Defense May Get Worse Before Improving

July 22nd, 2010
Those expecting Gerald McCoy to turn around the Bucs defense may be expecting too much too soon.

Those expecting Gerald McCoy to turn around the Bucs defense may be expecting too much too soon.

While Joe has high hopes for the Bucs defense and is generally excited about the two rookie defensive tackles Mark Dominik drafted last April, Joe knows, and is generally frightened, that the Bucs are relying too heavily on too many rookies.

Seems as though good guy and semi-regular (?) Joe reader Tom Jones of the St. Petersburg Times agrees with Joe. In a recent live chat on his paper’s site, Jones pointed out that the Bucs defense could take a step back while waiting for the rooks to season.

dspkabledspkable:
2 rookie DT’s mean some growing pains on the D-line. Will we suffer more in the run defense or QB pressures as these guys get their feet wet?

Tom Jones:
Good analysis. You’re right. There will be some growing pains for sure. When you talk to football people, they always say (somewhat surprisingly) that it’s more difficult to adjust to playing run defense than pass defense. Pass defense is simple: lower your head and go after the quarterback. But run defense takes discipline to stay in your gaps, etc. So, I would say run defense could be an issue more than pass defense in the early going for the young DTs.

As Pat Kirwan of NFL.com and Sirius NFL Radio has pointed out, rookie defensive tackles struggle more often than they shine.

In short, if Gerald McCoy and/or Brian Price can rack up 30 tackles and three sacks, for a rookie, those are good numbers and will be a good season.

84 Responses to “Defense May Get Worse Before Improving”

  1. Matt Says:

    Yes, but you must realize that these rookie DTs, even performing at nowhere near the level they are capable of, should still be equal to the obvious-backup vets they are replacing.

  2. FIRE GREG OLSON! Says:

    Geez Joe, this blog has become an emotional roller coaster…lol

  3. nick Says:

    Well, that’s when management comes into play. Put these guys in situations to succeed

  4. eric Says:

    Getting worse is the forte of the current regime.

  5. JimBuc Says:

    Eric — the world does not come to an end at the conslusion of the 2010 season. Pretty sure that most REASONABLE people would see Miller, McCoy and Price as a HUGE upgrade over Sims and Hovan.The young DTs will struggle this year, but thankfully this season is not the last season ever for the NFL. Anyway, I might even go so far as to say that there situational struggles (gap integrity etc) may be offset, in part, by youth and strength and speed. Pretty sure Hovan and Sims knew what gap they were supposed to fill last year, but that does not mean they were able to stay in the gap.

    Eric — did I see you recently on the corner of Westhore and Kennedy? Holding a sign that said “REPENT, THE END IS NEAR”?

  6. Not a Rocket Surgeon Says:

    I don’t see Miller struggling this year…

    That’s just me though.

  7. Joe Says:

    Not a Rocket Surgeon:

    Roy Miller is no longer a rookie.

  8. Not a Rocket Surgeon Says:

    Thanks for the newsflash Joe… ;) lol

    I was referring to JimBuc’s post.

  9. sgw94 Says:

    Pass rushing is simple?

    LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

  10. Aldo Says:

    @swg94

    i was thinking the same!!!!!

  11. oar Says:

    Mr. White,
    Come on, of course it’s simple! Haven’t you ever played before? LOL!!!!!

  12. Patrick Says:

    Even though McCoy and Price are going to be in their rookie seasons, I don’t see how they could be worse than Sims or Hovan even during their first year.

    2009: Hovan had 26 total tackles, and only 0.5 sacks.

    Sims had 25 total tackles, and only 1 sack. 1.5 sacks combined!

  13. eric Says:

    That Sapp “ghost” move must have been a walk in the park!

  14. Louie the HATER! Says:

    “Pretty sure that most REASONABLE people would see Miller, McCoy and Price as a HUGE upgrade over Sims and Hovan”

    If Miller is such an upgrade, how come he couldn’t crack the starting lineup last year?

    I’m not sure who “most REASONABLE people” are, but since McCoy and Price have never played a down (and Miller didn’t crack the starting line-up last year), it’s a little risky to state they will be a HUGE upgrade over the veterans. Had The Dream decided not to completely change the scheme last year, I think those veterans would have had a lot better year.

