective run game, The TE can be counted on for 5 catches a game!!! And 80% of the time, the WR’s cannot get open!!!

  4. Nole on Sat.-Bucc on Sun. Says:

    That game yesterday was so staged its ridiculous. My higher self can no longer bite my tongue when it comes to this bulls@$!. Dougie not hurt,never was. I’m signing off when it comes to all this fake @$$ sports entertaiment. Teddy Bridgewater injury is a hoax. He was removed for whatever reason. You can expect the Vikings to represent the NFC in the superbowl. Nonna this bulls@$! real yo,been noticing hole in all of sports for years hoping it was all in my mind but its not. Im done wit this s@$!.

  5. Jdogg81 Says:

    With the whole JW thing I think he heard about his buddy PJ before the game and thats where his head was at cause it wasn’t in the game yesterday at all

  6. Old Time Buc Says:

    Lots and lots of advil!! It was ugly and now we need to get back to work. Guess I’ll go down to Howard and ask or at least see for myself cause VJ is a very likeable guy and straight forward.

  7. Jdogg81 Says:

    I have seen the same thing

  8. JA Says:

    The Rams got smoked by thr 49ers who got smoked by Carolina. Then the previously smoked Rams went home and beat Seattle. Nothing makes sense in this league. Remember that next Sunday when the Rams come to town to play the just smoked Bucs. Nobody has a clue about what will happen.

  9. Tampabaybucfan Says:

    Listen…we simply got beat by a better team. That coupled with errant passes, traveling to the West Coast and turning the ball over will do it to you every time.

    I did see some encouraging things…..

    Adam Humphries is really developing into a solid receiver and return man.
    Mike Evans is solid. Our pickups of Cecil Shorts and Jaquizz Rodgers appear to be solid.
    As for the defense, only the play of Verner stood out as a positive.
    Our punter continues to send boomers.

    That’s about all the positives I can find.

  10. Buccaneer scotty Says:

    All I can say is WTF!!!

  11. iamkingsu Says:

    Didn’t watch the game but who was I talking to this week about David Johnson? ?Why no one told me he threw Kwon out of bounds on a missed tackle?

  12. mike n Says:

    We went up against a big dog and We found out we just puppies.

  13. Tampa Tony Says:

    Finally Joe made the correlation between Jameis and Freeman. Both are up and down QB’s who will tease you with greatness then break your heart with awful performances. Yet there are so many FSU homers here they are blinded to see the scary similiarlarities.

    Jameis needs to learn some consistency to be considered a franchise guy. Humbling game but I’m still optimistic Koetter matches Loser Lovies two year win total in 1 year

  14. Bucwylde Says:

    NoSBos dude you are really out there. You been saying for weeks “who are the good teams” and that “we are as talented as any team in the league”, Now we get exposed as a team not where we want to be yet and suddenly you change your tune to the whole thing is rigged? and Doug Martin and Teddy Bridgewater’s injury is fake? Please remove the tin foil hat and take some long slow deep breaths and try to relax.

  15. VA Tom Says:

    Oh stop for goodness sakes. Yeah it was a stinker. I guess our superbowl chances are done… insert rolly eyes emoji here… Ya know, cuz we were going to the super bowl this year and all. Hang on for more ugly games and a few brilliant ones. Yeah, I wanted a 10-6 team. But we all knew logically they are 8-8 best. Stop with the over reaction. Jayzus. What are we again? In the top ten youngest teams in the NFL…first time head coach… chill… and stop talking Bucs smack to your bar stool neighbor when they have a good game so you don’t look so stupid when they lose big.

  16. Waterboy Says:

    Regardless of how much you lose by a loss only counts as 1 game and they have time to rebound and show improvement. Although the final score wasn’t quite what I expected the outcome was to be expected. The Bucs are an up and coming team that I think will be consistently competing for titles in a few years but right now they are at best a 9-7 team and more realistically an 8-8 team.

    As far as yesterday, it was one of those games where pretty much everything that could go wrong did and at the worse times. There will be those kind of days but the one thing that I saw that I liked was the team didn’t quit. They didn’t execute well and we saw areas exposed where they are lacking in talent but I didn’t see them quit.

