A Move To Glennon In October?

September 10th, 2013

Joe is often ridiculed when he mentions the “Mike Glennon Mob,” as if the Mob is somehow part of Joe’s imagination. Joe’s not in the mob, but one would have to have his head in the sand (or worse) to believe there isn’t a faction of Bucs fans that want Josh Freeman to hold a clipboard.

Hell, the first caller to The Greg Schiano Show last night on the Buccaneers Radio Network was a vocal member of the mob.

Joe’s met these Mob members. Joe gets email from these people. Mob members call sports radio daily. There’s even an offshoot of the Mob forming that thinks Greg Schiano should go to Glennon now because he doesn’t trust Freeman and that distrust will never lead to a championship.

For those who still think Joe’s imagining the Mob’s existence, ESPN is taking on the Mob mentality.

NFC South writer Pat Yasinskas felt compelled to write about the Bucs hypothetically going 0-4 and making a move to Glennon after the bye in Week 5.

When a team starts off badly, one of the first things that often happens is a change at quarterback. And it often happens coming off the bye week, so the new guy can get some work with the first team. 

I don’t think the Bucs really want to throw rookie Mike Glennon out there, but they might not have much choice if this hypothetical plays out as a worst-case scenario. A benching would almost certainly mark the end of Freeman’s tenure with the Bucs. Plus, coach Greg Schiano would be on the hot seat if the season is spinning out of control and he could buy some time by going with Glennon and seeing some improvement. 

Has the world gone mad?

The Bucs aren’t going to throw in the towel on the season in Week 5. Glennon proved nothing in preseason to make one think he’s ready to thrive. Geez, the Bucs even felt the need to keep a third quarterback, Dan Orlovsky, with Freeman and Glennon both healthy.

These are crazy times for Bucs fans. If the Bucs win Sunday, they literally will be in first place in the NFC South when all tiebreakers are factored in. If they lose, well, a Bill Cowher Mob might start forming.

180 Responses to “A Move To Glennon In October?”

  1. Touchdown Gus Says:

    Off topic question but why is Freeman wearing a knee brace? Whenever I was competing wearing those things use to make me feel so damn heavy and constrictive.

  2. ShutTheBucUp Says:

    Glennon is a mediocre quarterback at best. He showed no signs of greatness in the preseason. If he is so great, how did he not win the job in training camp? The sole reason they drafted him was to light a fire under Josh, but it backfired big time. All it did was create division among the fanbase, and most likely in the locker room.

    If they felt Glennon could carry the team to more victories than Freeman, he’d be the starting quarterback right now. Its a win-now league.

  3. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    I read that post from Pat earlier and I have a sneaking suspicion that he did not see more than just the stat line and highlights from Sunday. (Just like certain fans around here.)

    Pat has always been a joke. Every one of his article’s comment sections is chalked full of people complaining about him as a terrible analyst to represent the NFC South. He is one of the many reasons that ESPN is actually “BSPN”.

  4. Mark Sanchez's Hairband Says:

    The bucs turned to Freeman at 0-9 in 2009. Whats wrong with going to Glennon at 0-4 in 2013?

    Freeman sucks.

  5. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    For the record, if we go 0-4, and Freeman plays bad, then I don’t really care if they make a change at QB. I would actually prefer it because I want them to know how bad Glennon is before the season ends so that they don’t go into the 2014 season thinking he is a viable QB.

    If Freeman is not the answer then I want a high draft pick or a talented veteran. Not just Glennon.

    (And before I get called out for “bashing” Glennon: I think he will make a FINE backup. He may even be a decent starter some day but history shows that scenario is INCREDIBLY UNLIKELY so I would rather us not bank on it happening.)

  6. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Let’s humor the Freeman Bashers a moment. Say theBucs win no games before the bye week. Do they really think Glennon comes inand saves the season?

    If we replace Freeman it better not be with someone who will win just enough games to have us pick in the middle of the first round. IF Freeman is that bad it makes more sense to keep him in so we can draft a real replacement in the draft.

    I KNOW Freeman AND THE TEAM will turn things around. The Saints are viewed as a good team suddenly. When we beat them next week it will serve notice.

    Won’t matter to Bucs fans though. Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, or Rogers. Those are the elite QBs of the league. We know Freeman is not elite yet. Losing to any of them should hold no shame. But Freeman has beaten two of them. Will beat Brees next week.

    And still some Bucs fans will not care. I could see a victory over the Pats bringing some credit. They’ve been the thorn.

  7. Chef Paul Says:

    First of all I hate that idea. However, if we go 0-4, (and we all know it’s very possible) The likelihood of Josh coming back next year is very slim. Weather it’s his fault or not, it’s unlikely they sign him. So if that is the case, why not put in Glennon. We might need him to get some reps for next year. This is the ONLY scenario I agree to this. I hate the idea of benching Freeman, but if we go 0-4, cmon lets be real, we are not going to the playoffs. So putting in Glennon will accomplish 2 things. Get him reps or we tank for teddy. just so yall know, I wrote this with a heavy heart. Like putting your dog to sleep. Hate to it, but it needs to be done.

    I also hate looking that far in the future, especially that far in the future with very very dark terms

  8. Morgan Says:

    Uh-oh, Mark.

    Now you’ve been added to the “mob” for asking such a question.

    The mob gets bigger.

  9. Chef Paul Says:

    That’s a good point WestCoast. Even though its very possible he is the answer, it’s unlikely and not something to bank on

  10. Ricardo Esteban Says:

    I said week 5 long ago, but after watching free implode on the 1st drive under center and then look like a whipped puppy I am going to up my prediction. If free plays like he did on Sunday he will not see week 3!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    write it down!

    I am not talking about the O line. they sucked out loud, and free did the best he could. I am talking about the lack of leadership he displays. the lack of faith the O puts in him-not O captain. The way he looked like he was going to cry and sulked on the bench. the way he did not take over when the headset went out (hell Schiano said he could call the plays in that scenario and free choked)
    he’s playing scared, he’s lost his mojo, he’s done.

    It’s not the stat lines I am looking at, it’s the big picture.

  11. Ricardo Esteban Says:

    anyone notice the jfro mob is diminishing

  12. tj187 Says:

    It probably has more to do with giving Glennon a chance so they can decide whether they want to draft a QB in the 1st round next year. If Freeman doesn’t improve like we (most of us) hope he will and continues on this way they know he will have 6 or 7 wins…too good for top draft pick but still not close to the playoffs. I think they’d want to give Glennon a shot to try him out. Personally, after watching him at NC St I don’t think Glennon has what it takes to be a starter in the NFL but who knows, I’ve been wrong before. And if Freeman shows that he doesn’t have what it takes to get us to the level (ie same mediocre play we are used to) and Glennon tanks we may be in a position (after a painful year) to draft Bridgewater or Boyd. I hope Freeman can step it up, but I have my doubts…and this is too good of a team to be finishing in the bottom half of the NFC year after year.

  13. Couch Fan Says:

    And what has Freeman done to disserve the starting Job? It’s dam sure not winning. Awful passes for the most part, combined with lots of Ints. and mediocre for 3 quarters of an average game…. Yea Freeman IS so much better. Him and his 6 wins a year… Schiano didnt divide a fan base by drafting A QB. That is yet another BS excuse. Freeman’s awful play did that.

    BTW Pat, has been on Freeman’s side all along. I guess the “haters” aren’t the only ones who can recognized inpetness when they see it.

  14. Keith Says:

    Add me to the Mob

  15. SteveK Says:

    WCBF,

    Thank you for disclaiming your view of Glennon, and what you think he can be one day.

    What do you see in Freeman? Is Freeman a “Franchise QB”?

    Hell, could Freeman even be a “game manager”?

  16. Stranger Says:

    If Glennon is out there in Week 5, then we’ll have a new GM and HC next year.

  17. RachelWatson'sthong Says:

    Doesn’t matter who plays QB. We will not be in 1st place after next week. Our o-line wii get somebody killed.

  18. SteveK Says:

    “If you put a gun to my head, and ask me if he (Freeman) can play, I’ll say no.”

    - Fran Tarkenton

    I hope Freeman can bounce back this week, and play well enough to WIN.

    Just WIN Freeman. Do more, and we win last Sunday.

  19. Couch Fan Says:

    Let’s humor the Freeman Bashers a moment. Say theBucs win no games before the bye week. Do they really think Glennon comes inand saves the season?

    ——————————————

    Probably not. But I dam sure would rather go 5-11, 6-10, 7-9 with a rookie than with our 5th year QB who has shown nothing. If Glennon shows promise, we could save ourselves a high draft pick that we would have to spend on a QB.

  20. (Formerly) Brown Bag Says:

    Watching the game, I felt like Josh was a lost cause. Then he drove us to the (should have been) winning field goal. It gave some hope. My opinion has evolved to their just being a complete lack of syncronicty in the offense. If that is the case, it can be resolved with more playing time.

