When Failure Is Accepted
January 18th, 2018
Joe just doesn’t understand it.
Unless you own your own business (Joe’s very lucky in this regard), every one of us has to go through a work evaluation. Joe’s been there before. You sit down with your supervisor, maybe a human resources director, and you are told pretty much what a terrible slob you are or what a great worker you are. Either way, it’s not good enough so shape up or we may ship you out.
So just like most of us, Bucs coaches had to go through an eval with their coordinator and/or Dirk Koetter this month. It seems, at least with his defensive coaches, Koetter grades on a curve that sinks lower than a burned out casino boat on the Gulf of Mexico.
Why? Because as we all know the entire Bucs coaching staff, at this point, will be retained for the 2018 season.
So for a team that was worst in the NFL on defense in yards per game, third down conversion percentage, passing yards per game, season passing yards and sacks, Bucs secondary and defensive line coaches got a passing grade, eh?
(Mind you these godawful defensive numbers were accumulated despite the Bucs having one of the best linebacker units in the game, highlighted by two Pro Bowlers and backups who easily could be starting for other teams.)
Joe brings all this up (again) because other teams who actually have goals are neither satisfied nor content with just being good enough. Seattle, a team that has been to the postseason in six of the last eight years including two Super Bowl appearances and one Vince Lombardi Trophy, completed their sweep and ran off their defensive coordinator this week, Kris Richard, days after offing its offensive coordinator, Darrell Bevell.
Oh, and the Steelers? The team that considers a nine-win season a failure? An annual playoff team? They just waved goodbye to their offensive coordinator, Todd Haley, despite having the No. 3 offense in the NFL and putting up 42 points on the No. 2 defense in the NFL on Sunday.
(Joe might also mention how a team from Wisconsin that is a regular participant in the NFL postseason that lost its starting quarterback to injury just had an upheaval of its coaching staff, too. Joe, however, doesn’t want to be mean and pile on here.)
Joe’s actually thinking of starting a pool to pick who is the first person this spring at One Buc Palace to say that the team is overturning every rock and looking under every bed for any possible way to improve the team.
Hey, if the secondary coaches could at least develop young talent, that would at least be something. Sadly, they can’t even do that.
To suggest there are no other secondary coaches in America – NFL or college – who can’t get an NFL team to, oh, say No. 31 in the NFL is pass defense, or any defensive line coach in America – NFL or college – who can’t squeeze, say, 23 sacks out of his unit in 16 games, basically says to a helluva lot of Bucs fans that mediocrity (or worse, abject failure) is perfectly tolerable.
Either that, or some folks over at One Buc Palace have a helluva different set of standards than a lot of winning teams. If it’s a pass/fail league, then Joe knows of three defensive assistants and perhaps four that sure as hell failed.
Hey, inept Lovie Smith was run for less.
Think about this the next time you cut a check to Team Glazer for season tickets.
January 18th, 2018 at 12:11 am
It’s mind boggling, isn’t it?
I wake up everyday, check Joe’s site first to see if there’s any tweaking, any changes. and NOTHING..
I too have my own business and work some side jobs and let me tell you, I have to do self-evals and see how I can improve, etc. If I don’t, my business stalls..so I have to tweak and even let go people that are not going to help me grow as an owner..
It’s really enough for me to put on some warm,razor blade bath music on..lol..Barry Manilow’s “Looks Like We Made It” was my song last year..
January 18th, 2018 at 12:13 am
LOL!!!
January 18th, 2018 at 12:14 am
Hard to lure good coaches here when ownership has already shown lack of confidence in the coach. Nobody likes moving twice in one year, and this is not looking like an organization that’s gonna be a springboard to better things. The fish rots at the head. The Glazer Brothers need to fire themselves and let Derrick Brooks run the team for them, because all they’ve shown me over the last decade is that they know nothing about running a successful franchise.
January 18th, 2018 at 12:18 am
This was discussed in the next “Ira Kaufman Podcast” which will pop later today.
