Going Nuclear
April 6th, 2017
Channel the past?
What are the Bucs to do with the Muscle Hamster?
Remember when some folks who had access to loud microphones and powerful laptops raked Joe over the coals a little over a year ago when Joe suggested the Bucs should have franchised running back Doug Martin and forced another prove-it contract?
Well, it seems one intelligent man thinks the Bucs should heed Joe’s words, albeit a year late.
As we all know, Bucs AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht got bailed out on Martin to a two-year guaranteed contract when Martin got popped violating the NFL’s banned substance policy, voiding the guarantee.
In a recent broadcast of the “Ron and J.P. Show” heard locally on WDAE-AM 620, co-host Ron Diaz suggested what the 49ers once did to former Bucs cornerback and documented sleazebag Eric Wright, by going nuclear and throwing him off the team when he did the same as Martin (flunk a whizz quiz), the Bucs should also wash their hands of Martin in the same way.
Peterson believed it may be in the interests of the Bucs to re-work Martin’s contract into yet another prove-it pact.
“I know this about Doug Martin: When he has to prove himself, he is a badass,” Peterson said. “When he has to prove himself. He. Is. A. Bad. Ass.
“When he is highly motivated and wants to play and is in tip-top shape and is running the way we know Doug Martin can, he is one helluva running back.”
The way Joe looks at it, if a guy can’t motivate himself consistently and one doesn’t know if he wants to play football, then you are setting yourself up for a massive fail. Besides, few believe Martin will be around after this season. With a draft allegedly loaded with running backs, why wait and instead bank on a guy you don’t know will be motivated?
But Joe understands Peterson’s point and it’s valid. A prove-it contract is more likely to light a fire under Martin, which is what Joe preached prior to last year’s free agency dinner bell ringing.
“If I am the Bucs, I make that deal,” Peterson added.
To hear the full conversation on this subject, click the arrow below. Audio courtesy of Joe’s friends at WDAE-AM 620.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:10 am
It may just be me, but I do not think Martin is that good even when he actually decides to try. Injuries, substances added to a lack of break away speed when he is healthy a trying make him kind of average IMHO.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:12 am
Even if you could assume that he would be motivated, the problem is that Martin is unreliable due to his injury history. Add to the fact that Sims is equally unreliable and injury prone, and you are consistently faced with the prospect that your starting RB on any given week is your 3rd stringer or was driving for Uber at the start of the season. Martin raises too many questions marks, IMO.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:14 am
I thought everyone was 99.9 % sure he would be released????
……this is my assumption since the draft is so deep with talent
April 6th, 2017 at 10:18 am
rayjay1122 what are you talking about lol doug just ran for 1400 yards 2 years ago after the bucs decided not to pick up his option??? that sounds like a B.A. to me but you’re right joe no need for this he’s gotten all the chances he deserves the way i look at it we rewarded him with a big contract for what he did for us witch really was only 2 good years and he rewarded us with not showing up to play and failing a drug test real working people get fired for stuff like that no different for someone in the nfl if he’s not making the impact he’s not worth the headache
April 6th, 2017 at 10:24 am
Ideal situation is that the ucs think he is clean, sign him to a reduced contract, and then draft McCafferey who could then play #3 receiver, return kicks, and provide a backup if Martin or Sims falters. I doubt they will keep Sims past this year, so McCafferey could fill a variety of roles. Our WR is back to what it was last year if Jackson or Evans goes down.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:28 am
I no longer care about the Muscle Enhancer.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:30 am
Still my favorite pic used by the Joes.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:45 am
Joe is it just me or are subliminal messages being sent. The other day you did a thread mentioning the potential of a draft day trade to keep a division rival from having a chance at a player our team may be strongly eyeing. Now I go to Buc.com and they doing a thread called “draft by trade”. With the emphasis on the exact same thing. Hmmm.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:47 am
Im sure people on this board hang out in s tampa and would know before licht if martin is mollying it up again…give the guy a base salary and see if he is the 2nd best back to cook or mixon, then trade him next year for a 2 or a 3 if he performs, then you have cook or mixon to step in
April 6th, 2017 at 10:47 am
Doug is an admitted drug addict that is injury prone, averaged 2.9 yards per carry last year and cost the Bucs a playoff birth as a result of his terrible play.