    Our offense needs to tune out the noise and focus on each play and getting in sync. Josh cannot thrive in this environment. If he is a “better-than-mediocre” QB, his team mates need to rally around him and overachieve.

    The only thing worse than Freeman collapse and Glennon coming in is the eventual calls for the Glasers to sign Tebow as a seat-filler. So. . . C’mon Freeman!

  21. Ian P. Says:

    Four losses is a bit early to pull the plug on Freeman. I understand that the bye is a convenient time to get Glennon some reps, but four games isn’t enough time. Now if we’re 0-8, then sure, it’s Glennon time, but 0-4 still leaves plenty of room to finish 8-8 which wouldn’t be too terrible.

  22. Adam L. Says:

    I think the Bucs SHOULD give Glennon the job.

    He’s got to be able to draft better than Dominik.

  23. Stranger Says:

    @SteveK

    “I hope Freeman can bounce back this week, and play well enough to WIN.”

    He did that Sunday, yet here you are throwing stones at him.

  24. Justin Says:

    The word has gone mad Joe. I cant ever remember such drastic negativity after an opening season loss on the road like this. We’ve taken it to a whole new level. I’m pissed about it but not writing the Bucs off just yet. We cant possibly play any worse than this past Sunday. I think the ball bounces our way this weekend and we get a W.

  25. Chef Paul Says:

    Just because I can see Freeman didn’t lose the game on his own doesn’t mean I didn’t see his faults. The presnap still bothers me. He should be able to call one play on his own. WOW I just realized I don’t know what to think about Freeman. He had great throws, bad throws, drops, pressure. He couldn’t call one play when his headset went out but called an audible for Martin to run up the middle for a long first down at a very crucial time. This guy is really is a facking enigma.

  26. Couch Fan Says:

    I would actually prefer it because I want them to know how bad Glennon is before the season ends so that they don’t go into the 2014 season thinking he is a viable QB.

    ———————————————

    How in the world can you say this about a guy who has not taken 1 single meaningful snap for us while judging him solely on his draft position and the fact “historically” not many good QBs come from that round.

    I think that would fit the definition of a real “hater”

  27. PewterPirates Says:

    I can’t wait to hear Freeman’s mob talk about how he drove us down the field for another come from behind game that the defense lost in the end…a lot like last year. It may have played out that way but anyone who watched it knows better….I hope.

  28. Justin Says:

    And not to bash on Glennon or defend Freeman. But if Glennon was in there Sunday behind that O-line (they way they were playing) it would have been a disaster of epic proportions. All these prognosticators saying Glennon will be playing by mid-season, have they even watched him play? The speculation and loss of true reporting is a shame. Inventing stories for the sake of posting a blog.

  29. Couch Fan Says:

    Let’s be fair here if you are going to judge on draft position. Freeman is a complete and utter failure…. 3 out of 4 losing seasons and the 5th is starting out pretty awful… Absolutely not worthy of a 1st round grade

  30. AceOfAerospace Says:

    If we start 0-4 in the NFC South. Our season is basically over. We will not win 10 of the remaining 12. Wholesale changes will be made. Maybe not until after the season is completely over, but changes will be made. It might be a different coach deciding Freeman’s fate. I still pray we go 15-1 this season and shut us all up, just not feeling it after what I saw. Hope I get proven wrong. Been a bucs fan since 76, seen this before.

  31. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    I disagree Couch Fan. This is a team sport. The TEAM has had 3/4 losing seasons. Not to mention the fact that his first one was half a season as a rookie. You always hang the wins and losses on Freeman as if he ultimately decides the outcome of every game.

    You say you understand but you really don’t. Freeman had a game last season (against the Saints I believe) where he threw for 300 yards, 3 TDs and 0 ints and lost the game. Obviously that game was not Freeman’s fault but the he gets the loss all the same.

    Wins and losses are not an indication of one player’s performance.

    Also, it has everything to do with Glennon’s draft position. You are absolutely right, we have no idea what Glennon will be like. So all we have to go on is history. History shows third round QBs very rarely become anything more than journey man backups. That doesn’t mean its impossible, just foolish to count on such a thing.

    Meanwhile history shows Freeman with two good seasons (and yes, last season was “good” compared to other quarterbacks and not win/loss records) and one bad one which consisted of a complete team collapse and the firing of a coach.

    You judge Freeman based on broad generalizations and stats that are not the direct result of Freeman’s play. That doesn’t mean he is Joe Montana waiting to happen. That just means he is not as bad as you portray him to be.

  32. RBellBuc Says:

    The fact that JBF has been hijacked with it’s own version of the Lords of Flatbush speaks volumes about how the national and local media can form the publics opinion.

  33. bucrightoff Says:

    Its the smart move. By week 4, if they’re 0-4, you’ll know what you have in Freeman. Thats pretty much 4 full seasons to evaluate. If you haven’t signed him by now, you’re not going to. Putting in Glennon lets us see what he has. If he has potential the Bucs can keep him. If he’s not that good, we’ll be in position to draft a real franchise guy, obviously strong preferance to Teddy Bridgewater. At 0-4 and with the difficulty of the remaining schedule, 7-9 or 8-8 seems like best case. If we’re not gonna be a playoff team and neither Freeman nor Glennon are the guy, a high draft pick is key because a guy like Bridgewater with the current team in place could win right away. We keep seeing now in the NFL.

  34. Mr Lucky Says:

    Let’s assume that the Bucs go 0-4 into the bye week….just assume

    If that’s the case then Freeman is GONE….PERIOD, END OF DISCUSSION.

    NOW You have to decide if Glennon is the man in 2014 so why not start him and see how he performs under pressure.

    PERSONALLY

    IF the Bucs go 0-4 then THIS IS WHAT I’D DO….

    Hire someone to talk to Johnny Football’s father and see how he feels about being the starting QB in Tampa in 2014. If there’s a possibility of that happening then I start whomever as long as I get the first draft pick.

    Hey look what Indy did with Luck!

  35. kh Says:

    The NFL is unpredictable, we always play the Saints tough, wouldn’t be surprised to see us win Sunday. Would be typical Bucs to lose to the Jets and then shock the NFL the next week.

  36. kh Says:

    Johnny Football?!? Crawl back in the hole you came from.

  37. Couch Fan Says:

    You say you understand but you really don’t.’

    ————————————

    No no I understand completely. In year 5, we continue to lose games and YOU along with the rest of the Freemanites continue to point fingers at everyone BUT Freeman….

    But yet somehow you are convinced Glennon is garbage simply because of his draft positioni. You clearly will NEVER give the guy a fair chance but yet you have this idea that a loser like Freeman is so much better.

    You are bias. Not me. I see this team for what it is. You see it for what you want it to be.

  38. passthebuc Says:

    Nothing that wrong with freeman that a good offensive line would not fix. Is he the best, no, but he ain’t a rookie like MG. Glennon without a line would be lit up like a Christmas tree.

  39. Couch Fan Says:

    And no Freeman has only had one good year. The 10-6 one. Because his stats were nice on paper doesn’t make last year a good year. Unless of course you are bias….

    I mean, seriously. A good year is defined by wins. Not stats on paper. And his play on the field is far less impressive than the stats would indicate…. Sunday was a perfect example of a typical Freeman game.

  40. Buc1987 Says:

    Mark Sanchez’s Hairband Says:

    September 8th, 2013 at 1:12 pm
    “Jets will win this game. Bucs suck. Bad.”

    Mark Sanchez’s Hairband ..was already hating on the Bucs 12 minutes into the Jets game on Sunday. 12 minutes in.

    Mark Sanchez’s Hairband = another member of the pathetic Bucs fan base.
    Good job buddy the team needs more fans like you.

    “Strike me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete! … Let the hate flow through you.”

  41. Buc1987 Says:

    Mr Lucky…what does it matter to you anyways? Are you going to go to any games anyways? Probably not. Why do I say this? Look below.

    Mr. Lucky says :

    Thin skinned HOMER is what I meant Buc1987.
    But thank you for turning over money to team Glazer. Don’t forget to purchase Bucs jersey #5 as well so we can see you on TV crying in your $8 beer ok?

  42. Stranger Says:

    @Mr Lucky

    Everything you just said, stop it. We aren’t about to put this Franchise in an immature brat’s hands. Next year’s draft will have Bridgewater, Boyd, Murray. All superior.

    @Couch Fan

    “Sunday was a perfect example of a typical Freeman game.”

    I agree. Freeman got us the lead and the defense lost it. Shame how that keeps happening.

  43. JonBuc Says:

    Turning to Glennon The Giraffe earlier than later will help the Bucs in the Boyd/Bridgewater sweepstakes…what a mess already.