The way college coaches bounce around, if Koetter was to call a young college coach, he’d jump at the chance to work in the NFL, if only for one season. That’s just how the Bucs got Mike Tomlin and Joe Barry. Team Glazer was really squeezing Father Dungy and it was clear from the outside the Glazers were running out of patience, so Dungy dipped into the college ranks. Tomlin was coaching at (University of) Cincinnati. Barry was a quality control guy with the 49ers and the previous season was at UNLV.
Lots of young guys trying to climb the ladder would take that chance.
January 18th, 2018 at 12:25 am
The only way we will be able to get rid of Koetter is if he wins the Super Bowl.
Totally not tolerated around here.
January 18th, 2018 at 12:28 am
Unfortunately, this loser culture will not leave this franchise anytime soon. I heard of changes coming, but I don’t think we’re not gonna see more than 3 percent of change. In fact, I’m betting that Doug Martin will stay. Because our HC believes that “one won’t lose his job due to injury”. Even without injury, Koetter would still start Martin over JQ32 or PB25. Add insult to injury, I also believe that Swaggy “Tree Humper” Baker will still be on this team because we payed a pretty penny for a slouch who whines on social media. I’m also predicting we’ll be considered average in the next 5 years if Licht continues to draft solid and miss on free agents which he’s been known for.
January 18th, 2018 at 12:33 am
Also, if there’s no changes to coaching staff, then Licht, Koetter, Mike Smith, and select few position coaches are going to be dead men walking the sideline. It’s really unfortunate that we’re continuing this mediocre staff personnel while top tier teams such as the Steelers, Patriots (albeit their top 2 coordinators are being hired somewhere else), and maybe the titans despite their turnaround season. Although I understand that there needs to be a continuation within the organization, I feel as if keeping this staff together is equally as worse. Anything worse than a 8-8 season and it’s time to clean the house
January 18th, 2018 at 12:35 am
With the heat the Bucs org has gotten over flipping coaches every 2 years I expected Koetter to stay. I did expect a few changes myself on anything Defense or training staff wise.
Probably player input to get into playing soft again. 😨
January 18th, 2018 at 1:07 am
Where’s the incentive to do better? Win or loose they generate revenue. They have multiple multi-billion dollar streams of income. Fans will still buy tickets, Merch and food. TV revenues, sponsors will still buy seats and advertising space. It’s the nfl it’s like owning a casino you can’t help but to make money.
Sure it would be nice to win but they are not losing sleep over a 5-11 season. Oh and when push comes to shove and they (hypothetically) must sell they’ll make at least a billion in profits even after the suckers of Tampa paid for most of the stadium.
These owners are different bc unlike a Jerry Jones, Al Davis or even George Steinbrenner the Bucs do not define the glazers. They could walk away from this tomorrow and still be Uber rich. Therefore unlike Jones and Davis their vested interest doesn’t make or break them, either way they are good.
January 18th, 2018 at 1:12 am
Team Glazer gives a lot of rope, but if things don’t improve drastically, I think Licht and Koetter both get the axe. Season ticket invoices haven’t gone out yet and status quo isn’t going to koet it for a lot of us. It sucks being forced to pay top dollar for two preseason games. The tickets only amount to maybe half the cost of going to the games. I’ll maybe find one or two good games to go to, but I’m over pouring big money down a black hole. Someone did one heck of a snow job on the Glazers recently.
January 18th, 2018 at 1:57 am
Dirk is back on a one season deal and he knows that. I’m not a Dirk defender by any means but he’s got one year or less to get it turned around or he’s gone as well as everybody on the staff is gone. One positive I will say is that when everyone knows their job is on the line they’ll either shine under the pressure or crumble. I personally don’t have an issue with Dirk, and Licht for that matter, putting all their chips on themselves as they are now. Personally I don’t think it’s going to work out, but hey, as John McKay always said, he had a 5 year contract and a 5 year plan – if he had a 4 year contract he’d have had a 4 year plan. Dirk has a 1 year deal at this point, so he’s going go with his guys. When you have a one year deal bringing in new people you don’t really want isn’t always going to turn out well and might help tank the team faster.