The Bucs need to get one of the top 3 running backs in this years draft.
As for Sims he is also injury prone and is terrible at the running back position(he may be pretty good as a slot receiver). He also averaged 2.9 yards per carry last year.
Jaquizz Rodgers averaged over 4 yards a carry but he didn’t even make an opening day roster last year and should be a solid #3 running back.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:50 am
All I need to know is what happens if Martin refuses to sign a new deal? Does he become an unrestricted FA, do the Bucs keep his rights or does he just get cut and is free to sign with anyone.
Joe I’ve asked this like 4 times, can you help me out please?!
April 6th, 2017 at 11:02 am
I think:
You sign either Peterson or Martin (to a prove-it deal) AND draft a RB later in the draft (3rd rd or later).
Save those top picks for the other areas of need on this team (D line, O line, Secondary, WR)
April 6th, 2017 at 11:02 am
The guy does not like being called Muscle Hampster Joe. Yet you act like an ole confederate general defying the union. Its no wonder we’ve had problems attracting players. If I were Martin, I’d want a fresh start elsewhere. He made one mistake. Yet many here don’t see him as worthy of a 2nd chance. I wonder if this was another player………
April 6th, 2017 at 11:04 am
So no players should sign more then a 1 year deal as any player – ANY PLAYER – can develop a substance abuse issue. Also, since players work harder in deal years, a deal of more then 1 year is crazy.
Hindsight is 20/20 Joe. At the time it was a good deal with the info we knew.
April 6th, 2017 at 11:08 am
Mike Johnson I agree. If he was tearing it up and got popped some on this board – and some admins – would be sending cookies to him in rehab and cheering him on in camp; as he had a horrible year they use it as an excuse to bash him.
April 6th, 2017 at 11:14 am
Martin will have to be cut to void his contract. Which is exactly what will happen.
And the Bucs don’t have to make a decision about whether to cut him or not until the beginning of week 4.
It would be smart to just wait until the end of Sept and let it all play out. Let Martin sweat it out with everyone else in TC and see how he looks in pre-season. And of course talk to Doug and see how willing he is to come back for $2-3M after he is cut.
April 6th, 2017 at 11:16 am
Just pisses me off people say can the guy. Hell, I think he would take a reduction in salary just to prove he’s the man. I wonder if Jameis stole some crablegs in Tampa again….or let his six shooter run wild out of his pants…Just sayin.
April 6th, 2017 at 11:20 am
im done with martin….and the bucs should be too!!….we have to set a standard….no more asj’s….no more drug martin’s…he is simply unreliable, whether its injury or drugs….we have to let players know that we are only interested in winning….this is part of changing the culture….we need to move on from him to show BS like this wont be tolerated….GO BUCS!!!!
April 6th, 2017 at 11:25 am
Nothing gets done until after the draft…..from there you have a back in which you have all the leverage on the roster to see if a younger guy emerges, veteran gets cut, injury occurs, etc. There is no rush on Martin and its a very good situation for the Bucs to go into the draft with. If they come out of the draft with no RB….then the chatter for Peterson becomes a bit more realistic. Why cut a player that another team might trade for? Even if its a 4th or 5th rounder, there are so many more options with Martin then simply cutting him for the sake of cutting him.
April 6th, 2017 at 11:34 am
Great minds think alike. 🙂
April 6th, 2017 at 11:34 am
@mikejohnson….a lot of fans are pissed with martin simply because he is unreliable….he was already inconsistent due to injury but now you have to worry about his mental health just as much as his physical…we need a mentaly and physically healthy martin or a reliable consistent rb to be successful…
its one thing to be injury prone like l.bell…a player that gets hurt frequently and like to smoke during the offseason but produces at a high level when he’s on the field…compared to martin who is also frequently hurt but is widely inconsistent with his health as well as production….GO BUCS!!!
April 6th, 2017 at 11:38 am
Real simple. Jason Licht holds the hammer. Martin has zero leverage. If the Bucs cut him, he’s free to go anywhere… provided he can find someone to sign him.