  15. McBuc Says:

    Patrick…I agree, even with mediocre rookie numbers, we will be in the same spot. I think we will see an exception to the rookie rule…mostly based on the poor oplay of last years vets.

  16. oar Says:

    Not saying Simms or Hovan were great, but gaining extra weight and playing in a new defensive scheme probablly didn’t help with their play or production last year either.

  17. oar Says:

    oops “Sims”

  18. eric Says:

    Hey, if they keep the Panther running backs from running through the line like a hot knife through butter, hats off to them.

    Im hoping that will occur prior to the 2014 season.

    Be nice to se it in week number 2!

  19. McBuc Says:

    OAR…good point. We can say that all over the field as well.

  20. eric Says:

    If we merely return to the same spot that is 32nd in the league in stopping the run!

    Surely the superstars we drafted in the best draft of all time, where second rounders are first rounders, can do better than that!

  21. BamBamBuc Says:

    Louie: “If Miller is such an upgrade, how come he couldn’t crack the starting lineup last year? ”

    Let’s see… maybe because his stats were better “as a rookie” than the vets. He had 33 tackles and 2 sacks. Yes, as a rookie. That is according to NFL.com.

    According to NFL.com, Hovan had 33 tackles, 0.5 sack and Sims had 33 tackles and 1.0 sack.

    That said… and Miller being a 3rd round draft choice… it would stand to reason that a 1st round draft choice and a 2nd round draft choice should have at least similar numbers that the rookie 3rd round draft choice had last year, which was better than the 2 vets had last year.

    As for Miller not cracking the starting lineup, it just shows that he outplayed the vets in a part-time role. According to ProFootballFocus.com Hovan was in on 776 plays, Sims on 623, and Miller on 473. As a rookie 3rd round draft choice. And still had slightly better stats. It also shows why Hovan is now a Saint, not a Buc, and why Sims will probably be a free agent if he’s not careful.

    For anyone that is “generally frightened” about two rookie DTs and a 2nd year guy rotating, just look above at what our vets did last year. You should be a little more at ease knowing that it won’t be all that tough to improve upon their numbers (or at least not get any worse).

  22. BamBamBuc Says:

    Sorry, Louie, grabbed the wrong quote…. it was more about what you said after that… about “reasonable people” and how risky it would be to state they’ll be a HUGE upgrade over the vets we had. I don’t see a lot of risk…

  23. JimBuc Says:

    Louie — thanks for pointing out where you fit in on the reasonableness scale.

  24. gruss222 Says:

    Joe,

    “Defense may get worse before it gets better”

    “The disturbing numbers of Michael Clayton”

    “Brian Price feeling the heat”

    “Bucs not among wave of next probowlers”

    “Bucs tagged as worst team in NFL”

    Between Joe and the negative trash that is written within this blog you would think that your all wearing Eagles jerseys behind your computer screens. Is there nothing at all positive that any of you “so called Bucs fans”, including this “JoeBucsFan” blog that can be written about or commented on? Joe, I think you average more advertisement post than positive research. The entire site has become a “where can I find the next negative comment to post and quote some flunky for making so as to not take the blame for saying it myself”!

    To the true Buc fans; keep the hopes alive and looking toward the future.

    To the rest of you worthless, constantly negative butt wipes; suck a Crawford injury!!!!

  25. Gary Says:

    BamBam,

    I do feel better after reading that. I felt the same as many others in that rookies would have been better than the starters last year, but its nice to have the numbers. Thanks for the research.

  26. admin Says:

    Joe here,

    Gruss222 – You are simply way off base. And that’s fact, not the fiction you are spewing. You might want to work on your reading skills, as opposed to the simple headline reading skills you couple with your negative attitude.

    The “Brian Price feeling the heat” post was a very uplifting positive message about the kid already being in Tampa trying to adjust to the humidity so he’s ready to rip people’s heads off in training camp.

    And the post about the “Bucs not among Pro Bowlers” gave Joe a chance to disagree with the John Clayton, of BSPN, who didn’t have Talib in his list of top up and comers.