  44. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    “I mean, seriously. A good year is defined by wins. Not stats on paper.

    So, applying this (false) theory to another player: Doug Martin had a bad year as well, correct?

  45. Chef Paul Says:

    “point fingers at everyone BUT Freeman….”

    LOL. Those 6 words alone prove you don’t get it.

  46. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    And for the love of God, no one is making excuses for Freeman. It it all your imagination. Nobody is saying Freeman went out there and played a good game. Sane people just distribute the blame rationally. They don’t expect one single player to compensate for the other players and coach’s mistakes to get the win. That is just ridiculous and that is exactly what you are doing.

  47. jarret Says:

    Glennon is a 3rd round QB for a reason. If he was any good he would have been a 1st or at latest 2nd round pick. If any change is made it should be the head coach. Playing conservative doesn’t win u football games. We lost to the freakin jets.

  48. Greg Says:

    “anyone notice the jfro mob is diminishing”

    So is the mob for Schiano!

  49. Couch Fan Says:

    LOL this coming from someone who has said Glennon sucks and wont amount to anything because of his draft position but still defends an inept QB and shows his ineptness every time he steps onto the field. I guess im imagining that to.

    You say you are defending him but thats all you do is defend him and blame everyone else. Was the coaches at fault? yes. Was the O-line bad? Yes. Was Freeman garbage like usual? yes….

    Anyways, I’ll stop Freeman bashing until next sunday when he underachieves some more and we can go back and forth on whos fault it will be then.

    “Blind faith. Just do it because thinking is to hard.”

    – Freemanites

  50. Stanglassman Says:

    I love that you added the 2009 season when Josh came in as a rookie losing on the road to NE in London in Game 7 on a the team hadn’t won a game. Its more like 2 out of 3 years. When Josh leaves here and goes to another team and wins a super bowl and the Bucs are rebuilding again you all will find a new person to blame. I’m sure there will be some excuse like he wasn’t good when he was here, the team he was on carried him. Give Josh a little time in the pocket a decent running game and a head coach that looks like he belongs in this league and he will rip the def apart. Last year when that was happening he threw 11 TDs in 4 game with 1 Int.

  51. Mr Lucky Says:

    Buc1987

    Just because someone doesn’t physically go to a game means nothing – I liked it better when you remained silent.

    Funny how you don’t comment on the subject just comment to attack someone who actually has a viable idea.

    As for the Johnny Football haters – what do you know?

    Screw the NCAA rules about getting $ for an autograph. The kid has an attitude and he’s a winner – two things that Freeman knows nothing about.

  52. Mr Lucky Says:

    My point is this with an 0-4 record you’re NOT making the playoffs with this team

    2. It’s time to get the best value in the draft and to test some of the backups

  53. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    “this coming from someone who has said Glennon sucks and wont amount to anything because of his draft position”

    Nothing like a bold faced lie. Show me where I said Glennon would never amount to anything. I have ALWAYS said that it is possible he becomes a good QB but HIGHLY UNLIKELY because of, wait for it . . . .wait just a bit longer . . . . HIS DRAFT POSITION!

    That doesn’t mean he WON’T be good. It means that it is not likely. Please learn the difference.

    I am not surprised though. Making stuff up seems like the way to go when you obviously don’t know what you are talking about. (I wouldn’t know.)

    I like your sig by the way. That is cute. Quoting something that nobody has ever said and then citing a group of people. Not sure you know how quotes work.

  54. Raphael Says:

    freeman is a star in this league….I will lmao at the implosion of the bucs if they let him go….don’t think they are that stupid tho…

    Hey maybe Glennon can block and play defense …lolololol !

  55. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    By the way, I should add. If you are going to paste that made up quote into each comment you should fix it first.

    “Blind faith. Just do it because thinking is TOO hard.”

    – Freemanites

    I don’t think you can afford to make yourself look any more ignorant than you already have. Unless, of course, your made up quote was intentionally wrong to show how stupid the “Freemanites” are? (I don’t think this is the case here.)

  56. Raphael Says:

    Mrsa
    Crabtree Hurt playing fullback
    We were not ready to play on Sunday
    We have no fullback
    We have no TE

    One of our best players Freeman is getting crucified .

    They better right the ship soon or Glazers will be chopping off heads.

  57. Stranger Says:

    @Mr Lucky

    “Screw the NCAA rules about getting $ for an autograph.”

    That’s not even the problem. The problem is he did so WHILE coming from a rich family. His father gives him everyday and he did it anyways, just because he wanted to. He didn’t think about the Heisman legacy, his University, or his team. The guy has a far bigger ego than Cam ever had. That’s the kind of person you want to be your leader despite superior candidates being out there. All you’re doing is looking at his W-L record and thinking it’ll magically carry over when football games aren’t won that way.

  58. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    OH, and I totally forgot, you didn’t answer my question. Maybe I should simplify it.

    Freeman + 7-9 = Bad year

    Doug Martin + 7-9 = ?

    Fill in the blank. Please.

  59. SteveK Says:

    WCBF,

    You are a “hater”, and it is obvious. Please continue to hate on Glennon.

    I hope Josh does well, and I hope he gets yanked if not. No excuses.

  60. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    How sweet of you to come in and help stevek. I like that your trying to conceal your Freeman hate after screaming it from the mountain tops for months.

    Your doing great!

  61. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    I’m certainly no member of the Glennon mob. I don’t want to bench Freeman because he is clearly our best chance to win. I don’t even see how that can be argued with what I saw in the preseason. Glennon may very well be less accurate than Freeman, if that is even possible. But please, please stop with this ridiculous nonsense that Freeman is no more responsible than anyone else. He is the freaking QB!!!!!!!! He touches the ball on every single play. He throws the ball 20 yards over Jackson’s head for a pick. He throws screen passes to guys that aren’t open (and they only reason they aren’t picked is because they are so incredibly inaccurate even the defense isn’t anywhere near the ball). He is the one that in year 5 still insists on throwing late across the middle. He is the one that completely freezes when his headset goes out. He is the one that struggles just to get a play off on time. He is not the only one responsible, but he plays a larger part than anyone else ON the field. That’s reality guys. Denying that is foolish. Go ahead and let me know of another QB that had a debacle like that on the first series of a game they have had months to prepare for. Go ahead, I’ll wait.

  62. SteveK Says:

    Hawaiian,

    Aloha! Great post, and you are dead on. I would love to hear what WCBF has to say.

    WCBF,

    Your undying hate towards Glennon is sickening. You mad, bro?

  63. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    The truth is Freeman didn’t have a debacle at the beginning of that game. Zuttah did.

    I’m sorry but please go through the list of QBs that have been successful with zero (not mediocre or below average but zero) from the run game. I’m sorry but Play calling and blocking were at least as much to blame. A lot of his wild misses, including the pick, came as he was hit. (Not pressured but HIT.)

    Freeman didn’t do anything to help but he was not the main cause for concern against the Jets.

  64. SteveK Says:

    WCBF,

    Can you judge Freeman and Glennon equally? Or, are you stuck on Free Free’s jock?

    You are going all “cookie monster” on that thing: “Nom! Nom! Me Loves Losing,,,”

    If we go 0-4, with this kind of offensive output each game, then throw out Big Bird!

  65. SteveK Says:

    WCBF,

    When can Tampa Bay have a QB that “is” the reason?

  66. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @SteveK

    I laugh at your attempt to make this about me hating Glennon. Nobody wants him to turn into a Hall of Famer more than myself.

  67. Morgan Says:

    Anyone hear #5′s radio show? Bunch of excuses.

  68. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    You confuse my display of statistical probabilities with hate. It’s okay though. I wouldn’t expect you to know the difference.

  69. RBellBuc Says:

    ^^^ all you dumbarses expect him to be perfect. There is not one QB out there that is perfect. Hawaiian picks one overthrow, yeah what about all the on a rope lasers that he threw. The fact is, you’ve made up your mind already and no matter how miniscule it is, you will find fault in Freeman

  70. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    It’s not about hating Freeman or not hating Freeman, it’s about knowing what we have. I’m just about at the point where I’ve seen enough that we know what we have with Freeman. He’s going to have good games, but more often he’s going to have bad games. I’ll give him credit that he often times comes back from bad games and puts together a late drive, but it shouldn’t even come to that. Play good for the first 3.5 quarters and we won’t have to kick a late FG against the Jets. Play consistent. Play smart. Make accurate throws. Run the offense. Run the ball if its there. Don’t look like a lost puppy on the field.

