Johnny Scrutiny And Bypassing The Bucs

March 31st, 2014

johnny football 0226Joe continues to see recognized draft gurus pointing to Johnny Football getting past the Bucs and landing with the Vikings and grouchy Mike Zimmer with the No. 8 overall pick.

Has the world gone mad? Would Lovie Smith and his handpicked QB guru Jeff Tedford really pass on a chance to upgrade the most important position on the field with the most talented QB in the draft?

Yes, Johnny Football is under scrutiny following his Pro Day attended by Lovie Smith last week. And rightfully so. Former NFL scout and longtime draft guru Russ Lande, who doubles as a CFL personnel man, penned an intriguing look at the performance. (And that’s what it was, a show.)

Taking every snap from under center, Manziel was quick and efficient in his drop back and on straight “drop and throw” passes, he did a good job of driving off his back foot and getting rid of the ball quickly. He threw 25 passes less than 10 yards and all were within the receiving radius of his receiver (in my opinion, seven of them were not throw to the ideal location, as they were either slightly behind or high). When it came to medium length passes between 10 to 19 yards, he was accurate on 14 of 15 passes, but of those 14 eight were not thrown to the ideal location. When Manziel threw the ball over 20 yards, it reinforced what I had seen on film and makes me confident that he is one of the three best deep ball throwers I have ever evaluated, along with RGIII and Jeff Blake.

On the day, he was accurate on 16 of 17 20+ yard throws and only missed the ideal location on three of those 16. It was remarkably impressive seeing him make outstanding 30+ yard throws down both sidelines while on the move, both rolling into his throw and throwing against his body. What surprised me is that Manziel often seemed to be throwing to his receiver and hitting him in the numbers, rather than leading receiver — on “out” routes especially. This may be an issue because many teams base their passing offense around throwing to a spot to lead the receiver, and if he does not improve in this area he will struggle within the confines of a traditional timing-based NFL passing attack.

Lande went on to peg Johnny Football as Minnesota material.

Overall, I came away impressed with the performances of both Evans and Manziel, but was not “wowed” by either one. I think the best way to sum up Manziel’s performance is that if you already liked him, you came away convinced that he is the top prospect you thought you saw on film. However, if you came to the workout with questions about his arm strength, release quickness and accuracy, you may have felt a little better about those areas and will likely go watch more film to figure him out better. At this stage, my gut says Manziel will be drafted by the Vikings in the first round (they hold the 8th overall pick), and that Evans will be selected between picks 10 and 25.

As Joe wrote last week, Joe doesn’t care about Pro Days. They’re thoroughly insignificant when compared to what a prospect would/will endure in a private workout with a team.

But Lovie Smith said he cares about Pro Days and raved about Johnny Football’s, and Pro Days do influence decision-makers for many teams.

The Bucs’ quarterback situation ultimately will come back to Tedford. Joe believes Lovie told Tedford to give him a list of quarterbacks in the draft he could turn into strong starters. And Joe’s confident the Bucs will grab the first one available, in whatever round that may be.

56 Responses to “Johnny Scrutiny And Bypassing The Bucs”

  1. lightningbuc Says:

    Joe doesn’t care about Pro Days. Joe only writes about what interests him. Yet Joe is still writing about a Pro Day that happened last week by a guy that will, more than likely, not be drafted by the Bucs.

  2. BirdDoggers Says:

    I could see the Bucs passing on Manziel if he’s still on the board, simply because we have no idea what Lovie, Licht and Tedford think of him. They might have another QB rated higher. It might be Bridgewater or Bortles. It might be a QB that will be available later in the draft. They might not draft a QB at all, although I hope that’s not the case. When a new regime is going through the process of dismantling and rebuilding a team, it makes it harder to figure out what they’re going to do.

  3. The 300's Says:

    So Lovie saying he thinks we have depth a QB is a smoke screen, but Lovie “raving about Johnny Football” is not? And if 6 other teams (a few of which have QB needs) do not draft the #1 QB in the world…. EVER!!!!, then why should the Bucs?

    Joe needs to turn this site into……..

  4. Bill T Says:

    “the most talented QB in the draft” – that is debatable. Bortles and Carr have more upside, Bridgewater is supposed to be most pro-ready (I disagree).

    What’s not debatable is Manziel isn’t the most talented player. I have at least 4 who are….Clowney, Watkins, Robinson, Mack. I would take any of those over Manziel if available

  5. Oil Derrick Brooks Says:

    The Lost Months

  6. tmaxcon Says:

    Lovie needs to be building up MG more so his trade value increases. The question is will the Mike Glennon mob follow MG to his new team.

    my preference is to trade down and snag ebron in first and grab Murray in 3rd or 4th(if bucs can grab a pick) i’d also be fine with Evans in first round. unfortunately no way in hell that sammy falls to 7

  7. bucslandonrevisisland Says:

    Cj mosley cj cj cj Cj

  8. bucrightoff Says:

    Passing on Johnny just has to happen for Joe’s reaction. I wanna see him ask Lovie and Licht if they never got laid in college and if that is why they passed on Johnny.