    You, sir, are the negative person infecting this blog with your hatred.

  27. BamBamBuc Says:

    Good points, gruss….

  28. Gary Says:

    Gruss,

    Even if he did post something positive, it would turn into what every post turns into… a bucs/morris/glazer bash-fest.

    Hope the season will shut some of these guys up.

  29. Gary Says:

    Whoa, Joe got mad over that one. There wasn’t even the obligatory “keep visiting this site” reference.

  30. admin Says:

    Joe here,

    BamBamBuc – I hope you’ll read my comment that came in just before yours.

  31. Joe Says:

    gruss222:

    Is there nothing at all positive that any of you “so called Bucs fans”, including this “JoeBucsFan” blog that can be written about or commented on? Joe, I think you average more advertisement post than positive research.

    So you are suggesting there are more positives to a 3-13 team than negatives?

    Joe’s not Rachel Watson. If he sees something negative, he writes it. If he sees something positive, he writes it. Joe’s not going to bury his head in the sand.

    Perhaps you didn’t notice how Joe stuck up a little for Michael Clayton this morning? Perhaps earlier this week you didn’t read Joe take a writer to task for making outrageous allegations about Raheem the Dream? Or maybe you (conveniently) missed the post where Joe questioned the cry of the “Glazers are cheap” chant? You also failed to mention the posts where Joe interviewed beat writers from Champaign and Los Angeles which lauded Arrellious Benn and Brian Price, respectively?

    Every one of these posts were published this week. Why did you not site these examples? Likely because they didn’t fit your angry narrative, right?

    Interesting how you are so selective in your anti-Joe rants. But do carry on. :)

  32. BamBamBuc Says:

    I read it, Joe… and I agree about the Price article. Not so much about the Pro Bowl one, as it was twisted into more of a Bucs/Bengals matchup facing Antonio Bryant and how our rookie WRs will struggle against the future Pro Bowl Bengals DBs.

    So, you get credit for 1 out of 5 stories positive.

  33. BamBamBuc Says:

    It’s ok, Joe…. sure some of us would like to see more positive stuff, even if it’s pure speculation at this point. Actually, most of the negative stuff is pure speculation at this point too.

    Man, I can’t wait for training camp, but that’ll only bring more speculation…. BRING ON THE SEASON ALREADY!!!!

  34. Joe Says:

    There wasn’t even the obligatory “keep visiting this site” reference.

    Fixed. :)

  35. admin Says:

    Joe here,

    C’mon, BamBam, there’s lots of positive in the Pro Bowl story and nothing about the Bucs WRs struggling against the Bengals DBs, only that it’ll be a great test for them. So that’s 2 out of 5 in this example, which is pretty good when your team has won three out of its last 20.

    And this Gruss character conveniently left out the post about the value of the Bucs and the Glazers (allegedly he was going in order), which was all positive.

  36. Gary Says:

    LOL… Awesome Joe!

    I love it when you say that to people. It’s kinda like you saying “I own you! I know you will be back tomorrow, and the day after, and after….” cause you know we have to get our Bucs fix somehow right?

    Gruss, I’m sure there will some nice posts once we destroy the Browns!!!

  37. BucnJim Says:

    Complaints = Site Traffic! If someone has a problem they’ll return time and time again to further prove their dissatisfaction with a product or a service. If everyone here was a Pro-Buccaneer fan then it would be a boring place and no one would return. I usually like to throw in some stats to support my arguements, but it is fun to read the extreme views. Speaking of; did you guys send the Captain away or what? Whether you like him or not; he is one funny dude!

  38. Louie the HATER! Says:

    @BamBamBuc: I agree, Miller’s stats where better than the veteran’s. Then how come he sat the bench if he was clearly outplaying the other guys? I can only assume the coaching staff knew what they were doing and were sitting him because he wasn’t getting the job done in other areas.

    Hey, I want Miller, McCoy AND Price (all 3) to do well, but I’m taking a wait and see approach, unlike some others who are all gung ho about these young guys.

  39. eric Says:

    Ok, I am reformed, I will only say positive things about the bucs and the upcoming season.

