Rutgers Offense
October 2nd, 2013
Joe hears from fans all the time about how the Bucs are awful at “play-calling.” Joe asks for specifics, but rarely gets them.
Often, fans want Mike Glennon to throw the ball, despite the fact that may be the worst option, which was displayed when Glennon threw two picks in the fourth quarter last week against the Desert Rats.
Well, supreme Xs and Os guy Greg Bedard of theMMQB.com decided to study the Bucs offense and came away thinking the offense, in general, is prehistoric.
And, in what has been a Greg Schiano staple since his Rutgers days, the Buccaneers’ scheme is outdated, unimaginative and too reliant on short plays. The short and intermediate passing game that is so crucial in today’s NFL is essentially nonexistent in Tampa’s system. It’s difficult to win without it. The thing is, the Buccaneers have solid pass protection—the line ranks No. 8 in our pressure points/per snap rankings—and running back Doug Martin is second in the league, averaging 99 yards a game. Those are two essential components of playing Schiano’s preferred style of offense. It means something is amiss with the quarterback and receivers. From my vantage point, both positions share the blame here. It’s just easier to replace one quarterback than get several receivers to play better.
Well now, isn’t it refreshing to see receivers (who have dropped passes from Josh Freeman far too often) catch some hell for a change?
People can forget about a strong passing game for at least the rest of the 2013 season. With a young, green as grass rookie at quarterback, having him throw a bunch is inviting destruction.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:01 pm
Best catch by a Buc this year was a defensive player… Johnthan Banks
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:02 pm
Here’s what I saw last Sunday, I saw a QB who didn’t look lost when he dropped back, I saw a QB who threw the ball with authority, I saw a QB who threw a tight spiral with touch, what I didn’t see was a 5 year veteran who looked lost and bewildered by what the defense was presenting, I didn’t see short passes and checkdowns one-hopped to the intended receiver. Is Glennon the answer, to early to tell, did he have issues, yes, he over-threw open receivers and the timing wasn’t there, but those will come with practice.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:02 pm
This is what always concerned me with Schiano. When he first got here he described the passing game as “and taking shots down field”.
NFL passing isn’t a hope and a prayer that you do when two running plays fail.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:03 pm
Actually I beilieve we are seeing the beginning of an adjustment on offense. The latest indication is the addition of Underwood & Owusu…that’s a lot of WRs & when you add Demps…. & also Wright WR turned TE…somehing is cooking.
VJax
MW19
Underwood
Owusu
Page
Sheperd
Demps
So, we just added an extra WR….even though we are down a Safety……
I think Schiano trusts Glennon’s arm & intelligence and if he has protection, he may start to show some improvement.,
Also….other teams will play us just like AZ until we proove we can score through the air.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:07 pm
Our only chance to score points with this offensive plan is to throw it. Otherwise the other team will constantly stack the box. Schiano said Glennon was on the level as Freeman with his knowledge of the playbook. He claims Glennon can make all the same throws as Freeman. So I don’t see any reason why we should get so conservative. Let Mike loose. Sure he will make mistakes, but playing close to the line of scrimmage won’t get it done and our run game will get shut down every game. Don’t water down the offense and let the rookie compete.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:10 pm
F$uk u schiano
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:12 pm
Here’s a bit of advice for you Buc fans that are suffering this season. I don’t like the 0-4 start as much as you don’t like it. It seems we are all going to have to live with it though. We all can see where the problem lies on this team. It’s the offense and the play calling, not just the HC.
As a Buc fan that suffered for quite awhile before Dungy and with Dungy’s offenses. Here’s my advice to you down and out fans and TBBF will back me up on this.
Futility makes winning sweeter.
Basically what I’m getting at is calm down and take the losses. Because when the team does start to win and win consistently, some of you might look back at all this and appreciate how far your team has come.
Have a nice day! 😀
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:16 pm
The one thing I believe we all saw, this past Sunday was Glennon’s quick release.
He may not end up being our franchise QB, especially with Schianopolean imploding One Buc Place to satisfy his ego while weeding out anyone that doesn’t bow as walks into the room, but he could have a good NFL career if he gets with a team whos coacing staff knows what the hell it’s doing.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:17 pm
coaching staff
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:17 pm
1987
Nice speech and all, but this team was built to win now. We don’t have the luxury of waiting.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:18 pm
Guessing you haven’t seen Blaine Gabbert at quarterback?
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:25 pm
“Prehistoric and unimaginative”
Sounds like an offense that Schiano would run! How can a system like that not succeed in the NFL? I mean, it was a losing system at Rutgers- might as well try it in the big leagues? And keep trying- even though all the defenses have obviously figured it out- and can beat your WRs to their spots!!!!!