With all that said it’s not like the Bucs are that far away – yeah people think they are, but they’re not. They played by far the hardest schedule in the league, they were 4-1 versus teams under .500 with the only loss being to the 7-9 Packers in GB, they beat the same number of playoff teams in the regular season as the Jags and Titans – they just play in a ridiculously difficult division. Also they lost nearly every close game and you can make legit claims they should have beat the Pats, the Bills, the Lions, the Packers, the Panthers and the Falcons, all those games were close and all came up with L’s. The 4-1 record versus teams with losing records means they were beating teams they should have beat.
To the d-bags who just blindly repeat YOU ARE WHAT YOUR RECORD SAYS YOU ARE, what I wrote isn’t an excuse for anything, it’s a way to predict the future and what might happen with some minor changes. Such as last year when the Bucs were 9-7 and I brought up the Bucs won nearly every close game, Dirk was ultraconservative on offense and the defense was amazingly lucky to not deal with injuries since they had zero depth. I thought the improvements on offense might offset any decline on defense, but the depth issue was never resolved, and it sank the team.
Anyways point being Dirk’s head is on the block, so it should be his call on what he does. I can respect that. I don’t think it’s going to work, even with all the stuff above said I think the team is a 7-9 team in the NFC South, but who knows, with a little luck, some d-linemen, a bunch of DB’s, a true C and Dirk coaching for his job and being creative on offense, maybe they can get back to 9-7 and sneak into the playoffs.
January 18th, 2018 at 2:01 am
On a different note did you hear Dick Vermeil say that Hugh Culverhouse called him and offered him a blank check to coach the Bucs? I’m a lifelong Bucs fan and I know Culverhouse was big on Vermeil, but I never heard he actually offered him the job, more or less told him he could write any contract he wanted. That is very much not like Culverhouse to open his checkbook that way.
Those who think the Glazers are cheap and don’t care – if you lived through the Culverhouse years you’d understand what a cheap disinterested owner is like.
January 18th, 2018 at 2:59 am
Rod,
I agree Hugh Culverhouse was a piece of work. I think the blank check was probably exactly that. A blank check………. typical HC method. Offer less and less until you get a no.
January 18th, 2018 at 5:17 am
Belicheck will be here as president of football operations soon enough. Then the changes will be made at his direction.
January 18th, 2018 at 5:40 am
^^^^^^^Yeah Right!!!!!
January 18th, 2018 at 5:55 am
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The Vikings, Eagles, Titans, Jaguars and Bills all brought back their coaches who MISSED THE PLAYOFFS in 2016 … and yet all 5 of those teams MADE THE PLAYOFFS in 2017 … continuity can be a good thing and makes changes just to make changes is insane.
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January 18th, 2018 at 6:24 am
When you don’t have the personal to play any coach will look bad and switching coaching staff is not a cure-all. Improve the pass rushing and the whole defense improves.Mike Smith and his staff didn’t forget how to coach but I think some of the dl forgot how to play. Improve line play with real pass rushers and the secondary will improve.
January 18th, 2018 at 6:25 am
I somewhat agree with NFLNut….
Continuity is something we haven’t had for a while….and if you are keeping Koetter and giving him the keys….you have to have confidence in his decisions.
The answer here is….if it isn’t the coaches, then it must be the players….so I am expecting a significant overhaul of personnel.
Joe wants someone fired….so here is some red meat, Joe…..I hear the assistant groundskeeper was canned.
January 18th, 2018 at 6:28 am
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Add the Saints to the list above as well … which means 50% of the entire playoff field this year was teams that missed the playoffs the year before.
If that holds true again next year, who’s to say the Packers, Cowboys, BUCCANEERS, Chargers, Colts and Raiders don’t all get into the dance? You never know …
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January 18th, 2018 at 6:33 am
Falling on the sword Loyalty will get yah fired
To many good coaches out there to not bring in some fresh blood
Defensive coaches underperformed especially
January 18th, 2018 at 6:37 am
Why hasn’t anyone asked Jason Licht straight up why no changes to the defense have been made after two years of last in the league?
This is yet. This is the first off-season I question ownership this much. Yes they showed trust in Koetter but didn’t step in and say he had to do something ?