    As bad as Winston and the offense started out yesterday they should have been going into the half down 10-0 and receiving the ball on the kickoff in the 2nd half. The miscommunication between Sims and Winston that lead to a fumble and killed that drive was the beginning of the end. After that I saw the air get sucked out of the team and they began to crumble. The long TD pass that Conte gave up just before the half a back breaker. All and all it was a disappointing week but still just 1 loss!

  17. Stpetebucsfan Says:

    It was simply a perfect storm. #3 awful…5 turnovers against none!!!
    Horrible luck as well..injury to Doug…balls bouncing off defenders to the Bucs bouncing again to a defender in perfect position for a pick six…that was one that wasn’t on #3. RB running into the QB’s arm causing another fumble which of course they recovered.

    We played horribly, got zero breaks, and they are freaking good. This is a game we simply need to forget.

    Meanwhile all i read this summer was about our strength of schedule. But the reality is the strength is all front loaded. And like Joe and everybody this is going to test the team and the fans mental toughness. i’m ready I hope the team is!

    First five games…3 on the road…two of them against the NFC finalists! One home game against the SB Champs, 3 of our first five against the top three teams from last year!!!! 3 games on the road! That’s a tall order.

    But the last 11 contain plenty of winnable games. If we beat LA we’re still in excellent shape for a playoff. Stop the panic unless you really believe #3 is going to play like this every week…instead of like last week.

  18. Buccaneer Bonzai Says:

    Welcome to reality, people. The Cards are an elite team. The Bucs are not.

    That doesn’t mean the Bucs are not on their way to being elite, but anyone who expected a win this week was living in a dream world. While anything is remotely possible, the Bucs had no more than a 15% chance of a win coming into this week.

    You all bought into the false hype. Congrats.

    Now pick yourselves up. Dust yourselves off. Quit feeling extreme highs and lows and level off your expectations.

    We all knew we would be lucky to go 1-4 in the first five games, with a likely win against the Rams. We got a nice blessing by beating the Falcons in week one, so it is possible we’ll go 2-3 instead. We hope.

    The real wins will start coming after the bye week. Until then, this team is trying to find its identity…as should have been expected from the start.

  19. LakeLandBuc Says:

    You can’t post the truth on this site, there’s some ” delusional teary eye” fans on this site. The sad part is they refuse to accept the truth, they want to continue living in their little fantasy world. They know who they are, I don’t launch personal attacks on commenters, I thought only “women ” do that. But they have no problem with that, why get into a catfight with the women (feminine) commenters on here. The bottom line is, the Bucs are NOT a good football team, they are light years away from being a good football team. We have a incompetent GM, who traded a 3rd and 4th for a kicker, while we have more important needs at other positions. We are taking a $12 million cap hit on a 33 year old receiver who is coming back from a season ending injury. We are taking a $ 6 million cap hit for a backup CB. We signed a $32 million free agent guard, who haven’t even dress out yet. And the BEAT goes on.

  20. Stpetebucsfan Says:


    Stuff is not true just because you say it is!!! Rip on other posters all you wish but it’s you who come off looking arrogant and foolish.

    You are stating things as if they are facts TWO FREAKING GAMES INTO THE SEASON. That doesn’t make it true even if you choose to disparage other posters who are not the negative nabob of negativity you seem to be.

    It must suck to live in such a negative HOPELESS world.


    1st int was a perfect long ball that ME13 got muscled out on. The 2nd int was definitely on JW3. He threw it behind VJ83. The 3rd int/pick 6 was a double tip that Sims had a chance to catch. The fumble was on Sims aswell. So it was a team effort @tampa tony not just on JW3. If u want mariota to be Ur qb so bad be a titans fan.

  22. Bucsfanman Says:

    We as fans needed this game to remind ourselves that this football team was 2-14 and 6-10 the last 2 seasons. Despite the talent upgrade, we’re not there yet. It’s that simple. We’re going to have a couple of these games. Winners are not built overnight.

    The VJax thing is odd. He does appear “off”. AND the pass rush! Well, it was obvious to me early on that we weren’t’ getting pressure on Carson (a statue!). A QB like that will tear you apart given that much time. Hence 40-7!
    Jameis was flat awful! All of his passes were off and I worried that he was going to get Mike killed a couple of times.
    It’s on to next week. Go Bucs!!!

  23. Tom Edrington Says:

    Can’t understand why everyone is so upset, if you had said a 1-1 start everyone would have taken it……now if they lose to the Rams at home that might be cause for concern. I see a lot of over-reaction today

  24. Stpetebucsfan Says:

    BTW let’s stop sugar coating it for some of our posters here.