No wonder Josh asked to be traded this spring!!
An appeal to the Glazers. Can we please fire this sad excuse for a coach, while this Franchise has a few good players left?? And some small amount of respect?? I’ve grown up being a Buc fan- and that had some bad moments! But since your Family has owned the Team, it has been a professional operation. One you always gave you optimism
Until now! This guy is making the franchise look bush league. He is failing both as a coach,a teacher, and a leader!!
We are with you! Make the move NOW!
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:26 pm
Were already destroyed.
Only way to learn to throw the ball is to throw the ball. The only thing that has an outside shot at saving Schiano IMO is if Glennon actually emerged at the QB position. That wont happen handing the ball to martin and checking down all game.
Fling the damn thing to V. Jackson I say. Sure it might make things worse. But really how is that posible. Cant go below zero wins.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:33 pm
Abusive Deep jumpballs and sidelines back shoulder throws is what is wrong with pass playcalling. There’s also absolutely no WR that goes in the middle of the field on short-medium routes.
Just gain some 1st down instead of always trying to go vertical.. A couple screen wouldn’t hurt too since we get blitzed like crazy.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:34 pm
RUTGERS SUCKS!!!
This coaching staff is
out coached the second half of every game
no discipline, stupid mistakes and penalties
playing not to lose with leads, predictable without
bush league tactics when game is .001% chance of winning
complete mismanagement of current/past roster
defense is playing better b/c personnel has improved and maturing, but still finding a way to lose or give it up at the end of games.
Glennon is not the savior. fire everyone and get a jump on potential GM/coaching hires and evaluating talent for next years draft. GO BUCS!
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:38 pm
When Zuttah, Wright, Leonard, Underwood and Glennon (the one he wish he had when he recruited him at Rutger) will be on the field at the same time, it will be hard to not think of a Rutger offense btw.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:39 pm
Tank for Teddy or Fail for firing!!
Seriously though, this Rutgers connection and atrocious playcalling is beyond ridiculous! This is the NFL, you have to adjust and game plan at a high level….something Schiano and his hand-picked staff are not able to do!
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:39 pm
“Prehistoric” “outdated and unimaginative”
And I’m supposed to buy tickets to watch that trash? Our players are supposed to buy in to playing that stupid scheme? And all of us are supposed to expect the team can win with that system???
And we are supposed to believe its Josh’s fault??
First article I’ve read today, and I’m already angry.
Amazing how all the long time, passionate Buc fans are just seething angry now.
Time for a house cleaning. Dom and Shiano must go !!!
Sullivan may be ok, if not forced to run Schianos wretched system
Sheridan has a good defense on the field
Meybe Butch or Dave can finish out the season.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:43 pm
This is the reason I asked for firing Schiano not the Freeman stuff.
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:45 pm
@Joe – “At least we’re not the Jags.” – Bucs 2013 motto
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:50 pm
Well, it absolutely is refreshing to hear someone place equal blame on the receivers, and it’s almost odd. Here’s why, we nearly had two 1000 yd receivers…VJax had a record season, just LAST year…as did the QB.
So, next year, when you add…lets use the word “different” elements of Sully’s offense…and suddenly those records the QB set illustrate that we must replace the MOST difficult position in the NFL?
Ironically, even in a stripped down, more rookie QB freindly format of Sully’s offense, the two receivers are STILL dropping balls – and the QB is the only one to take the heat?
Personally, I have nothing against Glennon, other than he made the same number of mistakes as the last QB – in a stripped down, everybody pull together so the rookie doesn’t bear too much of the burrden – ANNNNDDD after he got the majority of reps and starts in the pre-season…unheard of (…so don’t tell me they didn’t have all of this planned).
…after all of this, the receivers dropped the same number of passes, and the QB made the same type of mistakes.
IS it the offense? Who knows, maybe – but you certainly aren’t going to fix the LARGEST and most consistent problem – elite, starting receiverrs, are dropping balls like someone is paying them…
Maybe it’s hard to start c-a-t-c-h-i-n-g again after you’ve laid off, haven’t practiced properly….or don’t believe in a system that sets you up to take some very ugly hits several times each week.
I’m sure all of the circumstantial evidence that Schiano has lied about his role in undermining his starting QB – in order to make the case that HIS QB should be starting and running HIS offense – I’m sure the players will NOT feel manipulated or concerned about their coach’s behavior. Even if the coach himmself approves of his behavior “100%…”
I’m thinking Schiano’s actions are going to have a long term impact on thiis team, even if the Freeman situation was resolved quickly (it won’t be), and regardless how much of an endorsement the organization gives their head coach…
This was BADLY mishandled, and veteran players are only now beginning to get their heads around what has happened to their team and the impact it will have on their combined futures.