This sucks I’m rooting for the raiders next year this team is screwed
January 18th, 2018 at 6:38 am
Steelers are making a bad move firing Haley. The first year that offense really gelled and they droop him? Dumb
January 18th, 2018 at 6:43 am
@Joe … “if the secondary coaches could at least develop young talent, that would at least be something. Sadly, they can’t even do that.” You keep writing that Joe, but IMO Bucs have relatively little ‘young talent’ in the secondary. How many of those guys would be starting on winning teams? How many would have even been backups on winning teams?
@Rod … “what might happen with some minor changes.” Very good analysis Rod, and I agree with much of what you wrote. But not the ‘minor changes’ part. Sorry. This team lacks T-A-L-E-N-T in several critical spots, and ‘minor changes’ won’t cut it. You obviously don’t agree, but a team really is what their record says it is. All kinds of extenuating circumstances (injuries, tough schedule, etc, etc) but in the FINAL ANALYSIS, if you don’t win enough games, you can’t go to the party when the regular season ends. And THAT’S what the goal has to be in professional football: Super Bowl or Bust. Any owner, GM or coach who sets their sights lower needs to find some other sport to work in.
As an aside, I’m supportive of bringing back Koetter AND Smitty AND whatever elements of their coaching staff they choose to bring back. Several should’ve been let go, BUT I respect THEIR decision to choose THEIR own team of assistants. They’ll all sink or swim together in the end. They’re ALL on a 1-year deal … and 8-8 won’t cut it. But a record of 8-8 or better will put the Glazer Boys in a much better position to hire some top quality coaches to replace them.
January 18th, 2018 at 7:23 am
“Think about this the next time you cut a check to Team Glazer for season tickets.”
Damn Joe you throwing down the gauntlet like that? lol
January 18th, 2018 at 7:48 am
The Bucs have a losing culture that needs to be changed. When a HC protects his RB who is a known druggie and partier, that is supporting the culture. The tough Bill Parcells method gets much better results. His understudies have fared well.
January 18th, 2018 at 7:59 am
If the Glazers are comfortable with losing seasons and no changes then why did they not keep Lovie Smith in the first place? He is just as good as producing the results our team owners desire.
January 18th, 2018 at 8:03 am
So the defensive coaches suck even though they didn’t have much talent up front but with all that talent in offense those coaches are getting a pass from the Joe’s? I guess barber is the reason warhop keeps his job? And you can probably find a special teams coach in the high school ranks better than the one we have. Ride or die mentality is fine if your good at what you do these guys are average at best and send like they aren’t basically saying we had this record because of players
January 18th, 2018 at 8:11 am
Wow Joe. Respect for taking such a strong stance.
That last line in particular is likely to pissoff some suits over at OBP.
I don’t agree with you though. Advocating change simply for change sake is not going to improve the Bucs situation.
Pull guys in from College on one year deals who are green but “rarin’ to go” eh?
IMO Joe – Advocating the firing of 3 very well respected NFL position coaches – who happen to have FIFTY FOUR years of NFL coaching experience between them – because you didn’t like last year’s defensive results at their positions – THAT to me would be the irresponsible thing to do.
Keeping this staff fully intact for 1 more make or break year – showing patience and giving continuity a fighting chance for ONCE in the last 9 years – that is the intelligent decision and I applaud the Glazers for having the balls to make that difficult and obviously unpopular decision.
I’m guessing the results of the “continuity in coaching” movement of ’18 will result in an exciting and winning season.
We shall see won’t we.
January 18th, 2018 at 8:14 am
The problem is over at One Buc they took the word “aint” out of their vocabulary. So they actually think the saying is “If its broke, dont fix it”.
January 18th, 2018 at 8:30 am
If Joe can show me any of “all these coaches” that were “held accountable, had only 2 seasons, then were let go, then he would have a point!!!!!! But he does not!!!!!!!!! And the wrong of loser lovie getting run for less is so far off base!!!!!! There does need to be a president in place, a guru of football, and I hope JBF hires him so he can give good advice on how football works!!!!!!!
