Josh Freeman Enters The Hot Seat

April 30th, 2013

The Bucs will say otherwise, of course, but it doesn’t take a sleuth to figure out the Bucs are trying to force feed quarterback Josh Freeman to become an upper-echelon quarterback, not a bottom rung kind of guy.

He has all the toys a quarterback could want, plus a bruising front wall of an offensive line and a retooled defense to help him hold leads.

Someone with pull at One Buc Palace must not believe Freeman can lead the Bucs to January games given the Bucs drafted third-round quarterback Mike Glennon.

This is not lost on the “Total Access” crew at the NFL Network, as Daniel Jeremiah explains to Paul Burmeister why he thinks Freeman is on the proverbial hot seat now that the Bucs have Glennon.

Not only do Phil Simms and Rich Gannon think a lot of Glennon, so too does NFL Films Xs and Os guru Greg Cosell. He details why below.

117 Responses to “Josh Freeman Enters The Hot Seat”

  1. Biff Barker Says:

    With Glennon’s arrival here the FO has spoken, but, I’m curious to know what the locker room really thinks of Freeman.

  2. the_buc_realist Says:

    This is why everyone loves Free Agency and the Draft. No matter what the Gm and Coaches say, you only get the truth of what they think of the team is during these events. Not that i expect or need to hear the Gm on what he thinks of the team at every press conference. So what did we learn……..
    That the Secondary and Qb position was what held us back last year..

  3. Couch Fan Says:

    Good info. I love the people who keep saying, “Oh we could of had em in the 4th”. Only fools would say that considering the only way to know that for sure is to know all 32 teams draft boards. I personally loved the pick. Now IF (and I’m hoping this happens) Free stinks it up again this year. We wont be forced into drafting another QB or playing a rookie next year. Dom has always been a forward thinker.

  4. Oldguy Says:

    I think Freeman will step up this year (if his 2 all-pro guards stay healthy), but I like the Glennon pick too. Josh could get hurt anytime.

  5. Couch Fan Says:

    sorry thats suppose to say (and im NOT hoping this happens)

  6. Biff Barker Says:

    Agree, no way he’d have been there in the 4th. It’s the blowback from armchair GM’s not getting their guy.

  7. T in Orlando Says:

    Freeman is beyond the point keeping him on the team because of what he may become. He will only be kept based on what he’s done, which to this point, is nothing to merit a long term deal. He has one more year to add to his resume, and prove he is worth a long term deal that the Bucs would love to give him, should he earn it.

    I don’t believe that Glennon’s arrival means that anyone on the coaching or personnel thinks Freeman can’t get this team to the post season. However, as Freeman will only be judged (and subsequently paid) based on what he’s done, it makes sense to not be in a position for the team to force itself to use a 1st or 2nd round pick on a QB next year, should Freeman not get us to playoffs.

    Also, I think Glennon will be an immediate upgrade over Orlovsky (or at least he will be by the time the season starts). So in the event that something happens to Josh during the season, the Bucs have likely improved their ability to handle that.

    I just think the statement “Someone with pull at One Buc Palace must not believe Freeman can lead the Bucs to January games given the Bucs drafted third-round quarterback Mike Glennon” is a little too much of a leap, for a draft pick that amounts to a decent insurance policy for a number of scenarios.

  8. Ben Says:

    It just seems to me that the team was willing to spend a 3rd round pick on a guy that needs some work, but could play next year. They got a guy that they targeted, and they like, but they want to see what Freeman has this year and give themselves another option going into next year to choose between. The question isn’t Freeman or Glennon now, it’s Freeman or Glennon next year.

  9. Mike J Says:

    Nolan Nawrocki of ”Pro Football Weekly” projected Glennon in the first round, & sees him as a ”future starter.” FWIW

  10. Lev Says:

    Its a win-win situation for the Bucs. If Freeman takes us far then we re-sign him. If he stinks up the joint we move to the promising player behind him. Its that simple

  11. bucfanjeff Says:

    Why does it have to be “either or”? Why can’t it be both?
    RG3, Cousins
    Favre, Rodgers
    Freeman, Glennon
    Kaepernick, Smith

    I fully expect Freeman to get an extension unless he totally tanks.
    The Bucs are fortunate to be in positiion for Glennon to learn behind Freeman. If he earns the job and takes over as starter in a year or two, great.

    This isn’t either or, it’s both and win-win.
    QB are a premium and if we decide to trade one, that’s a bonus for us.

  12. BucoBruce Says:

    WOW! Glennon might be better than I even thought and I think he is Brady like.BUCS12-4

  13. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Here’s my thinking, and I may be wrong but I firmly believe this…the Bucs were not going to bring Dan-o back. This means they went months planning to draft a replacement. Then Dan-o comes back for a lot less money…plans were already made. And really, Dan-o is not a great backup.

    So they still needed a potentially good backup. Hence they picked Glennon. If they wanted a controversy they would have taken a QB early in the draft. Backups are chosen in the third round or later, in hte hopes that they MIGHT turn into something more if they ever get a chance to start.

    There are a lot of similarities between Freeman and Glennon. Maybe I’ve misjudged him a bit, but I still don’t believe he’s here to replace Freeman next year. Why?