They have been pawns in a PPR game – some will go back to work, because that’s all they know, others will quietly vote with their feet…
…or their alligator arms…
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:56 pm
The only way to win IS to throw the ball. I actually trust Glennon more to throw than I trusted Freeman. Glennon actually WAS hitting some short to intermediate routes and distributed the ball well. I think with the addition of Underwood and Demps we’ll see even more of that. Get the ball to demps in space and he is one dangerous character. That should take a lot of the pressure off of V-Jax if they can’t double him. We have desperately needed a guy like Demps who an opposing team has to game plan for. Glennon has that quick release that is needed to get the ball out on those short routes and slants. If they will quit being so damn stubborn running the ball on first and second down and run more play action to keep the defense honest this offense could be explosive. If Glennon gets comfortable with these receivers we could chew up big chunks of yardage. Philadelphia should be interesting. If our defense can limit their offense then I think we have a chance in that game.
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:06 pm
@ White Tiger
This was BADLY mishandled, and veteran players are only now beginning to get their heads around what has happened to their team and the impact it will have on their combined futures.
They have been pawns in a PPR game – some will go back to work, because that’s all they know, others will quietly vote with their feet…
…or their alligator arms…
_____________________________________________________________
So you’re saying players will jeopardize their careers by just playing poorly to show coach Schiano their displeasure?? And that will help them how?? You really don’t understand how this business works do you? If players don’t perform they don’t play and if they don’t play they don’t get paid. Even if you don’t like your coach you don’t trash your career because of it.
That deserves a “C’mon Man!!”
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:06 pm
One thing I’ve yet to see mentioned is the fact that the team that we got our offensive coordinator from is ALSO 0-4. I wonder if defenses have caught up with the giants offensive scheme which leaves us in bad shape.
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:07 pm
The offense was much better last year. If I had to guess, I would say Schiano let Sullivan handle most of the playcalling last year, considering he was a rookie head coach in the NFL. Schiano claims he lets the coordinators gameplan and call the plays, but he apparently makes changes when he sees something he doesn’t like.
The offense this year is covered in Schiano’s fingerprints, based on his offensive philosophy. The offense isn’t his strong suit. He might downplay the micromanager label, but that’s what he appears to be.
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:19 pm
@Joe… Way to flip-flop there, Joe. For the last few weeks you have been saying “every QB has drops”, can’t blame the receivers, blaahblahblahblah…
Now, suddenly its refreshing to see receivers “catch hell for once”? Last I checked, you can form your own opinions as well. Or do you have zero backbone?
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:24 pm
@bobby
No, I’m saying if players under contract stop believing, they can’t quit, but they can stop putting themselves at risk. Think back to what you saw under Raheem during his last year – I’ll be shocked if you don’t see the same from these Bucs under Schiano for the rest of the year.
If you can’t get a receiver to believe in your offense – they will round-off routes or run routes too shallow – so as not to run a crossing-routes in front of “no-man’s land”. You can’t pay anyone to endanger themselves f they don’t believe.
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:25 pm
I said this when I called Greg on Monday to tell him his victory formation rush was Busch League. At the beginning of my call I also stated that I can pretty much count on one hand in 4 games how many screens to Martin have been run let alone bubble screens to wide receivers. These passes are easily completed to give the QB some confidence and it also puts the ball in our playmakers hands and let them make a play for the offense. This throw the ball 40 yards outside the hash and see if we can come down with it is just hard to watch. I like taking some shots but hey lets move the chains put together some drives run some clock spread out the defense and open some run lanes.
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:38 pm
The thing that really bothers me about the offense is that we have the same offensive line coach that did such a great job last year and got them to create holes that the Douganator was able to use for 1400 yards and now now he has the 2 big horses back year and we cant open a hole big enough for Mickey Mouse to run through. What is going on?????
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:47 pm
Fans telling this coach ANYTHING are like talking to a brick wall. Schiano’s on the air…because they pay him to be on the air.
Have faith though – he’s doing EVERYTHING right to get himself fired – he’s doing ALL he can to make people STOP going to games. The owners even know that Schiano’s antics will cost them – thats why they’ve taken the unprecedented length of televising all home games regardless of attendence.
Make no mistake, the Glazers only hear one message – they want to be able to charge you whatever they can get away with – so every Sunday they televise free games – is not a FUNday! for them.
My only regret is someone had to clear this plan before the season – they shared how they could get rid of Josh by getting all “Psycho” trying to do their best Belicick imitation – and approved it!? If you don’t think this was an approved plan – then you don’t know how you go about getting private health care records. These fools miscalculated on an epic level when they thought we’d accept them benching the old record setting QB, in favor of the 3rd round rookie most pro-football fans never heard of…especially after going to such backstabbing, troubling-character indicating lows to get what they wanted (Josh traded to a team of THEIR choice).