  9. tmaxcon Says:

    i think everyone is missing the point on Johnny football and the ladies. Johnny is clearly a victim here. Let’s just say he does not properly take care of one of these fine ladies or worse yet he says NO to a picture; he will be labled an ARSE and not fan friendly etc. etc. etc..

    so really johnny is the victim and has no choice but to please these ladies in order to keep his name in good standing with the fans and the media. Johnny should be praised for his generosity and time he spends with the ladies not penalized for being a victim.

  10. Johnny Manziel Says:

    You seem to have an OCD condition about me Joe, and it’s scaring me. I don’t want to play for the bucs simply because I don’t want you writing about me all the time and obsessing about me.

  11. Jason Says:

    I don’t know if I can stand another month of you sniffing this guys farts. God help the readers of this site if the Bucs actually pick him. If we do end up with him are you going to change the name of the site to JohnnyBucsFan? You might as well because that’s what it’s turned into

  12. @rayswin100 Says:

    WOW The Bucs are at the FORK in the road and better be right about passing on any of the top QB’s and especially a QB with Drew Brees like numbers written all over him….Hate to have to make the pick BUT I would take this Guy rather than be the LOSER that passed on him. Especially when historically you never have had a QB, in the Division you play in nobody would blame managment for going after a QB…..GUTS and Million dollar Jobs really do go hand in hand…

  13. StPeteBucsFan Says:

    Think about past “most talented” Q.B.’s in the draft. When you talk about Manning or Elway or that type of player the question is will he go number one overall.

    Great Q.B’s that are clearly great coming out go in the top few pics. Obviously Brady and others prove you can find a Q.B. later in the draft if you you’re lucky and have a good eye.

    My point is that if Johnny Football is still available at #7 then he’s not really all that. Remember the draft pics the Redskins assembled to move up to get RGIII. There is none of the kind of talk going on right now.

    Obviously nobody knows whether Johnny Football will be the next Fran Tarkenton or Doug Flutie….if they did believe he was all that there would be a lot of clamoring and folks trying to move up. Johnny FB MAY be a franchise Q.B. but he’s no lock.

  14. Buc1987 Says:

    “Joe believes Lovie told Tedford to give him a list of quarterbacks in the draft he could turn into strong starters. And Joe’s confident the Bucs will grab the first one available, in whatever round that may be.”

    All I gotta say is what I’ve been saying for a little while now and will continue to say until the draft.

    Bucs 2014 training camp QB’s : McCown, Glennon, Kafka.

    That’s it people that’s the rotation. There will be no QB selected in this years draft. Check back with me next draft though.

  15. Hawk Says:

    “The Bucs’ quarterback situation ultimately will come back to Tedford. Joe believes Lovie told Tedford to give him a list of quarterbacks in the draft he could turn into strong starters. And Joe’s confident the Bucs will grab the first one available, in whatever round that may be.”
    I’m not sure what you meant by the above. You surely don’t believe that the Bucs would use the #7 pick for Carr or Murray, even if Tedford says that he could turn them into a starter. That would be a *HUGE* gamble with Lovies’ future.

  16. Buc Neckid Says:

    Bucs Interest in Manziel = them Fishing for a trade partner to trade down in first with

  17. Buc1987 Says:

    The real question for all you “why does Joe keep talking about Johnny” crowd is this.

    Will Joe still keep writing about him even after the draft, selected by the Bucs or not?

    I wonder if Joe has actual dreams about Johnny on the stage in NY with a Bucs hat on. As much has he writes about him, surely he MUST have real dreams about him while sleeping.

  18. dan Says:

    “Go Johnny”. Yea go to another team!!!!!

  19. SAMCRO Says:

    Why did they push the draft back again? Some of us are gonna have coronaries if we don’t get our fix soon. The anticipation is almost as bad as waiting for the actual season to begin. At least the draft used to break the monotony up by almost splitting the wait time in half. Honestly, I don’t know how much more I can take on Manziel, especially when there is a chance he doesn’t even make our team.

    I would rather blog about what is fact, and that is the players we already have on our team and what bringing in more competition could mean for some of them who have landed on the proverbial bubble. i.e. Steven Means Leonard Johnson. Let’s talk about the players we actually have, unless you really are using your little corner of the web to try to influence the Buc’s Brass on their decision, which you have vehemently said “I have no agenda” ..smh

    I know there are two Joe’s but do we really have to see both of your faces? 🙂

  20. phil Says:

    If the Bucs pass on Johnny Football at #7 it will be the biggest mistake ever made in the draft history of the Bucs and considering our draft history that’s saying something.