    Anyone who has watched us for the last 5 years and still believes Freeman is elite (or going to be elite) needs to have their head examined. It’s not going to happen. What has he ever done to put him in the same ballpark as Brees, Brady, Manning, Rodgers, etc.? What has he ever done to put him in the same ballpark as Flacco, Ryan, Roethlisburger, or Eli? I can name 20 QB’s that are without a doubt better than Freeman. I’ll cheer for him every week (hell, I wore his jersey on Sunday), but he is what we think he is. There will not be a line waiting for him at the end of the year. There may be a couple teams interested, and maybe someone will give him a job, but I promise you he won’t have a TV special on his decision on where he’s going. What decent team is going to get rid of their QB to have him? I challenge anyone who thinks Freeman is great to just give me one team. Once again, go ahead, I’ll wait.

  71. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @RBellBuc,

    Is that the first overthrow for a pick he’s ever had? Are you kidding me? Look at his stats over his 5 years. He does it all the damn time. And what “lasers” did he throw? He made the same throws that all 31 NFL QB’s can make. Geno Smith threw more “lasers” than Freeman. These guys are paid to throw lasers. Freeman had 15 completions. 7 were to Jackson who catches anything in the vicinity. He made a couple nice throws no doubt, but he made just as many (if not more) horrible throws. Do you think Brees makes more horrible throws than good throws? Of course not. You are falling in love with him over flashes, but you aren’t seeing the whole picture.

  72. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @WCBF,

    How exactly is 2 delay of games and a burned TO the fault of Zuttah? When Freeman is pointing to his helmet with just a couple seconds left on the play clock (not even under center), what is Zuttah supposed to do? That’s so wrong it’s not even funny. That debacle falls squarely on the shoulders of 2 people: Schiano and Freeman. Freeman could have at least run a draw like he did last year with the game on the line.

  73. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    I don’t expect Free to be perfect. I’ll tell you what I do expect: over 50% completion percentage. I’m not even asking for 60%, 50 is just fine at this point. He can’t even do that. I’ll take below average at this point, to hell with perfect.

  74. MARK Says:

    Everyone (except Lindell) needs to stop making excuses for their poor play/play calling last Sunday. The coaches & players did not prepare well and it showed. This weekend should give all of us a better idea of what our team is going to look like this year. It’s clear that “ALL” fans want the Bucs to win sooner rather than later.

  75. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    Backed up in their own end zone, Zuttah was right to hike the ball before the QB asked for it? The safety is on Zuttah. The TO’s and delay of game penalties correctly go to Freeman and Schiano.

    Again, if you have the ability to rewatch the game then look at how many of his “errant throws” came as he was taking a hit. His problem wasn’t accuracy, it was that he either waited too long to throw it or didn’t have enough time.

  76. Bucnjim Says:

    SteveK,
    Can you tell us all how old you are so we can have a good laugh. Cookie monster really? There are more serious issues with some of you posting then with the Bucs.

  77. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    Also, Vincent “catches everything in his vicinity” Jackson DID have one drop.

  78. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    That one drop is the difference between 48% and 51%. Lets not even talk about Ogletree’s two drops that would have bumped it up to 58%.

    You are judging Freeman by a stat that is not completely within his control.

  79. RBellBuc Says:

    Joe Flacco a new member of the QB elite club just threw 55% his last game. Do they put him on the bench for the backup, genius?

  80. RBellBuc Says:

    I wish I knew some of you personally. I would make your lives miserable. I would act towards you with the same vile hateful personalities that you people portray in this public forum. You might as well be Taliban as far as I’m concerned. Any person who can think with hate in their heart all the time is a rotten person to begin with. It would be suffice to say that most of you, who are always outright hateful, spiteful, and mean have hardly any real friends to begin with. If your attitudes in here, mirror you on the outside, in the real world, I pity your lonely pathetic soul.

  81. Freeman's Helmet Says:

    Starting to think Josh is ignoring me.

  82. Stranger Says:

    @RBellBuc

    No, but they should cut his contract in half and trade to get Boldin back, and give Boldin a raise.

  83. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @WCBF,

    I said the first drive. The safety wasn’t on the first drive. It’s not even that I’m blaming him for the loss, but he played a huge hand in it, as all QB’s do. As for him getting hit, that happens to all QB’s. So are we at the point where if he makes a bad throw, it’s not his fault if he gets hit? That’s a joke right? I watched an awful lot of football this weekend and saw a lot of QB’s get hit as they threw the ball. I didn’t see Peyton throw a bounce pass to any receivers. I didn’t see Brees throw the ball literally 20 yards past his WR when he got hit.

    As for V-Jax’s drop, that’s petty and you know it. I’m with you that benching Freeman is a mistake (because we have nothing else), but you are better than that. If we didn’t have Vincent, we would be a horrible team on offense. You know that. Are you really going to sit here and argue with me that Freeman is more valuable than Vincent? If so, I’m leaving this conversation.

  84. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    It is his fault for waiting to long to throw it. Not for throwing inaccurately after he held it for too long. You right to criticize, just not for what you being critical of.

    Not sure where you got that take about Vincent. I merely said he dropped a pass. I didn’t mention his value versus Freeman’s. Vincent had a fantastic game, I was just pointing out how one dropped pass was the difference between under and over 50% completion.

  85. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    Every QB has drops! So now we are at the point where we are counting drops towards his completion percentage? Oh my goodness, this is becoming comical. There isn’t a QB in this league that didn’t have at least a couple drops on Sunday. Wes Welker had a drop. Geno had at least 3 drops I can remember off hand. Unbelieveable!

    As for comparing him to Flacco, that’s even better. Yeah, he’s comparable to a Super Bowl winning QB. And last I checked, 55% is over 50% anyway. You know, that number that Freeman can’t hit even if you include the preseason.

  86. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    “It is his fault for waiting to long to throw it. Not for throwing inaccurately after he held it for too long.”

    ——-

    Heh? Re-read that one more time please. Makes absolutely no sense.

  87. SteveK Says:

    WCBF,

    Why didn’t Freeman keep scoring after being up 14-5?

    Why did he take his foot off the gas?

    LVD is the sacrificial lamb this week, but getting outplayed in your 58th start by a rookie making his NFL debut is unacceptable.

    Schiano needs to get this team going in the right direction.

    As this team’s QB, it is Josh’s duty to lead the offensive unit to consistent production greater than his opponents on any given Sunday. I saw Geno Smith play football this weekend, winning football. Our defensive miscue came to fruition from a day of slow, unproductive offense.

    We need a spark. Demps?

  88. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    RBellBuc,

    You don’t know me. I am as supportive as anyone. I fly 6000 miles to watch at least 2 games a year every single year (3 games this year). I’ve got 3 rooms in my house dedicated to the Buccaneers (one of which includes a Freeman Fat Head). I have both home and away jerseys of Freeman. I’ve got autographed pictures with Freeman. I’ve even met his parents. I’ve supported him since the day we drafted him. But he’s not getting the job done. He needs to, or he needs to be gone. It’s as simple as that.

  89. SteveK Says:

    Why can’t Freeman look and play better than Geno Smith, at this point in the game?

    Why can’t Freeman run around and play with confidence the way Smith did?

    At this point in his career, we should be seeing something more.

    Call me a hater if you must, but Freeman has tremendous physical potential. What is the problem? Why can’t it equate to offensive production?

    The D was better, but they did some dumb stuff. They will get that right.

    WCBF- WHAT THE HELL IS UP WITH THE TIME OUT, DELAY OF GAME, TIME OUT? UNACCEPTABLE. Josh needed to take the game in his own hands and call a play. Instead, he froze up and did not take charge of the situation.

  90. RBellBuc Says:

    ^^^^^ lol BS lol ^^^^^

  91. RBellBuc Says:

    They would be very proud of you!!!

  92. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    If you’d been on this site longer than a minute and a half, you would know where I stand on the Bucs. As the saying goes, you better ask somebody.

  93. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    I am done Stevek. You keep asking the same damn questions no matter how many times I answer them. I’m done responding to your mindless, incessant b!tching and moaning that rivals that of a hormonal teenager on the rag.

    @Hawaiian Buc

    I’m not trying to argue that Freeman played a good game. He didn’t. I am simply recognizing all the factors in this game.

  94. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    Also RBellBuc, Hawaiian Buc is one of the more level headed fans here. No way he deserves to be lumped in with Stevek and fan of the couch just because he disagrees.

  95. SteveK Says:

    WCBF,

    Throwing in the towel so early? Shame there isn’t more fight in you like their isn’t more fight in JF5.

    Lol, jp, good debate today. I look forward to future arguments.

  96. SteveK Says:

    WCBF,

    How do you see this offense looking this weekend? Do you see us improving from last week? Will it be enough to keep up with the Saints?

  97. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @Hawaiian Buc

    I guess “fault” was the wrong word. I should have said “problem”.

    His problem was waiting too long to throw it. Not throwing inaccurately.

  98. Stranger Says:

    @Stevek

    “Why can’t Freeman look and play better than Geno Smith, at this point in the game?”