When you cut a guy, he is cut. When a player is cut, there is zero tie back to the team that cut him (though a team can always bring him back. Remember: Rudy Humphries was once cut by the Bucs as was Cam Brate). That’s why the word “cut” is used.
Perhaps one reason your question wasn’t answered is like asking what happens when you trade a guy? :::shrugs::: He’s traded! 🙂
April 6th, 2017 at 11:40 am
Simple as that.
April 6th, 2017 at 11:43 am
Boo, hoo. And Joe doesn’t like inconsistent running backs who do PEDs.
1. Folks do not get to dictate how to gloss themselves.
2. So Joe should call him “Mollie Hamster?” Or how about “Druggernaught?”
Doug Martin has significantly bigger worries in his life right now than what his nickname should be. If he is smart, he’d embrace “Muscle Hamster,” trademark one of the greatest nicknames in sports history and start selling gear. He may need a new source of income much quicker than he previously realized.
April 6th, 2017 at 11:47 am
My bad.
I kept hearing re-sign at a cheaper price but wasn’t sure if he had to be cut first or if he just re-sign a new contract then and there. Thanks for clarifying.
April 6th, 2017 at 11:48 am
Druggernaught Has a good ring to it. #LIKE
April 6th, 2017 at 11:55 am
@Mike Johnson- Kwon Alexander comes to mind. Same suspension, different standards. Why? On top of it, people are spouting so much hatred toward the guy like it’s solely his fault for the Bucs not making the playoffs or something.
I’ll put it simply so everyone can understand: If Doug doesn’t test positive, he is STILL the starting RB for the Bucs. Yet, unlike Kwon, he doesn’t get the benefit of the doubt because it was molly and not a “sports drink”! Same 4 game suspension, FYI!!!
Sometimes it is truly irritating being a Bucs fan.
April 6th, 2017 at 12:02 pm
This appears to be one of those stories that just won’t die. All the cards are in Jason Licht’s hands at this moment … none in Doug Martin’s. Licht has zero incentive to cut Martin until after the draft, and in actuality, might even wait until the 4th game of the season if he so chooses (don’t think that’s how Licht will play it however … that kinda leaves Martin in a very bad position & I doubt Licht would do that to him). Really no room in the backfield however for (1) a stud RB like Cook; (2) Martin; and (3) Rodgers, Sims & Barber. Got a hunch most everyone knows who’d be the odd man out.
April 6th, 2017 at 12:08 pm
I realize he messed up in a big way; however I am willing to give him a second chance. He basically had 3,600 yards combined in two excellent years. Post draft I would rework his deal with a low base incentive laden deal, if he gets on the x again or gets injured again, oh well cut him. He’s better then anyone we have on the current roster imo and worth another shot.
April 6th, 2017 at 12:13 pm
The Gerbils future is bright… They are looking for endorsers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ciwnivq6Yc
April 6th, 2017 at 12:16 pm
Do you realize that Blount almost tied the Gerbils career touchdown mark last year alone. the gerbil is king of garbage yards. he does not score consistently, always hurt and he screwed over Jameis. Enough. see ya… Send a message Licht go up get cook, grab Goodwin in Second and a DT in third to fill in when the fragile mccoy and mccdonald miss time. simple as that.
April 6th, 2017 at 12:18 pm
I will never call The Muscle Hamster “The Muscle Hamster” only if he legally changes his name to “Drug Martin”!!!!!!
April 6th, 2017 at 12:24 pm
Send a message Licht go up get cook, grab Goodwin in Second
Cook and Godwin in the first two round would get Joe more excited than Rachel Watson.
April 6th, 2017 at 12:25 pm
@Mike Johnson
We are not unreasonable!! let us all compromise on the subject!!!!! He shall now be know as “The Molly Hamster”!!!!!!!!!!
April 6th, 2017 at 12:26 pm
Yeah no garbage yards or td’s for Blount lol
April 6th, 2017 at 12:33 pm
Curtis Samuel in the second. Godwin reminds me too much of Michael Clayton.