    Uhhhhhhhhh………………………hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm………………let me think…………..got to be something……………..

    Ill get back to you on that!

  40. JimBuc Says:

    Joe called Gruss a” negative person infecting this blog with your hatred.”

    Talk about ironic . . .Joe, do you read the comments on your site??? Pretty sure that there are a few other candidates that were more suited for that label.

  41. admin Says:

    Joe here,

    JimBuc – Hatred of Joe carries more weight.

  42. BamBamBuc Says:

    I discount any article regarding owner finances. In the NFL, such things are really non-factors and neither positive or negative. In normal years (which I know this isn’t due to the CBA) teams have a salary floor and ceiling within which to keep their players and they receive revenue sharing of a greater amount than the salary cap. This means teams make money no matter what, and all teams have the same guidelines within which to work. I couldn’t care less if the Glazers are selling 3 houses and 5 cars to catch up on bills, so long as they’re still within NFL guidelines. This year (with no cap or floor), they are near the bottom (I believe I saw 2nd or 3rd from the bottom, but that will change with specific signings), but they are still in the vicinity of some other teams spending. It is what it is…

    I do understand why the articles are what they are though. It’s true, controversy and disagreement brings more traffic. Even a “positive” story about the Glazers finances would incite a litany of posts about how they’re still cheap, and that’s obviously known by those who run the site. Just mention Glazers and money and watch it go wild. Same goes for any mention of Gruden, Bryant, free agents, etc. I can’t blame you for bumping up the traffic a bit….it’s business, right?

  43. eric Says:

    Sometimes its hard to put a positive spin on stuff:

    Hindenburg Disaster
    Bay of Pigs
    Stock market crash
    2010 Bucs

    What’s a Joe(s) to do?

  44. BamBamBuc Says:

    When it’s all speculation about a future result, it’s no more difficult to put a positive spin than a negative one.

    Hindenburg disaster…. in the past, it’s over, of course it’s negative
    Bay of Pigs… in the past
    Stock market crash(es)… in the past, although you can put a positive or negative spin on the “future” of the market and the “potential” for Bull or Bear market.

    2010 Bucs… in the future… unknown… could be BAD… could be good… but it’s all speculation at this point.

    It’s like watching the news…. 3 car crashes, 4 arrests, a homicide, a hurricane, and a “feel good story”… they gotta throw that in there somewhere because we’d all be psychotic depressives if they didn’t…. but the negative stuff gets people to watch…

  45. oar Says:

    Whether you’re a professor positive or a negative nelly, one thing is that we share in common is we are all BUCS fans here.

  46. lightningbuc Says:

    Gee, if you want positive, uplifting, optimistic, goober-smooching fluff news 24/7 about the Bucs then go to buccaneers.com. When the economy is bad, I expect most of the news about the economy to be a tad negative. Likewise, when my team stinks, I expect a good majority of news pertaining to them to be negative as well until said team PROVES they no longer stink.

  47. oar Says:

    Bucnjim, As for CaptTim, I hope he didn’t go out on a three hour tour aboard his tiny ship(canoe).

  48. JimBuc Says:

    Joe said:

    “JimBuc – Hatred of Joe carries more weight.”

    So all hate was created equal, but some hate is more equal than others? Wow. In any event, I think maybe you missed part of Gruss’s comments because you seem to think he was tlaking about Joe, but Gruss also said this:

    “Between Joe and the negative trash that is written within this blog”

    Joe note that he used the word “AND” He is talking about the commentary. How about this one:

    “Is there nothing at all positive that any of you “so called Bucs fans”, including this “JoeBucsFan” blog that can be written about or commented on?”

    Joe note that he says “any of you” How about this one:

    “The entire site has become a “where can I find the next negative comment to post and quote some flunky for making so as to not take the blame for saying it myself”!”

    The “entire site.” I think he means commentary as well. Assuming he does, even you Joe would have to acknowledge that as far as the commentary goes Gruss is not very far off base. Now, to be fair it’s not unique to your site, most sports blog commentary is inane overly-negative drivel, but the negative stuff posted her (and other sites) is almost comical. I find it almost comical, but others like Gruss obviously do not.