    Because when Geno Smith dropped back, he got time. The first pass Geno Smith dropped back, we sent four and he got all day to throw. We had to blitz to get consistent pressure on him (and even then, that didn’t always work). 4 out of 5 of our sacks were from LB. Not to mention we often lost contain and without no spy, Smith was able to run free.

    In comparison Jet’s D-line got the best of our line. If they sent extra, it was almost certain Freeman was going down, and going down hard. There were several plays where both our tackles got wooped. There were plays when the Tight end that was supposed to help block, got wooped. Their end Wilkerson was blowing up our line and that’s after announcing he could before the game. Their first round rookie was also getting back there and even got a sack.

  99. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    Thanks WCBF. And even though it sounds like I totally disagree with you, I really don’t. It’s certainly not all Freeman’s fault. I just don’t think he is part of the solution either. That really upsets me, as I absolutely hate the fact that we may have to go QB shopping again. In the 37 years of this franchise, we don’t have a lot of success with that. I would love nothing more than for you to pull up one of my negative posts about Freeman as we are headed into a playoff game in RJS in January and shove it right in my face. I’ll eat that crow gladly. Hell, I’ll fly into Tampa for the game and buy you a beer!!!

  100. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @Stranger

    Don’t participate if you plan to use logic. People don’t take too kindly to logic ’round here.

  101. Tim S. Says:

    I don’t post here very often but I read every article and just about every comment. It’s obvious the Glennon Mob is growing in droves. I haven’t jumped ship on Freeman yet but I have to say, I have one leg over the bulwark.

    I lost a LOT of respect and hope I had for Freeman while watching that train wreck (aka opening offensive series). I immediately turned to my brother and said, verbatim “if he was looking for an opportunity to prove he’s worth $120 million, he just missed it”.

    In my humble opinion, to be considered a true franchise quarterback, in that moment you need to put the offense on your back and march them down the field. After a full season, and a second preseason, you should be capable of calling plays similar to what your coordinator would call until the communication issues are resolved.

    Also, I’ve always been under the impression that teams script the first 15 plays (give or take a few). If that’s the case then this is even more of an indictment of Freeman.

    He appears to have all the tools necessary except for one. The tool between your ears. The most important one.

  102. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @Hawaiian Buc

    My last comment was not directed at you.

    I have too much respect for you to rub it in your face. I understand your frustrations. I don’t know with any amount of certainty that Freeman will pull it all together this year. I really hope he does though.

  103. Lynch Says:

    I just want a QB that understands that if his headset goes down and its 1st and 10, that he can call one play to call to avoid taking a timeout or a delay of game.

  104. RBellBuc Says:

    ^^^^I keep hearing everyone say that. Let’s say he did call a play, he still would have had to call a time out on the second play, unless you expected him to ignore his coaches and call every play after that. Yeah that would have gone over well. His helmet malfunctioned and he had to use a TO then or after a play it didn’t matter.

  105. Raphael Says:

    It takes 11 guys on the same page for an offense to work ….it’s not the QB , it’s not that simple .

  106. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @Raphael,

    But it all starts and ends with the QB. It’s not just the QB, but there’s a reason why they tend to make more money than anyone else on the field. They are the most important. They get the most credit, as well as the most blame. It’s the nature of the beast. Not accepting that is delusional.

  107. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    I don’t have a problem with the first timeout. The headset goes out, the clock is running down, I get it. However, when you have a timeout, go to the sideline, then come back and subsequently get 2 delay of game penalties, that’s a problem. Here’s a novel concept: get the play call while on the sideline. After that, I can even live with calling another timeout for the next play. That didn’t happen. Instead we got 2 consecutive delay of game penalties. I have never seen anything like that at any level.

    Even in the event that he doesn’t want to ignore the coaches and call a play, then call a timeout. Don’t back yourself up 10 yards! I bet you Brady won’t have 2 delay of game penalties all year, and Freeman had 2 without taking a snap! Let that sink in for a moment. Freeman isn’t the first QB to have his headset go out, and he won’t be the last. It’s about how he responds to adversity. He is the leader of the offense. How much confidence can that possibly instill in his fellow offensive teammates?

  108. Stranger Says:

    @Hawaiian Buc

    That doesn’t make it right. Flacco got 120 million dollars worth of credit for their SB run. In exchange, they had to trade Boldin who was lights out during that run and got 208 yds this weekend. Meanwhile, Flacco lost while having his RB and FB as his leading receivers.

  109. RBellBuc Says:

    I’m going to put the blame where it should be,

    offensive play calling did not adjust

    Lavonte David’s penalty

    We won that game regardless of scoring almost exactly the same amount of points most talking heads said we would have.

    We won the game regardless of the refs giving the Jets more opportunities at the most convenient times

    We lost that game because offensive play calling did not adjust

    We lost that game because Lavonte David’s penalty.

    We lost that game because the Jets kicker made the field goal with 2 seconds on the clock.

    Josh Freeman put us in the position to win that game, he did NOT lose it.

  110. Miguel Grande Says:

    I’ll vouch for Hawaiian, he is the most sophisticated and eloquent poster. He is a loyal Buc fan. He has a great time zone.

    He stood up against me when I suggested trading Freeman to KC for their draft pick and trading LGB with another player to New England for Mallett.

  111. MadMax Says:

    Look, Freeman wasnt the entire blame vs. the jets….a lot of it yes, but in saying that, the coaching and schemes had more to do with it. …..anyone sincerely know whose fault it was for the miffed snap in the end zone that cost us 2 points?

    As much as Joe wants to put the cost of the game on LVD, I put just as much blame on that miffed play as well…….2 points……………………..2 points it cost us…………….we lost by 1 point :(

  112. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @Stranger,

    QB’s get the most money. They are far and away the most important position on the field. Look at what happened to Fitzgerald last year without a QB. Good QB’s win games, bad ones don’t. Find me an exception in today’s day and age. Look at how much teams throw the ball now. The QB is more important than ever.

    Flacco got paid because he deserved it. He wasn’t a game manager. He was magnificent in the playoffs. In fact, he has gone to the playoffs every year he’s been in the league. There are obviously other factors involved, but they do not win the Super Bowl last year without him. There’s no debating that. As for Boldin, if they wanted him, they could have kept him. They paid other free agents, did they not? They sure didn’t have a problem paying Dumervil.

    Bottom line is this: If we get rid of Freeman, what teams are going to get rid of their QB to have Freeman? I challenge you to find any non-bottom feeder team that would.

  113. blackmagic00 Says:

    I went through the game again and I have to say other than the helmet carp free looked better than he has in a while. our line sucked and the jets dline was pretty relentless, probably because our line let them. free did a decent job with what he had to work with. I think glennon would have been killed out there. just my observation.

  114. gotbbucs Says:

    Freeman did exactly what he has been doing for four years now. The difference now is almost everybody has finally come to the realization that he isn’t going to develop like we have all been hoping for. All he has to be able to do is complete simple short passes, and he can’t, it’s almost unbelievable to watch.
    His confidence is gone, and from the looks on the faces of some of the offensive players last week, his teammates are coming to this realization too. The look that comes to mind was Freeman missing Jackson on an easy slant pass, where Jackson had won his one-on-one matchup, and Freeman overthrew him badly. Close-up of Jackson’s face and he is just rolling his eyes on the way back to the huddle.
    Don’t kid yourselves, Freeman has lost his teammates full support. They will make nice in interviews and in front of cameras, but that whole “Captain” vote is way more telling than anybody is letting on.
    I’ve tried being supportive for as long as I could, but it’s over for him. I said it a couple weeks ago, I think Freeman has maybe two or three years left in the NFL. The Bucs will not resign him and one or two coaches will try to re-develop him, and then it will be over.

  115. Chef Paul Says:

    I don’t know what to think. I agree with Hawaiian and West Coast. This guy creates an ulcers daily through Buc Nation

  116. BucFan20 Says:

    If it’s true the run sets up the passing game , why didn’t Freeman open holes for Martin? And whos fault is it we did’t have a FB to help open holes. That’s Freemans fault too. I damn sure don’t usually take Freemans side but some of you damn sure did not watch the OL play. “Why did Freeman take his foot off the gas?” It was NEVER ON IT! Penn, Carimi, JZ, DJ Martin, Stocker all getting blown up and missing blocks all day. No running game and all the Jets had to do was Tee off on Freeman and they knew it. We had the lead. Late hit or not Geno still had enough time to run one more quick out of bounds play to get closer and try a 63 yard FG. If they make it they win anyway.

    I do know this. If the offense does it’s job and the defense blows it be 0-2 and still most people will blame it on Freeman.

  117. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    I wish everyone would stop blaming the OL, as if Freeman would have played great had he had more protection. They obviously didn’t play well, but am I the only one that saw several turrible (my best Charles Barkley voice) screen passes? Granted Doug dropped one, but even that one was high (catchable, but not on target). That’s not on the OL. Also, is it not the responsibility of the QB to call out protections? The Jets had guys coming unblocked, which means the protection calls probably weren’t there.