    Because the QB class will be better next year and if Freeman bombs, we’ll have a chance at one of the better ones. It’s that simple.

    That’s why I think this wasn’t about Freeman, it was about Dan-o. The media loves a story, so they are blowing things out of proportion and feeding the Josh Haters but I just don’t believe it.

    Freeman is clearly a better QB than any the Bucs have had. ANY. Does this mean he’s good enough? Maybe not. Maybe so. But I do believe if they were not sure, they would go after someone next year ratheer than this year.

  14. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    bucfanjeff Says:
    “Why does it have to be “either or”? Why can’t it be both?”

    This is exactly what I think it is.

  15. Vern4499 Says:

    I guess the redskins didn’t believe Griffin couldn’t get them to the playoffs last year when they drafted Cousins after giving up 3 #1′s for Griffin. That’s wild. freeman is and will be the QB in my opinion. I believe he will show us all that.

  16. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    Upon reflection, bucfanjeff, I think wemiht be wrong. There is only a 2 year difference in ages between Freeman and Glennon. If they wanted him to groom ike Rodgers, he woul be a least 5 years younger than Josh I think.

  17. BuccaneerBonzai Says:

    From PFT:

    The Buccaneers had a clear need for some quarterback help in the draft, but they’re trying to make it clear that Mike Glennon was chosen as depth, not as an immediate replacement for Josh Freeman.

    “I think that’s hard with any rookie quarterback,” Buccaneers coach Greg Schiano said, via the team’s official website. “It’s going to be a matter of how fast he grasps our system and all those things.

    “And the fact of the matter is, we have a starting quarterback.”

  18. J 2.0 Says:

    In other news, Eli Manning is in the “hot seat” because the Giants drafted Ryan Nassib. Ben Roethlesberger (or however it is spelled) is also in the “hot seat” with the arrival of Landry Jones. Also Tom Brady has barely hung on to his job by reaching the Super Bowl and the AFC Championship the past 2 years when the Patriots drafted Ryan Mallett.

    Or maybe everyone should knock it off. Freeman will be the QB for the Bucs for many years to come.

  19. Gus Says:

    @couch fan you hope freeman stinks this year! What! So your saying you don’t want the bucs to make the playoffs! I hope Freeman has a career year. If not then I hope Glennon is the man! Back whoever the starting quarterbacks of the buccaneers! Go Bucs!

  20. Gus Says:

    @bucfanjeff it’s exactly rg3 and cousins

  21. Couch Fan Says:

    @Gus

    Couch Fan Says:
    April 30th, 2013 at 10:18 am
    sorry thats suppose to say (and im NOT hoping this happens)

  22. Andrew 2 Says:

    Im so glad I dont live in Tampa…I would unload on the first freeman hater i saw and make him look stupid in front of his family, friends, at his kids birthday party. IDC

    Freman Hater’s need a little perspective with their #5 Haterade.

    Wins-Losses are the result of the team, all players all coaches combined. To judge one player by wins-losses regardless of how he played is IDIOTIC.

    Josh has been the full-time starter for 3 years. His numbers were top 10 in 2010 and again in 2012, they also were top 10 for the combined period of 2010-2012(3 seasons)….that is amazing for a player of his age, and especially with the lack of talent in 2010 and 2011.

    He owns or will own early in 2013 every major franchise passing record there is…and has done so in way less games than those who held the records previously.

    We had the highest scoring offense in FRANCHISE HISTORY LAST YEAR and people want to run him out the door? Are they blind, dumb, ignorant or all 3? If you think Josh had nothing to do with, please put down the drugs.

    The man has been the full-time starter for 3 seasons. 2 of those are the best 2 a QB has had in franchise history go look it up.

    Last season if you take away his two bad games, he threw for 26 tds 9 ints in 14 games. There isn’t a player on this team that didn’t have 2 bad games, not one.

    What about interceptions? Because thats all these people can bring up when you put the facts in their face. Guess what. In 2010-2012(Josh’s time as a full time starter) do you know who had the most interceptions? A man named Eli Manning, number 2 is a guy named Drew Brees…theyre both pretty good with 3 Super Bowls and SB MVPS between the 2 of them in the last 6 seasons.

    GET REAL PEOPLE….HELLLLOOOOOOOOOO

  23. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    Wow, talk about considerably high praise for Glennon. I don’t think I respect many people’s opinion more than Cosell’s. He thought Glennon was the best in the draft (which makes me laugh really hard at the Jets) and that he could have gone in the first? Dom’s comment about Glennon being too good to pass up makes even more sense now.

    I am just glad to have a legitimate contingency plan in case Freeman gets injured or plays poorly. I am liking the pick more and more.

  24. Sneedy16 Says:

    @Couch Fan

    I do not understand your reasoning for wanting a losing season. If Freeman stinks then you will rely on a rookie QB who has freeman like qualities to take over.. Not making the playoffs is not worth it.

  25. Sneedy16 Says:

    My bad Couch didn’t see your reply to Gus.

  26. Stephen Says:

    So let me get this straight… The Bucs spend a mid-round pick on a QB from NC State (who by all accounts appears to be a Josh Freeman clone – only whiter) and now the guy who owns basically all the passing records in Bucs franchise history is supposed to be looking over his shoulder for 2013?