You are asking a regime to produce of else then also trying to make them make changes and succeed!!!! That is the worst recipe!!!!!!!!!!!!
But I know that the “stick carriers” or “paper bag carriers” will hold a poll for what Head Coaches name to chant next year if the Bucs are down in the first preseason game!!!!!!!!
Go Bucs!!!!!!!!!!!
January 18th, 2018 at 8:31 am
Nfl nut
Youre not enough of a nut. The bills and jags hired new coaches. Might wana at least look it up if youre gona throw out a stat. Well jags actually hired theres with a few games left year before but was just interim them. And titans needed lots of help to get in, got in and just canned their coach. Your list is down to 2 and one was a 2nd year coach, other is zimmer who isnt going anywhere for a long long time. Change is needed when people continually do the same things over n over n expect different results. Well when those things dont work
January 18th, 2018 at 8:41 am
I said it before and I’ll say it again. If you wanted Dirk Koetter to stay then the status quo should not surprise or disappoint anyone.
As we get further away from the season I feel keeping Dirk Koetter was probably the right thing to do, even though I have no confidence things will get better next season. Unlike Joe, I *do* think 9-7 was the fluke.
The Bucs must really believe the issue is with the talent on the field. That’s on Jason Licht and this entire rebuilding process (entering year five) goes to show you that GMs can’t afford to miss on high draft picks or the team suffers. I’ve said this before, Licht should have been fired on the spot for the Aguayo pick. Second round picks are much too valuable to treat it like a scratch off ticket.
January 18th, 2018 at 8:47 am
“Licht should have been fired on the spot for the Aguayo pick”
Reactionary much D-Rome
Despite the ASJ and Aguayo failures, Licht is still succeeding at a 66% clip with his 2nd round picks – which is a good 10-15% above the NFL average in that round.
January 18th, 2018 at 8:49 am
meant to say 15-20% better.
2nd round picks “bust” on average 50-55% of the time.
January 18th, 2018 at 8:50 am
Not enough hustle and aggressiveness on the field. Too many games where they got their asses kicked and comebacks that were too late.
If they played all the games like they did when they fell behind by 14-17 points we would all have something to get excited about. The slow starts and lack of scoring in Q1 and Q3, falling way behind on scoreboard is something that was a pattern. We all saw it on our tv screens and coaching didn’t change it and the same players didn’t change it.
Lavonte David and Brent Grimes are the only veteran players on that defense that are playmakers. Every single defensive lineman and corner are all replaceable based on what results have shown.
Relying on broken down injury plagued defensive and offensive lineman gets them nowhere. Draft and free agency should be aimed at replacing both lines. Smith and Marpet are the only starters, the guards are bad and Dotson is starting to get hurt a lot. He’s breaking down physically.
Defensive line, McDonald is the only player who showed up when healthy, the rest of them should be replaced with younger guys. If Gerald McCoy wants to play for a playoff team since he probably has about 2 good years left and the Bucs could get a couple of good draft picks for him, I say send him off. He’s been on the team for 7 years and the defense still sucks with him. He is a good player but at 30 he isn’t going to help this team like 2 or 3 younger guys can.
January 18th, 2018 at 9:11 am
The Losing Attitude Has to change
Some of our Star players could careless about post season
We need players who want to win and an Ownership that demands it
Bucs still make money even when the stadium is full of the other tens fans
Bucs fans get the “Fans need to support the team”
And “Oh we were Flat today”
Some of our players are happy to be on vacation now with their 10 million dollar pay day
No Change until the Elephant in the room is removed
January 18th, 2018 at 9:13 am
Why do many players leave the Bucs and do great with other teams?
THE LOCKER ROOM DEMANDS IT
Coaches can only do so much with million dollar players
The Lockerroom controls the win or lose attitude
January 18th, 2018 at 9:17 am
Not there yet:
Bucs have four guys, more than a third of the defense, that has played in Pro Bowls.
If you called half the defensive coordinators in the NFL and asked if they had to start over with a core of GMC, Lavonte David, Kwon and Brent Grimes, they’d do cartwheels.
Yet with this same core, Bucs have a totally lousy defense.
You do the math.