    The line gets a failing grade, but so does Freeman. Hell, any QB in the NFL will be great if they have time on every play. Ever noticed how the great ones are basically un-blitzable? Ever noticed how the great ones have COMPLETE control of the offense? Ever noticed how the great ones don’t get their best receiver in one on one coverage all day? Ever noticed how the great ones hit their targets in the numbers, instead of making their receivers stretch for the ball, thus exposing them to getting pounded? I have.

  118. blackmagic00 Says:

    Buchan20 spot on

  119. RBellBuc Says:

    @gotbbucs says,

    Freeman ain’t no good cause I’s can see it in his eyes! Oh Lordy! You can see it all their eyes. Those eyes keep telling me something!!

    Good grief

  120. RBellBuc Says:

    @Hawaiian

    We get it…

    …. you hate Freeman!

    Are you looking for sympathy or are you on a crusade?

  121. Stranger Says:

    @Hawaiian Buc

    “I wish everyone would stop blaming the OL, as if Freeman would have played great had he had more protection.”

    It’s like this. If the OL can play better, then Martin can run. If Martin runs, less on Freeman’s shoulders and more ways for our offense to attack. If you didn’t notice, we didn’t even take our traditional Freeman deepshots that game. Our offense looked more West Coast than Run n Shoot. So its not a stretch to say Freeman plays better with better protection since our offense would run like its designed to.

    And the screen passes were basically just surrenders. You throw them out to see if maybe something can happen, because otherwise we’re terrible at them.

  122. Stranger Says:

    As for the OL protection and block schemes, I can’t for certain who’s at fault but I will say this. The coaching staff has reviewed that during the offseason and will probably review it after every game. If Freeman is making bad calls or can’t make calls in general, he would have been stripped of that ability a long time ago or removed altogether.

  123. Splengo Says:

    I don’t trust this Hawaiian guy. I remember him from a while back he wanted to trade up and take Trent Richardson in the 2012 draft. We would have not gotten Doug or Lavonte. When the guy starts to get a few right, I’ll start to listen. Until then I’ve got to lump him in with Couch Fan and SteveK – two guys who couldn’t find their a$$ if you tied both hands behind their backs.

  124. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    RBellBuc,

    Apparently you struggle reading and/or comprehending. I don’t hate Freeman at all. I don’t want us to bench him (think I said that 3 times now). I want him to play out of this world and make me look stupid. I really like the guy, and have supported him from day one. I think if you had been on this site long enough, you would know that. But I don’t think he gets a pass on his performance. He is playing poorly, and I don’t see anything that makes him deserve a new contract. He is to blame (as are others) for the loss on Sunday. If you twist that to believe that I hate him, then you are an idiot.

  125. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @Splengo,

    First of all, get your facts straight. I wanted us to draft him, but I said we should trade the house to get him. Why don’t you go check the archives. Did I or anyone else know we were going to be able to get Doug and Lavonte? Of course not. From the day of the draft, I was thrilled with what we got. (and by the way, Richardson is a good enough player to be in the top 100, so we aren’t talking about an awful player).

    Regardless, if the organization believed in Freeman, they would have signed him already. What’s your argument to that? And I notice that no one has answered my question about what team is going to give up their QB to get Freeman. It’s so much easier to just criticize me for calling it like it is.

  126. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @Stranger,

    I’m very well aware of how the OL could have helped Freeman. I don’t think you get my point. However, you can’t expect to get great protection and a huge running game all the time. You certainly should be able to beat the Jets without those two. My biggest problem is his inaccuracy, and lack of control of the offense. Answer this: would you classify him as an accurate passer? Would you say that he has command of this offense? Would you say he is anywhere near an elite QB? If you were the owners of this football team, would you invest $100M in Freeman off of what you’ve seen? Instead of everyone getting all bitter at me and pointing the blame at someone else, why don’t you try answering the questions. I bet you won’t.

  127. Buc1987 Says:

    I don’t want Glennon to start 1 game this season.
    See how easy that was. 1 sentence no need for debate.

  128. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    should be: we should NOT trade the house to get him.

  129. realtalkfaulk Says:

    People who want Glennon are morons. Everyone wants the back up till they realize he sucks. If Glennon is ever put in realize the Bucs win 1 game at most. Fans will be sorry. Schiano is a bad coach and he’s been undermining Freeman the whole time he’s been in Tampa. I can’t wait till he benches Freeman starts Glennon and wins no games and gets fired.

  130. Buc1987 Says:

    Hawaiian Buc…my summation of the offense in Sundays game went like this 70% Sully’s terrible play calling and 30% Freeman’s terrible play. Sully was solely responsible for the sputtering offense. He saw the same plays were not working and kept dialing them up. He never adjusted to the Jets D. I’m not looking for a debate about it either. I think people on here should know that I could care less about 90% of what other people’s opinions are. I’m just stating the way I saw things. Take it or leave it.

    “A Move To Glennon In October?”
    Since the headline of this article is solely about Glennon starting. I just summed up my answer to that in my above post in 1 sentence. I don’t want Glennon starting 1 game this season. Take it as hate I don’t care. It is what it is and hate has nothing to do with my reasoning behind thinking this way.

  131. Broy3434 Says:

    You people are out of your minds- some of you atleast. You can’t solely blame freeman. It’s on everyone except like 4 players. All the coaches,freeman, ogletree, lavontes brain. What sickens me is watching the 9ers and Packers and thinking first drive “man they make this look easy”. Still think freeman has what it takes but he won’t ever be elite. If he doesn’t throw for 250 and keep it close Sunday then he needs to go and I consider myself one of his biggest fans. Sad part is no QB taken in the mid to late first round region will be better than Freeman. And Boyd will not be better than Josh. And lastly people need to stop saying I don’t see Rodgers or Brees do this or that. You’re right but you do see cutler rivers Bradford and everyone in Freeman’s tier do it. We don’t have an elite QB so stop the comparisons. Either they win 10 and get in great roll with Josh for a couple years. or start Glennon after 0-4 and hope we lose a bunch of close ones and get Bridgewater

  132. Splengo Says:

    Hawaiian,

    The answer to your question is Jacksonville Jags. Still can’t put you in the ring of honor until you get one right. Afraid you might be wrong this time too.

  133. BigMacAttack Says:

    I may have to revise my 13-3 prediction to 12.5 – 3.5.

    Possibly ruined one QB, don’t make it two.

  134. RBellBuc Says:

    @Hawaiian says,

    The line gets a failing grade, but so does Freeman. Hell, any QB in the NFL will be great if they have time on every play. Ever noticed how the great ones are basically un-blitzable? Ever noticed how the great ones have COMPLETE control of the offense? Ever noticed how the great ones don’t get their best receiver in one on one coverage all day? Ever noticed how the great ones hit their targets in the numbers, instead of making their receivers stretch for the ball, thus exposing them to getting pounded? I have.

    _______________________________________________________

    Sounds like you hate him to me. He ain’t perfect enough for you.

    And by the way, as much as you think the Great ones are so terrific, they are not perfect. They miss receivers, they stare down receivers, they throw ints, they get sacked, they fumble, they have delay of games, etc. Take away the supporting cast and I can turn any GREAT QB into an average QB. No Josh isn’t a GREAT QB yet or maybe never but he’s the best we have now, and he can get it done when his supporting cast does exactly that …. support.

  135. Broy3434 Says:

    Either we go 10-6 and roll with Josh or bring in Glennon after the bye and hope for Bridgewater. No mid tier qbs. But you people have to stop comparing Josh to Elite Qbs. We all know he isn’t elite. Give him Fitz and Dez to go with Vjack and I still don’t know what he’d be.

  136. Buc1987 Says:

    Hawaiian Buc…I’m not one of the ones fighting with you I agree with you most of the time. So I’ll give my honest answers to your questions. Excpet I’m going to number them so it makes it more clear.

    Answer this: 1. would you classify him as an accurate passer?2.Would you say that he has command of this offense?3. Would you say he is anywhere near an elite QB?4. If you were the owners of this football team, would you invest $100M in Freeman off of what you’ve seen? Instead of everyone getting all bitter at me and pointing the blame at someone else, why don’t you try answering the questions. I bet you won’t.

    Answers :
    1. You never know what your going to get with him.
    2. Still to early to tell, because I blame Sully for crappy the playcalling in the Jets game. 70% Sully’s fault 30% Freeman’s fault Sully never adjusted to the Jets D. He kept dialing up the same plays that were not working and should have adjusted.
    3. As of right now, of course not.
    4. Well they have not yet so that point is moot at this point of course I would not.