  49. lightningbuc Says:

    I don’t think the Captain has posted since Joe ridiculed his annoying pirate speak. Thanks Joe!

  50. JimBuc Says:

    lightning bug — there is a HUGE difference beetween negative news and ridiculous negative commentary just for the sake of being negative. If you want to go see an example look at the Price signing article.

    In the Price singing article, Joe included one sentence that said that the early signing of Price put a “dent” in the theory that the Glazers are cheap. That one slightly positive comment brought out all the roaches. One huge roach actually suggested that the Glazers and Dom conspired to sign Price not because of his talent but because they knew they could take advantage of Price and his agent by getting them to sign a “cheap” contract. Come on now? Conspired ot take a guy because they could pull one over on him and his agent? WTF?

    By the way, Price signed for an 8% increase in GUARANTEED money over last year’s pick in the same spot

  51. lightningbuc Says:

    JimBuc,

    What is comical is how you broke down a post complete with an analysis of the word “and”. Bill Clinton could have used you when he was unsure of what the definition of “is” was!

  52. admin Says:

    Joe here,

    JimBuc – Joe assures you he didn’t miss anything.

  53. admin Says:

    Joe here,

    As for Capt. Tim, he did seem to disappear after Joe playfully slapped him for Piratespeak. …But the good Captain has not been banned. ..>That fate has only befallen a few people at most

  54. oar Says:

    Wonder if there is a job as comment analyst for JimBuc? He could pull part-time, so it wouldn’t interfere with his comment gaurdian against negative nelly’s job.

  55. McBuc Says:

    Gruss…Do not mistake the negative posters for the Joes (there are two of them if I remember right). This site has more information than any other Bucs site that I visit. Keep up the good work Joes.

    OAR…You are correct sir, we are all Bucs fans.

    BamBam…I am glad to see someone else living in the half full crowd. Eric will not change until the Bucs are at least at 9-7, but he does stir things up.

    Capt…Where are you? Ship wrecked?

  56. Joe Says:

    The “entire site.” I think he means commentary as well. Assuming he does, even you Joe would have to acknowledge that as far as the commentary goes Gruss is not very far off base. Now, to be fair it’s not unique to your site, most sports blog commentary is inane overly-negative drivel, but the negative stuff posted her (and other sites) is almost comical. I find it almost comical, but others like Gruss obviously do not.

    Come on JimBuc, you are not this naive.

    Did you seem to forget the Bucs were 3-13 last year? Ever hear the phrase “lipstick on a pig?”

    So Joe is supposed to be overtly positive about one of the worst teams in the league and still look at himself in the mirror? What, you think Joe is Rich Herrera?

    Joe calls it as he sees it. People don’t like it, too damn bad. Joe’s not an ostrich. Maybe the people mad at Joe because he’s not a cheerleader should direct their rage at the root of the problem: the team posting four times as many losses as wins and set a franchise record for consecutive games allowing 25 or more points. Last time Joe checked, he’s not the one who couldn’t block the wind, who couldn’t catch a cold, who couldn’t tackle a stop sign.

    People who want to curl up in their blankie and feel warm and fuzzy at night should go to the sites that market to such an audience such as Buccaneers.com and Pewter Report.

    If Joe’s going to whore himself out and give away any shred of credibility, at least he should be paid (well) for it.

    Given the fact Joe started with zero traffic two years ago and now has 50,000 unique visitors a month, Joe suspects people find Joe’s honesty refreshing and that Joe has struck a chord with the public at large.

    The fact Joe has received plenty of compliments from some very heavy hitters in the media industry who Joe respects, Joe believes he’s doing things quite correctly.

  57. Joe Says:

    Gruss…Do not mistake the negative posters for the Joes (there are two of them if I remember right). This site has more information than any other Bucs site that I visit. Keep up the good work Joes.

    You are right McBuc. Two Joes.

    Look, Joe wants the Bucs to win as much as anyone. But Joe’s not going to manufacture caca just to pacify the thumbsucking crowd.

    Joe has pointed out the many positive posts he’s had just this week. If people fail to see or read those, not much Joe can do.