January 18th, 2018 at 9:18 am
If I were the Buccaneers, I would promote Monkin to Assistant Head Coach and sign Todd Haley as offensive coordinator.
Booya!
January 18th, 2018 at 9:21 am
If we all agree that a lack of talent on defense was the issue…then the defensive coaches maybe need another year and new players.
I know fans tend to be intolerant, but sometimes you have to actually give coaches the players they need to succeed.
January 18th, 2018 at 9:21 am
@joe…..I agree 100%
as you pointed out, the injury excuse doesn’t hold up with teams like the packers and dolphins having better records than our…..
people scream lack of talent but we have kwon and GMC who made the PB with LVD and grimes getting snubbed…..they played well and could’ve easily been a selection…..so the lack of talent is out of the window…..
there is no reason to be sitting on our hands at 5-11….we should’ve been one of the first teams to shake up the coaching staff and show the fans and players that 5-11 is unacceptable…..GO BUCS!!!!
January 18th, 2018 at 9:25 am
Nothing but treadmarks of a failing ownership group and a consistently weak organization.
January 18th, 2018 at 9:27 am
bonzai
lack of talent is not the issue….Bucs have four guys, more than a third of the defense, that has played in Pro Bowls…..
kwon and GMC are there this year and LVD and grimes could’ve easily been selected…..
the “lack of talent” excuse is not valid…..GO BUCS!!!!!
January 18th, 2018 at 9:42 am
I have been a season ticket holder for the last 4 years, I have suffered through the misery of so many losses that I just can’t do this any more. The retaining of this defensive staff after the showing this year is the last straw for me. I am DONE!
January 18th, 2018 at 9:43 am
This season was derailed by Irma and missing a bye. literally our entire defense was hurt all year.
It does not help that we have squandered first and second round draft picks for years and that our QB routinely throws more untimely picks than run of the mill touchdowns.
GO BUCS!!!
January 18th, 2018 at 9:43 am
NFLNUT
I disagree….titans, jags, bills all had new coaches…..zimmer is proven….eagles coach is currently in his second year as HC
and the most important stat are “W”…..
all of those teams improved their teams record from year 1 to year 2…..they did not regress like dirk…..
vikes-2016-8-8….2017- playoffs
eagles-2016-7-9…2017- playoffs
titans-2016-9-7…2017-playoffs
jags-2016-3-13…2017-playoffs
bills-2016-7-9….2017-playoffs
bucs-2016-9-7….2017-5-11…WTF?
the jets were accused of trying to tank and they finished with the same record as the bucs….that should tell you all you need to know about this staff…..
as joe pointed out, teams that made the playoffs or just missed the playoffs are shaking things up and trying to get better….seems like we are trying to stay the same at best…..GO BUCS!!!!
January 18th, 2018 at 10:52 am
I’m not comvinced our ownership has that passion..to WIN and create a long time winner. I don’t know the Bucs business angle but I’m sure the glazers are making great profits. I see real NFl winners making adjustments, tweeking even more already to Win next year again. They want to WIN. Everybody here knows I have no faith in Koetter and Mike Smith as WInners. I could live with Koetter for another year. But Mike Smith’s time in the NFl has come and gone. I don’t see the Defensive enthusiasm with him or his current players/coaches. AS for Licht, He’s a great Spinner. Until this organization commits itself to all out Winnning, we shall always be average or slightly below that. I’ll always be a Bucs fan. I’m just not..all in now until I see real change in the organizational structure. And sadly with these Glazers, It probably will not happen.
January 18th, 2018 at 11:40 am
👏🏾All Solid Points Steve
Without Bias – can you honestly say the Bucs did either on Defense?
January 18th, 2018 at 1:50 pm
We need a president with a pedigree of winning!
I’ll hold my judgement of Licht, but someone needs to help consult this first-time GM who has made a whole lot of poor decisions. The sad part is I feel like we have the right heads in the room, just poor decisions being made.
January 18th, 2018 at 2:09 pm
Defense – I meant from the teams side they might believe since they did go 9-7 with basically the team and they lost a ton of close game – so with some minor changes they can get back there. I’m not saying I agree with that, only that internally that is what they probably are telling themselves.