  21. Buc1987 Says:

    phil…and just think 3 other teams ahead of the Bucs that badly need a QB would have passed on him as well.

  22. Kyle Says:

    I would rather have one of his two teammates that would also be available for Tampa…

  23. phattitudes Says:

    Joe. How did the Bucs not hire you as GM or Coach or GM / Coach. You have such a clear vision of talent. Evaluation is obviously your specialty. While in one way it would be our loss to have you in one of those roles, it would be to our benefit as Bucs fans.

  24. sam Says:

    JEFF BLAKE??. I read that one scout from a top franchise said that you would almost have too run your entire offense completely out of shotgun formation for him too have any success. #Pass on johhny

  25. Patrick Says:

    The Bucs drafted a loser out of college (whiney Freeman), but they would pass up a chance to draft a Heisman trophy winner from the best conference in college football? I don’t get it.

    I realize it’s a whole different regime now but my point is we invested 5 seasons into Freeman yet some people are so scared of having JF on our team.

  26. lightningbuc Says:

    Yeah, how could you pass on a Heisman trophy winner? It’s such a recipe for success, especially at QB. Eric Crouch, Jason White, Matt Leinart, Troy Smith, and Tim Tebow – their NFL legacies ensure drafting a Heisman is a can’t miss.

  27. Joe Says:

    Why did they push the draft back again?

    TV cash. May is sweeps week which brings in most ad dollars for networks. The draft is guarenteed eyeballs. By pushing the draft to May, more cash for the NFL.

  28. owlykat Says:

    The NFL Network is asking sports editors in different cities with NFL Franchises who they think their team will take in the draft. They then projected Houston will take Bortles and the Browns will take Derek Carr (so much for the posters who believe that would be a stretch for the Bucs). Watkins and Mack were also early choices. If those choices are correct, the Bucs may be able to pick Johnny Football or Teddy Bridgewater, especially since the rumors are swelling that the Raiders want to get Matt Schaub, and you know the Falcons would probably take Clowney but for sure will not be looking for a QB. If this is the way the draft goes, I would want Teddy Bridgewater, who is amazing in his completions, ability to throw accurate passes at all levels (unlike Johnny), and touted as the most NFL Ready and can run too. My main reason is that I see Johnny as being a QB like RGIII and I think he is too small to stand up to the hits in the NFL and will be hurt bad in his first year.

  29. Yar Says:

    Johnny Tinkerbell would not be an upgrade but a setback, Clowney at all cost!

  30. Eric Says:

    JF is both the most talented player and most talented QB.

    As Chucky said , Steve Young 2.0.

    He has outrun, out thrown, and out taped Bidgewater by a mile.

  31. rawr Says:

    I totally agree with joe.we are here cause we are fans and fans are supposed to get excited for their team to draft an exciting player.and if thats a bust we will do the same thing next year being fans.We have a GM and a HD that needs to be carefull who they draft because they lose their job.Why not dreaming about being excited for each snap our QB takes instead of just going to the ground cause is safe?I know we are not going to the SB with or without Johnny but why not enjoy my team when they play.I am tired of boring football the mos exciting thing was Goldson getting flagged.We probablly wont draft him but i can dream cant I? So lets get Johnny

  32. bucsfan85 Says:

    Lovie attended his pro day, we met with him privately,Lovie had nothing but great things to say about him! If he falls to us there is not a chance in hell we pass on him! I personally think we move up to get him ! we need someone who is going to sell out our stadium !! so many fans in Florida are pathetic! they will go watch nascar and monster truck driving and not go to football games it’s s joke! Johnny would be a game changer end of story.. and I see a number #2 QB wearing Red and pewter soon! suck it haters

  33. rdbucfan Says:

    Manziel will most definitely be a game changer. When throws all of the pick sixes off his back foot, the game will change right away in favor of our opponents.

  34. Buc1987 Says:

    suck it haters?

    and I see a number #2 QB wearing Red and pewter soon! suck it haters?

    bucsfan85 ….Give me that crystal ball you have or can you atleast tell me what else your seeing in it for our team.

  35. rayjay1122 Says:

    @Buc1987…at least if Manziel were the Bucs starting QB, you could pose with your sign again. I would draft his girlfriends though. Does that lingerie league still exist?

  36. bucrightoff Says:

    2012, Manizel and Bridgewater both went up against Florida’s elite defense. Manziel went 23-30 for 170 yards (wow that’s a bunch of checkdowns) and lost at home. Bridgewater went 20-32 for 270 yards (more respectable but still meh) and his team won.

    But as we can see this isthe class we have. Neither line blows you away. There are no true franchise QBs in this draft. Bucs better be wise enough to draft OLine or DLine.