    No. That’s dumb.

    Josh will get THE chance (not A chance) to be the guy one more time this year and lock up a long-term extension, with us now actually having someone on the roster who can throw a deep ball to V-Jax just in case Free gets kneecapped on a scramble. Dan Orlovsky is still going to be a mentor to both of these kids, very much like Ronde Barber should be if he comes back. Lord help us if Dan-O ever takes the field. We’d be completely sunk.

  27. Buc Fan #238 Says:

    Great find Joe!!!

  28. Stanglassman Says:

    I remember seeing this video and thinking of it when the Bucs moved up to get him. The brass must have been pissed at this guy for driving up Glennon’s stock perception. The last time I saw a QB orchestrate a 4th quarter comeback on FSU like he did was Favre in ’89 with univ S. Miss I hope all the fans who are scratching their heads wondering why the Bucs took this guy in the 3rd see this so they at least see a professional’s perspective.

    Farve: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-TIP-rcn9Q

    Glennon: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_V6sH2FktUc

  29. Fritz50 Says:

    “Freman Hater’s need a little perspective ”

    Your post brings up a lot of good points, but, I don’t think it’s ‘Hating’ to be upset with the bonehead plays Free comes up with every game. All in all I think you’re right, & Free isn’t going anywhere. Saw quite a few such plays from a guy named Favre, too, in his day.

  30. Joe Says:

    J 2.0:

    There’s just a wee, little issue with your premise.

    Tom Brady = three Super Bowl rings/five Super Bowl appearances.

    Ben Roethlisberger = two Super Bowl rings/three Super Bowl appearances/four AFC championship appearances.

    Eli Manning = two Super Bowl rings in as many games.

    Josh Freeman = zero playoff appearances.

    Other than that, carry on.

  31. tye Says:

    The more I hear about Glennon, the more I believe that HOPE for the Bucs near future may have come… Of course it is all only talk until he can get his chance to show it! Bucs Preseason games have become more intriguing.

  32. Andrew 2 Says:

    @admin
    playoffs, super bowls and wins are team results not a single player

    Josh Freeman should be judged on what he does not the team as a whole.

    You don’t penalize a single offensive player for what the defense does or what the entire team does.

    By your premise we have no good players on the team and should get rid of them all.

    COMPLETELY WRONG TRY AGAIN

  33. Buc Fan #238 Says:

    Who is being penalized?

  34. Buc Fan #238 Says:

    Adding a back-up QB that will drive competition is “being penalized”?

  35. Andrew 2 Says:

    GUYS we have another STOP THE PRESSES moment

    apparently we can take team success/failure and pin it all on one guy

    apparently Ronde Barber by that logic is the worst player we have/had. I mean he’s been on the team for the last 10 seasons and we haven’t won a single game.

  36. crazy Says:

    Building depth at QB is wise regardless of what the Bucs expect from 5 in his contract year. The interesting thing about the Glennon pick is it suggests the decision to keep 5 in the pocket was no accident regardless of his above avg playmaking ability on the run. Clearly they want more Marino and less Moon.

  37. Joe Says:

    Andrew:

    apparently Ronde Barber by that logic is the worst player we have/had. I mean he’s been on the team for the last 10 seasons and we haven’t won a single game.

    Might want to lay off the bourbon this early in the day.

  38. Couch Fan Says:

    lol does anybody read? I corrected my typo!!

    Couch Fan Says:
    April 30th, 2013 at 10:18 am
    sorry thats suppose to say (and im NOT hoping this happens)

  39. lightningbuc Says:

    andy 2,

    A quick check at ESPN finds Freeman finished 2012 ranked #13 out of 17 NFC QBs in Total QB ratings. I’m judging him, not the Bucs, when I say he ain’t very good. It ain’t the inept secondary that caused his low ranking, in which he even finished behind Christian Ponder.

  40. Andrew 2 Says:

    @Joe…no bourbon and it’s not my logic…it’s yous and others…especially admin

    If wins-losses and team success/failure can be blamed on one person then Ronde is the worst player we have. He has lost as a Buccaneer more than any player here…probably 4 times as much as the next player.

    I personally would go off what said player has done on the field, but I’m in the minority apparently.

    The season has been over 4 months, I havent seen one article that showed statistically where Freeman was compared to the other QBs in the league….or even the 3 year span that he’s been the starter. Look it up, write it up. I feel compelled to tell both sides of the story.

  41. Joe Says:

    Andrew:

    I personally would go off what said player has done on the field, but I’m in the minority apparently.

    If you think Ronde was the worst player the past decade, Joe’s confident you are not just in the minority; you are a party of one.

  42. Couch Fan Says:

    Andrew 2

    you are really talking dumb. Freeman has played very well at times. But to deny has has played piss poor a lot of times as well is ridiculous. Theres no possible way anyone can justify thinking he’s the long term answer as of right now. Clearly Dom and Schiano arent convinced. Neither do most of the media. I respect your opinion but stop talking like an idiot. lol Ronde Barber? I cant believe you even said that LMAO. Hilarious

  43. Andrew 2 Says:

    that is not my logic joe…it is yours

    take you’re logic in the comment to J2.0, use that logic on Ronde Barber and see what you get

    I clearly don’t believe Ronde is the worst player we have, I judge Ronde on what Ronde has done…not the entire team….same as I judge Freeman on what Freeman has done not the entire team.