Also again if you are what your record says you are then why wasn’t this team 9-7 again? You record is what you were, not what you are, and predicting the future you look at the record and how you got there.
Personally I think they’re a 7-9 type team, but when you have a QB you have a chance, and healthy Jameis beat the Saints nd should have best GB, Carolina and the Falcons too – in all four cases it was Winston that gave the team a chance to win. So the team isn’t a lost cause by any means. That’s what I think they’re thinking internally.
January 18th, 2018 at 2:09 pm
Dang pickgrin I swear you are reading my mind and stealing my posts. LOL
” Advocating change simply for change sake is not going to improve the Bucs situation.”
Exactly. Change for the sake of change is not productive!!!
And all of you please stop with JAG comparisons. PUHLEEZE
This team just won ten games in the worst division in the worst conference in the NFL!!! They have hardly been world beaters! Their playoff win came against a team that wasn’t playoff caliber!
Meanwhile look at their record over the past five years leading up to this.
2-14
4-12
3-13
5-11
3-13
I would not trade our roster for the Jags. Position by position of course you can find where they have better players but add it all up and our teams are both mediocre…when we play well.
If the Jags win ten or more NEXT year then I’ll start giving them props. ONE year in a horrid division is hardly proof of a genuine turnaround or quality team.
I DO NOT ENVY THE JAGS! Happy for their fans though…at least this year they got a reprieve from the 17-63 record over the past five years including 3-13 last year. BTW the Bucs were 32-52 over that same period.
January 18th, 2018 at 3:19 pm
stpete says: If the Jags win ten or more NEXT year then I’ll start giving them props. ONE year in a horrid division is hardly proof of a genuine turnaround or quality team.
that’s all BS, and you know it…..
first, only 1 division had 3 teams in the playoffs….the nfc south…..the afc south had 2 teams….and had d.watson not gotten hurt they could’ve easily had 3 teams as well…..
second, last year the falcon were the only team to make the playoffs from the nfc south and I didn’t hear anyone saying how lousy the nfc south was…..
so according to you, the jags only validate their season this year by winning 10 games next year……so what does that say about the bucs and this staff?……we won 9games last year and 5 this year…..so are you not giving dirk props for the job he did last year because we finished 5-11 this year……
the jags beat a team many thought was going to be in the SB…PITTSBURG(TWICE IN THERE HOUSE)
they got a new HC, found an identity and played ball…..you gotta give them props….they earned it…..the props your trying to give dirk and the staff is BS….they don’t deserve any props….there’s none to be handed out after a 5-11 season….GO BUCS!!!!
January 18th, 2018 at 3:49 pm
@Joe … “Yet with this same core (i.e., GMC, David, Kwon, Grimes), Bucs have a totally lousy defense. You do the math.
The MATH is extremely simple to do Joe. It takes ELEVEN (11) guys on defense to win, not just FOUR. That’s been the problem with the Bucs for years now: they don’t seem to understand that building a T-E-A-M takes a lot more than just signing a handful of very good athletes then rounding out the rest of the team with wannabees. Half of our starting defense last year would’ve had difficulty making it as backups on the playoff teams. I’m convinced that (for the most part) they played their hearts out for the team & for each other, but … in the final analysis T-A-L-E-N-T counts for something.
January 18th, 2018 at 4:10 pm
Rod, I could go along with them being a 7-9 team last year. And I do agree BTW that the team’s record defines who you WERE, not who you are. Licht, Koetter & all the assistant coaches are fighting for their professional careers right now. A bad 2018 and they’ll all be toast, and most will probably end up back in the college ranks. A LOT of incentive in other words to do well this coming season.
That said, Bucs have a decent core of relatively young, experienced guys to build off of. I’ve looked at who we presently have under contract, and I can see about 26-28 guys who IMO played well enough to make next year’s 53-man roster. In other words, HALF the team. So I’m looking at 25-27 roster positions that SHOULD be filled by FAs or draft picks. If we re-sign certain of our FA guys (Grimes, McDonald, Clarke, McClain, Fitz, Pamphile, Evan Smith, Sims) that’d take the numbers down to 17-19 slots that’d need to be filled with higher quality players than we let go (or brought to training camp to see if they could UP their game). Figuring that maybe 7 of those slots would be filled by draft picks, we end up needing 10-12 FAs.