  37. Buc1987 Says:

    rayjay1122…LOL that’s true and I still have it too. No need to do anymore stupid painting.

    @Joe would you tremble the first time that you interview Manziel if they draft him? I bet you would. Try not to stutter Joe. Don’t be shy…

    When he flies into Tampa. Will Joe be front and center at Tampa airport?

    Joe you might try sleeping over in the airport just to get a good shot at Johnny Bieber when he comes off the plane. All stalker-like.

    Lord help this poor kid if he is drafted by the Bucs. Lord help us readers of this site as well.

  38. Eric Says:

    Bridgewater struggled vs. air.

  39. JoeMan(Ziel)CrushFan Says:

    If Johnny Football goes to the Minnesota I’m a little worried that the Pirate at the top will be supporting a new color, hat and weapon. All will be banned and the title will have been changed to

  40. WalkdaPlank Says:

    Wearing red and pewter? Don’t you mean wearing red, black, orange, chrome, and digital clock?

  41. JoeMan(Ziel)CrushFan Says:

    And there’s a Vikings cheerleader named Rachel…it’s setting up perfectly for a move

  42. Chris Says:

    Until he shows he can be a pocket qb in game time and make reads and not miss open wrs, then this means squat.

  43. rdbucfan Says:


    Florida’s d coordinator was none other than Dan Quinn, Seattle’s d coordinator. Everybody talks about how Manziel beat the vaunted Alabama defense. Last time I checked Kirby Smart wasn’t being considered for a NFL head coaching position like Quinn. Quinn has to be one of the best d coordinators at making in game adjustments.

  44. Fritz50 Says:

    “JF is both the most talented player and most talented QB.

    As Chucky said , Steve Young 2.0.”

    Wow, I’m surprised anyone still has good things to say about Josh Freeman…LOL

    “phil…and just think 3 other teams ahead of the Bucs that badly need a QB would have passed on him as well.”

    How telling this is would, naturally, depend on how confident you are in your player evaluation. Plus, how would this apply to all those teams that chose to pass on Mr Brady…(Multiple times) including the Patriots. Guess those Patriots were pretty stupid, huh? Guess,maybe, there’s a lot that goes into it & it might just be a crapshoot. Ultimately, L & L will have to decide who to draft, & I seriously doubt they’ll pick based on the Opinions of Talking Heads, Public Statments of other teams, or even, ( Perish the thought ) Internet Blog Commenters. In the end, the pick has a better than even chance of failure , and all that would do is show just how hard it is.

  45. bucrightoff Says:

    Bridgewater did struggle against air. JaMarcus was the greatest ever against air. Point being? Draft is a crapshoot. That people can act like a Maziel or Bridgewater is a sre thing is laughable.

  46. Nick2 Says:

    Joe, great breakdown of Manziel. I know this sounds silly but Lovies from Texas and I can’t think of any great quarterbacks from Texas in recent memory unless you count Andrew Luck and RGIII who are still trying to prove themselves. I think Lovie would be proud to draft what could be the best Texas prospect ever to play quarterback!!!!

  47. tickrdr Says:

    bucsfan85 Says:

    March 31st, 2014 at 1:30 pm

    ………………….. and I see a number #2 QB wearing Red and pewter soon! suck it haters


    I thought we already tried that.


    Note: Since I’m not sure the linky thing works, it should be a picture of#2 in Red and Pewter……………………….Chris Simms

  48. Barry Says:

    RG3 can’t hold MG8s jock.

  49. Architek Says:

    I will be glad when this is over because the Johnny solicitation is taking away from other stories like lets say the draft.

  50. Architek Says:

    Barry stop with Glen-Mobbing please.

  51. Buc1987 Says:

    Fritz…your using teams passing on Br-ady as the argument. Wow Amazing. I guess I can use Br-ady as an example for just about every player in the draft QB or not. How silly.

  52. stratobuc Says:

    “I know this sounds silly but Lovies from Texas and I can’t think of any great quarterbacks from Texas in recent memory unless you count Andrew Luck and RGIII who are still trying to prove themselves.”

    Ever heard of Drew Brees?

  53. Eric Says:

    It’s always a crapshoot. Every year, every position.

    Doesn’t mean you don’t draft a QB if you need one, which we do.

  54. Mr Magoo Says:

    buc1987: 12 teams passed on Warren Sapp. Was picking him a mistake by the bucs too?

  55. Buc1987 Says:

    Mr Magoo…you can name 1000’s of players that teams past on over many drafts. WTH does that mean? Oh dear Lord Tampa fans. They still don’t get it do they? This fan base….?

  56. BoJim Says:

    Buc1987 Said:

    “bucsfan85 ….Give me that crystal ball you have or can you atleast tell me what else your seeing in it for our team.”

    Hmmm. You must have one too.