    Thanks for the compliments man! Much appreciated. :)

  58. Joe Says:

    In the Price singing article, Joe included one sentence that said that the early signing of Price put a “dent” in the theory that the Glazers are cheap.

    Thank you JimBuc!

    [golf clap]

  59. oar Says:

    Amen Joe! Amen! Keep up the great work!

    As I’ve always said, don’t like it? Turn the channel or don’t read it or in this case don’t visit the site anymore.

  60. Joe Says:

    Thanks oar. Compliments are very much appreciated. And thank you for your long time devotion to Joe. :)

    Now, Joe has to go back to his real job and finish a project so he can go home.

  61. Radio Mushmouth Says:

    What would ever give you the crazy idea that our defense might get worse with two undersized rookies anchoring the middle of our defense next year??

    But whatever happens, just remember: It’s all a part of Radio’s 10 year rebuilding plan

  62. eric Says:

    I can’t fathom anybody questioning the Dream’s plans!

  63. BamBamBuc Says:

    “Did you seem to forget the Bucs were 3-13 last year?”

    No, haven’t forgotten.

    “So Joe is supposed to be overtly positive about one of the worst teams in the league and still look at himself in the mirror?”

    Overtly? Not necessarily, but ya gotta admit even the positive ones sound more negative based on the headlines. Read further, and it’s not so negative (until you get to the comments, not your fault). Beyond that, I would never consider the Buccaneers to be “one of the worst teams in the league”. Not even when they were winless the first year. They were my team, and I’ll always consider them THE best team in the league (with the understanding they can improve).

    “Maybe the people mad at Joe because he’s not a cheerleader should direct their rage at the root of the problem: the team posting four times as many losses as wins and set a franchise record for consecutive games allowing 25 or more points.”

    And we’re back to last year again. I know, I know… it’s the only actualy games we have to base anything off of. That doesn’t mean the team hasn’t improved. Maybe they have, maybe they haven’t… but I’m not looking back to last year, but forward to this year. Looking forward to two young men in the middle of the d-line, to two young WRs catching passes from Freeman, to competition at SS, to seeing how these guys perform with schemes in place from day 1, to watching Hayes/Black/Ruud come together and grow, to an O-line that is pretty well intact another year (assuming Penn signs), to Caddy continuing his amazing comeback from knee surgeries, to Stroughter and Peanut and Graham and all the others.

    Last year was last year. I didn’t like it any more than anyone else. I think we’ll be without a lot of the things the team went through last year, this year. Tanard’s suspension, Talib’s taxi cab fiasco, two coordinators fired, and on and on and on… Without those this year, it should be a better year already.

  64. eric Says:

    You make a good case Mr. BamBam, I hope you are right.

  65. BigMacAttack Says:

    Well if “No news is good news”, I’ll take the bad.

    BamBam always has a good argument backed up with facts. I don’t know about The Gruss Inuendo. Most of us just hate on each other or the circumstances surrounding this Buc experiment/work in progress/sort of/ rebuilding/ cost saving thing.

    Rarely does anyone hate on Joe. It’s his/their house. What kind of person walks in a man’s house, eats his food, drinks his wine, and then hates on him? Strange Brew.

    Whatever the case, we’ll all have plenty to bitch about (Eric, Thomas) if they lose, and plenty to cheer and be positive (the rest of JoeBuc Nation) if they win.

    I think the biggest thing we can have right now as Buc Fans is Hope. Hope they can stop the run and generate a pass rush. Hope they can hold opponents to less than 17 points per game. Hope these young WR’s can just bring it week in and week out. And Hope that at the end of the season we have at least 8 wins. I would call that successful. Raheem knows he has a lot to prove this year, and I hope like hell he does it.

  66. eric Says:

    If the dream takes the cards he has been dealt and gets 8 wins this year, he not only did a good job, but would be a good candidate for coach of the year.

    i’m sticking with 0-3 wins, but am hoping to be very pleasantly surprised.

  67. thomas Says:

    Hope is pussi-s!! Reality is for men.