    During the debate about which QB to take I was on the fence and seriously worried about the “off field” issues. Not any single one but the totality of them indicated either bad judgement or immaturity. He was a teenager when much of this happened and so it’s clear to me now it was simple immaturity. Kids will be kids.

    Now that he’s grown up and become not just a decent guy but an EXEMPLARY young man there is no doubt we made the right call.

    I sense however from some they still haven’t gotten over their bromance with MM. I do not need to pile on MM. He’s going to be a fine QB…but NOT as good as #3.

    Some of you need to check yourselves. I sense that some…certainly a minority…would rather be perceived as having their MM love vindicated than root for our current QB. That’s just sad.


    Thank you @st pete that’s what I’m saying. This game wasn’t on any 1 person. Although JW3 will publicly and willingly take the blame. Tipped balls and Ur back up rb causing a fumble is not all on JW3

  26. Nole on Sat.-Bucc on Sun. Says:

    Did you A holes not see Teddy Bridgewater standing on the sideline like he was perfectly fine lastnight. No crutches no nothing.

  27. Nole on Sat.-Bucc on Sun. Says:

    Tin foil this dude what you wager DM22 plays next week. Ima check back to if you up for anything.

  28. LargoBuc Says:

    NOSBOS, I love the optimism, you are a die hard and the Bay bneeds more fans like you. But it’s time to admit that the team isn’t as good as you thought.

  29. Buccfan37 Says:

    Seeing is believing. We all saw it. Now believe it. I’m over it too. I expect better coming up.

  30. briandorry55 Says:

    I feel like you’re watching a different offensive line than I am.

  31. 813bucboi Says:

    cant blame lovie and his so called incompetent staff…..we’re still getting blown out….defense still looks shaky….second game in a row that we haven’t forced a turn over….qb pressure was nonexistence…

    I agree with @Lakeland in regards to Licht and the mistakes he’s made….and Roberto missed a fg he should’ve made….with those picks he gave up to get him we could’ve added a wr, de or safety….GO BUCS!!!!

  32. Pewter Power Says:

    You guys kill me. Bucs fans are the most reactionary in the league. After the Falcons game you guys thought they were winning the Super Bowl now you guys are saying 1-15. Get a grip everybody. Yes it was horrible but it was one game. All the great quarterbacks lay a stinker from time to time. Those defensive players get paid too. Geez.

  33. Pickgrin Says:

    Well – it was UGLY. That’s all that can be said. A very few bright moments for some players but over all – a terrible effort by the team as a whole.

    Worst game I have seen Winston play as a Buccaneer – perhaps rivaled only by last year’s 1st Carolina game.

    We were hanging with them OK defensively in the beginning and then turnovers happened and it all went down the crapper and got ugly.

    Back to the drawing board.

    The 2016 Bucs are not nearly as bad as they looked yesterday nor perhaps as good as they looked vs Atlanta.

    7 to 9 wins is probably still about where this team will wind up most likely. A 2-3 start was what I expected before the 1st game was played – so not really panicking over an ugly loss to a better, more talented and pissed off AZ team on the road.

    The glass half full viewpoint is that the Bucs are 1-1 and technically leading the division because we have a division win and no one else does yet.

    Winning even 1 of the next 3 games leaves us still in position to improve and make a run at the playoffs. Lets see how the team plays against the Rams at home. I think they will rebound and play pretty well next week.

    Even the mighty ’02 team got their ass handed to them in a game out west by Oakland en route to winning the Super Bowl – so this ugly loss is likely not as significant as it would seem the morning after.

  34. BIG IRISH.....SECTION 318 Says:


  35. Bucwylde Says:

    NoSBoS I don’t gamble on things I have no idea about and I have no idea on the severity of DM22 injury, I would hope they keep him out next week to protect further problems. But for you to suggest that teddy faked an ACL tear and dislocation so that Sam Bradford could come in and win the super bowl and DM22 laid down so the Cards could win is asinine.

  36. Buccfan37 Says:

    I can’t wait for Saturdays TV matchup between FSU vs USF in Tampa. The Seminole fans should fill up the stadium. Hopefully FSU doesn’t do an Arizona Cardinals on the Bulls. Go Bulls! Win one for the home team. I expect FSU to win though.