  44. Couch Fan Says:

    And statistics are just as over rated as Win/Loss record

  45. Joe Says:

    Couch:

    And statistics are just as over rated as Win/Loss record

    Sadly, win-loss record is really the only stat that counts. :(

    Other than rings, of course.

  46. Couch Fan Says:

    Exactly Joe. But I can understand the argument that Wins and Losses are a team effort. So I just judge by the persons actual play on the field. Personally, I have never been impressed with Freeman. He starts out mostly every game extremely slow, only to make a small 2nd half comeback, usually ending in a close loss.

  47. Andrew 2 Says:

    ^^^those are for a team….not for a player

    “Sadly, win-loss record is really the only stat that counts.

    Other than rings, of course.”
    ^^^Apply this to Ronde Barber over the last 10 years and what do you have? How has Ronde played over the last 10 years on those merits?

  48. Andrew 2 Says:

    “Sadly, win-loss record is really the only stat that counts.

    Other than rings, of course”

    How about Tony Gonzales and all those bad teams he was on in KC? How does he fair given this criteria? Dan Marino?

  49. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @Andrew 2

    I see what your trying to do and I understand. Freeman has done enough for us to make the playoffs more than once but the rest of the team has let him down. Despite this Freeman, at least publicly, still shoulders most of the blame for not making the playoffs whether it really is his fault or not. This is because of how QB driven this league is now. If we make the playoffs this year he will most likely receive a disproportionate amount of praise so it really goes both ways.

    Also, attacking Ronde Barber is definitely not the way to go to make your point. (Whether it legitimately works to prove your point or not.) I would drop that argument.

    No amount of talking/commenting will convince the haters. You really just have to let Freeman prove it one way or the other. I think he can do it but only time will tell.

  50. Andrew 2 Says:

    Aaron Ross has 2 super bowl rings
    Ronde has 1

    Ronde is clearly the better player, rings are a measure of a team.

    Joe Flacco and Colin Kaepernick were not the two best QBs…Ravens and Niners were the two best teams

  51. PRBucFan Says:

    It is what it is!!!

    Freeman either proves that he can get past the JekyllHyde Act or he’s gone and we start the Glennon Era unless somehow without trying a high profile QB falls to us haha.

    This should speak volumes to the Free homers in denial.
    You say Free isn’t accountable for anything at all, there’s always an excuse???
    Clearly the FO thinks otherwise ;)

  52. Architek Says:

    @Andrew 2
    Let me give you some advice here. Lay off the caffeine and posts logical arguments here because the Freeman debate is a foregone conclusion around here.

    We have all agreed to disagree. You’re not going to get much action with this debate as you are one year late. Freeman is who he is and thats the truth. The Bucs made a brilliant move in drafting Glennon for the franchise interests, period. Any solid organization won’t have a bottleneck or a single point of failure.

    Whatever your perception is concerning Freeman is all arguable because he’s inconsistent at best. Somewhere deep down we wich him the best but this a results driven business and Freeman is not a winner (even based on his record).

    Facts are the facts.

  53. Andrew 2 Says:

    LET ME SAY THIS ONE MORE TIME, I love Ronde, I think very highly of Ronde

    using logic of W-L, playoff wins and SBs to look at Ronde over the past 10 years would say he is….????

  54. the_buc_realist Says:

    Freeman’s and the Pop-star’s seats are so hot that they are on Fire!

  55. PRBucFan Says:

    Bla blah blah none of that has to do with Freeman and his circumstance.

    Two different individuals, different circumstances, positions, & eras.

  56. stevek Says:

    Andrew 2,

    Foolish argument, dude.

    Ronde is a beast, and a HOF DB.

    Freeman is a coin flip performer, and he has this year to hone in consistency, or HE GONE!

    Enough with the blubbering about how great Freeman is.

    Ronde won a SB, and he might have had another if Josh Freeman was 12 the QB Brad Johnson was… on a CONSISTENT basis.

    Nice try, slugger, but get real and get real quick.

    Freeman’s franchise best year, is a mirage of sh!tty QB play in Tampa.

    Freeman has exactly 16 games to qualify our team in the Top 6 of the NFC this year (playoffs). No playoffs, no pay day.

  57. stevek Says:

    Andrew 2,

    QBs are different than CBs.

    Does Ronde get to call the audibles, take the snaps, and MISS THE EASY THROWS Josh does?

    No sir, so stop with that BS argument lol, brutal!

  58. Couch Fan Says:

    How in the world can someone do “enough” to get us to the playoffs… if we didnt actually go to the playoffs? Clearly he didnt do enough. Yes, the defense was bad but given that, if he did enough, he would of took us to the playoffs…. Thats like saying, i should of won the lotto because i had 3 numbers instead of 6.

  59. PRBucFan Says:

    Again, Clearly Freeman is not as untouchable as you thought..