I know, it’s not gonna happen. But to me, that’s how massive our T-A-L-E-N-T deficit is currently. Trusting Jason Licht to solve that major deficit in talent just isn’t in my DNA. BUT … if we can improve on the T-A-L-E-N-T level this coming year, the next GM & coaching staff will be much better off than what Dirk Koetter & his staff has had to work with.
January 18th, 2018 at 5:12 pm
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Some of ya’ll called me out on my list … and you were right about the Bills but were wrong about all the others.
Mularkey was NOT a new coach this year, that’s NOT true. He took over the Titans back in 2015 after Whisenhut was fired after Mariota started 1-6.
Also, the Jags do NOT have a new coach either … Marrone was on their staff back in 2015 and was technically their head coach for the last game of 2016.
Anyways, the FACT is that 5/12 playoff teams this year were “new to the field” and still had the same coach they had on the last game of the previous year in which they did NOT make the playoffs … that’s a fact.
I’m NOT defending the Glazers not making changes … I would have fired Mike Smith and the entire defensive staff and offered the DC job to Mike Vrabel with a “wink agreement” that if the Bucs didn’t make the playoffs in 2018 he would be my first choice to take over for Koetter as head coach in 2019 … and if he turned me down, I probably would have given the same type of deal to Jim Schwartz, and if he said no, I probably would have given the same type of deal to Teryl Austin who just bolted the Lions to become the DC of the Bengals …
All I’m saying is that 5 out of 12 … and if you want to nit-pick about Marrone, it’s still 4/12 or 33.3333% of the playoff teams this year had the same coaches they had the season before in which they missed the playoffs entirely … and that continuity can be a good thing.
I don’t think anyone will be shocked to see the Cowboys with Garrett, the Seahawks with Carroll, the Packers with McCarthy, the Texans with O’Brien, the Broncos (especially if they get a QB like Cousins or Eli) with Joseph, the Chargers with Lynn or the Ravens with Harbaugh make the playoffs next season … and ALL SEVEN OF THOSE TEAMS are retaining their coach who missed the playoffs this year … the Buccaneers are in the same boat and I’m okay with that.
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January 18th, 2018 at 5:53 pm
Because loosing is acceptable at the top. Period
January 19th, 2018 at 11:19 am
StPeteBucsFan Says:
January 18th, 2018 at 2:09 pm
Dang pickgrin I swear you are reading my mind and stealing my posts. LOL
” Advocating change simply for change sake is not going to improve the Bucs situation.”
Exactly. Change for the sake of change is not productive!!!
And all of you please stop with JAG comparisons. PUHLEEZE
This team just won ten games in the worst division in the worst conference in the NFL!!! They have hardly been world beaters! Their playoff win came against a team that wasn’t playoff caliber!
Meanwhile look at their record over the past five years leading up to this.
2-14
4-12
3-13
5-11
3-13
I would not trade our roster for the Jags. Position by position of course you can find where they have better players but add it all up and our teams are both mediocre…when we play well.
If the Jags win ten or more NEXT year then I’ll start giving them props. ONE year in a horrid division is hardly proof of a genuine turnaround or quality team.
I DO NOT ENVY THE JAGS! Happy for their fans though…at least this year they got a reprieve from the 17-63 record over the past five years including 3-13 last year. BTW the Bucs were 32-52 over that same period.
Hey genius here’s the only problem with your synopsis, last year they brought in Tom Coughlin a REAL FOOTBALL mind who knows who to build and maintain a contending/championship team. They made the changes needed to get better, and holy sh!t look…..THEY GOT BETTER! They went out there and brought in blue chip FA’s and they paid off. Unlike the ass clowns running/coaching this team who don’t have a clue and bring sub par FA’s that are just looking for a fat payday. This is not change for the sake of change, this is change to make this joke of a team better.