  137. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @Splengo,

    We are really having trouble reading today aren’t we? Let me go ahead and copy and paste the question for you, and then you can try again:

    “Bottom line is this: If we get rid of Freeman, what teams are going to get rid of their QB to have Freeman? I challenge you to find any non-bottom feeder team that would.”

    Jax is the very definitiion of a bottom feeder team.

  138. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @RBellBuc,

    You are a trip dude. I can’t believe from even what you posted you would think that means I hate him. You have the comprehension of a 2 year old.

    It’s also funny how you completely ignore me saying how I supported him from day 1. You ignore me saying I have a fat head and 2 jerseys of his. You ignore how I want nothing more than for him to be great. But yeah, you’re right. I hate him. He’s better than Brady. It’s all because of the coaches and the OL. I digress.

  139. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @RBellBuc,

    I do support Freeman. I wore his jersey Sunday, and I’ll probably wear it again next Sunday. Regardless, I’ll cheer my arse off for him. Don’t even talk to me about support. I am the definition of supportive. But I’m not going to make excuses for him.

  140. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @Buc1987,

    Got no argument there.

  141. RBellBuc Says:

    That’s an unfair question. The only teams that need a QB are going to be bottom dwellers. Ask that question at the start of free agency next year.

    Could be Denver if Manning goes down for good, hell it could be any top team that loses their franchise QB. It could be the Steelers if Roth sucks .. it could be San diego if Rivers sucks Detroit ,Bears

  142. Buc1987 Says:

    What I’m really hoping for this Sunday is that the Bucs upset the Saints at home and knock the snot out of Brees. So people will stop bashing Schiano. It’s been 1 game that the team looked unprepared. Allow the guy to fix those problems, before declaring him a terrible coach after 1 game and wanting him fired already. The Bucs gave Raheem an entire season in 2011 to get it turned around, yet there are many in here that are convinced that Schiano must go already after 1 game. Like I said give him a chance to correct the problem, because if he does and the Bucs beat the Saints this Sunday. What say you Schiano bashers then?

    Bash Freeman all you want. I mean hell he’s been bashed for 2 years now. Why stop now?

  143. RBellBuc Says:

    Freeman could care less if you support him or not. In fact he’s probably sorry you met his parents. When I said support, I wasn’t talking about your sorry butt. I was talking about Freeman’s team. You know the other 45 guys.

  144. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    That’s exactly right. That proves that good QB’s win games. No good team thinks Freeman is better than what they have, because their QB actually wins games. They aren’t going to get rid of their guy to get Freeman. It’s not going to happen.

  145. RBellBuc Says:

    Not at the beginning of the regular season dummy. He doesn’t even know the playbook. Most teams would want to at least lose a couple first.

  146. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @RBellBuc,

    Aren’t you a sour puss. You really don’t have a clue who I am, or how much I love this team. Like I said earlier, if you’d been on this site for anytime, you would know better.

  147. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    Oh my, you are either in middle school, or just really really stupid. I’m speechless at this point.

  148. Buc1987 Says:

    I still don’t think Freeman lost the Jets game though….

  149. Buc1987 Says:

    There is only 1 word for why the Bucs lost to the Jets and it’s not Freeman. The word is penalties. So now I guess Freeman is 0-1 to start the season, even though he did not lose the game. It was the penalties. Sure some of them were on him, but not the costly ones. I don’t look at it like Freeman is 0-1 in 2013. Since it was a collective failed effort by everyone on the team but VJ. The team is 0-1 not Josh.

  150. RBellBuc Says:

    I don’t give a rats azz how long you been here. I don’t care if you’re Jon Bon Jovi. The fact is for someone who says they like Freeman you have done nothing but blame him without taking in other considerations. That is a person who has already decided. You hate Freeman as our QB and would probably secretly like to see the team gamble and play Glennon. Take a chance on throwing away the entire season after one game. How is it logical to continue bashing him? What does that achieve? I do my best work when I feel at least a little appreciated don’t you. But hey, it’s you’re prerogative to be hateful, just like it’s my prerogative to call you out as a judgemental fool.

  151. Splengo Says:

    Oh Hawaiian,

    That is a clever question because you know that no winning team is going to get rid of its starting QB. That’s like heads I win, tails you lose. You don’t know the future. Who would know that when Doug Williams left here that he would win a Super Bowl and you don’t know if Freeman left what his future holds either. Just like you didn’t know that Doug and Lavonte would be there when you wanted us to trade up and draft Richardson. My point is you are just as likely to be wrong now as you were then.

  152. Buc1987 Says:

    When Dilfer left I said he would never win a Super Bowl ever. I swear on my kids I said it. Then look what happened.

  153. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    Nope RBell, not at all. I don’t want Glennon to ever see the field. I’m not bashing Freeman, but he does get a huge part of the blame. That’s all I’ve ever said. You are blaming others, so why is it not ok for me to blame Freeman? I don’t get that. I don’t want to cut him. I’m just very disappointed in what I believe is very little progression in his 5 years here. I’ve said I believe 4 times now I hope he comes back and plays great and makes me look stupid. I want him to be the best in the NFL. I’m just very skeptical that will happen. I just don’t see why he gets off without any of the blame, which is what you are expecting. Don’t get it.

  154. Buc1987 Says:

    As far as I’m concerned I’m not fighting with fellow Buc fans anymore. That’s why I’m not in here anymore during the daytime hrs. I might pop in and drop down a comment or 2. Then I click off, because I don’t care how they reply anymore. I don’t want to fight with fellow Buc fans. I’ll save my fight for Saints fans, the way it should be.

  155. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    Maybe Free will go somewhere else and be great. Like you said, it has happened before. Whatever is happening in Tampa, I don’t see it working. He’s had multiple coordinators and coaches. While that doesn’t help him, we’ve still seen the same old Freeman. Wildly inconsistent. My patience is just running thin. I don’t see how any fan of this team could feel differently. How many more years should we give him?

  156. RBellBuc Says:

    So be positive. There’s already enough jerks out their trying to tear down the very fabric of his soul. Maybe if you made positive comments it would help parlay a healthier atmosphere instead of just piling on like a mob mentality.

  157. Buc1987 Says:

    How many more years should we give him?

    I can answer that with a question. How many more months will we give him?
    Answer : 4

  158. Buc1987 Says:

    RBellBuc… I’m the Vice President of the Josh Freeman fan club on JBF. Ask anyone here. So when you see me start to get P.O.’d with him this season then you will know his career is over in Tampa. I’m not there yet though.

  159. RBellBuc Says:

    Nobody could operate efficiently under this much scrutiny, nobody. It’s eating away at all the players. Even Penn said the media has all the players stressed out with all the negativity. It just eats away like larvae on a leaf, where players spend to much time worrying about making mistakes instead of just feeling comfortable with what they are doing.

  160. Buc1987 Says:

    RBellBuc…basically it’s really the media bashing Josh, none of which he ever listens too though. Seriously look it up. He was taught by his father at a young age to never listen to any of his critics or his supporters. He was taught that it would cloud his thinking either way. He says he never hears any of the criticism until somebody on his team or family member brings it up. He just tunes them out. Never reads about it or listens to it on the news.

  161. RBellBuc Says:

    1987 he’s got this year first, after that it alls get evaluated at the end. This maybe Josh’s last year as a Buc. So let’s at least give him room to breathe.

  162. Buc1987 Says:

    He team on the other hand might not have that mentality though. If they keep reading it and hearing it and then see it happening on the field. They might stop believing in him. Not all of them, but some might.

  163. Buc1987 Says:

    RBellBuc…you do know about the 25 foot banner that I held up during preseason against the Ravens right?The sucker was massive. It read WE BELIEVE IN JOSH! I made sure he could see it too. I did not do it to get on TV or anything I did it for Josh, because of all the bashing he has been taking. That sign cost me about 20 bucks to make and 2 hours time too.

  164. RBellBuc Says:

    He may say that but trust me he peeks or listens, and even if he doesn’t, his team mates do. Don’t think it doesn’t effect them too, especially Penn and the offensive line.

  165. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    Pressure is part of the business. NFL players face so much pressure because their contracts aren’t guaranteed. It just comes with the job. I don’t think the scrutiny affects Josh one way or the other, at least I hope not. And like you said, I’m sure he could care less if I support him or not. The players are going to base their support on what they see on the field. They are the ONLY ones that know whose fault it is on a particular play. We can speculate all day long, but they know for sure. They see him everyday in practice, and they know exactly how dedicated or not dedicated he really is. So as far as the support of his teammates, I don’t believe anyone affects that but Josh Freeman himself.

  166. RBellBuc Says:

    wow 25 footer? How did you hold that sucker up? lol

  167. Stranger Says:

    @Hawaiian Buc
    “would you classify him as an accurate passer?”

    Not consistently, no.

    “Would you say that he has command of this offense?”