  60. Vern4499 Says:

    I now live 30 miles west of Baltimore. All Last Season Ravens fans were screaming for Flacco’s head. He lost 4 of his teams last 5 regular season games. People here couldn’t stand him. Obviously those people were wrong. I hope that doesn’t happen in Tampa. I believe with a top 15-20 defense we easily win 10-11 games last year. I also think Free will get the job done. Playoffs 2013 at Raymond James.

  61. PRBucFan Says:

    Funny thing is your right I’m from Bmore and that’s the exact truth.

    My bestfriend turned on Flacco but I did not and as crazy or however untrue it may seem I told him Flacco would take em the whole way this time and he did lol. I suppose the reason I believed in Flacco and don’t believe in Josh much is because Flacco has always been consistent when it comes to what he puts out on the field. Josh not so much.

  62. Oil Derrick Brooks Says:

    I don’t dislike Freeman, but, I am also not 100% sold on him either. And, I think that’s the biggest thing. Going into his 5th year, you would think you would have a clearer picture on the guy, right?

    As others have said, it’s all on him this year. I would love nothing more than to get Flacco’d, and be into him for a huge extension. But, no more excuses. He has a line, receivers, and a RB that many QBs would be very jealous of. Just be consistent. Can’t tank it for long stretches anymore.

    There’s no sacred cows in Tampa (I’m ignoring Myron Lewis). Earn it, or move over for the next guy, whoever that may be.

  63. Architek Says:

    I tried to warn you Andrew 2 but now you’re going to see why I tried to offer advice.

    -Using Ronde was poor choice

    -Reopening a concluded argument was unwise gesture

    -Your supportive information isn’t strong enough to sway the majority

    Just let it die dude, lick your wounds and go to another thread.

  64. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @Couch Fan

    Freeman did enough in 2010 and 2012 to get us to the playoffs. Enough meaning that he did all that could be expected (and possibly more) of a QB his age with his amount of experience and supporting cast. If Freeman performs identical to last year but with a better defense then we are playoff bound. It wasn’t great but it was ENOUGH. It could be better but it was not the reason we didn’t make the playoffs or have a winning record.

    If Freeman performs at last years level with zero decline and our defense improves then we make the playoffs and ensure Freeman’s future as a Buccaneer. If not, Freeman gets the boot and in comes the, GULP, Glennon era.

  65. TBSwarm Says:

    This year should be much better for Freeman, year 2 in the same scheme and Off players (VJax, Doug, etc).

    If we don’t make it to the playoff, I think Freeman is still our QB, but his extension is not going to be worth near as much at it would have been.

    If its more of the same in 2015, I think we start seeing Glennon (see Aaron Rodgers as back-up for 2 years)

  66. stevek Says:

    West Coast Bucs Fan,

    Freeman did not perform well enough in 2012 to take us to the playoffs.

    He bombed out for 4-5 games, while being 6-4, and in the hunt.

    Freeman is physically gifted, and he has 16 games this year to put it all together.

  67. Couch Fan Says:

    I disagree, enough would of been playing 4 consistant quarters of every game. That would of been all he could do. Doing enough to take us to the playoffs would of took us to the playoffs. 4000 yards look real pretty on paper but as you see the result on the field dont match. If he has another 3 or 4 game stretch of really bad play again this season, we wont make the playoffs again. I guess our idea of “enough” is completely different. You can use the defense as an escape goat all you want to but that doesnt excuse his poor play and to me thats not enough. Did the defense’s bad play factor into the season Win/Loss record? Absolutely but so does Freemans eratic play.

  68. Vern4499 Says:

    @stevek,

    He bombed out in 4/5 games? Come on Steve, I’ll give you 2 for sure. Saints and Rams. But 4-5 no way. And the defense was just as bad in those 2 games. But I’ll put them on Freeman but you can’t honestly put the rest on him. That laughable.

  69. PRBucFan Says:

    Round and round we go,
    Where we land?
    We ALL know…

    It is what it is, it’s now or never Free Free

  70. Couch Fan Says:

    @Vern

    Dont forget the Dallas game. He was awful. Defense wasnt much better but Free’s play was pretty uninspiring.

  71. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @stevek

    So, your saying there is no possible way the Bucs make the playoffs with a top 20 pass defense last year? Zero chance? There wasn’t four games that could have been a win instead of a loss if a 4th quarter lead hadn’t been blown?

    Okay.

    Real quick though. Is this a make or break year for Freeman? Does he have to perform well enough to get us to the playoffs? We need to be in the top “what” number of teams to make the playoffs?

    Im sorry stevek but you are really starting to sound like a broken record with your sign offs at the end of every post. The things you say may be true but repeating them doesn’t make them more true.

    We get it.

    Dom needs this team to make the playoffs. Freeman needs this team to make the playoffs. Or they are gone.

    @Couch fan

    I guess we have to agree to disagree. Every QB has consistency issues but when you look at the best QBs in the league they usually maintain some level of continuity in the coaching staff. Freeman was far from spectacular but was hardly the reason for our losing season. He could have been better but when you have a unit on the other side of the ball that threatens an all-time NFL record for futility then I think we can point most of the blame in that general direction.