April 6th, 2017 at 12:42 pm
@bucfan….there are 2 differences between kwon and doug….first kwon was a rookie when he got popped…martin was a seasoned vet…not saying kwon didn’t know better but doug really knew better….
second, kwon was playing lights out during his rookie year that ended prematurely due to his suspension….doug was hurt(again) and wasn’t producing when he got popped….
the reason why l.bell is still with Pittsburg even tho he gets injuried a lot and like to smoke during the offseason is because he is highly productive on Sundays….GO BUCS!!!
April 6th, 2017 at 12:45 pm
Draft a RB and cut this lazy bum please. I’m tired of reading about his garbage.
April 6th, 2017 at 1:16 pm
@813- I whole-heartedly disagree with that rationale. Kwon’s is “excusable” because he was a rookie? Did we not tank the 4 games he was gone? There is NO difference other than Doug was not having a good year. And for the record, Kwon is not Ray Lewis! Hopefully, yet!
With your rationale, it would’ve been OK if Doug had “popped” in 2015 because “he was more productive”?! C’mon!
It’s a double standard!
I’m confident that the Bucs will make the right decision but lets not make up excuses to validate opinion.
April 6th, 2017 at 1:31 pm
He wasn’t a lazy bum in 2015 now, was he?! A lot of people, hypocritical people, were cheering on the 2nd leading rusher in the NFL that year.
Some of you “fans” are so quick to turn on a guy! I don’t even know what to say anymore. Sad!
April 6th, 2017 at 1:33 pm
W u bucs fan
April 6th, 2017 at 2:04 pm
Muscle Hamster is OK by me. Like has been said, you don’t pick your own nickname. As far as the freakout over “drug issues”, how insane considering the recent admitted players lining up for their illegal painkiller doses before each game. Much ado about nothing when it comes to Martin.
April 6th, 2017 at 3:03 pm
The only All-Pro running back in the Bucs history that was 2nd in the league in rushing 2 years ago – and has been one of the best players in the league for 40% of career. I don’t know if the issue is motivation, depression, injuries or something else – but this idea you take a guy that has proven to be the best in the league when the chips are down, and just cut him makes no sense. You bring in Martin, you do all the offseason stuff, the preseason stuff and see what happens – if he’s healthy, clear eyed and motivated why would you just cut him because you’re mad? That’s what losers do. Winners squeeze everything they can out of players – and if motivation is an issue – I can’t believe Martin won’t be motivated at an insane level this year. Martin isn’t a bad guy – at least I’ve never heard anyone say, or even say tumors, that he is. If someone deserves a 2nd chance it’s someone like Martin. I’d still draft a RB of the future – but that future can wait a year if Martin is back to being who he is.
With all that said what exactly is his contract guarantees? Does it again become guaranteed if he’s still on the team week 1? I thought he now just has a non-guaranteed deal, period – if that’s not the case then sure, try to do a new deal and if he won’t take a new deal you’d have to cut him. But I won’t redo his contract if it’s not guaranteed as is – if the issue is motivation he should be very motivated to earn that big money contract he signed – and if he’s not the all-pro Martin, then cut him.
April 6th, 2017 at 3:27 pm
Joe Says:
April 6th, 2017 at 12:24 pm
Send a message Licht go up get cook, grab Goodwin in Second
LOL – I keep seeing statements like this – and now Joe is doing it too.
Newsflash “go up and get cook” means trading away additional valuable draft picks to do so. It will take our 2nd round pick to get up to #12 and additional picks to go higher. Dalvin may well be gone by #12 – but if he’s still available then and we DO trade up for him – than there will be no Chris Godwin or Zay Jones or talented safety for the Bucs in the 2nd round because we WON’T HAVE a 2nd round pick. Duh!
What makes more sense – a 1st and 2nd for Cook or draft McCaffrey at 19 if he is there and also get a great player at WR, Safety or TE in the 2nd round and have all our picks to work with in this deep draft? Again – Duh!
April 6th, 2017 at 3:49 pm
Cook is a hell of a RB prospect – but unless he drops to us at 19, it makes no sense to pay extra to “go get him” with all the RB talent in this draft. We still have too many other needs and there is sooo much talent in this draft that we need to be taking advantage of in rounds 2,3 and 4.