They could have just signed him, benched him, then traded him – now they get nothing – and we get even less.
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:53 pm
Wait a minute. Is the Rutgers offense the same as the NYG offense? All along it was said that we have the Giants offense, who throw the ball down the field, don’t use TE much for catching, and use the run to set up those long throws. It worked as recently as the first half of last year (which is hardly prehistoric).
October 2nd, 2013 at 2:23 pm
[quote]
Otto Says:
October 2nd, 2013 at 1:53 pm
Wait a minute. Is the Rutgers offense the same as the NYG offense? All along it was said that we have the Giants offense, who throw the ball down the field, don’t use TE much for catching, and use the run to set up those long throws. It worked as recently as the first half of last year (which is hardly prehistoric).
[/quote]
Pretty much same offense as Pittsburgh and NYG… all 0-4 teams. lol. Its been figured out.
October 2nd, 2013 at 2:52 pm
Bucs1987
That was actually the most honest, credible thing you’ve said all year. Not that you’ve been dishonest. I agree 100%.
I believe that Schiano, as bad as it has been, should at least finish the year unless things get so out of control the Glazers have no choice. This latest story is something that could push them to it if true.
I think coming out of the bye is when we’ll see if he can adjust. IF he is replaced, I think they should put Butch Davis in charge as interim. Meanwhile the Glazers should try everything they can to get Dungy back. I know he’s retired and never plans to return…but if they can somehow persuade him then this team will gain instance stability and respect.
Lovie won’t bring it. Marty won’t bring it. Sully being promoted certainly will not.
Better to let Schiano finish the year. Odds are if he is so out of control he might get offered a college job and leave on his own…saving the Bucs a ton of cash.
As it stands, if they fire him they are paying far too much in salaries to coaches again, which could mean a period of not spending again.
October 2nd, 2013 at 2:54 pm
Ricky Bobby
The myth of us having a NYG offense was generated by the Bucs having Sully. The truth that in the last year he was there they were not known for running the ball…they were last.
They still are not known for it…although they signed JOHN CONNER so they may be moving more in that direction. He is a fantastic blocker.
October 2nd, 2013 at 2:55 pm
Sorry that was meant for Otto
October 2nd, 2013 at 2:56 pm
Capt. Tim Says:
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:39 pm
“Prehistoric” “outdated and unimaginative”
And I’m supposed to buy tickets to watch that trash? Our players are supposed to buy in to playing that stupid scheme? And all of us are supposed to expect the team can win with that system???
And we are supposed to believe its Josh’s fault??
First article I’ve read today, and I’m already angry.
Amazing how all the long time, passionate Buc fans are just seething angry now.
Time for a house cleaning. Dom and Shiano must go !!!
Sullivan may be ok, if not forced to run Schianos wretched system
Sheridan has a good defense on the field
Meybe Butch or Dave can finish out the season.
—————–
Tim…
Remember, Sheridan has stated time and time again that he is just running Schiano’s defense. That’s why I have a strong feeling that Sully is just running Schiano’s offense. If given his own ability to hold things down, i think he could do it.
still, give me Lovie as the DC and i’m a happy panda.
GoBucs
October 2nd, 2013 at 3:00 pm
Bobby Says:
October 2nd, 2013 at 12:56 pm
The only way to win IS to throw the ball. I actually trust Glennon more to throw than I trusted Freeman. Glennon actually WAS hitting some short to intermediate routes and distributed the ball well.
————–
Its easy to throw the ball well on short and intermediate routes when the game plan calls for it.
And if having 2 WRs near 1000 yards (M.Will was a few yards short) is not distributing the ball well, then i don’t know what is. I believe Martin had about 500yards receiving too. And Clark had his fair share as well.
October 2nd, 2013 at 7:25 pm
Celly,
Really?? You’re a happy Panda?
We are 0-4. 1-11 in last 12 games.
But you’re feeling pretty upbeat?
Really??
What, are you a Cubs Fan? From Jacksonville? Some kinda Sado-masochist?
Who’s your dealer, and does he want more clients??
Oddly, when I support and invest in a team- I expect them to be at least competitive- and trying to improve!!
Not losing good players and games, because they are under the tyrannical rule of a crappy coach.
But if you are happy, meybe I’ll join you!! We can go outside- and run around, singing about Rainbows and Butterflies!
Later, we can go hug some Trees!!!
October 2nd, 2013 at 11:47 pm
Um, but I doubt it