  72. Vern4499 Says:

    @couch,

    Please find me 1 QB in this league that played 4 consistent quarters every game. YOU CANNOT DO IT!!!

  73. Vern4499 Says:

    @couch,

    I’ll give you the Dallas game. But Steve said 4-5 games to end the season. So that’s 3 games out of 16. If the defense was even decent we win 10-11.

  74. stevek Says:

    West Coast,

    2012 is done, finido, gone.

    Last I checked, Freeman wasn’t good enough to even finish .500, let alone get us in the playoffs.

    How did Freeman have the 2010 season he had, and he is no better today, but the team around him sure is?

    2013 is the true test for Josh. Toughen up, play consistent, or HE GONE!

  75. stevek Says:

    Vern4499,

    I can think of about 6 NFC QBs, and 6 AFC QBs that played “more consistent” than Freeman.

    The best example is Mr. Andrew Dalton, the 2nd year feiry red headed veteran is coming off a 27/17 TD-INT ration, 4k yards passing, and 2 CONSECUTIVE PLAYOFF APPEARANCES.

    No playoffs= a Josh Freeman lay off.

  76. stevek Says:

    West Coast Buc Fan,

    Great QBs are far and few between. We did not have a “true leader” at the QB position (with Freeman there).

    Freeman needs to step it up, and fight adversity.

    We can’t sit around spoon feeding him excuse after excuse.

    Newsflash: Freeman has had 55 starts, but isn’t one bit better than he was in 2010.

    Can he look off a receiver, read a defense, or avoid crapping his pants when his radio goes out with the game on the line?

    I am still waiting to see Freeman take the next step, as a bonafyde leader.

    Wait for it, wait for it, waiting….. 55 starts later- it is officially put up or shut up time.

  77. Vern4499 Says:

    @stevek,

    So Dalton’s #’s are good enough to get to the playoffs but Frees aren’t?(you want to bring up stats) the difference is you can’t compare Dalton’s defense to Frees. Because frees was HIDEOUS!!! Give Free that same defense and he leads his team to the playoffs.

  78. jimmy Says:

    Andrew:

    re: Freeman/Ronde debate:

    This may be the most asinine argument I’ve ever seen, probably because I am sober and haven’t pulled from the bong lately.

    So you are saying a cornerback has as much or more impact into a game than a quarterback?

    A quarterback touches the ball every time the ball is snapped. The direction of the offense is directly in his hands.

    A cornerback may go for games without touching the ball.

    Andrew, you are truly a special kind of idiot. My compliments.

  79. Couch Fan Says:

    Come on now yous are Nit picking my words. All I’m saying is a consistant Josh Freeman gets us in the playoffs last year despite the mediocre defense we had. If you are trying to tell me Josh played consistant enough to get us in the playoffs then pass me whatever it is you are smoking.

    If Free played the first half of games the same way (or even close) he plays the 2nd half. He would be top 5 QB in the league and we would be in the playoffs with a bad defense. But as of right now. No QB and NO team in the league can win with a QB that only shows up for half a game. I dont care how good there defense is.

    But ill end the debating now sense for some reason youl want to keep bringing up the defense instead of staying on point. Like SteveK said, there will be no excuses this year. The defense has nowhere to go but up. It’s all on Josh.

  80. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @stevek

    Vern beat me to it. Dalton had a top ten defense to work with. Comparison over because that is the entirety of my argument. Not all QBs turn into all pro signal callers. We don’t need Freeman to turn into a “bonafyde leader”. We need him to be a little more consistent and not be the reason we lose games. It would be nice if he turned into a top five QB but he isn’t a failed QB that needs to be replaced if he doesn’t.

    it is officially put up or shut up time.

    Ugh.

    @Couch Fan

    Calling the defense last year “mediocre” is an exaggeration, a compliment even. The defense was nothing short of horrendous.

  81. lightningbuc Says:

    A lot of “if’s” and “but’s” in this thread.

    IF Grandma had balls she’d be Grandpa. BUT she doesn’t, so she’s Grandma.

  82. Buc Fan #238 Says:

    If the Bucs re-sign Freeman to a bottom 5, small contract after failing to make the playoffs… that would be okay with me.

  83. Buc Fan #238 Says:

    stevek… OF those 55 starts, how many were actually on TV? How many did any of us see? Some of these guys don’t know how bad he really is.

    :-)

  84. Couch Fan Says:

    lol good point Buc Fan. Never thought of that.

  85. Andrew 1 Says:

    I too really like Glennon. I am going to stick my neck out a little bit and say that in a couple of years he is going to be a starter, either for our team or for somebody else. what he does with that opportunity is anybodies guess.

  86. Andrew 1 Says:

    in the mean time he can sit on the bench and learn as much as he can.

  87. Red86 Says:

    Freeman is the best qb that played for us for an extended period of time. It’s a big mistake to even think about replacing him. It would be a big step backward. Especially, Freeman being a key part of the best offense performance the Bucs ever had. ( If you say Steve Young, then he proves the point that W/L is based on teams talents and playing together. Admit it. Tampa Sucked then during Steve Young days in Tampa.)