    This team sucks, according to Randy Cross – 32nd out of 32nd. Nobody knows how well or poorly they drafted, they added no meaningful vets, the qb is unproven, the defense porous, the o-line inconsistent, then the coaching staff – so far one of the worst in history – blaming the coordinators, the Lefty debacle, switching defensive philosophies, offensive philosophies, in game management.

    Hell yes we are negative! 4 or 5 wins this year better not make anyone feel better unless you are one of those pansies that believe that you shouldnt keep score in little league games b/c someone shouldnt lose.

    Winning trumps all! With Rah and Dom running things, you will NEVER see .500.

  68. Forunlawfulcarnalknowledge Says:

    Here’s some reality for you Thomas the train engine, the Bucs AND Raheem Morris go .500 this year! Mark it down as fact. If they don’t I will personally post that your negative rants were correct and I was wrong, but I wont have to. This team has a lame schedule, they have one of the better QB prospects in the league, and they have talent. Young talent, I will admit, but talent. Here are some other facts for you to ponder.

    Geno Hayes (barring injury) will post numbers similar to Barrett Ruud in tackles.
    Mike Williams will be the best rookie receiver to come out of this years draft.
    Styles White will post 8+ sacks this year.

    Mark it down Negative Thom! Don’t trip jumping back on the bandwagon in a few months!

  69. Joe Says:

    Forunlawfulcarnalknowledge

    A Van Halen fan!

  70. Patrick Says:

    F.Y.I Bobby McCray just signed with the Saints. Nice work Raheem, another solid guy we could’ve easily signed and that would’ve helped us! He’s nothing great, but he’s a lot better than what we have and he’s only 28.

  71. JimBuc Says:

    Patrick — you’re upset that the Bucs did not go after a 28 year old DE that was a 7th round selection in 04 and who had 12 tackles last year? Really?

  72. Patrick Says:

    @JimBuc

    I’m saying Bobby McCray is a hall of famer or anything like that. I’m just mentioning how he would’ve been a simple signing and he would not have even been expensive. And it’s a fact that he’s better than what we have.

    Look at Jimmy Wilkerson for example. His first four years with the Chiefs, he only had 1 sack. 1 sack!! When he came to Tampa, he played much better. Not great, but he was pretty solid. We should’ve brought him back, but and Raheem and co. decided not too, not having any proven players to replace him. So DE is a big need for us.

    I could see McCray doing well here in Tampa, kind of like Wilkerson did. Let him play here, draft a DE in next year’s draft and let him learn under McCray. He’s had a ok career. Not great, but ok.

    Oh, and 28 is not old.

  73. lightningbuc Says:

    I think Van Halen fan got a hold of some of Eddie and Alex’s stash! Prognostications typically aren’t considered as fact.

  74. BigMacAttack Says:

    McCray is a pretty good player though. Unfortunately, I think the Saints are just using him for a Camp Body and when they whittle it down to 53, I think he may go if the rest are healthy. The Saints had to make room for this year’s rookies so some of the fringe guys may have to go. I would have been happy if the Bucs would have given him a shot. On the flip side. maybe Wilkerson is healing slow or didn’t show the Saints what they wanted to see so far and he may get cut before the season. This isn’t a problem we have here, with too many good players and too few spots. BTW, I hate the Saints. America’s team my a$$. Brees is going down in the clutches of the Big Man, GMC! GMC! GMC! GMC! GMC!

  75. JimBuc Says:

    Patrick — Ijust meant that I can see fretting over missing the opp to get a a “proven” player over our unproven players, but he is not a proven player. he and many others like him will get cut during training camp, so plenty of his type around.

    Hey, but here’s an interesting question. Let’s say the news today was that the Bucs signed him for a modest deal. What would be the response by many on this board? “Cheap” “Useless” LOL, you know that is they type of stuff we would all be reading. Just like Vincent.

  76. eric Says:

    Wow, got some folks prediciting 8-8.

    Glad to see the confidence emerging.

  77. Pete Dutcher Says:

    [quote]Did you seem to forget the Bucs were 3-13 last year? Ever hear the phrase “lipstick on a pig?”