I would much rather go:
1st Rd – McCaffrey/Njoku/Budda Baker(after trade down)
2nd Rd – Zay Jones/Chris Godwin/ Evan Engram/ Budda Baker(trade up)
3rd Rd – RBs Hunt/Perine/Mixon / S – Josh Jones or Montae Nicholson
4th Rd – WR Josh Reynolds/ TE’s Jordan Leggett or Michael Roberts/ or the best of remaining RBs if one has not yet been drafted
If we stand pat and come out of the 1st 4 rounds with a Safety, TE, RB and WR in whatever order – this team will improve quite a bit.
April 6th, 2017 at 5:04 pm
@Pickgrin
Don’t know why you are trying to reason with Joe. This is the same guy who just a few days ago was suggesting we trade up all the way to 7 in order to get Cook.
Unbeknownst to him, doing that means no Godwin, because it would take over half of this years draft to make that trade.
Doesn’t matter how much sense you make, Joe (Lee) has a hard on for Cook.
April 6th, 2017 at 5:42 pm
Blake – going to #7 would take 85% of the value of our draft. Draft Trade chart says going from 19 to 7 would roughly require our 1st,2nd,3rd and 5th round picks.
How high we have to go for Cook depends largely on how quickly Fournette comes off the board. If the Jags take Fournette at #4 which I think is a fairly high probability – then Cook is unlikely to get past the top 10 or 11 at most. If Jags do not take Fournette, then Carolina almost certainly will at #8 and in that case, it’s possible that Dalvin slides as low as 14 or 15. Even then, it would take our 1st and 3rd rd picks to get up to #15 and I don’t want to do that either. A pick in the 3rd round this year can easily be a day one or at least future starter if Licht gets the pick right.
April 6th, 2017 at 6:24 pm
Doug made one mistake, you don’t give up on the back that finished second in rushing yards just two seasons ago. The guy didn’t forget how to run.
April 6th, 2017 at 8:16 pm
Actually I know nothing about this drug that Martin was said to have taken. Is it a performance enhancing drug and what in particular does it enhance? To me, Martin was never the same after his initial injury last year.
April 6th, 2017 at 8:44 pm
Great minds think alilke…
Now that has to be the funniest thing I have ever freaking read on this site. Wow. Just wow.
April 6th, 2017 at 9:01 pm
This is what I’ve been saying since he got popped last year. Specifically, he needs some redemption, he is not a bad guy, and we know what he can do when he wants. And I think he’ll want to. Again, no RBs at all before the 3rd round. No need. Yeah, we need Rodgers and Barber and Sims to suck it up for three games. But they did last year too…at least Quizz did….
April 6th, 2017 at 9:02 pm
Hey Joe (Lee) just here to let you know that you’ve lumped yourself in with a guy who thinks that the earth is flat.
That is all.
April 6th, 2017 at 9:58 pm
Joe did you forget about Joworski Lane. He single handily help our running game. It wasn’t Doug fault. Our oline was weak but having a bruising fullback in front of Martin in why he excelled. Luke Caught blocker Stocker is not a fullback. Doug has never had a lead blocker until Lane made the roster. He would get hit 2yard behind the LOS by opposing tacklers. Sure will is what made Doug have those productive seasons.
Last year it was Doug because Quizz had better production behind the same line. At times it seemed as if Martin was running on his hamster wheel or tip toeing like Sims. Koetter Doug just wanna run the ball!
It’s called a RUNNING BACK not a CATCHING BACK. The more passes a RB catches there’s a WR going throw me the DAMM BALL.
April 6th, 2017 at 10:25 pm
Many said McCoy was a bust when he was hurt his first 2 yrs.
Martin is an excellent running back , when healthy- better than anyone else Bucs have right now. Let draft and training camp play out and decide then…
Upgrade offensive line, defensive line and secondary in draft and this team can win superbowl. Patriots won it without arguably their 2nd best player, Gronk. Why? Controlled trenches in 2nd half of SB
Upgrade lines and Bucs will be there!