    No Freeman isn’t perfect, but there is not one qb that is perfect. All qbs has slow starts. All qbs miss throws. All qbs throws ints. All qbs have struggles. They all need the whole team to show up and play good. The last ATL game is a perfect example of what this team can become if everyone shows up.

    Here what so hypocritical about qbs debate on a national scale. Many think Farve is one of the best qbs ever. Farve is the leader of the most overall ints thrown in a career. He haven’t won another championship after the great defense which Reggie White was apart of. Farve is absolutely a reckless qb and it caused them to lose more often than win.

    Freeman is far from playing like Farve…nor do I wish he did. Freeman have some minor but correctable flaws in his game. It’s well documented. But, Freeman has the ability to be Marino once he correct them and get comfortable and confident in correcting his flaws.

    This is why I say Freeman is like Marino. http://youtu.be/pTPFdn9uzj8 http://youtu.be/20O5gtEM_Zo

  88. stevek Says:

    The defense was the defense last year, consistently.

    Freeman was playing like an “All-Pro”, only to come crashing down to earth for 4-5 games, in which he stunk it up.

    I hold Freeman more accountable for bad play because of the talent he posseses. I would not be bellowing off if Freeman didn’t have the tools to do the job.

    Freeman is capable of much, much more. 2013 will be a great test to see how Freeman handles competition.

    Bottom line, if Freeman played up to his draft status, then we wouldn’t even be talking about “when is Glennon starting?”.

  89. stevek Says:

    Good Quarterbacks find a way into the playoffs.

    Good teams find their way into the playoffs.

    I think we have a good team, do we have a good QB?

  90. BucoBruce Says:

    Everyone should look up Grudens QB show with Glennon

  91. Daffy Buc Says:

    Free being so inconsistent, is the main reason Rockstar and NSO took a QB. We actually had a cupcake schedule last year compared to this years. 7 wins against KC, OAK, CAR twice, SD and an ATL team that wasn’t playing for anything.

    The only quality win was against MINN. If we played a harder schedule we would have been in the top five of the draft. I hope Free has a great year and we get to the playoffs, but if not we have a good option for 2014.

  92. Red86 Says:

    When I look at Glennon tapes. I think this guy could’ve be the top qb selected. If it wasn’t for the many drops by the receivers and te, then he would be first round. I just think that pick could’ve went to repairing the defense (another corner beside bank so we can get rid of the M. Lewis experiment.) or picking up a te. But He would be good trade bait or a solid backup.

  93. WestCoastBucsFan Says:

    @stevek

    Bottom line is he is still very young, regardless of experience. Consistency is the one, most difficult, skill that every QB in the NFL strives for. Peyton Manning, one of the best QBs to ever play the game, choked away the playoffs with an interception in overtime this past season. Even the best of the best have consistency issues. Manning has had how many years and he STILL has consistency “issues”? ALL NFL QBs struggle with consistency. Its a never ending challenge.

    Freeman gets this season to show he can be a little more consistent and not let his “lows” be game killers. This is obviously an important year for him and many people in the Buccaneers organization.

    “Good Quarterbacks find a way into the playoffs.

    Good teams find their way into the playoffs.”

    I guess the Giants are a bad team with a bad quarterback.

  94. PRBucFan Says:

    Where’s SilenceTheCritics when you need em lol

  95. BamBamBuc Says:

    Not that anything will ever change anyone’s mind about anything, I’ll throw this out there. Most of the discussion is about consistency and QB’s winning games or losing games for us. Well, here’s a couple things to think about…

    In the Dallas game last year, admittedly one of the poorer performances by Freeman, we only lost by 6. We were only down 3 going into the 4th qtr. Free had a chance to win the game, so let’s put the blame on him…. but wait. Doug Martin ran 19 times that game for only 53 yards. Why isn’t he responsible for getting more than 2.6 yards per carry to win the game for us? That was one of his poorer, inconsistent games. How about the D giving up a 78 yd drive for a FG, or special teams giving up a 44 yard punt return to set up another FG? Aren’t they responsible too? Weren’t their games inconsistent?

    We can look at the late season loss to the Rams as well. Freeman threw 4 picks in that game, but the first returned by Jenkins for the TD, didn’t Mike Williams slip on his route on that play? I don’t blame Free or MW, those things happen, but it sure looks bad. I can’t remember for sure, but was that Freeman in coverage on Kendricks when he ripped off an 80 yard TD reception against us? Yeah, I didn’t think so either…. 2 of his INTs were in the 2nd half, down by 15, attempting to bring the team back from behind. Not apologizing for the INTs, if they were TDs instead, we may have come back and won that game. However, circumstance didn’t work out that way that game. Of course, he has had 10 game winning drives, 9 were 4th quarter comebacks in his 57 NFL games played.

  96. jimmy Says:

    How many of you blockheads know that in four seasons, Freeman is 5-20 against teams with a winning record? That’s a .250 winning percentage against good teams.

    Yeah, real franchise quarterback.

    Kevin Kolb, anyone?