    So Joe is supposed to be overtly positive about one of the worst teams in the league and still look at himself in the mirror?
    [/quote]

    Joe, while there is no denying that last year, the Bucs were at the bottom of the barrel, that doesn’t mean negative things for this year.

    How many times, during Gruden’s time, did we do well, do bad, then do well again? How many times have we seen teams that were “rbuilding” suddenly do well after a year or so?

    The way I see it, the Bucs can do well this year. Maybe not 13-3 well, but they might be able to go 8-8 or 9-7 if things go well…and that [b]might[/b] even be enough for them to contend for a Wildcard spot.

    It’s a new year, and the Bucs made some incredible picks this year. If Freeman has improved, as most of us suspect, it will make a difference. We have a healthy Faine this year, and T-Jack is not suspended this time around. Our schedule is not as grueling as last year either.

    On top of that, we have a stable offense and a stable defense, and the linemen have all gotten their weight back down after being told to put on weight last year (except maybe Dre Moore).

    When you consider these points and others, there is no reason to think the Bucs will not win 5 or more games this year over last year. Even with Rookies at the Dline and the WR position.

    Shoot, even the rookie WRs can play better than most of our Veteran WRs.

  78. Matt Says:

    As a backhanded compliment: While he can be a bit sensationalist at times (probably driven by the nature of the business), I don’t see Joe as being overly negative, just reporting on the current state of the franchise.

  79. Joe Says:

    As a backhanded compliment: While he can be a bit sensationalist at times (probably driven by the nature of the business), I don’t see Joe as being overly negative, just reporting on the current state of the franchise.

    Matt nailed it!

    For those who believe Joe is overly negative:

    1) Has anyone read Joe calling for the heads of Mark Dominik or Raheem the Dream?

    2) Has anyone read Joe calling for Greg Olson’s head?

    3) Joe has written several times, unlike many fans, he doesn’t believe the Glazers “are cheap.” This would be news to Mike Nugent, Luke McCown and Kellen Winslow, among others.

    4) Please go back through all of this week’s posts and see the positive stories Joe has written or those where Joe stuck up for a player/coach.

    For those that still believe Joe is a hater and all negative, consider Joe received an e-mail in January or February from a very, very high-ranking official at One Buc Palace. Joe will not write who authored the e-mail because said executive asked Joe not write about it. But said executive thanked Joe for being fair — his word, “fair.”

    Joe’s done with this subject. As Joe wrote yesterday, his traffic numbers and feedback he gets from heavy hitters in the football media suggests Joe’s doing something right.

    Thanks Matt for understanding.

  80. bucfanlostiniowa Says:

    this site is awesome you can say pretty much whatever you feel with out worrying about being banned. I would also like to ad that Joe is one of the fairest guys I know afterall he lets a certain defrocked captain of another blog write a column here and that guy never I mean NEVER had a good thing to say about joe on his former blog.

  81. admin Says:

    Joe here,

    bucfanlostiniowa – Joe realized quickly that The Optimist, in his former life, just hadn’t really read JoeBucsFan.com regularly. To be fair, Joe simply asked him to read the site, and he subsequently quickly changed his perspective on Joe. …Open minds usually lead to happy endings. …At least that’s what Joe tells the women he meets.

  82. JimBuc Says:

    Joe, I don’t think your work is overly negative, I think the posters work is overly negative, but that is the norm.

    What has me more concerned than the negativity is this:

    “Open minds usually lead to happy endings. …At least that’s what Joe tells the women he meets.”

    Instead of “single Joe and “married Joe” we may have “hopelessly single Joe” and “married Joe.” Need to work on the game Joe if that is truly how you roll. “hey baby . . open minds usually lead to happy endings.” Ugh. :-)

  83. Joe Says:

    Instead of “single Joe and “married Joe” we may have “hopelessly single Joe” and “married Joe.” Need to work on the game Joe if that is truly how you roll. “hey baby . . open minds usually lead to happy endings.” Ugh. :)

    No need to catagorize JimBuc. Simply, “perpetually horny” Joe will suffice.

  84. bucfanlostiniowa Says:

    perpetually horny? Isn’t that everyman in America? I know I am.

 
 

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