    I say he does, or else he wouldn’t be here. I don’t consider him a magic entity that should bolster the play of those around him like other people seem to want him to.

    “Would you say he is anywhere near an elite QB?”

    Nope. Of course not. There are only 4 of those in the league.

    “If you were the owners of this football team, would you invest $100M in Freeman off of what you’ve seen?”

    Nope. Only elite QBs should get that kind of many, and I don’t consider Ryan, Flacco, or Eli elite.

  168. Splengo Says:

    And Buc1987,

    Don’t you cowtow to anybody. If you like Freeman and he stinks, your opinion is as valid as anybody else’s. I like Hawaiian. I read his posts and he is not a hater like some of the other guys you go toe to toe with. And like all of us he, BamBam, Macabee and others whose opinion I respect only have opinions like you and me. So pick up your sword and carry on the fight.

  169. RBellBuc Says:

    Ok again, I wasn’t really talking about players supporting Josh as a teammate rather than supporting as an effiecient offensive line, WR catching everything, defense holding the opposition, special teams putting the team in great field positions and scoring points. That’s the support I was talking about. That’s the support the great QB’s get on great teams, but what you said was a nice gesture though, and I agree.

  170. Buc1987 Says:

    LOL I had the wind on my side. I was worried about that before the game. My wife and I held it up in our living room and the middle kept flopping over. So my plan was to find someone with a #5 jersey to help me out. Well it turned out the wind worked in our favor like a sail and we did not need anyones help. I had a bunch of fans taking pictures of it though. I held it up in 2 different spots in RJS.

    So like I said before, when you see me calling for Freeman’s head. Then you know he’s done.

  171. Buc1987 Says:

    “So pick up your sword and carry on the fight.”

    LOL I do battle don’t I? I noticed when I said I was done with the site and would not blog anymore. I had quite a few people wanting me to come back. So I did. I just don’t like fighting with fans though. I don’t see the point in it.

  172. Buc1987 Says:

    When and if the team starts to put together a winning streak. I hope most of the fighting will stop.

  173. RBellBuc Says:

    Look, I know Freeman has faults. I’m not a goober head with my head in the sand. He has this year to put it together but it takes the whole team clicking for that to happen. We know Freeman can’t do it on his own, even though he tries. So with that in mind, I would still like to focus on winning and being positive. All this negativity has me and everyone else on edge and it is not conducive to a winning attitude. If every time the game came on and I said to myself we’re gonna lose, that would make me a sucky fan. I don’t accept defeat before I’m defeated that’s asinine. But there are those who revel in all the negatives and welcome defeat just so they can somehow prove themselves worthy cause they ripped on our QB all week like they were the real enemy. Hell, most of the time the enemy has nicer things to say about Freeman and the Bucs than a lot of our own fans.

  174. RBellBuc Says:

    Well 11:30 …time for bed..

  175. Hawaiian Buc Says:

    @RBellBuc,

    I’m 100% with you, more than you probably realize. I’ve spent a lot of time after a loss (and a poor game by Free) defending him. I am not a negative fan, not at all. I went to the Atlanta game a few years ago (Raheem’s last game) and saw us go down 42-0 in the second quarter. I stayed the entire game, cheered when we got a pick 6 to bring ourselves within a mere 35 points, and still don’t regret going to the game. I went to the 49ers game the same season and watched us lose 48-3. I will support this team whether we are 0-16 or 16-0. I will support whoever is coach, or whoever is QB. That doesn’t, however, mean they are free from being criticized. I rarely do it, but it is at times justified. After last week, it is justified. There are a lot of people to blame, but it starts with the coach and the QB. They better get it right, or at least one of them won’t be here next year. I’m all about us doing whatever it takes to get better. Glennon will not make us better, and he’s our only option for 2013. I’ll be up at 7am on Sunday, screaming my head off at my TV for the Bucs and Freeman. You can bank on that.

  176. FanOfBucs Says:

    Stranger Says:
    September 10th, 2013 at 4:45 pm
    If Glennon is out there in Week 5, then we’ll have a new GM and HC next year.

    +1.
    FACT.

  177. Buccaneer79 Says:

    I have not commented on here before. But I am a huge fan of the Bucs since 1979 but didn’t really start paying attention until I could actually watch them play every Sunday, probably around 1995. I live in Indiana, but have missed maybe only 5-10 games since then & have attended 5 regular season games since 1996.

    OK, I’m not a coach; I haven’t studied film. However, after watching enough football, it becomes easier to recognize certain, very simple things, for example, a kick-ass offense, which I don’t know about the lot of you who comment on here, and although we have all seen Tampa Bay have stand-out performances on offense, although it seems rare, right? But a well-oiled machine that scores at will? A well-balanced, consistent beast of an offense has been never really been a part of any team in this franchises’ history. A complete offense that dominates is what this offense should be. Until that run for the Super Bowl when they “turned it on,” I hadn’t seen a good Tampa Bay offense. They have finished in the top 10 in offense to finish the season just 3 times (2012-13, 2003-04, 1984-85); their highest finish ever, 9th, last year under Greg Schiano.

    My point is, with the talent on this offense, it should be unstoppable. When they aren’t prepared for anything, it goes on coaching. Just like how I witnessed the dominating Bucs D come together with that killer instinct in the late 90′s until they won Super Bowl 37, I am seeing a window of opportunity for this offense with Freeman, Jackson & Martin (…and Williams). The 2 weaknesses, TE & the left side of the line, not having a healthy Nicks has hurt already. You have have a QB who can make all the throws with inferior protection schemes? No QB is invincible. Mike Sullivan as an OC has to use the strengths of this unit for the team, not against it. Make up for the weaknesses with creative adjustments, no matter what kind of D you face. This staff had to know what was coming from the Jets, right? Either way, this loss goes on the entire offensive staff, players & Greg Schiano, not David’s unfortunate penalty. With these guys on offense, they should be having a field day. Maybe Freeman doesn’t have it; he has been prone to mistakes, but if Jeremy Zuttah doesn’t snap that ball into the end zone for a safety, maybe the Bucs win. Everyone wants to blame Freeman, I get it. But the coaching staff needs to be held accountable just as much because there is a lot of talent that needs a system that plays to its strengths. Hey, maybe the Jets D is that good, too, but hey, Coach Sullivan, let’s not try to be creative with all this talent you got over there. Could have spelled Martin perhaps with one of the other guys. I’ve seen this before with less talent. Time to bring it up a notch. I like killer instinct in an offense; this offense has that, but it’s not being used that way. In other words, take more chances. It’s like that college coach who said the other day after his team won like 70-0. He said something to the effect, “I learned a long time ago, if you’re not trying to score, you won’t.”

    Now when this offense does get going, I don’t know about anybody else, but this defense might be on its way back to being great, they aren’t playing flag football out there, this team could/should be very tough to beat. Drew & the Saints are gonna rip em apart, but how much will make a difference. Get the offense rolling though & this team could beat any team in the league.

    Freeman, yes, he has to take blame. He’s not been elite. But Ronde said he needs to have fun. He always seems a little tense in his PC’s, not completely confident. Is it this system? Could be. Coaching? Possible. Is it him not truly grasping it? Very possible. The talent? Um, my guess is no on that. Freeman has what it takes, but it’s all gotta come together. Also, I agree about Olgetree, too; Underwood probably should have gotten that spot. They need Nicks, Lorig & Crabtree back soon. Oh, & if Glennon starts, season’s over.

  178. MTM Says:

    The problem with the offense at this time is coaching. They are trying to make Freeman into something he is not, a pocket passer. Freemans best attributes are being misused. Roll him out of the pocket. Design a few runs and open this offense up. Take the effing training wheels off. He is not Tom Brady.

  179. mord Says:

    Glennon? Geez.

    Say what you will about Freeman’s performance, or about his state of mind under the current coaching structure, but of the two, Freeman is the only one likely to have a long career as a starter in the NFL. I believe he’ll figure it out at some point, though maybe not with the Bucs, at this rate.

    As for Glennnon … with the “mob” talk, I decided to google “Mike Glennon Highlights”, and watched a couple of youtube compilations from his last collegiate season … It seemed like 4 out of every five highlights featured the announcer saying “Glennon’s got plenty of time”, or similar, while Glennon stood in a huge, safe pocket for 4,5,6 seconds or more. ANYONE can make passes in that time and space.

    What’s more illuminating is the way he looked in the preseason against NFL players and roster-wannabes. That glimpse made me think he might not even have a long career as a *backup* QB.

    I surely hope Freeman shuts down this conversation with better play … But if he doesn’t .. .. I hope the next QB picked for the Bucs actually has some bigger potential.

  180. Oil Derrick Brooks Says:

    Brady will go with Edelman as his number one receiver, no Gronk, and STILL own the Jets. Just watch.

 
 

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