  97. Architek Says:

    I’m over all of this already can we please start regular-season so This guy can prove himself or not. I don’t care anymore one way or the other somethings going to happen either he will fail or he will succeed. One thing is for sure I’m tired of the excuses

  98. BucFan20 Says:

    Looks like a lot of people missed Doms’ statement about Glennon being able to hit all three levels. Then followed that by saying that’s important in our system. So was he saying Glennon does not throw the short dirt ball? The big thing that caught me in that was All 3 Levels. And what have a lot of Freemans’ problem been? I hope he gets better. But I don’t think the team thinks there will be.

  99. BucSnob Says:

    Watch what Freeman does with an actual defense to hold those leads. By the way Colin Kaepernick better watch out too….they drafted B.J Daniels… There’s going to be some pissed off people when Freeman breaks…his own records!!!

  100. Bucs Fan #238 Says:

    Freeman has EARNED this competition.

  101. Couch Fan Says:

    @BucSnob

    I could careless what records Freeman breaks. Only record I would be interested in hearing about him breaking is all time wins record. Screw records. Just win baby!

  102. stevek Says:

    West Coast,

    The 2012 Giants were not a good team last year, and they still whipped our butts.

    Josh Freman did SQUADOOSH in the 2nd half.

    I just want to see his potential become bonafyde talent, after 55 starts it is logical to think one’s potential has been tapped. That is not good, if that is the case.

  103. PRBucFan Says:

    Just wanted to say that the Doug Martin comment about his lack of production in the Dallas game or early game is IMO seem off.

    It would normally make sense but he was a rookie and it wasn’t until after their bye week as its been well documented till he came on like demon on fire and never looked back.

  104. PRBucFan Says:

    IMO seems off*

  105. Andrew 1 Says:

    look at it this way, even if you think Freeman should have taken this team to the playoffs with one of the worst secondary in NFL history, what chances do you think the bucs had at getting to the super bowl while they were in the playoffs with that same terrible secondary? I say none. we would have been eliminated in the first round vs those playoff caliber teams with the secondary we had.

    no team would ever get to the super bowl with one of the worst secondaries of all time, I dont care what QB you have.

  106. Andrew 1 Says:

    that was directed at you, stevek.

  107. BamBamBuc Says:

    PR: Would it have helped if I pointed out that the other bad game Freeman had near the end of the season, against the Saints, Doug Martin had 9 carries for 16 yards, a 1.78 y/a? Why is that loss Freeman’s fault? Because of the 4 INTs? Sure, that’s bad, but we were already down 7 when he threw the first pick, down 10 when he threw the 2nd, 24 when he threw the 3rd, 31 on the 4th. Do you get the feeling that with only 9 rushing attempts, and being down by so much that the likelihood of throwing picks goes up as the team makes an effort to get back in the game?

  108. BamBamBuc Says:

    Oh yeah, that’s not to mention the D giving up 307 passing yards to Brees and 149 rushing yards (by the #1 run D, hmmm….)

  109. Andrew 1 Says:

    I know, it makes to much sense. I would like to see anybody answer that question differently than the obvious answer, which is no.

  110. PRBucFan Says:

    Your answer lies in the fact that it was a mere nine carries he had.

    Not Dougies fault.

    Anywho this little Free Free debate had been long dead.

    It is now or never. Either he takes us into glory or he shows us the return of JekyllHyde and we part ways. Now with some sense of security :)
    Your mr untouchable ain’t so untouchable : /

  111. BamBamBuc Says:

    So, wait… if we make the playoffs, if we may even win some playoff games… Free gets all the credit? All of a sudden he’s a superhero? Even if we have the #1 rush offense, and #1 overall defense in the league, right? Free gets the credit, right? Coz I don’t wanna hear all these excuses about how the rest of the team carried him, when it’s been all his fault so far…

  112. Bobby Says:

    Am I mistaken or did we not have the lead in the final plays of the Giants, Redskins, Atlanta, and Eagles games? The defense blew those games. That’s 4 games and they were NOT Freeman’s fault. We should have been 10-6. That’s ‘Playoffs’ so yes, Freeman has done enough to get us to the playoffs. Now that the pass defense is fixed and our O-line is healthy I expect us to be 11-5 this year.

  113. Andrew 1 Says:

    @ Bobby

    try telling that to the Freeman haters and you will find that it just doesn’t register with them. for them it goes in one year and out the other.

  114. Andrew 1 Says:

    * one ear and out the other.

  115. PRBucFan Says:

    Now or never, from JeykyllHyde to MrConsistancy is what we need!!!

  116. Couch Fan Says:

    Bottom line is we didnt make the playoffs. So no, the defense did not do enough to make it to the playoffs and neither did Freeman. The Freeman Jock riders can make all the excuses you want to. Blame whoever you want. But bottom line is Freeman wasnt good enough and neither was the defense.

    But keep riding his jock lets see if thatll make him play harder. if not he’ll be gone by this time next year.

    One thing is for sure. Defense wont be an excuse next year.

  117. Bucs Fan #238 Says:

    The Glazers fixed their first big mistake in making Mark Dominik fire Raheem Morris.

    The final clean-up job will be to make Greg Schiano bench Josh Freeman.

    I can’t wait for the phone call to the sidelines… “Greg, bench him now. We only pay the BEST players at each position. Freeman is like the 25th best in the NFL QB rank. We refuse to overpay the 25th best QB in the league.”

 
 

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